Robinski

Lol, no I'm not going to change it, but still, lol!

I could not be further away from malice if I was in Queensland and it was in Portland. When I comment on this subject, it is always because I want either to improve my understanding, or because I really do feel there is a inconsistency in what is happening on the page. I'm delighted to be corrected in either case. If any of my comments have come across as malicious, then I'm truly sorry, and retract them unreservedly. I'm kind of troubled not to be able to ask about things I don't understand, but I can refrain if that's what you want. On that basis, I won't ask the follow-up that I have on the scene under discussion, but I might PM Kaisa on the subject, if you wouldn't object.

Lol - not to mention the denouement on the burning boat...

Welcome, Ghando. Yeah, hope to see you submitting soon (no pressure though, hanging out is cool too!). We're a friendly bunch, happy to read anything, anytime, and always comment from a place of mutual respect and helping (I hope) to help see the wood from the trees. Good luck with the editing, but finishing is good too. That often is harder to do than going back

Lol. Rofl!

I must admit that I was a bit bored through the earlier parts of this submission, maybe the first half (details below the line). It was mostly to do with the numerous descriptions, mostly of people who came and went in moments, which I started skimming, but also the fact that none of the conversations really warranted the term, being very cursory and not as satisfying as I wanted. I thought there was a lack of clarity in the phrasing of parts of the prose, which are complicated enough to induce that confusion. Simpler phrasing in those places would go a long way to pulling the reader through the long passages of description, and would make the dialogue more direct without affecting the complexity of the content. Things improved when Lasila arrived at the table and met the ‘family party’ as it were. I did enjoy those exchanges. I think though that Iluya’s helpfulness was too immediately convenient to Lasila’s need, and so suddenly available that it strained credulity. Finally, cheese before desert? Shocking ;o) <R> ------------------------------------------- “if they were to be absent that illusion” - ??? “A third or a quarter or so, and and of those all but two or three would only know that something was coming” – I think ‘those’ refers back to the guests, but something seems to have fallen out. “before she did something like ‘tch’ aloud” – I think the sound is best marked out. Also, I'm sure what kind of sound this is. What is interpret it as is a ‘tsk’, which is an accepted form of a sound meaning disapproval. “But the coat, the trousers, they were midnight blue” – This is the first mention of blue and we’re on Page 3. I’ve got the wrong mental picture of Savae by this point. “that inauspicious colour” – do we know this from before, do we have a reason for it? “It almost distracted from the fact that they were completely bare-faced” – Now then, we’re in Lasila’s POV. Why would she refer to Savae as ‘they’? This tends to imply that all humans are binary. Is that right? It seems unlikely to say the least. Otherwise, surely Lasila would make an assumption one way or another, would she not? Her thoughts in parenthesis earlier show that she is not sensitive to judgements that a human might find offensive, so why would she be sensitive to Savae’s orientation when she knows nothing about it? “ideal aelin androgyny” – No, hang on, you’re losing me. As far as I can remember, no other aelin has been referred to as ‘they’, it’s all been he’s and she’s – and yet androgyny is their ideal? So none of the aelin comes close enough to that ideal for them to be perceived or referred to as ‘they’ by Lasila? “I never would have imagined.” – This is an anodyne statement. It seems beneath her. “They approached the cluster...” – By this point, I am skimming descriptions, as I find them getting in the