KaladinWorldsinger

Yes I know that? I was responding to the idea that Taln was very broken( in a real sense) and the interlude was shown as proof, but OB perpendicularity moment makes it seem like the effect of a magical madness

I had almost completely forgotten about this interlude and had to go read it again. But if his mind is that incoherent, then why does he suddenly become coherent when Dalinar opens the perpendicularity? He recovers a little too quickly for PTSd-torture-induced madness. His quick fix and reverting back to original state makes me think it's magical madness than real madness in the interlude. Yess I like that. That feels right to me. Like how Kaladin will never get 'cured' of his depression but he will learn to cope with it. So if people's cognitive perception of him changed him( he is more like a spren), do you think he has the normal PTSD torture madness? Because OB's perpendicularity moment really messes with my head. Also the answer with him becoming more like a spren is fine and I can buy it if it happens in the books. It still feels a little convenient right now, you know. Maybe Brandon will flesh it out more and I will be ok with it. I think a more interesting reason he didn't break would be something similar to a tinfoil theory with no evidence at all. The theory was that Taln bonded a peakspren before going to braize and for all this time he had a friend in his pain. I don't think this is true but I would love an answer more like this you know? Just not being alone could be the difference between breaking and not breaking. Maybe he had a fused friend who showed him kindness( Leshwi? Raboniel?) and that was enough for him to carry on? A magical reason will always feel a little convenient

Oh I meant it was very inhumane. I don't know why things got so bad, but if this was the best plan, sure.

I realize that all the heralds are wierd like that but it is also a fantasy series so they don't bother me as much. I give them leeway because they clearly have changed very much due to the torture. Not just the magical madnesses but their personalities. The heralds all prolly started out very loving to humanity but now Ash sneers at our heroes for trying and kalak has simply stopped caring and even ordered some people's deaths as Restates. The amount of the torture they survived is very unrealistic, but since they very clearly broke, I don't mind it that much. But only a handful of people on Roshar knew that Taln was betrayed. If the entire planet believed that he was unbreakable, I could see that. Also the other heralds seem to to show the inverse of their divine attributes, so I don't know Possible, but seems very convenient for Roshar. It also paints insanity as a good thing which is icky in a series about the struggle against mental illnesses. I think BS is trying to fight against the problematic idea that 'the broken are the more evolved' or the 'van Gogh did his best paintings in his depression (not actually true)' type idea. This seems too similar to that. He seems to suffering from the same kind of magical madness the other heralds are facing because he comes back to his normal self after OB's 'I am unity' just like ishar was fixed for a second. He doesn't seem more affected or more 'broken' than the other heralds even though his ordeal was exponentially bigger. He does not seem completely insane to me. I don't think that Brandon has made him just a perfect character, but I think the fandom seems very comfortable in seeing him that wa. I don't know how to feel about that. Am I just exaggerating?

