What would you see if you looked at the other Shards

[Sythrin]

In some books, it was described if you looked/felt a Shard when you confront the vessel.

In case of Odium, you felt various emotions. Like kisses, glory of victory and things like the burning sun.

When you looked at Preservation if I remember correctly, you see stone, unmoving moutains over eternity existing. (Please correct me if I am wrong)

What do you think, you would feel/see in the other shards? I like colorful creative ideas.

Maybe in case of Honor. You would feel steel. Unbreaking steel chains and strings. Maybe you would feel the connection of everybody, the bond that you get from brotherly love, the bond that you feel when keeping a promise. The satisfaction of seeing a surviving family member. Or the feel of protection a weaker person.

Cultivation is more clearer. Probably forests, fungus, the smell of carpenter wood, the growth a mother feels in her pregnant womb. But as well the death of an animal that is than devoured by bacteria and than by bigger animals.

[Elite01]

Good question 

endowment would probably involve colors/rainbows, the feeling of giving and receiving things? 
 

for Ruin I though kelsier described looking at Ruin was like watching things collapse, I’ll look later and edit my post 

[alder24]

1 hour ago, Sythrin said:

In some books, it was described if you looked/felt a Shard when you confront the vessel.

In case of Odium, you felt various emotions. Like kisses, glory of victory and things like the burning sun.

When you looked at Preservation if I remember correctly, you see stone, unmoving moutains over eternity existing. (Please correct me if I am wrong)

What do you think, you would feel/see in the other shards? I like colorful creative ideas.

Maybe in case of Honor. You would feel steel. Unbreaking steel chains and strings. Maybe you would feel the connection of everybody, the bond that you get from brotherly love, the bond that you feel when keeping a promise. The satisfaction of seeing a surviving family member. Or the feel of protection a weaker person.

Cultivation is more clearer. Probably forests, fungus, the smell of carpenter wood, the growth a mother feels in her pregnant womb. But as well the death of an animal that is than devoured by bacteria and than by bigger animals.

We've seen Ruin in SH ch 2-1:

Quote

The light thinned, and he looked into someplace new. A dark expanse that was neither the world of the dead nor the world of the living.
In that other place, he found destruction.
Decay. Not blackness, for blackness was too complete, too whole to represent this thing he sensed in the Beyond. It was a vast force that would gleefully take something as simple as darkness, then rip it apart.
This force was time infinite. It was the winds that weathered, the storms that broke, the timeless waves running slowly, slowly, slowly to a stop as the sun and the planet cooled to nothing.

Here's Preservation SH ch 1-1:

Quote

The man met Kelsier’s eyes, and in them Kelsier saw eternity. A cool, calm eternity—the eternity of stones that saw generations pass, or of careless depths that didn’t notice the changing of days, for light never reached them anyway.

Here's Odium OB ch 57:

Quote

It was the scream of a thousand warriors on the battlefield.
It was the moment of most sensual touch and ecstasy.
It was the sorrow of loss, the joy of victory.
And it was hatred. Deep, pulsing hatred with a pressure to turn all things molten. It was the heat of a thousand suns, it was the bliss of every kiss, it was the lives of all men wrapped up in one, defined by everything they felt.

I like your description of Honor, which uses steel and chains. It fits very well.

For Cultivation I would see like you said - growing life, a living forest, trees spawning a new leaf, vines climbing onto the tree, moss growing on rocks, insects crawling on it, birds singing, animals running around. Devotion might be described by motherly love, a warm embrace, a passion of lovers, parents taking away troubles from their children, a child caring for their ill parents.

Hard to say about others, Autonomy might be described by a lone wolf traveling through a forest, a trapper surviving in a wild, an eagle flying high and free, feeling of uniqueness and individualism experienced by a single person. Endowment might be a warm welcoming, joy experienced by sharing and receiving, art full of colors created to be admired, a breath shared with others, a meal given to those in need. Dominion is greed and possessiveness, kingdoms and empires stretching beyond the horizon, kings and queens ruling over their people, riches collected by nobles, planets kept in hands of gods. 