way of actual events/actions. “Perhaps, or perhaps you'd find yourself permanently affixed to the sort of woman who would marry that far down” – Confused. I thought the red head was the one who would have been marrying ‘down’ to Ealis’ sister. “Even Eshrin wasn't interjecting much, so Lasila easily grasped that she didn't need to say much.” – This is obvious from the first part – don’t need to tell it. “The edicts of the Sleeping God's priesthood” – If it’s an edict that woman cannot be senators then her thoughts about it being improbable are erroneous. “So there would be at least semi-privacy to be had” – She really has no clue about what an orgy is, does she? Do we know what level of experience she has in carnal matters? I don’t recall any reference to it, but she certainly comes across as being virginal. She doesn’t seem sufficiently nervous about the latter part of the evening. Lasila considers the intendeds dress to be conservative, and yet by the end of the description she’s thinking about her bold choices – these notes seem contradictory. Hmm, “I'd go with lucky, myself” – She’s here to elevate herself and raise the profile of her family, make valuable contacts and generally try to punch above her weight, but she is really undermining that by how she’s acting. Maybe that’s your intention, of course. “But, no, she didn't need to lose her calm after regaining it” – She certainly doesn’t need to. I get no sense of what she means. ‘need’ seems like the wrong word, too bland. ‘mustn’t lose her calm’ or ‘didn’t want to lose her calm’, I think. “is he truly the one who stopped that anarchist that tried to attack the Senate chambers?” – Ah ha, this is the first thing in the submission that has caught my attention. I'm sure we don’t know about this yet. It refers to a character already well established and actually makes me with that Varinen was here. I'm more engaged now that there is some substantive conversation taking place and we’re past the floating around and blocks of description. “Do you know, my lawyer mentioned that his assistant has been needing time from the office. She's due in a few months, you know. It might be that he could use a hand a few days a week?” – The first two sentences here are questions, and the third one is not. All’s fair in love and prose, but this reversal of ‘?’ use struck me as odd, it certainly stood out. “and are were very thrilled indeed to avoid becoming lunch” – I think. “Lasila rather doubted Iluya knew quite so well what it was to be alone” – Some of the prose is overcomplicated. I don’t think the reader should have to work so hard to get the meaning. I feel that this submission flows less well than most of what has gone before. “so she must be of a listed noble house” – I don’t think I know anything about this list and the implications of being on it or not. “hordes of breathless women who inquire after him so” – Where does this come from? I don’t remember any mention of this. “pressing his lips to her wrists” – This seems odd, I suppose you are going for a different take on kissing (or rather not, simply brushing the lips against, if even that) the back of the hand. Long live necessary capitalisation in fiction (and everywhere else!). “Adrichel, of House Melqueth” – It’s the name of a particular house and I therefore should be capitalised. Later on “Lasila of house Vahendra”, and there may be countless that I have missed. If you don’t believe me, just look for the examples in the material that you read. The corollary of course is “And so Eshrin was whisked away by that breathless Senator...” By the same logic, this does not deserve a capital every time you using it when referring to just ‘a senator’. “dagged” – Yeah, okay, but I had to come out of the story to G**gle it. “He should be pleased he's pretty, or else I might be annoyed with him.” – It’s not immediately obvious that she means Melqueth and not Eshrin, although I suppose you would have referred to the latter as being pretty earlier if he was.

