Trusk'our

Yeah, seems like it's at least in a similar category from what I can tell. Thanks, I appreciate it

For a long time, I've wondered just how much faster does Allomantic pewter actually make you. It would certainly be useful for determining just how much you could siphon off as an A-pewter/F-steel Twinborn for extra speed. Okay, so we from when Breeze rode away from Cett's army in WoA that it was mentioned that Vin could keep up with his galloping horse. I feel that this is the best example we have right now to figure out Allomantic pewter's enhancement to speed. A thoroughbred horse can run between 38 to 44 mph, though that is without a rider. With a rider, it drops from 38 to 32 mph, and Breeze isn't exactly a light man. Plus, his horse was already exhausted if I recall correctly, so I'll ere on the slow side for the horse's speed and say it was probably running around 32 to 30 mph. Vin mentions that she doesn't exactly love running in TFE during her extended Pewterdrag with Kelsier; she's not a couch potato, but she isn't going to be running any marathons without a boost from pewter as she hasn't honed her ability to do so. That said, she's also a bit stronger than other Allomancers in terms of raw power (Ham mentions this during their sparring in WoA and Kel when her tin lets her see light sooner in the cave hideout in TFE), so this very well may compensate for her lack of natural athleticism. As such, I think I'll just say she's going to get the average speed for an athlete to cover this discrepancy. I was going to factor in Vin's 5' height, but there are many conflicting sources that say it does and doesn't (here's a few of them; link, link, and link). As such, I think I'll omit this from Vin's total running speed. What's more, it seems that Vin is sprinting in the scene with the galloping horse instead of jogging (as would be seen in a longer marathon-like run). Okay, with these in mind, Vin's sprinting speed without her pewter is probably going to be around 17 mph. Her enhanced speed lets her move closer to 30 mph when sprinting. Soooo, this means that standard Allomantic pewter's speed may grant you around double your normal speed, at least when Flaring. Despite this number having a LOT of variables I had to fudge, I think this is at least somewhat accurate. If anyone has other ideas on calculating this speed (or would like to point out any mistakes I made with this), I'd would love to hear it though

Nice to meet your acquaintance! What's your favorite magic system, and why?

That could be the case, but the way it was worded lead me to believe that Brandon was referring to Hoid's lingering Dawnshard effects on his Spiritweb. I disagree with the idea that you cannot fill a Hemalurgic spike with an entire functioning Spiritweb. I think that you could do it, but that it would be highly impractical and would likely require multiple hacks to make function (such as Awakening or finding other ways to stick extra Investiture to the spike), but I see no reason it couldn't be feasible with some dedicated work and knowledge. For our purposes of our discussion though, I think you have a point; Savantism seems to be a convergent property of the entire Spiritweb, and as such it would probably be unlikely that you could realistically steal Savantism effects via Hemalurgy. That's certainly possible. Perhaps, though if his powers still function normally I'd say they should be in about the same "location" as a normal Invested individual's. If his warped Spiritweb does significantly affect those powers and attributes however, there's a good chance you're correct in the difficulty one would have in properly spiking Hoid.

We have an old WoB stating that you cannot steal Savantism from someone via Hemalurgy (WoB). However, we have a far newer WoB that states if Mraize were to steal part of Hoid's Spiritweb via Hemalurgy that it would have altered effects (WoB). Do you think this means that while you may not be able to transfer Savantism itself, that the powers or attributes taken from a Savant would be altered in some way? Perhaps you could get a slightly greater benefit from an A-pewter Savant's Allomancy, just not to the same extent as the Savant themselves. Or perhaps if you stole strength via Hemalurgic iron it would be weaker in that Savant due to their Spiritweb's altered state.

True, the Fabrial tech in RoW shows that they do have some pretty neat things up their sleeve. I would still argue that the Metallic Art's powers are easier to mass produce and augment, however. Aren't those supposed to be physical manifestations of Spren? Most likely Radiant Spren, I would think, which would severely limit the number of them you could make.