[Dofurion]

48 minutes ago, Sythrin said:

In case of Odium, you felt various emotions. Like kisses, glory of victory and things like the burning sun.

Quote

It was the scream of a thousand warriors on the battlefield. It was the moment of most sensual touch and ecstasy. It was the sorrow of loss, the joy of victory. And it was hatred. A deep, pulsing hatred with a pressure to turn all things molten. It was the heat of a thousand suns, it was the bliss of every kiss, it was the lives of all men wrapped up in one, defined by everything they felt.

 

49 minutes ago, Sythrin said:

When you looked at Preservation if I remember correctly, you see stone, unmoving moutains over eternity existing. (Please correct me if I am wrong)

Quote

The infinity of a note held perfectly, never wavering. The majesty of a painting, frozen and still, capturing a slice of life from a time gone by. It was the power of many, many moments compressed somehow into one.

Ruin:

Quote

It was the winds that weathered, the storms that broke, the timeless waves running slowly, slowly, slowly, to a stop as the sun and the planet cooled to nothing. It was the ultimate end and destiny of all things.

 

1 hour ago, Sythrin said:

What do you think, you would feel/see in the other shards? I like colorful creative ideas.

Valor (Hypothesis): 

Quote

It was the dying courage of a man on the front lines charging an enemy army. The glory of a woman fighting for her child. The feeling of an old man on his last day of life stepping into darkness.

Honor:

The weight of a king's crown protecting his people. The certainty of doing the right thing by following the law of a just people. The resolve of a pioneer to fight for a just society for his descendants. And the joy of a common man, knowing that the help he has given has been of some use.

Cultivation:

The intensity of a sculptor visualizing his work to begin. The concern of a shepherd trying to cure his sick cattle. The planning of a farmer to sow in the following season and his impassivity in getting rid of pests.

If more occurs to me, I will update this post.

[Treamayne]

2 hours ago, Sythrin said:

When you looked at Preservation if I remember correctly, you see stone, unmoving moutains over eternity existing. (Please correct me if I am wrong)

M: SH Descriptions -

Spoiler

Ruin - P2C1:

Quote

when the next pulse came he pushed himself in the opposite direction—not along with the pulse, but toward its source.

The light thinned, and he looked into someplace new. A dark expanse that was neither the world of the dead nor the world of the living.

In that other place, he found destruction.

Decay. Not blackness, for blackness was too complete, too whole to represent this thing he sensed in the Beyond. It was a vast force that would gleefully take something as simple as darkness, then rip it apart.

This force was time infinite. It was the winds that weathered, the storms that broke, the timeless waves running slowly, slowly, slowly to a stop as the sun and the planet cooled to nothing.

It was the ultimate end and destiny of all things. And it was angry.

Kelsier pulled back, throwing himself up out of the light, gasping, trembling.

Preservation P2C1:

Quote

He happened to catch a glimpse of Fuzz’s eyes as the pulse passed.

And in that moment, Kelsier was reminded why he had named this creature a god in the first place. There was an infinity beyond those eyes, a complement to the one trapped here in this Well. Fuzz was the infinity of a note held perfectly, never wavering. The majesty of a painting, frozen and still, capturing a slice of life from a time gone by. It was the power of many, many moments compressed somehow into one.

Fuzz stopped before him and his cheeks unraveled fully, revealing a skeleton beneath that was also unraveling, eyes glowing with eternity. This creature was a divinity; he was just a broken one.

 

I'll update with the rest, as I find them

[Dofurion]

7 hours ago, alder24 said:

Hard to say about others, Autonomy might be described by a lone wolf traveling through a forest, a trapper surviving in a wild, an eagle flying high and free, feeling of uniqueness and individualism experienced by a single person. Endowment might be a warm welcoming, joy experienced by sharing and receiving, art full of colors created to be admired, a breath shared with others, a meal given to those in need. Dominion is greed and possessiveness, kingdoms and empires stretching beyond the horizon, kings and queens ruling over their people, riches collected by nobles, planets kept in hands of gods. 

