Shallan's drawing, page 354, alethi script translation [spoilers]

[jcoop513]

I've been trying to figure out the alethi script translation on Shallan's drawing on page 354.  Can anyone help me out?  I haven't seen any other references to this particular drawing/translation yet, so I'm not sure if others have noticed it yet.

 

It's from this image:

 

 

The script is mirrored (unless I'm completely wrong about this, which is entirely possible), and I think I've made out some of the words, but it's just so hard to make out.  A lot of this is complete guessing, but here's what I have so far (no doubt a lot of it is wrong).

 

line 1: "the statement that intrigues* me though is that of king Nohadon (he/which) implies"

line 2: "Uritheru could be reached (if/by) me ?? (sites/cities) if such a thing" 

line 3: "(our/where/war) (possible/passible/possibly) evidence of the roads ... ...be in place among the"

line 4: "kingdom(s) of today I (leave/have) since (vetoed/visited) ... ... and found"

line 5: "what I believe to be gateways there but the ..."

line 6: "(once/ones) and how to work them it is likely too dangerous to activate them on the"

line 7: "center of a populated city as (a/I) ... ... planned with my uncle"

line 8: "I hope to find them (an/in) unpopulated ..."

 

*"intrigues" was a guess from what looks like "intnegs"; hoping for a misspelling until I'm corrected.

 

Has anyone else figured any of this out?  I was hoping it would be part of the key for the chapter 84 epigraph, but it doesn't seem like it so far.

 

 

Edit: changed translated text, added a few comments (in bold).

Edited March 11, 2014 by jcoop513

[Scriptorian]

I didn't even notice this. The script is definitely mirrored. Ugh. I took me about half an hour to translate just the few lines from Navani's notebook, and that wasn't backwards.

[Mysty]

I think this is line 3 "uritheru could be re(something)...."

and line 5: "what I believe to be gateways there but the ..."

and line 6: "and in how to work them it is likely to dangerous to activate them on the"

 

of course, why is Shallan sketching on the back of Jasnah's paper to begin with? was there no blank paper in the trunk? or is this just a sly way for team Sanderson to keep us busy between stormlight books?

 

will work on more

Edited March 10, 2014 by Mysty

[jcoop513]

Thanks Mysty.  I updated the original post, and I'll try to keep it updated as more translations are posted.

[Mysty]

the word in line 4 after "since" seems to have the letter "vitod". My best guess for its non-phonetic equivalent is "vetoed", but i don't know that "vetoed" fits in context....doesn't seem very Alethi to me.

[jcoop513]

It looked like vitod to me as well, but I wasn't sure.  I couldn't think of vetoed though, which seems to be the closest english match.  I added that to the original post for now.

[Harakeke]

Great eyes! I noticed that the words are written phonetically, whereas Navani's spelling was much closer to English. For example: the vs. thu. Perhaps this is an indication of Shallan's Veden accent?

 

I did some tweaking in Photoshop to try and improve the contrast:

 

I got something pretty similar. Just a few words different here and there:

 

Thu Statmint That Intregs Me Thou Is That Uv Keng Nohudan hch implis

Urithiru Kod Be Rechd If [__ __] [uv___ Md__] Sites If [_____ __] [Thaag]

War Pasibli Evadins Uv Thu Rods [__________] Be In Plas Umung Thu

Kengdums Uf Toda I Lav Sens Vitod [Th_________u] [s______] and Faond

Wut I Belev To Be Gatwas Ther But Thu [____ba] [_dgr] [A____] m

Uns An Hao To Work Them Is Likle To Dangerus To Aktuvat Them On Thu

Senter Of a Populatd Site As I [Ag_________du] Pland With Mi Unkl

I Hop To Find Them En Unpapulatid [_________]

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

The statement that intrigues me though is that of King Nohadon which implies

Urithiru could be reached if [_____] [_________] sites if [____] [__] [_____]

War possibly evidence of the roads [__________] be in place among the

Kingdoms of today I <have> since <visited> [________] [_______] and found

What I believe to be gateways there but the [______] [____] [____]

Ones and how to work them is likely too dangerous to activate them on the

Center of a populated city as I [_____________] planned with my uncle

I hope to find them in unpopulated [__________]

Edited March 10, 2014 by Harakeke

[jcoop513]

I believe so. The "the vs thu" issue threw me off at first. I thought it might have been toou (two) initially, but that pattern is seen multiple times in this image, and "two" didn't make sense contextually. I'm not sure if the difference is a matter of preference, or because this was meant to be a part of a code, or perhaps a way to leave a signature in her writing to help spot a forger.

I'll update the top post with your additions. Thanks!

[Azul]

Nice catch!  I didn't even notice the writing on the page.  I'm guessing it's from Jasnah's notes. 

 

 

ok.. this is odd..  Cannot upvote for some reason.  I'm logged in but the forums are acting as if i'm not.  The icons to read latest post and those that indicate which i've posted in are missing as well.  hmm... 

[Natans]

Thu Statmint That Intregs Me

"Two statements that intrigues me"

perhaps ?