Hey King, great to hear from you and thanks so much to reading this. Yeah, I've got quite a bit of work to do on this story, but I feel like it's progressed from the first submission, and can progress again, thanks to all the great comments I've received, including yours!! Best, R

Thank you, Kaisa, great comments. I had one light bulb moment just now reading your thoughts (as written here!). I see I have dropped the ball at the end. It's the traveller that Harth takes over the edge, not the rival leader. At least one thing I will need to clarify, among numerous others. Thanks so much to reading again so soon. I think I will take some time to mull this over and move on (or back) to another project for a bit.

Thanks for the comments, Spieles and Mandamon, much appreciated. I can see the lack of focus, and that the story is not working because of the lack of convincing motivational threads running through it. I'll come back to your comments in detail when I get the chance, but really appreciate you reading this again relatively soon after the first time. I'm reassured that it's improving. My big take-away this time is to work to make the Magdi-Harth relationship convincing and worthy of emotional investment by the reader. Also, I have an idea in relation to the king / traveler that might dial the ending up a bit. Thank you both!

All detailed comments now coded according to MRK’s espoused ABCD method! (A) Awesome; (B) Boring; (C) Confusing; (D) Disbelief; and G) Grammar/typo, (an essential adjunct to the ABCD!). Hey, I'm first! Woo-hoo!! That's where the good news stops, I'm afraid. I can totally understand why you want to rehash this chapter. So, I found the scene in the hospital frustrating and disengaging. I did not find his entry into the restricted ward convincing, but rather disjointed and boring (sorry!) in a man-beats-tight-security trope way. Then the conversation between Oz, Hayden and Dion happens, and reads like a cut-and-paste of things that need to happen. The fact that Dion is related to Claire goes back to my comment last time about everyone being related to everyone else. There’s no need for everyone to be connected to everyone else in this way, is there? It’s really standing out for me know. There are various other notes in this chapter that I'm not overly enamoured with, I must say. Nothing really happens, and the dialogue therefore has to do the heavy lifting, but for me it didn’t sparkle other than in a couple of places. I guess this feels like a placeholder to me. Still, it could do quite a bit to paint the city for the reader, and sell the class divide between the pents and the rest, but I don’t think it achieves that. I’ve noted below how I feel like we’re told there is a class divide, but not shown any compelling evidence of it. Yeesh, I seem to be providing a big fat downer this week, sorry. It’s only because I’ve been well entertained in previous weeks, but I'm not feeling it this time. I'm all for scene or chapter sequels where the pace is dialled down, but that doesn’t excuse them from being effective and entertaining, of course. Still, I'm very keen to read next time, which I presume we will get into the bride / Project Null testing, which I am really looking forward to. <R> ------------------------------------------------ (A) – “I feel threatened” – LOL (G) – “I wait for the eastbound train” (C) – “For as long I can grasp it, this is my new life” – I don’t get the sentiment. Does he mean, as long as I can stand it? (C) – “The style is a perfect match to the painting she showed me” – I don’t think art is best described in terms of perfect matches. The style will be recognisable, of course, and the artist will do certain things in a consistent way, but they are not striving to achieve a ‘match’ with previous works, but to express some different thought or need, albeit it using the same skills. (D) – No, the description of the painting really turns me off the description of the hospital. Who, in their right mind, would hang such a thing in the reception of an institution the function of which is to care for people, and create a confident, capable and reassuring atmosphere on arrival? (C) – How is it that Brick can now show him where Calgary is when it could not before? (C) – “The guy stabs both hands into his fro” – What is a ‘fro’? I don’t get what he’s doing. (D) – The scene with the guy and the medic at the second desk fell flat for me, very contrived. Are we to believe that Brick engineered that situation? I must say, it felt clumsy, in terms of their dialogue and the all-too-convenient outcome. (G) – “but her voice has real seer sneer? when she turns back on the guard” (G) – I think step-mommy should be hyphenated. (G) – “he was just out of surgery from on his leg” – I think. (G) – “Dion is watching our exchange with too much scrutiny” – weird and awkward line, doesn’t seem to be doing anything, imho. (C) – Are we supposed to know who Mira is? (G) – “Pascal’s hands flail.” – To me, flail is a random, chaotic motion – is that really what she’s going? She strikes me as being a controlled person, this comes over flighty and unbalanced. (C) – “Penton is recruiting men to fight the Rex again?” – It’s WRS, I'm sure, but I can’t remember why men don’t fight the Rex, that’s really restricting resources. (C) – Whoa, when you start talking about Fara, I get confused by the use of the name, forgetting who it is, then it chops back between Pascal and Fara in a way that I find disorienting. (D) – “Typical pents,” Liz sighs. “They use every opportunity to keep themselves on top.” – I'm not convinced by the class war theme. I just don’t think it’s been established effectively. People tell me about it, but I don’t feel it’s being shown. (G) – “and we both settle in” – redundant, ‘we’ conveys that it’s both of them. (A) – “Your new hair makes you look like an electrocution victim.” – rofl. (B) – “but then my breathing synchronizes to hers. Time blurs, my lids grow weights and I, too, surrender to sleep” – This close to the chapter, for me, is over-complicated. Also, feels like every story has a description of someone falling asleep (mine too, I admit it!) – like it’s become a cliché.