Honestly, I've always felt like the intents for Dominion and Devotion have been misinterpreted. When Brandon asked which MTG colors would correspond to Shards, he said Dominion was a [/] and Devotion was a [/]. And although this is not canon, it is a good starting point to know how Brandon envisions the way the Shards act.

While I agree with the definition you propose, I think it is only half of the Intent of Dominion. The other half would fall into the range of self-control and creating systems.

As for Devotion, it is generally attributed to a similar intention to 'Love' but I think it goes much further.

I think it is about the strong feelings towards a single specific task, in terms of what concerns this publication:

The dedication of a prince to his people (Raoden), the fascination of two linguist kids (Kaise and Daorn), the meticulousness of the farmer (Galladon) and the dedication of the mathematician (Aiden).

As a note, the other character Sanderson has defined as [/] is Vin, so for me Devotion is like Vin, only with a slightly softer character (perhaps leaning towards maternal) but a million times more insistent in his goals and hobbies.

 

Edited October 21, 2024 by Dofurion

[Sythrin]

15 hours ago, alder24 said:

Hard to say about others, Autonomy might be described by a lone wolf traveling through a forest, a trapper surviving in a wild, an eagle flying high and free, feeling of uniqueness and individualism experienced by a single person. Endowment might be a warm welcoming, joy experienced by sharing and receiving, art full of colors created to be admired, a breath shared with others, a meal given to those in need. Dominion is greed and possessiveness, kingdoms and empires stretching beyond the horizon, kings and queens ruling over their people, riches collected by nobles, planets kept in hands of gods. 

Like your idea with Autonamy. Maybe the silent but kinda penetrating sound of dark forest. The breaking of twigs in them. Actually quite silent but being the ones that break through the silence, make them memorable. Or the feeling of being better than others. 
Maybe the feeling of selfsatisfaction. Accomplishing womething, especially against the odds. A form of pride if you may say.

15 hours ago, Dofurion said:

The intensity of a sculptor visualizing his work to begin. The concern of a shepherd trying to cure his sick cattle. The planning of a farmer to sow in the following season and his impassivity in getting rid of pests.

Like your description. Maybe a bit darkness would be nice as well.

Something like a beast devouring a slain prey, to feed it to its offspring. A flesh bacteria feeding and multiplying in a wound of ill person.

Cultivation is not only positive. I see it like ruin. It can destroy something if you can build later more from it.

[Dofurion]

2 hours ago, Sythrin said:

Something like a beast devouring a slain prey, to feed it to its offspring. A flesh bacteria feeding and multiplying in a wound of ill person.

Cultivation is not only positive. I see it like ruin. It can destroy something if you can build later more from it.

Sure, I agree with you, and Sanderson himself has told us that no Shard is purely "bad" or "good", and in WoB's he has given us contexts in which Preservation and Honor would have been the villains.

Partly that is what I wanted to convey in the last two sentences where I wanted to show that he is capable of eliminating life if it gets in the way of his long-term plans. Although I differ a little in your definition since I get the feeling that he is more inclined to hunting, and the Cultivation Intent is not as active.

Edited October 21, 2024 by Dofurion
duplication

[Quantus he/him]

11 hours ago, Dofurion said:

Honestly, I've always felt like the intents for Dominion and Devotion have been misinterpreted. When Brandon asked which MTG colors would correspond to Shards, he said Dominion was a [/] and Devotion was a [/]. And although this is not canon, it is a good starting point to know how Brandon envisions the way the Shards act.

While I agree with the definition you propose, I think it is only half of the Intent of Dominion. The other half would fall into the range of self-control and creating systems.

As for Devotion, it is generally attributed to a similar intention to 'Love' but I think it goes much further.

I think it is about the strong feelings towards a single specific task, in terms of what concerns this publication:

The dedication of a prince to his people (Raoden), the fascination of two linguist kids (Kaise and Daorn), the meticulousness of the farmer (Galladon) and the dedication of the mathematician (Aiden).

