[Stormlight 5] The Stormfaker isn't a Cracktheory: The Official Stormfaker's Support Group

[listerfeend]

On 10/1/2024 at 8:36 AM, alder24 said:

This is not the first time the Stormfather was caught red-handed - this happened at least two times in OB. The first time was, when he tried to hide the fact that he can sense Ishar, a chapter later he tried to omit that Dalinar can speak other languages. Both times he revealed the truth only because Dalinar pressed him further and the Stormfather was not happy. OB ch 64:

What is weird about this to me is: why would he relent after being pushed by Dalinar? Honestly, it makes no sense to me that Stormfather would have all these ulterior motives and act so suspicious (in retrospect), but then cave the second Dalinar puts his hands on his hips and gives him the stern disapproving dad stare. What can Dalinar do to the Stormfather if SF refuses to divulge the information?  If he can lie and omit and be all sneaky and stuff, why come clean on anything? 

[alder24]

3 hours ago, the_archduke said:

The prologue in the final version was very different than the original one we got years ago.  I suspect that Brandon realized that the Stormfaker theory looked too correct, so he toned it down in the final.  

I think he didn't expect people to search for a Stormfaker at all, so he changed it to make sure people will focus on the Stormfather lying part.

1 hour ago, Erklitt said:

but not eliminated: that whole 'Gavilar will be a Herald' idea. Even in the final version, SF does not completely deny the possibility.

He did, he said he was searching for a champion, not a Herald:

Quote

I have not promised you this boon. You guess it is what I offer, but I seek only a champion.

 

1 hour ago, Erklitt said:

And the words that he says are 'almost them' sound far more like a Herald taking up the burden of the Oathpact than the first ideal of the KR.

Intent was behind those words, it wasn't the words that Gavilar got always wrong, he lacked the proper intent and that one time he was close.

Quote

It’s not about what you are saying.

 

1 hour ago, Erklitt said:

About the second, nothing has changed:

Quote

A Herald… a Herald has died… No. I am not ready… The Oathpact… No! They mustn’t see. They mustn’t know…

It would make sense that Ishar doesn't want the other Heralds to know about this before he has his replacement Herald ready. But if this is the real Stormfather, who are they, and why musn't they know?

Yes and this is what the difference between the Stormfaker and the Stormfather was all about. The Stormfather has some hidden motifs, plans of his own, he lies and isn't the person we thought he was. Earlier I did think he was talking about other Heralds here, that they can't know another Desolation is coming, now I think he is absolutely terrified by the idea of somebody Ascending to Honor and a new Desolation drastically increased the probability of this. And when Honor gets a new Vessel, they will learn the Stormfather and Tanavast's shame - whatever it is. The Stormfather desperately tries to hide the truth of his and Honor's past "crimes" from getting exposed. WaT ch 22:

Quote

Regardless, if you look into the Spiritual Realm… you will see. Perhaps you will see.

“See what, exactly?”

Our shame.

 

54 minutes ago, BinarySecond said:

I think the Stormfather is far more Tanavast than we've been led to believe. How Leras had 16, Tanavast had the Stormfather.

The Sibling has commented how different the Stormfather is - And the timelines aren't matching up on their existinance; Navani is going to figure something with that out.

Yes, the Sibling knew him when she was young, but now the Stormfather is different. That's definitely because Tanavast's Cognitive Shadow merged with the Stormfather. The Stormfather even said in OB ch 113 that this event changed him. And maybe that's why the Stormfather remembers the migration from Ashyn even though he wasn't created back then? He has Tanavast's memories of this, not his own. 

Quote

It is more than that. My memory of all this is … strange. First, I was not fully awake; I was but the spren of a storm. Then I was like a child. Changed and shaped during the frantic last days of a dying god.

 

35 minutes ago, listerfeend said:

What is weird about this to me is: why would he relent after being pushed by Dalinar? Honestly, it makes no sense to me that Stormfather would have all these ulterior motives and act so suspicious (in retrospect), but then cave the second Dalinar puts his hands on his hips and gives him the stern disapproving dad stare. What can Dalinar do to the Stormfather if SF refuses to divulge the information?  If he can lie and omit and be all sneaky and stuff, why come clean on anything? 

That's a good question. I thought that he did it just because he was caught in the act, but this works for the second example, not the Ishar situation. Maybe there is something Dalinar can do and it's related to how Dalinar can speak in small caps, become Unity, grow to be equal to the Stormfather and even accept Kaladin's Ideal? Maybe the Stormfather is scared of confronting Dalinar because it might push him towards finding Honor's core someone?

[LewsTherinTelescope]

9 hours ago, listerfeend said:

What can Dalinar do to the Stormfather if SF refuses to divulge the information?  If he can lie and omit and be all sneaky and stuff, why come clean on anything? 

Presumably he doesn't like doing it when he doesn't feel it's absolutely necessary.

Spoiler

The Stormfather rumbled, and the dark thunderheads calmed. I’m supposed to be better than lies, Dalinar. I should be constant. I am the winds. I do not lie.

 

[listerfeend]

7 hours ago, LewsTherinTelescope said:

Presumably he doesn't like doing it when he doesn't feel it's absolutely necessary.

My point was sort of: why does he do anything he doesn't like to do? It's not very clear to me why he would refuse to do something one second, and then decide to do it the next, just because Dalinar says so.  There hasn't really been anything that SF said 'no' to Dalinar about, and stuck to it. It's always been 

Dalinar: Tell me!
SF: NO!
Dalinar: TELL ME RIGHT NOW
SF: Fine....

16 hours ago, alder24 said:

That's a good question. I thought that he did it just because he was caught in the act, but this works for the second example, not the Ishar situation. Maybe there is something Dalinar can do and it's related to how Dalinar can speak in small caps, become Unity, grow to be equal to the Stormfather and even accept Kaladin's Ideal? Maybe the Stormfather is scared of confronting Dalinar because it might push him towards finding Honor's core someone?

That seems likely, but he has been doing that basically from the moment they Bonded. So, SF has known that this was going to be the path from the jump? That seems like it's sort of obvious, since SF was actively seeking out someone to give the visions to. Seems likely he'd know exactly what he was looking for, but man, things still don't make a ton of sense with him and why he went to Gav, and decided to go with Dal after saying he'd never trust a Kholin again... There's a lot that is going to need to be explained about the SF... I can't wait

[BinarySecond]

Going to Dalinar after swearing off the Kholins is a very odd move.

 

I wonder if the Stormfather was more simplistic but Dalinar's behaviour was forming a proto bond - Like Kaladin had with Syl without saying the first Oath - And this bond was a modifying influence on the Stormfather.