Yeah, A-pewter and breathing Stormlight aren't the same; pewter seems to last longer, adds more strength, and balance. Yup, that's the truth of it. A Pewterarm will always be at a disadvantage against a Radiant holding Stormlight unless they use some other magic to bolster themselves or cheat (which, really, should always be the go-to in a fight anyway ). Well, to be fair, A-Atim is very, very hard to get ahold of on present Scadrial, and it Burns very quickly. Compounding isn't very common, it would seem; there have only ever been 3 recorded Crashers including Wax himself as of BoM. So a Compounder of a specific type is likely going to be just as rare unless you can crack Identity contamination when involving Hemalurgic spikes. As for F-steel itself. . . yeah, that one has no reason to be omitted when speaking about Feruchemy or Hemalurgy, and even without Compounding its pretty busted from what I can tell. I wouldn't necessarily go that far; I think there may be some really interesting ways to use those powers, we just haven't seen a whole lot of them yet. Perhaps someday I'll do a thread on that. . . Limitations do typically invite greater creativity. Plus, Scadrial has had much, much longer to master the use of their magics as opposed to most Rosharan magic users (Fused are weird because they seem to forget half of what they know- propably due to, you know, madness- and Heralds are just as broken, preventing them from really using or sharing their knowledge). While I do know that Rosharan Surgebinders almost always hold more Investiture than Scadrien Metalborn, I think that this is a bit of an overstatement; we've seen Mistborn and Twinborn do absolutely devastating damage to armies before, allowing them to destroy hundreds of their opponents singlehandedly. Also, Purified Dor liquid Investiture, which is considered to be its most potent form. Stormlight is gaseous, not liquid. As such, comparing the Purified Dor to Surgebinders seems like a bold leap to me. Basically, what I'm trying to say is that while Rosharan Surgebinding has a leg up in terms of raw Investiture to the Metallic Arts, I have strong reason believe it isn't as large as you suggest. One final note I'd like to make, the Metallic Arts seem to be much, much easier to scale up or mass produce; while there are only ten Honorblades, there can be many, many Unsealed Metalmind medallions that can be made. What's more, Hemalurgic spikes along with Identity fiddling, Allomantic duralumin, Feruchemical nicrosil, and Compounding allow for a great deal of power. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Scadrial someday is able to create super soldiers that can overpower any Surgebinder that isn't directly fueled by the Shard of Honor itself, simply due to the nature of the two planets' magic systems and the upgrades they allow.

I think you may be onto something. I think that there's a little more going on as well, such as more Spiritweb chunks being taken by Kandra Blessings, but Identity has a key roll in their process I would suggest. I think that the Donors may have their Identity Blanked (or removed via duralumin Hemalurgy) and then have a specialized command/knowledge used to steal the attributes to fill the Blessing. The Identityless spikes would adapt to the new Identity of the soul they were plugged into- that of the Mistwraith- as it seems even Unkeyed Metalminds like to develop something of an Identity over time. It also could be that instead of the spikes having a Blanked Identity that they cause the Mistwraith's natural Identity to warp to better fit the spikes, but with the knowledge we have on Hemalurgy right now that seems like a much less likely scenario, as it's pure conjecture whereas we have real proof for the spikes changing Identity.

I don't really want to turn this into a vs. thread, but honestly, being able to have 5 - 10 times your normal strength while moving 3 - 5 times faster than normal could probably deal more damage that those Surges. Even directly against a Radiant, I'd say this Twinborn has the upper hand unless the Radiant is 4th or 5th Oath. Yeah, if you're prepped correctly for this power set, running out of metal isn't really an issue.

Honestly, if you're looking for pure combat ability, this is one of the best power combos to do so. I would argue that a decently prepped A-pewter/F-steel Twinborn would be more dangerous than most Surgebinders.

Hello friend! Which Brandon Sanderson works have you read? And which one has your favorite magic in it?

Basically, as @Quantus said, Kandra are just a different species. The rules just don't seem to apply to them in the same way. Not exactly satisfying, but that's what we really have to go off of right now. I will say though, Kanda have flexible Spiritwebs, as they are shapeshifters. It could be the reason they don't seem to need a Linchpin spike is because the spikes they have don't have the same need to coordinate due to the Kandra's Spiritweb being flexible. But that's just a guess. Are we sure that one of the Koloss's spikes doesn't count as a Linchpin spike?