I think my opinion might be highly unpopular, but here goes. To start with, I really loved the character of Taln while reading the four books. I remember being giddy whenever he had a scene. He was my top fav side character. Just one problem. I thought he broke. I took the idea that taln broke as a fact. I am dumb and didn't realise that RoW in particular was hinting that Taln didn't break. The arrival of the everstorm to circumvent the oathpact and taln breaking in the same time frame was a little too wierd. And then Brandon confirmed it in a WoB. Some fans cheered, some fans were surprised and some fans felt vindicated as they already were expecting it. I was less than thrilled. The problem with Taln is he is JUST TOO DAMN PERFECT. I loved Taln when I thought that he tried his best and ended up giving humanity 4500 years of time. He was a very inspiring character. Now he is a freaking god. Apparently, he still has a lot more years of torture he can endure. He is nowhere close to being done. He is basically unbreakable. Taln, as he is right now, is vey antithetical to the themes of SA, and the fact that nobody is talking about it drives me nuts. First of all, NO HUMAN is strong enough to what Taln did. I mean where would you even cultivate the inner strength to endure so much torture? How can you even reach that level of determination? If instead, you think it's more likely that such strength can't be cultivated, you have to be born with it, it still makes Taln an angel who descended to earth compared to the rest of the humans. Because 4500 years is a mind-numbingly long time! A fact that I feel that many people are not giving the importance it deserves. If a random stranger says that he will die for you, you won't be inspired, you would be creeped out! I feel the same way with Taln. No one should be that self-sacrificial. That is not healthy, that is insane and scary. I would stay as far as possible away from him in real life. Can you imagine if a guy like that got angry with you over something? He might chase you to the ends of the earth. Second, he makes the lives of all other characters kinda pointless. The main theme of SA is that 'broken' people deserve to live happy lives (even after making mistakes). Teft deserves love. Shallan deserves love. Kaladin should not kill himself. Dalinar deserves forgiveness and redemption(debatable). But its very hard to say they deserve anything with the presence of an infallible person who has suffered so much more than them. All their conflicts and struggles seem melodramatic compared to the sheer amount of pain that Taln went through without making a mistake. . If the survival of humanity is the highest moral goal right now, Kaladin's life is just not priceless. It's nothing compared to Taln's worth as an 'unbreakable' human being. Because Kaladin just can't hold the desolation back for that long. Example: in tWoK, Kaladin briefly considers abandoning his friends and saving his own life. In WoR he doubts his own friends' love for him in the jail cell. In OB, he gets angry at Adolin for no reason and chides himself. These thoughts are not ooc for Kal even though he is a windrunner poster boy because everyone is fallible and breakable. Everyone makes mistakes and that's fine. Every character in SA has some insecurity about something, even Jasnah. If i must fall, I will rise each time a better man. Finally, he legitimises the oathpact and trivializes torture. The oathpact is a horrible plan and anything else would have been better. No human should be asked for that much. But Taln makes it look like it was the heralds who were insufficient, not the freaking plan. Because of Taln, the other 9 heralds look bad, even though they were amazing people who went through the saddest times possible. SA is a optimistic series, but if you took a herald as the protagonist and went through their life, the desolations alone would put the series solidly in grimdark territory. They really deserve more respect, but who can NOT compare them to Taln? He also trivializes torture. No way around it. Torture is horrific and inhumane. It scars people in irreparable ways physically and psychologically. In a series with realistic depictions of battle shock, Taln sticks out like a sore thumb. If I am right in thinking that the heralds can heal in braize, how many times do you think Taln's genitals were shredded like cheese? Cuz let's be sure, that definitely happened in 4500 years even if the books will never show it happening ( shivers).( I hope I didn't break any coppermind rules with that sentence) I feel like there has to be an actual reason why Taln did not break. I have faith in Sanderson. Every other character in SA feels real to me. Even the evil ones like Sadeas and Rayse. I am just surprised that most fan discourse I see don't seem to question it and seem to think that Taln just weathered it with his own strength, which I find impossible. He must have had advantages right? If the ans is just that Taln is a Super Mega Alpha male chad boy with a golden heart, I will probably keep ranting about it.

I totally could have guessed that. Nice to see another doctor who fan.

It's a bit of conjecture on my part, Life has natural pathways in the spiritual realm, which lets life be similar on different planets. And since Singers are crustations, or close rather, not mamals, those pathways are needed, biology on it's own isn't enough. But female mateform singers have breasts right? So they are mammals. Their biology could be compatible without the need for investiture.

Wait what??? I had no idea this was a thing. Is this some WoB I don't know about? Where does investiture come into the process? Good point. So the rhythm of a song changes if it's sped up? I don't know much about music, I am afraid. Hmm. People with irregular heartbeats and heart problems are probably not healthy enough to be warriors and shardbearers. So I still think it's possible Also, what's with so many people with the name Ookla the something? What does it mean?

Aww are we sure about that? Because humans and singers can interbreed safely, but that would be impossible if their hearts are fundamentally different right? It's not like carapace which is an external structure,The heart is the important organ. I actually don't think this refutes my theory as the heartbeats are not the rhythm of Honor, heartbeats are the beats in the rhythm of Honor. And a song which has a good beat can be sped up with no problem, it will still be the same song. I do think people with irregular heartbeats can't summon Shardblades. Do we know any who can?

Dalinar and navani are really cute Who?