Hey Wayne, welcome to Reading Excuses! Great to read something from a new voice around these parts. Finally, thanks to prompting by others, I'm trying to apply Mary Robinette Kowal’s ABCD approach (or is it someone else’s and she just promotes it?) Anyway, it goes like this, in case you are not familiar: (A) Awesome; (B) Boring; (C) Confusing; (D) Disbelief; (G) Grammar/typo? (An appendix to the ABCD). Detailed comments as I read below the line, but overall, I enjoyed this story a good deal. I express my reservations over the girl’s age. I don’t see a good reason for her to be so young. For me, it was pretty much unbelievable that should could have survived in business in such a place at the age of twelve, with nothing but younger siblings for security in numbers (presuming that the guardsmen cannot be there every night, as seemed to be the case. So, good job, I thought the story read smoothly, with some nice flourishes and a sound setting. I thought you established the characters pretty well, they were enjoyable if not entirely engaging. I felt that it was the dialogue that held my attention rather than the characters themselves. Nice work. Thanks for sharing and again, welcome to Reading Excuses!! <R> ------------------------------------------- (C) – “Chisa's smallest brother, Pala” – Does this mean her youngest brother, or is he older but smaller? I think saying ‘smallest’ introduces confusion. (D) – “tossed him slivers of copper” – Ouch, sounds dangerous! (C) – “brown as a board” – I don’t really get this description. Are all boards brown then? (C) – “or muck out dog pens” – What do they use dogs for around here? Seems a slightly odd phrase without some kind of context. (A) – “and servants when the spells failed” – I like the immediate introduction of the fact that spells are not flawless and magic has a downside. (A) – “All around him the crowd broke and flowed, never quite touching him, their eyes never looking right at him. It was bad luck. Everyone knew that, but here she was, looking.” – I really like this passage, it conveys good background about wizardry in a compact and elegant form. (C) – “but the look on her face told him what he needed to know” – But it doesn’t tell the reader. I'm not really clear and what to take from this section about parents and children. (A~D) – “Mam had literally built the restaurant with her bare hands, and Chisa was determined to keep it.” – This is a good strong character motivation, but we also see her somewhat hankering after being a wizard (or maybe I'm reading too much into that). These elements might be contradictory, or I might be over-thinking it. (C/D) – “Probably to complain about the poor fare and how he is not going to pay,” – Why would he think this? I was not aware of him being served, but why would she jump to this conclusion? I see no basis for her reaction. (B/D) – “turning the chair and straddling it” – Cliché, unnecessary and seems out of character for her. Why has she gone from being reverential to the wizard to being suspicious/antagonistic and now presumptuous and over-familiar? Does she treat all guests in the ‘restaurant’ like this, sitting down at their tables? (A/D) – The verbal byplay between the two at the table is very good. I was convinced. It had some nice flourished, especially those of the wizard. This said, I am struggling with Chisa’s dialogue to the extent that her repartee seems more sophisticated than that of a twelve year-old. (G) – “and smiled against again before he resumed slurping his noodles” (D) – “Iskir was not called The Thieves' City by outsiders for no reason.” – This is rather familiar. Have you read Fritz Leiber’s Lankhmar books? Absolutely splendid stuff, and there’s Robert Lynn Asprin’s Thieves’ World, set in the city of Sanctuary (i.e. from the law). It just seems like a very familiar setting / idea. (D) – “After Da and Mam passed” – I'm not convinced this was all that clear to begin with. I formed the impression that her parents were still around. It just reinforces the problem that I have believing a 12 year-old has the capacity to do what Chisa does, apparently. (A) – “Her bribes were paid up, and she'd kept her head down, angered no-one” – I do like this line, it paints a colourful picture of the setting. (C) – “Not a dozen cranes could move it.” – Given the level of technology I presume for this setting, I must admit I thought this referred to the birds!! I know that cranes of the lifting variety existed in the olden times (Egypt and all that), but still, that was my first impression. (D) – “thundering under its tons of weight” – This phrase is rather crude and awkward. I don’t like this wording at all. (G) – “to lie still against the cooper’s garden wall” (G) – “and so it looked back to Chisa. Chisa took a long slow breath” – Awkward repetition of her name twice together. (D) – “the great lion's tail thrashed, smashing a chair into a wicker ruin” – Nice phrase, but it’s a massive beast, how does it only smash one chair, and not demolish the whole dining room?

