therunner

True enough, solely due to weight of their bodies. Though I will point out that largest Koloss are 12-13 feet, i.e. about 2x the size of human, so their muscles are about 4x the size of what is feasible for 6.5 feet tall human. So it is odd that coincidentally Koloss top out roughly where 4x the human strength is.

Electricity was quite old news by WW1, WW1 is about as as far from comprehensive theory of EM (and many inventions are older than the theory) as iPhone is from invention of integrated circuit. It is within their capabilities to e.g. electrify a ship so Fullborn cannot land on it, or to create electromagnets strong enough to strip Fullborn of most of his combat metals (so no superspeed for him). With that in mind, you could design a trap.

Argument can be made that Koloss are large because of the spikes, in that they grow into their 4.75x strength, and smaller Koloss are weaker. It would be interesting question to ask.

Yeah, but Koloss don't fight smart, don't have Invested powers and don't heal. Which can be taken away by simple Reverse Lashing. Any piece of equipment that is not aluminum can and will be taken away from Seer. So if they have shield, first take it away, then proceed to break ankles. Thinking about it, Seers are basically limited to non-metal weapons (and that assumes they must have prepared before hand). If they used regular weapons/shields, they would be without them about 10 seconds after start of battle. Good luck blocking deadly blow from a spear or sword with bare hands. Why would Windrunner raise hand? They hold sword/spear in front, and infuse the sword/spear with Reverse Lashing (or at least the handle). No need to raise hand or anything. And again, they don't move it to where Seer would be, they hold it in front of them, and use Reverse Lashing to possibly drag Seer into it. Greek fire and poisonous gas I grant you, thought those cannot be wielded by a single person But throwing plague infected bodies is not a WMD. Yeah, but my point is, we don't know how it was used. Did she pull it out because they were loosing, and kill a thousand soldiers in ten minutes? Did she run around for full fight? We don't know. But we know that Nightblood eats a lot of Investiture, and he eats more the longer he is drawn. Solely based on that, she probably could not have kept it drawn for hours on end. Also, Vasher did not kill her just because he was horrified of what Nightblood and Shashara did, but because of what they did and because she wanted to share knowledge of how to make weapons like Nightblood. Basically, his reason was less 'holy-expletive that was horrifying' and more 'holy-expletive this cannot be allowed to get into anyone's hands', sort of nuclear Non-Proliferation argument.

It can, just blow him up. Difficult to set up, but possible (e.g. lure him onto a ship that is rigged to blow up for example). As long as you can separate his body from Gold metalminds, Fullborn dies relatively easily. Fullborn still has to take time to Compound his stores, then he is vulnerable (see Miles, who regularly has to get Gold to be able to do what he does). Also, 20k of Metalborn is across the entire population, most of them won't be combat ready (too old, young, infirm). At best you could get ~8k Metalborn, but many of those would not have powers suited for combat (even if we assume that all powers are equally likely), roughly only 2/3 of them would have combat ready powers. So you have one Fullborn, few Mistborn and Feruchemists, and ~5-6k Mistings and Ferrings who have powers somehow useful to war effort.