So in an earlier post, I outlined my theory that in book 5 there will be an event called night of sorrows, and one of my main predictions is that the stormfather dies. Tldr: There is a lot of foreshadowing for stormfather's sacrifice and learning mercy by choosing not to kill people in his storm. However this will prolly have unintended consequences. Like the total splintering of Honor's investiture. I think anti-stormlight will be used to kill a weakened stormfather( after showing mercy) in a very specific way. Stormlight will become very limited. The darkest point of the book, where we almost lose hope Now we know humans have a connection to Honor. The rhythm of anti stormlight sounds horrible to Navani, just like how the rhythm of anti-voidlight is horrible to fused' ears. But If honor is completely splintered? I predict that humans will lose that intrinsic connection and not be properly able to sing it. Things will look dire. Fanfic Time: I imagine Navani and Dalinar in a room after something catastrophic happens. Navani laments that it's all her fault. Dalinar would disagree and tell her not to blame herself. He will confess that he thinks there is no way to win against odium. Then he will say something like " If this is our destination, as long as my heart beats, I will keep resisting" Navani rests her head against his chest, somehow comforted by his decision. Then hears it "Honor's rhythm is orderly and staccato" Lub Dub. Lub Dub. Lub Dub. Lub Dub....... "Honor still lives in the hearts of men" I predict that Navani will realize that the beat of a heart( both human or singer) is the beat to sing the rhythm of Honor and be one step closer to reviving Honor Evidence: The wierd ten heartbeats rule for Shardblades. We know that the deadeye spren is getting partially revived everytime. Is it because it literally hears and connects with Honor? Thoughts?

Hoid as a villain? Sounds horrifying, don't know if it's likely, but I love it

I think at this point Kaladin and shallan see their relationship with hoid as friends and they will definitely consider it a betrayal I also think that they will break up. But I don't think Jasnah really would care about the relationship breaking, instead I think the Hoid will do something far more personal. Hoid is right now very involved with the shallan-ghostbloods plot(as of RoW) and I bet Jasnah will get roped into it too with the ghostbloods( this might be when Jasnah learns about shallan's secrets) And their side of the plot seems to be about the unmade. Like finding ba-ado-mishram. We also know that shallan's household had unmade influence over it. Jasnah has said that the thing that scares her the most is the thought of losing her sanity, not being able to trust her own mind. This is very personal because she had a period of 'lunacy' during her childhood, a very formative experience for her. What if hoid sticks an unmade on Jasnah as part of his betrayal? Somehow helps an unmade possess Jasnah? This would be the worst thing that someone close to Jasnah could do to her. Irreparably damaging that trust. The fact that we see Hoid on other planets during the ten year skip makes me feel like the relationship is going to break I don't know if odium escaping has to mean cosmere wide war definitely ( taravangian might be a lot subtler and go quiet for a decade and a half), but I do think that goods betrayal will fail in some way. I don't think he will go soft, he will prolly betray them and then be surprised on just how much it hurts this time. The back half might have him face the consequences of that decision.

She thought that Taravangian becoming odium was the safest thing for the human race. She took a similar bet with Dalinar and he chose right. However she clearly did not understand the consequences of handing taravangian a shard well enough

