Fake Charlie

[SilverLumos]

Note: I’m super new to this forum so if I’m doing something incorrect posting this myself please let me know. I scanned through the topics and didn’t see this one posted anywhere.

What does everyone think the reptilian creature posing as Charlie was? My first thought was a Sho Del, but the lack of mention of extra limbs points to that not being the case. Also, with Hoid being the narrator and just casually mentioning other cosmere crossovers by name, it feels inconsistent for him to ignore that.

Maybe some kind of hemalurgic chimera? Maybe a kandra, as they seem to be taking on more non-human traits at this point in the timeline? Or maybe something entirely new we just don’t know about yet?

What does everyone think?

 

[Yumiya]

2 hours ago, SilverLumos said:

 Maybe a kandra, as they seem to be taking on more non-human traits at this point in the timeline? Or maybe something entirely new we just don’t know about yet?

I doubt it was a kandra, doesn't seem to be their style. My guess is something entirely new that is more animal than sentient.  

[StormingTexan he/him]

He was an Aelfinn! I am not exactly sure what he was but I think this was also kind of a joke the whole Lizard people troupe. 

[Requiem17 she/her]

I'm glad you made this post because what was going on there!? I also thought Sho Del at first but yeah, it doesn't make sense. This is a new mystery we have to keep an eye out for. 

Quote

Lightweaving had fallen away, revealing a creature that only resembled a human— reptilian with golden eyes and a toothy grin.

Who was Lightweaving? The reptilian?? Riina??? 

[AquaRegia he/him]

I have no problem accepting that The Sorceress could pull off a Lightweaving like that.

I have no idea what the reptilian creature is.

[Lightspine]

1 hour ago, Requiem17 said:

Who was Lightweaving? The reptilian?? Riina??? 

Almost certainly Riina. We see Raoden use something that would probably be classified as Lightweaving in Elantris to pass off as a non-Elantrian. This should be well within Riina's abilities.

I don't think the creature fits any known descriptions of the Sho-Del, so it's probably an intelligent race we haven't met yet. I'm also interested in why they're around. Are they a friend of Riina's, or more like a pet? I assume they aren't native to Lumar, so Riina must have brought them with her?

[lacrossedeamon]

Glad to see at least one post about this. It could be a native species to Lumar that Riina invested to grant self-awareness as stated she was capable of doing in ch 28 (although that could have been a red herring to cover Huck being created the opposite way and she can't really do that). It could be a human who like Charlie was transformed into something else. It could be a new non human sapient species we haven't seen before.

[SilverLumos]

14 hours ago, lacrossedeamon said:

Glad to see at least one post about this. It could be a native species to Lumar that Riina invested to grant self-awareness as stated she was capable of doing in ch 28 (although that could have been a red herring to cover Huck being created the opposite way and she can't really do that). It could be a human who like Charlie was transformed into something else. It could be a new non human sapient species we haven't seen before.

Good point! It could definitely be one of her curse victims that she turned into a lizard creature similar to how Charlie was turned into a rat.

[Yumiya]

22 minutes ago, SilverLumos said:

It could definitely be one of her curse victims that she turned into a lizard creature similar to how Charlie was turned into a rat.

And to break his curse he has to successfully help the sorceress curse someone else, just like Charlie had bring Tress back to be cursed.  

[CognitiveShadow he/him]

I still lean towards a Sho Del. It doesn’t call out the extra limbs but says it only vaguely resembled a human. To me that leaves it open enough to have been a Sho Del.

[lacrossedeamon]

36 minutes ago, CognitiveShadow said:

I still lean towards a Sho Del. It doesn’t call out the extra limbs but says it only vaguely resembled a human. To me that leaves it open enough to have been a Sho Del.

Actually I think you might be right. I just reread the page for Sho Del and it mentions reptilian eyes and the image used (admitted a fanwork) has scales. It is weird to not mention the extra limbs but yeah does seem pretty tasty… I mean Sho Delish.

[StormDad]

I’m pretty sure he was a gorn

[lacrossedeamon]

12 minutes ago, StormDad said:

I’m pretty sure he was a gorn

Like Hrathen? I don’t see the connection.

[StormDad]

I was joking, I was referring to a gorn from Star Trek 

[lacrossedeamon]

Ah sorry, not a Trekkie 

[StormingTexan he/him]

On 1/9/2023 at 11:07 AM, lacrossedeamon said:

but yeah does seem pretty tasty… I mean Sho Delish.

Haha very punny! 

[basement_boi he/him]

It was Mark Zuckerberg. Cosmere in real life confirmed.

[Dreamwa1ker she/her]

On 1/17/2023 at 0:20 AM, StormDad said:

I’m pretty sure he was a gorn

This is exactly where my brain went when reading it  I was like, did Brandon just have a Gorn cameo as like a joke?

In seriousness though, I'm suspecting it,s a sapient species we haven't seen or a sho del, because otherwise why in a meta sense would he choose a fake with such a weird description vs just it being some random human dude.

[AltonicKeys he/him]

Yeah, Hoid could just be joking, and calling a human a lizard as an insult. He's played with words often.

[Argenti he/him]

It was actually the cognitive shadow of Adonalsium.

[Weaver of Shadows he/him]

Turns out it was one of the lizardfolk from 5e.

[Rlain]

As a follow up question: where did it go after Tress discovered it's deception. Tress stormed back into Riina's command center, denying that the creature was charlie, the lightweaving was dropped revealing the reptilian creature and then Tress confronts Riina.

But what does the reptile creature do at this point?

Hoid doesn't mention it leaving the room. Tress doesn't mention it again. Riina doesn't consider it during her calculations about whether or not to fight the crew when they're all there.

So..... Where did it go? 

[Weaver of Shadows he/him]

It may have gone to its “den” in the ship. Maybe it wasn’t useful in a fight, or was too far away for Riina to call to help her, there are a lot of options.

[Rlain]

I just find it odd that Hoid didn't mention it "slinking away" or anything after it's ruse was discovered. It's entirely possible that's just what happened, but with the whole building going on high alert when the ship started immobilizing the awakened soldiers, it just seems odd that the lackey wasn't still around to participate. Either it was skilled enough at lightweaving that it was able to mimic charlie or Riina set the lightweaving and dismissed it. Either way, this creature was a tool of hers who was self aware enough to attempt political subterfuge and covert operations. Why toss aside a useful tool like that when there is so much commotion going on?

It might just be a quirk in the storytelling, but it feels off to me that a character was introduced and was present in the room where the action was taking place, and it leaving wasn't noticed by anyone. That being said, I also don't have another explanation for it. 

[Weaver of Shadows he/him]

It is weird that Hoid never mentioned it, my guess is that something happened to it to stop it from interfering, but I think that might be something only Sanderson can answer.