Well, if we assume one side can use their powers non-stop for hour (Seer) fair assumption is that the other side can do the same. So squires have enough Stormlight to be lashed at several lashings, to cover large surfaces in Full Lashing for minutes at a time etc. But, yeah, I agree we need precise measurement. Seer's use Solid Investiture (well, alloy), so plausibly hour of atium burning is human sized sack worth of spheres, since Solid Investiture is the most dense form Yes there is, just use attacks that target large areas, so Seer cannot dodge them. Or limit their options, like with using Full Lashiing to restrict their movement. Seer's are still human. Don't have books on hand, but Szeth does it few times, and Kaladin in RoW infuses large areas at once, including by 'throwing' Stormlight away from himself. Two are enough, Seer cannot defend both from front and back. And if enough Seer's are immobilized, Windrunner can gang up. And Seer cannot block stone lashed at their feet, and dont have A-pewter to resist pain, so that is viable tactic. Windrunners engage in 'honoroble' 1 on 1 combat solely to survive Kaladin literally says that duels benefit them, and he wants them to continue as long as possible so they don't lose people. Windrunner would absolutely kill you in non-duel (see, well everyother fight they are in that is not with Honorable ones). Seer's were dying even against Koloss, and even prior to running out of Atium (if I remember right), they are not unstoppable by someone without future sight. Atium is also not pure Godemetal, and can be pushed/pulled, so it is considerably different from Shardplate/Shardblade. But thank you on WoB on Shardplate, that is indisputable But Reverse lashing they will only see it is applied to some surface, they won't be able to see what it effects, nor what its range is. They cannot protect against that at all. Addressed above, Windrunners are doing those duels only because it is advantageous to them. And you can take 2 vs 1 if you establish Full Lashing perimeter, which second Seer cannot traverse. And so will Seer's ankles, which is quite painful. And while they are out of it because of pain, just stab them with dagger. But Seer cannot see their own future. If all Windrunner does is stumble a bit because body is now impaled on their weapon, all Seer sees is Windrunner stumbling, and maybe that they have some Investiture in their hand. In this tactic, Windrunner does not move at all, it is Seer that moves. And since Seer does not see their own shadows, they cannot properly react to it. Probably should have specified, battle with medieval armies That WoB does not say anything about how Nightblood was used in the battle. Heralds are also clearly on another level in general (10 of them vs however many Fused), and Taln seems to be step above other Heralds. Yeah, that is my point If you strip away all the context it sounds dumb, just like saying Fused are being defeated by a bunch teenagers lacks a lot of context. Not to mention, we don't yet have end to the first arc, so there can still be revelations happening as to why are current Radiants so proficient despite lacking teachers (Honor lives in heart of men anyone?). Have you tried to pick up some sport you were pretty good at after not doing it for a few years? Fused are that times a literal thousand. And Vin is not even 20, and beats far more experienced Mistborn left and right, a few Inquisitors and two gods for good measure. We are reading about exceptional individuals, not your run of the mill people. They were made with more care? Odium does not seem to care too much about his servants, but Honor used to. Plus 10 Heralds plus human kingdoms (sometimes in literal stone age) were able to stand against Thunderclasts, Unmade, Fused, Regals and Singers. By all we know Heralds must be far more powerful than run of the mill Fused, they are more on the powerlevel of Unmade if anything. Fused and Heralds never were on the same level, and were not meant to be.

Jasnah had her powers longer than Kaladin, and is more advanced in her Oaths for most of the story, and yet has exactly zero squires. Shallan had her powers for similar length of time as Kaladin, and had about 4-5 squires. Kaladin (and other Windrunners of 3rd Oath) have between 10-15 squires each. It is literally about twice as much, and it is quite noticeable. Radiant can take back Investiture they used to power a Surge. But, e.g. in Plate of another Radiant they could not use Surges, due to it being keyed to different Identity. I assume the process of using Investiture with Intent to fuel a Surge is what keyes it to a given Radiant, since Radiant can alse re-infuse spheres, and those can still be used by anyone. So Stormlight powering a Surge = Keyed to given Radiant, Stormlight only held = unkeyed to any particular Radiant.