FYI: I have only read Stormlight Archive, Warbreaker and Mistborn Era 1 and Secret History. This theory is based on what I know about hoid till now. Anyone who has read the other cosmere works, please correct me where I am wrong. Hoid usually is very content with he does. He seems to be in control most of times, nothing really surprises him anymore. He is one of the oldest beings in the cosmere and one of the most knowledgeable. His persona is of a chaotic trickster with no allegiance to anyone. And that is very much true to his real personality. But Roshar is where we have seen him be most... human. Rosharans surprise Wit a lot. For ex he is flabbergasted about something when he sees young Shallan at the marketplace ( we have no idea why. Not important to the theory, just mentioned it) He is at a genuine loss for words when shallan hugs him years later. I don't think he expected for shallan to be affectionate towards him. He is again shocked when Kaladin asks him for a story, saying that 'no one has ever asked that'. Also hoid is at his most wholesome with Shallan and Kaladin, giving them very heartfelt therapy- story sessions.'Accept the pain, don't think you deserve it' and 'You will be warm again' can make me tear up. He is very helpful this time for protecting the planet( instead of Mistborn where he accelerates the danger). He also has a romantic interest in Jasnah. He is also very open about his belief in a god. The main theme is that hoid is developing actual human connections with the Rosharans, something he has never had before. This will end only in tragedy. Because taravangian Brandon has confirmed that Taravangian completely ' hornswoggled' hoid in the epilogue. Hoid did feel true terror there. He did lose some of his memories. Hoid, for the first time, has been actually hurt in a confrontation. Brandon also said that Hoid will find out what happened in the lead up to the contest. (Prolly with the metalminds) This dude has not felt fear in maybe 7000 years, who says Hoid won't overreact? Because hoid was really motivated in having rayse- odium bound to the system. And todium has proven himself to be far superior of a threat already. There is also a lot of foreshadowing that Hoid will betray Roshar. When he talks to Dalinar, he says 'i will burn this world down to get what I want, even with tears'. He repeatedly tells shallan and Jasnah not to trust people. At the end of RoW, Dalinar has to choose between trusting odium and wit I think we will see Hoid betray the people of Roshar in a cruel,stone-cold way just to make sure todium stays bound. I don't know exactly how, but it will happen. The good guys will have to fix what he did too and some damage could be irreparable. He will definitely lose all his friends and this time, he will have genuine sadness and tears. This time? Yes, because hoid has definitely betrayed Roshar before. During the first desolation. We know he knew the heralds (as midius). Isn't it interesting that stonewards are associated with topaz and they swear an oath to be where they are needed? Two things common with hoid? Also doesn't rayse seem just a little too angry when he reads 'cephandrius' name in the contract. Like he really, really hates hoid for some reason. Is it because all of this has happened before, like this? Hoid bring up the idea of the oathpact and the heralds. Because whose plan was this exactly? Who the heralds bring up the idea of eternal torture themselves. No this seems cruel enough to be hood's idea He was meant to be the the tenth herald, the stoneward-ish herald, but the moment the oathpact was created, his business was done and he left the planet, leaving the Rosharans to panic. Taln steps up for the job and the rest his history. I think in this case Hoid knew that taln was going to pick his place. But what he did was still a betrayal. He just doesn't care much This time, he will care What do you guys think?

How do we know this??

Did the humans do very insanely horrible things to the singers? Yes. Absolutely yes Should they be genocides? NO. Simple question: will you murder a baby because his parents, grandparents were Nazis and horrible to jews? Because some of the fused use that justification. Odium doesn't even need justification to kill a baby, he will do it happily. Nale sided with THAT guy. That's just wrong This isn't that hard, bro

I hadn't thought of ash being adopted, honestly that makes a lot of sense For the heralds appearance, there might be a simpler explanation Warbreaker

A desolation causes 9 out of 10 people to die. You are completely fine with that? If nale actually cared about giving singers back their land, he had 4500 years of time trying to make singers and humans coexist. He knows very well that odium does not care about anybody in this war, he only wants soldiers. Just because singers were a enslaved minority does not justify genocide. Most normal humans on roshar don't even know that parshmen were sentient once. And humans have been living on the planet for 4000 years. It is their home too now. Nale has gone full evil to avoid the torture at the end of a desolation he would face as a herald.

Nale deliberately chose to side with odium, knowing full well odium can do (attempted genocide, abnormal wars that threw people back to the stone ages). Even with all that information, he chooses to side with odium. That is amoral and evil. He also somehow has a fifth ideal bond with a highspren. So clearly spren bond doesn't actually indicate any moral knowledge. If nale has indoctrinated the other skybreakers, then maybe they should not be judged. But nale has gone full evil

I would guess that that role is filled by wit now. What's with all the super old dudes falling in love with Jasnah anyway?

What?? When? How? What??? Lol

Can someone tell me which direction is the shadesmar sun in rosharan CR? It hangs in the sky but near which horizon? East or west? The coppermind article doesn't mention it Preferably with a quote?

The proper title is King Lopen the First, airsick lowlander

Oh the Tashikki definitely are associating the sun with odium. The Name is Nun-RAYlisi like Rayse. He is also the enemy of their god, meaning we can be sure that the god of gods in this case is definitely not odium( it's probably ishar) There is no association with the shin sun god to evil. Instead szeth thinks of himself as evil and clearly feels shame in sunlight. Also the purelakers, like Tashikki, believe in two gods, BUT they they believe in never covering yourself from the sunlight. Their enemy of God is Vun-Makak or something, which seems a clear odium parallel. So we can be sure the sun is not always odium is not always god of gods