Ah, I see. I would say that a mechanism you could use for gold Feruchemy is to make it less efficient the more you Tap. So you could, for instance, get 1 HP for every 1 health charge you Tap- but only when Tapping at a rate of 1 charge per round. If you want to heal 5 HP a round, maybe it's more like 10 charges. That sort of thing. I can also say from experience playing D&D that fast healing (basically regeneration in 5e terms) 5 - 10 HP per round doesn't do as much as one would think, at least not once you get to 5th level or higher. Vampires usually have such regenerative abilities, and unless they have some minions to take the heat for a few rounds and let them heal up the vamp always gets smoked by the players in 2 - 3 rounds. That actually reminds me of a time where I was playing Curse of Strahd with my cousins. . . Curse of Strahd spoilers:

Nice! I once added Nightblood to my campaign. . . things were. . . interesting, to say the least. I will say, if you're planning on adding the Metallic Arts to a previously existing campaign, I think that @Tamriel Wolfsbaine's idea of having a maximum number of Feruchemical charges you can Store is a good one. Otherwise, you risk making Feruchemy too OP. Seems useful. You could also say that gold has to take a short or long rest to fill their Metalmind, perhaps with some extra benefit for the long rest. That way they can get a little more effect out of it, but they can't abuse it so easily. I'm curious; how are they immortal? I'm not disagreeing (those are two of the most overpowered Feruchemical powers, after all), I just haven't read the whole MAG handbook before, only the free PDF.

Sounds like a lot of fun! How much time do you have before your campaign? Because if you have a bit (maybe a couple of weeks) I plan on posting my second draft for the 3.5 Mistborn homebrew. You could take a lot of the stuff there and modify it (such as reducing the numerical bonuses on some metals) to better fit 5e. As for filling Metalminds specifically, it's going to depend on the metal. Pewter, steel, and gold are the most straightforward, where you can store a base amount plus any ability score modifiers as charges per long rest (I may tweak it a little, but that's the main gist). I would also recommend making it get exponentially more expensive to Tap Feruchemical charges, meaning for example that you could get 10 turns in combat of getting a +2 to strength, or 2 rounds of having a +6.

Str is used for all melee attacks and damage in 3.5. You can take a feat that lets you use your dex for the attack roll instead, but you still use str for the damage. Plus, I believe that there are composite bows that allow you to add your str modifier to your ranged damage.

Lol, I was planning to make a feat similar to this in a Mistborn homebrew. Basically, you Tap of bunch of cigar smoke you've saved up and a cloud of smokescreen explodes out of your face.

Oh, it makes perfect sense to make such an assumption. I do as well, because 99% of the time if they don't specify that it isn't 5e, then it's 5e. And it does have its merits; it's definitely more streamlined and it's easier to learn to play. Plus, you don't have to put in as much planning (I feel, at least) for 5e because its simpler, which makes it easier to fit into people's schedules. I still like 3.5 for its more expansive rules and the possibilities that can be achieved when trying to assemble a powerful (and fun) character. For example, I love that you can split your skill points as you wish and that there is no limit to ability scores. Very fun to play a fighter or barbarian with a 24 in strength (and that's before counting magic item boosting) And speaking of ability scores, I feel that they are much better balanced in 3.5; strength and intelligence matter in 3.5, whereas in 5e they're dump stats unless you're specifically playing a barbarian or wizard. And even then, part of me feels bothered that I don't get more from those abilities than what is specifically laid out for that class. So, let me see if I understand this suggestion correctly; the idea is that a Feruchemist may choose to take a certain penalty when Storing, and they make a roll. If they fumble it, they take some kind of negative consequence based on the attribute being Stored. The benefit (the number of charges Stored) is directly proportional to the penalty they take while Storing, but the more the Store the more risk there is of bad things happening to them, meaning they have to be careful when they choose to Store else they harm themselves more than they help. I actually really like that idea; it adds a level of choice and consideration for Feruchemists that isn't otherwise present and could help spice things up a bit. Oh yeah, the way I have Compounding set up right now is super-duper busted. It's more of an NPC or villain ability than a PC one, or perhaps an option for a one shot where the DM says "screw it. I don't really care if you blow up the village to beat the BBEG. Have fun, you little psychopaths". (It's funny, I had a group destroy an entire town withing 5 minutes of gameplay once. I just said they walked fifteen minutes down the road and low and behold, a perfectly identical town to the old one was there. And then told them not to blow it up again. DMing a campaign is fun ) To be fair, that's one of the big reasons I decided to start making a Mistborn homebrew; I do love me some D&D combat. . . but, I do love character interactions as well, especially when I get to DM a crazy gnome NPC who always carries 20 sticks of dynamite in his cargo pants' pockets. That's just the best . Yeah, I'm going to be honest, I'm a bit of a cynic when it comes to random chance in obtaining your magic powers. Cause if I were in a magic setting, I probably wouldn't be one of the magic people. It's just not statistically probable or reliable. I know that's kind of a pointless way of looking at it (it is fantasy after all), but that's just how I'm wired, I guess. Now Hemalurgy. . . that's cool because you can choose which ones you get. You can work for it and achieve new abilities as you research and learn. I certainly hope I can do the magic justice in the homebrew.