Several minutes at minimum? That is usually how long Full Lashing lasts typically. And since assumptions is that Squires have enough Stormlight for hour, I assume that means they have enough Stormlight to actually use their abilities for an hour. Harder to influence, not immune to Reverse Lashing. If it makes them stumble into Full Lashing, that is enough. And we see Reverse Lashing affect objects on ground as well, when Kaladin uses brush infused with it to steal case full of spanreeds. So there is that. Elend is caught off-guard, Squire would not be (if we assume both sides know about the powers). Elend has no way to immobilize the Seer, Squire does. Elend could not just fly around Seer, Squire can. Elend tried to engage Yomen in close quarters, Squire would not (at least not without Immobilizing them first). We don't know that Shardblades have Atium shadows as far as I know. But we know that sufficiently Invested objects cannot be detected via steel lines, so perhaps they would not cast Atium shadows either. Either way, put Full lashing circle around Seer, and Seer is locked in there and you can start painting the inside to trap Seer. Seer has no way to avoid it then. If Seer tries to jump, use Reverse lashing to pull him back. Not standing in place, physically rooted in place, if you cannot shift your legs at all, you are severely limited in your range of movements (unless you want to fall over). Once immobilized like that, Squire could throw Full Lashing on him, and then topple him (e.g. by Lashing some larger object at Seer). Seer can no longer dodge, they are just human with no Pewter enhancements or anything like it, if they physically cannot dodge, they will get hit. Then, when they are glued to ground, you can stab them at leisure. Alternatively, just get two Squires attacking at once from different sides, Seers cannot block both at once. Easy and done. Another option, Lash a spear fast enough at their immobilized legs to break them. They cannot block that (not effectively), and with broken legs they topple over, get fully immobilized, and can be stabed at leisure by a single Squire. So Seer cannot afford to strike someone with healing? Give me one example of IRL battle were unseen weapon of mass destruction was unleashed, and killed possibly thousands. Also, we don't even know if Nightblood was wielded throughout the entire battle, it is possible Shashara pulled it out as a last resort, and used it to end the battle relatively quickly. But since we know that Nightblood eats exponentially more the longer he is out, that 50000 Breaths are a gigantic amount, I think we can comfortably say Shashara could not have wielded Nightblood for hours. Five Schoolars simply did not have enough Breath to keep it fueled. Unlikely, he was weaker. Fused have carapace in a lot of places that can be about as strong as Steel. Vin has no way to hurt them without using Duralumin steel pushes, Duralumin Pewter punches, which leave her open for a counterattack (not to mention she has to extinguish other metals to use Duralumin). The only ace in the hole Vin would have is Atium, and even that is questionable against some Fused. Row spoilers: Also, all Fused are now at least a bit insane, since they have been Cognitive Shadows for over 5 millenia. Of course they won't be as effective as they were when they started. I don't think you need that much practice, Kaladin uses it before swearing first Oath instinctively. And when restricted in RoW, pick it up very fast. The main thing there is Intent, which is quite straightforward (pull that stuff to yourself). Well Fused are far more insane than in past Desolations, that alone makes them less dangerous. And even so, they are still quite challenging. I would say they are no more joke than TLR, who fell to a teenager with less then a year of practice, despite being a fricking Fullborn No, they had possibly hundreds of years of experience, and thousands of years of being locked away on Braize. If they practiced there sure, but from what we hear, I don't think that is the case, if I am not mistaken they are described as 'sleeping'. So if anything, current Fused are thousands of years out of practice. Also, current batch of Radiant is more skilled then Fused expected, and some Fused note multiple times how quickly humans are coming to Surges. And Honor's restrictions are falling away, if that means anything. So at the same time Fused are weaker than they used to be, and Radiants are stronger then Fused expected.

Ah, fair Well, under effect of Supperssor fabrial which severely lowered his effeciency, Kaladin was still able to easily paint entire hallway in Full Lashing just on a couple of spheres, which are far less then one hour worth of Stormlight. Also, you can use Reverse Lashing to pull Seer into painted Full Lashing, Seer cannot see Reverse Lashing nor react to it properly. Fair, but Squire can tank a couple of blows, which Seer cannot. If both sides know about both powers (fair assumption) then Seer will know they have to land crippling blows, or sever spine for any efficiency, which limits what attacks they can do. But it won't help them dodge Full lashings or Reverse Lashings. Conversely, Windrunner will know to keep distance, and with their superior mobility can easily achieve that. Second, they know they have to immobilize Seer, and they have tools for the job. I don't think so, All Windrunner has to do to win is apply Full Lashing to seer once, and then sever blood vessels in their legs and wait for Seer to bleed out. They can achieve that either by trading one blow for one touch, or by painting enough of ground with Full lashing to trap Seer, or by painting ground with Full lashing and then using Reverse Lashing to forcibly pull Seer into it. Windrunner has a lot of options on how to limit Seer's mobility and then those immobilized body parts. We don't know how long that battle was, it is possible it was over after couple of minutes for all we know Also, Nightblood was weaker at that time, it is possible he was drawing in Investiture more slowly back then.