As a note, the other character Sanderson has defined as [/] is Vin, so for me Devotion is like Vin, only with a slightly softer character (perhaps leaning towards maternal) but a million times more insistent in his goals and hobbies.

 

I dont think that part is true, what you describe is the progression of Civilization which is currently represented by Honor+Cultivation in the Venn Diagram of Shardic purviews.  Dominion doesnt really imply Doing anything specific with things, no inherent transformation, it's just extreme Domination or at best Extreme Territoriality.  In fact I would think Dominion would play really well with the Unchanging Statis aspect of Preservation more than the sort of inherent change/progression of say Cultivation or Ambition (or even Ruin).  

[Dofurion]

On 10/21/2024 at 8:41 AM, Quantus said:

I dont think that part is true, what you describe is the progression of Civilization which is currently represented by Honor+Cultivation in the Venn Diagram of Shardic purviews.  Dominion doesnt really imply Doing anything specific with things, no inherent transformation, it's just extreme Domination or at best Extreme Territoriality.

I think I need to explain this a bit.

An analogy I often use to help me understand the Shards is that they are people who were pushed into playing a video game, a God simulator to be exact.
But there are different types of God simulators, in the specific case of Cultivation it would be a farming simulator, where the gameplay loop is focused on planting, and refurbishing the farm with the goal of optimizing profits and ultimately, completing automation.

As for Dominion, she was playing a City Builder, in these games all the legal, population and production intricacies are managed centrally by the player and the ultimate goal, like the previous example, is still automation and stabilization in the state desired by the player. What greater display of dominion than not having to do anything and still maintaining what you want?

[Ninth of the Night]

23 hours ago, Dofurion said:

An analogy I often use to help me understand the Shards is that they are people who were pushed into playing a video game, a God simulator to be exact.

That's a really cool way of looking at it!

Now I imagine Odium as one of those people who just loves to torture their Sims in any way possible. Or maybe that's Ruin? Though he would instead probably prefer to invade someone else's well established game and destroy it all.

Edited November 4, 2024 by Ninth of the Night

[Trusk'our he/him]

1 hour ago, Ninth of the Night said:

That's a really cool of looking at it!

Now I imagine Odium as one of those people who just loves to torture their Sims in any way possible. Or maybe that's Ruin? Though he would instead probably prefer to invade someone else's well established game and destroy it all.

From a videogame point of view, I think Ruin would likely be the terrible sibling who always tries to delete your Minecraft worlds.

[Treamayne]

1 hour ago, Ninth of the Night said:

Now I imagine Odium as one of those people who just loves to torture their Sims in any way possible.

Dungeon Keeper (Pre-StarCraft RTS) - Though I doubt most of the people here would be old enough to remember this great classic (cheap on GOG).

Spoiler

 In Dungeon Keeper, the player builds and manages a dungeon, protecting it from invading 'hero' characters intent on stealing accumulated treasures, killing monsters and ultimately the player's demise. The ultimate goal is to conquer the world by destroying the heroic forces and rival dungeon keepers in each realm.

Example Narration:

Quote

• Intro: "Cosyton. A hideous sham of a town, in which the prosperous citizens have no gripes or moans. Sadly, even the children are happy and secure. This is because they aren't punished for non-existent crimes!"
  • Win Level: "Darkanna. The surviving citizens have more on their plates than a Demon Spawn with three dead adventurers to munch. Not that many citizens have survived, as such."
• Intro: "Skybird Trill— the ultimate in cute. A frown in Skybird Trill brings all the townspeople to the sufferer's door with gifts of love, fine cheer, and eternal friendship. A place where nothing can ever go wrong, or so they fondly believe..."
  • Win Level: "Longterror. The world of Skybird Trill is nothing more than a charred wreck of a nightmare. We have won a furious, vital victory, and you are ruler supreme over the whole world! What next, Master?"