[jcoop513]

It could be, as there may be at least one spelling error in this assuming "intrigues" is even the right word.  I ruled out "Two" in this case because the following word, statmint didn't end in an S, and the fact that the "thu" or "toou" pattern shows up elsewhere without any other number references nearby that I could find.

[Mysty]

I would bet the last word in the first line is "implies" because it fits the known letters and fits in context. "...King nohadon implies uritheru could be reached..."

[Harakeke]

Oh look - suddenly posts appear.  

Yeah, I've been trying to update my post.  [impl _ _ s]  --> implies

 

It's definately "The" [ThU]. That word, at least, is very clear.  "Two" [TUO] would look very different.

 

 

Edited March 10, 2014 by Harakeke

[jcoop513]

Thanks a lot Mysty and Harakeke.  I've updated the post with your updates.  I think you took care of the harder parts. I'm not sure how much of what's left can be extracted from the original image.  If there's any more tomorrow, I'll keep it updated.

 

I've been having issues with the server, so I can't upvote anyone, but I'll do so to your posts later.  Thanks again!

[Harakeke]

[uns] at the start of line 6 could also be translated "ones", which on reflection I think might make more sense than "once"

Edited March 10, 2014 by Harakeke

[Nogzio]

I just found the Alethi writing and was worried I'd have to wait for a translation, thanks guys!

[jcoop513]

I believe I made out "such a thing" on the end of the second line under the text from the drawing.

[Harakeke]

&amp;nbsp;

I believe I made out "such a thing" on the end of the second line under the text from the drawing.

&amp;nbsp;

Ah! In which case the next line probably starts with "Were"

"If such a thing / were possible..."

Here's my latest interpretation.

Words in [] are pure speculation based on context & length.

Words in <> are close to what I see written in the original text.

The statement that intrigues me though is that of King Nohadon which implies Urithiru could be reached [from] [within] cities. If such a thing were possible, evidence of the roads [could] be in place among the Kingdoms of today. I <have> since <visited> <the> [shattered] [plains] and found what I believe to be gateways there, but the [______] [____] [____] ones and how to work them is likely too dangerous to activate them <in> the center of a populated city as I [_____________] planned with my uncle. I hope to find them in unpopulated [__________]

I just posted some speculation on Urithiru in my glyph translation thread that you may find interesting.

http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/6487-thaylen-and-alethi-glyph-translation-spoilers/page-3#entry109296

Edited March 11, 2014 by Harakeke

[ParadoxicalZen]

Apologies for the Necro, but the 'centre of a populated city as i <blank> planned' part could be 'had originally' or ' had Initially' planned'. At least, it makes sense English wise. And the [could] sounds more like [would] given she sounds sceptical

Edited July 21, 2015 by ParadoxSpren

[Sand Master]

Um.... I feel like I've just walked in on a multi-variable calculus class when I was only just introduced to basic algebra. Anyone mind if I ask how the HELL everyone is reading this?

[soulcastJam]

Um.... I feel like I've just walked in on a multi-variable calculus class when I was only just introduced to basic algebra. Anyone mind if I ask how the HELL everyone is reading this?

Wait. You can't?  =)

 

A while back some people figured out how to translate the various scripts we come across.  In my opinion their work is nothing less than brilliant.  

[Sand Master]

You just blew my mind

[natc]

There are people here who can probably write in Steel Alphabet as well. It's a thing.

[hoser]

These seem to be the notes corresponding to the comment in Chapter 89 that follows:  

Now that he saw those pillars from this perspective, he recognized that there was one of them in Kholinar.  It made up the dais upon which the palace and royal temple had been built.  Shallan suspected that Jasnah had tried to open the Oathgates there; the woman's notes said that Oathgates to each of the cities were locked tight.

  As far as we know, Jasnah had not been to the Shattered Plains, which is why she and Shallan were traveling there.  So I think "Shattered Plains" is not correct for the bracketed text, but rather something like Epoch capitals or Silver Kingdom capitals would fit contextually, since we know that she has been to all the other Oathgates. 

 

The mirroring of the text could be because the notes are on the other side of the paper or the facing page and Shallan is drawing on the back or opposite.  In chapter 17 of WoR, Shallan is described as follows:

She turned back to her new sketchbook - one of Jasnah's notebooks that didn't have many pages filled-...

[ParadoxicalZen]

Another thing. It is speculated in this translation is that Jasnah had originally planned to activate them with her 'uncle' but the only one she has, that we know of...is Dalinar, and Dalinar knew nothing of Oathgates at this stage. So who could she be referring too? 

 

In other words

 

'Wut I Belev To Be Gatwas Ther But Thu [____ba] [_dgr] [A____] m Uns' I interpret the ending of this line and beginning of the next as 'means' and not once/ones. I also think that the 'ba' sound is a word ending in B if the whole thing is phonetic

 

"An Hao To Work Them Is Likle To Dangerus To Aktuvat Them On Thu" Are we sure this word could be 'and' and not 'of'? 

Edited July 21, 2015 by ParadoxSpren