Thing is, Squire does not have to fight Seer in close quarters, they can immobilize them first with Full lashings, and then cut their legs (which cannot move) and let them bleed out. Hour worth of Stormlight would be more then enough for this tactic. Alternatively, they can use Reverse Lashing on Seer to impale them on Squires' weapon (hold out weapon in front of you, use Reverse Lashing to pull Seer onto it), since Seer cannot see their own Future, and Atium sight would only show Squire standing there with weapon out. Edit: Probably Vasher and Phantoms, Amaram's army was still basically ordinary people. Same for Marsh and Koloss, they would win. And so would Elend and 200 seers I think.

If Windrunners can't have shields (and lets face it, with reverse lashing, nearly anything can serve as shield, since you don't have to maintain contact), I don't see why seers get bows. The only danger is Elend, Seer vs Windrunner squire goes to squire easily (spray full lashing around Seer, close in to immobilize them, then use Reverse Lashings to pull them apart or simply shoot them full of rocks), and Elend's ranged offense can be entirely eliminated via Reverse Lashing, and Kaladin has range advantage in melee. I think Elend would get overwhelmed, since his Seers would fall sooner. Edit: Also typical advantage of Seer is not so strong against someone with Healing, who can simply tank a killing blown to land killing blow on Seer. Seer's are completely physically inferior to Squire, who is stronger, faster, more nimble, do not tire, and heal their wounds. So does Vasher have enough Breath to keep Nightblood drawn for an hour? Because that is absolutely obscene amount of Breath, Nightblood draws exponentially more the longer he is drawn, and we have never seen him drawn for longer than few minutes at a time at most. If he does, then Vasher alone could probably kill all of that army, if not, good tactic would be to throw down Nightblood and let it do its thing, Koloss would slaughter each other with it, and Vasher is free to use all of his Breahts and Phantoms to fight Marsh.

We don't know, but the limit is above storing all of the attribute, so you cannot reach 0 grams, 0 Kelvin etc. (https://wob.coppermind.net/events/105/#e1096) Most likely you could not die from malnutrition, because in some Invested Arts, body uses it keep itself alive (see F-Gold, A-pewter) even when user is not conscious. Practically speaking, I would expect the limit to depend on the given metal, but generally being in the ballpark of single-digit, low double digit percentages of attribute.

I guess reverse event horizon is a good description. It would be less like the object becoming more massive, and more there is a force that acts to counteract attempts to carry Investiture away from system. Well, neither Kelsier nor Wax know anything about realmatic theory, so I would take their statements with grain of salt. I think instead that what they see is Innate Investiture, and since we know that energy, matter and investiture are the same (in the same sense IRL matter and energy is the same), it would look the same. Yeah, possibly.

Well, mass is still relevant, the heavier the object the difficult it is to accelerate it. I imagine Connection to system acts sort of like a force that counteracts any attempt to move Investiture away from system. Within system it does nothing (or next to nothing), but closer to the edge of system you are, the stronger the force becomes. In that way it acts kinda like strong force, which also becomes stronger with growing distance, unlike the other forces we are familiar with. I think objects would be still beads (in Rosharan cognitive at least), but they would probably be glowing or something like that. It is interesting that metal glows in Scadrial CR, but does not seem to have similar effect in Rosharan CR.

It is possible, however I think CR or PR it would work the same way. The Investiture comprising or sufficiently suffusing the objects/entities is bound to be in certain location, and CR and PR both are location dependent. I mean objects CR representations typically track their PR manifestations, so traveling in PR inevitably leads to movement in CR as well.

I think there is a WoB (though I cannot find it right now) that says that even travel in Physical realm is impossible for objects/entities bound to given system. The example given is that (SA spoilers I guess?)

Possibly, however the voice merely says that "They are all the same". And since we know that matter, energy and Investiture are the same thing, this makes sense. That alone is not evidence he can see into CR (much less SR), only that with powerful enough steelsight, you can possibly detect not only metals (or anything possibly magnetic) but also Investiture. I don't think it is anything more than something along the lines of powerful enough Life sense. Do all Awakeners see into SR? Steel lines are spiritual in nature because they are Connection formed in SR, however that does not mean their visible manifestation for Metalborn is them seeing into SR or CR. And there is a difference, while most things have manifestation in all 3 realms, seeing manifestation of a thing in PR, does not mean you see into CR or SR. And I don't see a reason why it should, since what Wax experiences can be explained by Investiture manifested in PR. It seems to me that lately all the Metallic Arts are getting heavily speculated upon, and stretched into increasingly extreme powers, and this feels like that to me. There are some metals that allow user to peer into Spiritual realm, they are Gold, Electrum, Atium and Pure Atium (and their other alloys possibly). I don't know why should physical metal like Steel do both Physical thing and spiritual thing at the same time.