Very interesting submission as, at last, we get the big reveal of the fiendish plot. There are some details below about certain reactions that I was not entirely convinced by, but the biggest is the group’s reaction to the (presumed) scope of the Baldek plot. I think their perspective is a bit narrow. Depending on the scope of it, and how well the plot goes, this could have a huge effect on Methiemum civilisation in the future, could it not, causing their population to contract significantly, tantamount to a kind of creeping genocide. I just felt that certain reactions should be stronger. Also, per my comments below, I'm still unconvinced by the balance and ‘tone’ of the relationship between Prot and Amra. Overall, though, I enjoyed the submission and I'm keen to see how they deal with the situation, morally and physically. I went back and categorised my notes to the ABCDs and realise I don’t have any A’s in there! On the plus side, there are no B’s either, but anyway (A) – the pacing is spot on for me. (A) I like the different character voices and perspectives. I would prefer to have a better handle on them physically, but that might just be WRS, and me not remembering well enough the longer descriptions of the species from Seeds of Dissolution. (A) They really feel like a crew with alliances and tensions, but the same goals and a certain unspoken loyalty. <R> ------------------------------------------- (C) – “They might have even met each other.” – I thought later, when she passes them through, that the customs woman’s acceptance relied heavily on her believing that the Colonel is (was) a majus. I suppose she has the proof of him being able to open the box at all. There is also the vague suggestion that they know each other. I'm trying to decide if I'm convinced that she lets them go so readily, and wondering if it needs a slightly stronger flag in relation to her opinion of the Colonel. (D) – “I can spare five percent, and that’s it,” I preempted,” – For me, here is another sign of Prot’s in experience as a hard-nosed trader. Never, never, never make an offer first, I would have thought. “You want to me to do something else with this medicine” – I'm not convinced here. For all Prot knows, the Colonel wants him to give the medicine away to the needy and make no money at all. He should not be paying the man until the game has played out. Prot holds the card now, surely, having got through customs now. (D) – “The dirty old man was probably just taking the chance to ogle my accountant.” – Really? Where does this come from? I don’t recall seeing anything in the Colonel that would suggest this leeriness, or Prot being anything like jealous or protective (of Amra) before. “No,” I said, honest. ” – I think this would resonate more without the embellishment. (D) – “And a little girl.” – This felt to me a bit like keeping Amra firmly in the stereotype of the little lady who, deep down inside, just wants a kid and a garden. I'm not saying that such a thing is inappropriate, I think it’s just her delivery, and I'm not convinced that he is sincere, even if he thinks he is. (D) – “Can’t we just deliver this baby and take the money?” – I don’t believe his reaction. I've seen nothing to suggest that Saart is so amoral. “It really didn’t seem an effective strategy when Saart explained it that way” – Did you mean ‘did’ seem effective? Because Prot’s being tempted? (C) – “This will actively hurt people” – Will it? I’ve heard them mention sterilisation, but it doesn’t cause pain directly, does it?

Thanks NG, I do appreciate you taking the time, and there are some good comments that I will certainly make use of. Also, thanks for taking the time to explain further in relation to my response, that is helpful. Much appreciated. <R>

Well, after a minor crisis of confidence and giving Silk the run around (sorry Silk!), there is still a vacant slot so here I go, in for a penny... as they say. This second (and final) part of Hold the Bridge is unedited since last week, so you may find similar issues to ones you encountered before. Better to keep the benchmark the same, I thought. Thanks for reading if you have the chance and the inclination - all comments gratefully received. Cheers, Robinski

Well, you certainly weren't vague, NeonGrey. There are some good points in there.

Duly noted

In case you hadn't noticed by now, I'm a flighty old coot with an inferiority complex only matched by the size of my yapper. Soooo, since there are only four subs this week and I did have a request in, I thought I might as well put the second half of Hold the Bridge up, since I've got brilliant comments on half of it at the moment. I won't do that though, unless Silk approves it, as I did pull out, or maybe unless there anyone wants to 'approve' my request in case Silk doesn't return till Sunday night. Or, can I have a slot for Monday 11th July, as an alternative? Cheers, <R>

Brilliant comments. Thank you, Krystalynn. I take great confidence from these and the other feedback that I am making strides. There are some clear and specific targets for further revision emerging from these responses that I will target in another edit. - Fermarald's unreliable description of the horde does not land; - Harth's choices could be more convincing; - I suppose I could cut Cresca, but she is there for a reason - to highlight Fermarald's detachment; I've taken a couple of days to reflect and I think there are only four submissions this week...

I will not be submitting on Monday.

Well, don't I feel silly.

Hey, Kammererite, I guess here you meant 'mental deterioration'? If so, then I'm afraid I don't deserve that credit However, now that you mention it, it's not a bad idea.

Thanks Mandamon, great comments. I'll certainly look at the Sergeant Disconnect (clearly a Robert Ludlum book, or episode of Big Bang Theory). The idea was for Fermarald to paint a picture of the horde that gave one impression then for it to turn out to be unreliable when Harth realises that they are just people. It seems like I'm half way there, but haven't landed the resonance of the relisation through Harths reaction. More work to do there. Magdi's reaction is something I can adjust. I'll look at that again. Thanks again!

Cool beans. Ta very much.

That's great! I always enjoyed listening the WE casts about publishing. I hope it's an offer that you'll be able to accept from a business standpoint, i.e. it's fair and reasonable. Hurry back to WE and listen to their cast(s?) about offers/contracts, I know there's at least one. Or maybe you don't need to do that. Anyway, I always presumed that knowing what to do with your life and being published (in fiction) were not necessarily connected!!