Mazman he/him Posted May 8, 2022 Posted May 8, 2022 Compounding Copper is something not discussed in the Mistborn novels. All WoBs on the topic have been RAFO'd. So, I will propose a few theories I have created. 1. Compounding Copper fills in gaps The idea here is that Compounding Copper will fill in gaps that were lost. Little details you didn't give much importance, things you forgot before storing the memory, etc. 2. Compounding Copper continues the memory Basically, the memory is expanded upon. It adds stuff to the end and/or beginning. 3. Compounding Copper copies the memory You get the idea. 4. Some combo of the three above This one is simple. What if both 1 AND 2 were true? Or maybe all of them? There is not much proof for any of these theories, and nothing to back them up. It could be that none of these are true. I don't know. 2
+Invocation Posted May 8, 2022 Posted May 8, 2022 Personally, I think it's the first one by way of the third one. Copies the memory, lets the Feruchemist restore the original with bits of the copy then allows for the copy to either be stored for restoration of other portions (if there's anything left) or just fade away with the rest of the Allomantic power. Of course there's a very real chance I'm entirely wrong and copper lies along some axis of shenanigans within the Metallic Arts and crosses into some other territory of hilarity.
Lunu’anaki he/him Posted May 9, 2022 Posted May 9, 2022 The first idea sounds like a very very cool ability for the protagonist of a story to have.
EmulatonStromenkiin he/him Posted May 9, 2022 Posted May 9, 2022 I was thinking something similar, Probably memory duplication, maybe that's how Kelsier made so many memory-medalions?
Frustration Posted May 9, 2022 Posted May 9, 2022 My personal theory is that Compounding copper makes it impossible for you to forget the specific memory.
Morningtide she/her Posted May 9, 2022 Posted May 9, 2022 24 minutes ago, Frustration said: My personal theory is that Compounding copper makes it impossible for you to forget the specific memory. So you're saying if you compounded copper while remembering or experiencing something, you would be incapable of forgetting that memory or moment? That's a really cool idea.
Frustration Posted May 9, 2022 Posted May 9, 2022 1 minute ago, Morningtide said: So you're saying if you compounded copper while remembering or experiencing something, you would be incapable of forgetting that memory or moment? That's a really cool idea. No, I think that the memories you compounded would become permenant.
Returned he/him Posted May 9, 2022 Posted May 9, 2022 3 minutes ago, Frustration said: No, I think that the memories you compounded would become permenant. Permanent, clear, and easily accessible, maybe? Sazed's copperminds probably hold far less than the Lord Ruler's, and even he needs to store things like indices to be able to reference them well. The Lord Ruler's memory is quick and amazing, like recognizing Kelsier immediately and remembering details about his failed theft and Mare. Of course, he could be doing some workarounds with compounded zinc to achieve that same effect.
Frustration Posted May 9, 2022 Posted May 9, 2022 Just now, Returned said: Permanent, clear, and easily accessible, maybe? Sazed's copperminds probably hold far less than the Lord Ruler's, and even he needs to store things like indices to be able to reference them well. The Lord Ruler's memory is quick and amazing, like recognizing Kelsier immediately and remembering details about his failed theft and Mare. Of course, he could be doing some workarounds with compounded zinc to achieve that same effect. He also had a reputation for never forgetting anything. Spoiler Brandon Sanderson We mention the Lord Ruler's flawless memory here. This is actually the only time in the entire series that it's mentioned. However, this is an important clue for later. However, as I'm writing this, without being able to hide this text, I don't want to explain too much and inadvertently ruin something. However, if you've finished the book, you might be able to figure out why the Lord Ruler might have a reputation for being able to remember things. Mistborn: The Final Empire Annotations (Oct. 6, 2006)
Returned he/him Posted May 9, 2022 Posted May 9, 2022 Just now, Frustration said: He also had a reputation for never forgetting anything. I recall that one too, but that could also be in line with an "ordinary" coppermind. The event I referenced above is the only time I recall us seeing that incredible memory in effect, and what differentiates it from Sazed's (at least that we see clearly) is the immediacy and depth of detail he recalls. The immediate recall could easily be compounded zinc, but the detail is less obvious and I'd bet it's due to copper compounding in some way. I'd be disappointed if copper compounding was as limited as perfectly recording a memory without removing it from the Feruchemist's mind, but your idea has a bit more meat to it which is exciting. It's unlikely that the Lord Ruler would be bothering to dump every moment of every day into a coppermind and also doing the rote work to also have the information in his mind, and only modestly less unlikely that he's constantly tapping his copperminds like an all-encompassing external storage device. Even then, the sheer volume of information he'd have to sift through would be an irritation, more so with each passing day. That it's consistently been a RAFO suggests that copper compounding has a substantial effect which will be meaningful in a plot at some point. 1
Brgst13 Posted May 9, 2022 Posted May 9, 2022 Maybe copper compounding blocks memory formation in others at the expense of your stored memories.