Note that Wax has literally zero experience with CR, much less SR, so him saying he sees 'souls' is at best poetic description of seeing people, and possibly some more physical aspects of Investiture in them. There is no evidence that steelsight, even of such power, lets you see into CR.

Radiant healing primarily gets more efficient, and better at healing spiritual damage at higher Oaths. At 2nd Oath, Kaladin healed broken legs after a fall (comparable to ones Miles) had fast enough no one basically noticed. It was not as fast as Miles, but he still healed multiple fractures around a second or so. So Coinshot would have to try against even 1st Oath Radiant. By Order Windrunner far better mobility than Coinshot, and can use Reverse Lashing to protect against coins. Coinshot has next to no chance. Skybreaker again, far better mobility then Coinshot. Though no defense, and only offense is Lashed rocks + whatever weapons they have. Again Coinshot has little chance, but a bit better. Lightweaver, Coinshot has no idea where to shoot, while Lightweaver can sneak nearby and kill them. Elsecaller, hard to say, depends on how quickly they get access to Soulcasting, and how proficient are they. Edgedancer, any glancing hit is a miss thanks to Abrasion, mobility is about on par (Edgedancer far faster on ground, but Coinshot can jump if heavy metallic object is nearby). But if they had some seeds and used progression on them, that could let them make makeshift defense structures, and reduce option for Coinshot. Wood is sufficient to stop Coinshot, so grow some and use it for defense. Stoneward: With Cohesion and Tension they have basically lightweight steel armor on at all times, except made out of leather. Coinshot cannot penetrate that (they cannot get even through wooden shields). If they can use Stoneshaping, then Coinshot possibly loses anchors. I think Coinshot would struggle to kill most 1st Oath Radiants, but on the other hand, most would struggle to get close enough to kill Coinshot. But all in all, I think 1st Oath radiant has advantage for about half of the orders. At the end of the day, single solid hits takes out Coinshot, but 1st Oath Radiant can take multiple and keep on going. I would say the big question here is, how experienced are the Radiants? Because some Orders have all of their Surges available, and with higher Oaths get Blade, Plate, better spiritual healing, and greater efficiency with Stormlight. But they could still do everything else with Surges already at 1st Oath, only possibly lacking practice, because they are new to this. So do we consider equal amount of experience? I.e. Coinshot has 5 years of practice, and 1st Oath Radiant also (only having been stuck at 1st Oath?).

Did you read WoK Prime? Because there is possible explanation for this hidden there. WoK Prime spoilers

I think there were two 'bounding' events. First, Honor restricted Surges after destruction of Ashyn, which limited capabilities of all Surges accessed through Surgebinding of Rosharan system (access through any combination of HCO). These started falling away with death of Honor (so Bondsmiths can now manipulate Connection more generally, Stoneshaping might start getting more destructive, etc.) Second, Ishar (possibly with assistance of Honor), reformed wild Surgebinders into Knight Radiants. Personally I think this included addition of Plate (and possibly Blade), and the strict gating using Oaths. RoW spoilers This would also explain why wild Surgebinders were such danger, since they did not necessarily have to swear such restrictive Oaths (or such formal Oaths). I see that possibility as well. Personally, I think the part spren mimicked was the bond between Honorblade and Herald, which granted them surgebinding. The Blade form came only after Ishar reformed into Knights. I do agree that the healing can be a bit much, but various RoW discoveries could limit that.