Mazman he/him Posted May 9, 2022 Author Posted May 9, 2022 Quote That it's consistently been a RAFO suggests that copper compounding has a substantial effect which will be meaningful in a plot at some point. It could also be that he just hasn't finalized what it does. 3
Returned he/him Posted May 9, 2022 Posted May 9, 2022 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Mazman said: It could also be that he just hasn't finalized what it does. That's true, but his answers suggest to me that he's got at least a solid idea for it. So I guess I'll hedge and say it's likely to be really important or really unimportant Quote FireArcadia Is there any use to being a copper Compounder, from a Feruchemical point of view? I think the same point would also apply to an aluminum Compounder. Brandon Sanderson Some combinations, like some abilities themselves, aren't really that useful. That said, being able to Compound copper...that could do some things. Aluminum, not so much. 17th Shard Forum Q&A (Sept. 25, 2012) Quote Questioner I was wondering what happens when you compound copper? Brandon Sanderson I will reveal this eventually. You're getting a RAFO. Do know that not all compounding does cool stuff. Not all of it does cool stuff, but a lot of it does cool stuff. Shadows of Self San Francisco signing (Oct. 9, 2015) Edited May 9, 2022 by Returned
Stormtide_Leviathan Posted May 11, 2022 Posted May 11, 2022 To me, multiple copies seems most likely. It would be vaguely useful for the ability to save knowledge for later while still holding onto it now, but where it would really shine i think is when identityless metalminds come into play. That would let you share memories with people, lots of people at once which would be quite a useful ability. in fact, you may even be able to do some particularly tricky stuff with identity to limit who can access the metalminds. For example, you might be able to do something like "store most of your identity away completely, except for your identity as a member of your family". Then, only people who are part of your family could access the memories (or people who consider themself part of your family, given how cosmere magics work). Or instead of "your family", you could do "membership of some secret organization" like the Set, or the Ghostbloods, or the Sons of Honor. Being able to share memories with people, and to control who can access those memories, seems incredibly useful and exactly in line with how brandon seems to work by introducing seemingly simple abilities and combining and iterating upon them.
Quantus he/him Posted May 11, 2022 Posted May 11, 2022 Doylistically I Duplicating the memory is most likely. Without that mechanism we have to wonder how Hoid got such a specific and suspiciously incriminating Memory of The Sovereign. That being said the WOB's about the Lord Ruler's memory abilities sure imply that there is something specific there. Compounding Zinc instead might explain it, and if he can Copy the memory into the Coppermind rather than Store it, he could likely develop a habit (or savantism) those two compounded metals should let him backup every waking moment for later review.
cometaryorbit Posted May 18, 2022 Posted May 18, 2022 I think it probably copies the memory (and that the coin medallion at the end of BoM is an example of this). It may be a RAFO because this 'copying discrete things through Compounding' process is the same one used to make medallions, except with nicrosil rather than copper.
Trusk'our he/him Posted May 20, 2022 Posted May 20, 2022 Personally, I would guess that Copper compounding would duplicate the memories stored within, since they are a discrete and specific set of things rather than a bunch of raw power like with most other Metalminds. Someone mentioned on another thread once (can't remember who, sorry) that maybe it would have allowed you to "revisit" the memory, almost as if you were there, and that maybe the Lord Ruler used this as a kind of drug almost, remembering the better times when the world wasn't such a blasted wasteland and when he was actually happy.
LordFlea Posted May 23, 2022 Posted May 23, 2022 You would be burning the feruchemical coppermind. I kinda think it would flash you into the memory almost like a stormfather vision, where you walk around and watch stuff.
Dellexe he/him Posted June 4, 2022 Posted June 4, 2022 Personally, I think it works like how the Mistborn Adventure Game describes it. The extra Investiture, filtered through the memory, creates extra details that the original memory never had. The more Investiture, the greater the increase in detail.
ReinyxGrey Posted June 5, 2022 Posted June 5, 2022 Just curious, a thought i had reading through here... If you used a compounded coppermind, and forged it into a spike... could you use hemalurgy to steal memories from someone?
Stormtide_Leviathan Posted June 6, 2022 Posted June 6, 2022 On 6/4/2022 at 4:38 AM, Dellexe said: Personally, I think it works like how the Mistborn Adventure Game describes it. The extra Investiture, filtered through the memory, creates extra details that the original memory never had. The more Investiture, the greater the increase in detail. While that may be what happens, I wouldn't take the adventure game as proof of that. it's not considered strictly canon, so stuff in the books might contradict it 9 hours ago, ReinyxGrey said: If you used a compounded coppermind, and forged it into a spike... could you use hemalurgy to steal memories from someone? I'm sure there is a way to steal memory with hemalugy. I dunno if it's this specifically; it could be though, i dunno. What does happen if you spike someone with a metalmind?
ReinyxGrey Posted June 7, 2022 Posted June 7, 2022 22 hours ago, Stormtide_Leviathan said: I'm sure there is a way to steal memory with hemalugy. I dunno if it's this specifically; it could be though, i dunno. What does happen if you spike someone with a metalmind? It might work the same way that whatever Todium did to Hoid's breaths works... You just know that if there is a power - someone, somewhere, has found a way to weaponize it.
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