I would offer additional perspective that could be helpful, in that while most Invested Arts are 'natural' (side-effect of Shard investing a system), the most powerful ones have been somewhat modified by magic users (or at least so it seems). On Roshar, wild Surgebinders were "bound"/organized by Ishar into Knights Radiant (and other Heralds even call them Ishar's Knights, suggesting quite strong connection). And when we look at powers they get, they are directly suited for warfare, either in direct combat or in support roles. But all get Plate and Blade, which are clear combat tools. Personally, I think wild Surgebinders had access to Surges, but had neither Blade nor Plate, and Ishar (possibly with help from Honor) modified the way Nahel Bond functions for them to include these two provisions (and possibly others). So from this angle, strength of Knights Radiant (it is even in the name) makes sense, since they were at least partially designed for combat, unlike most other Invested Arts. Honorblades are similarly directly intended as weapons of war, not just accidental Invested Art. And on Sel So overtime, as other worlds get better at realmatics, they too could further empower their Invested systems. Of course, neither Roshar nor Sel will stand still either, however there is also regular technology to help bridge the gap (e.g. magitech of Roshar vs regular tech + Medallion tech of Scadrial).

There is one thing that would really ruin Fullborn's day, and that is sufficiently powerful electromagnet. Now, not all metals are magnetic, so only some metalminds and vials would get stolen from Fullborn, these would be (most likely) Iron -> so no weight changing for pushes/pulls and no pulls Steel -> so no superspeed movement and pushes Tin -> so lost senses Zinc -> no mental superspeed, no rioting Cadmium -> no "force fields" from overlapping speed-bubbles Bendalloy -> no speed bubbles Net result of this, is that Fullborn is left without mobility (no Iron/Steel), lower capacity to perceive danger (no Tin, Zinc) and lowered ability to avoid danger (no Bendalloy), and with exit wounds were metals were ripped from body. As such, if this attack was successful, regular guns and explosives can be used to finish off Fullborn, who at that point is dangerous primarily through A/F-Pewter, A-electrum and Duralumin Soothing. Sufficient explosives should blow away metalminds away, and so kill Fullborn. Also, since compounding can cause Savantism in Feruchemy, loss of those metalminds could also have severe side-effects on Fullborn (e.g. without F-steel they would be slugish, similar to how without A-Tin Spook's senses were too weak). In ultrastrong magnetic fields others could be drawn as well, but WW1 tech would be insufficient to produce such electromagnets. (Sidenote: Bendalloy has melting point of only about ~70 degrees Celsius, so Fullborn cannot do much with Brass, lest they melt it away )

Aluminum Feruchemy might be outlier, it is possibly what is stored simply goes away, and so Aluminum never becomes Invested.

You have to build factories to do that, and those are highly susceptible to sabotage via Soulcasting, or Stoneshaping. Single Reverse lashing on a piece of metal tied to Windrunner would divert vast majority if not all bullets. In previous thread I ran numbers on it, and Reverse Lashing is sufficiently powerful to divert bullet by ~10 cm per 1 meter of distance at minimum (possibly up to nearly 50 cm per 1 meter), so in dogfight it would be very good defense. And Windrunner is far smaller target than bombers/fighters those turrets were useful against, they are ~1/10 the size , so targeting them will be incredibly difficult even without Reverse Lashing. You have Reverse Lashing and/or Plate for protection, and plate would resist bullets well per WoBs. Additionally, we have seen walls 15 feet tall, 10-30 feet wide and 4-6 feet thick being Soulcast in the middle of battle previously (Jasnah in O), so it would be doable. Or you can do it from Shadesmar if need be. And you don't have to soulcast entire wall, really piece of rock 1 meter in diameter would down the plane if it ran into it. Tanks are hilariously weak against Stonewards/Willshapers, they can simply render the ground underneath them liquid, and tank is completely immobile with basically no chance of recovery. Similarly Lightweavers/Elsecallers can render air around tank into mud/rock, and render it immobile that way. Basically 4/10 Orders can on demand create nightmare scenarios for tanks. And you can blast aluminum away, since pure aluminum is quite soft metal, so lashed rocks would strip it away eventually. Or just use Soulcasting to set the tank on fire, crew wont enjoy that, or Soulcast air inside the gun barrel into rock, and watch as the tank blows itself up. Well, the location is Roshar per OP, and we assume Shin developed the tech.