Honestly, I watched it a few years after it had come out as well I heard that a lot of people didn't like it, but I thought it was great. Maybe that's just because I'm relatively easy to please, but I enjoyed it regardless. Oh yeah, Kandra are the Cosmere's Venom 100%. I even came up with a Venom-styled Kandra character a while back; I named it the Kandra of Ruin . They have gooey bodies, can shapeshift, and can eat bullets all day without breaking a sweat. I would say that Midnight Aether is probably the best way if you want to expand the Kandra's abilities a bit further, but honestly most of Venom's power portfolio is already there. Stealing the carapace-growing powers of a Progression Surge Fused with a Hemalurgic spike could also be used to make a skeleton from scratch, and a strong one at that; Jasnah punched one of those Fused in the knee in RoW while wearing Plate, yet the carapace was strong enough to fully absorb the blow. As for protecting from Shardic/Allomantic control, I have a few suggestions; 1. Aluminum skeleton or box around the nervous system to disrupt control. 2. Feruchemical electrum (especially improved with Compounding or having a friendly Rioter giving you extra determination to Store) to resist being controlled. 3. Utilizing Feruchemical duralumin to Store the Connection formed by an Allomancer or Shard trying to control you, thus severing their influence. 4. Supercharging Allomantic copper, the Blessing of Presence, or the Blessing of Stability (probably via Awakening or Identity Blanking hacks and recharging the spike with multiple Hemalurgic donors). Also, if you want to be a human and be Venom, Midnight Aetherborn probably can achieve some amount of success in this area by creating a "suit" that covers you and responds to your mind.

Hmmm, true. I had been expecting to add a monetary system to the Mistborn adaptation as you'd need to get more metals for Allomancy and if you wanted more Metalminds (which, depending on how much time you give your players between adventures could prove a useful investment). This would definitely give a good way to spend their hard-earned cash. A disorienting penalty would also probably be good to use for the power, especially since that's how its described as functioning in the books. Yeah, I have been focusing a little too much on a murder hobo system (my players pretty much always turn out that way ), so perhaps I should focus a little more on there being some powers that just aren't as useful for fighting but have roll play value. I still think that there's room for Allomantic gold to do some cool things, but perhaps it would require extra training to actually be useful (basically, you take feats to make them work). That could be an interesting idea; using your shadow's vision to perceive areas you shouldn't be able to could be a fun and creative hack. I think that this should be made an optional feat at the very least. Using a gold shadow to gain information based around previous possible actions? I could see a creative player using that effectively. I like that idea. I do think that it should be more of a "soft" rule than a hard one though, where what the Auger sees is dependent on the DM's approval and the situation. Wisdom especially fits that narrative as well, I would think. Yeahhhh, I can see how not knowing what the others do would be a problem here. Sorry about that. Honestly, the biggest problem I ran into with this particular power is that there isn't a ton that it does that another metal shouldn't, mechanically speaking; F-chromium the big roll modifier, F-steel is the one that grants lot of extra AC and actions, and A-electrum is supposed to actually give you precognition, not just a watered-down version based on human prediction. Alright, that's quite a few ideas I will say, after reading these, I think that I'm going to make F-zinc less of a direct battle metal than pewter or steel, but it would definitely still have some uses (particularly if feats come into play). I think don't know if I want a direct intelligence score boost like with F-pewter since F-copper already covers most of that function (not a direct boost to the score, though it makes those checks easier), though @Quantus's idea of Tapping zinc to allow the addition of your intelligence modifier to other types of rolls seems like it could have some nice potential, especially since that could still make it useful for combat and for a lot of other tasks without making it unreasonably over powered. I was planning on this for 3.5 actually, since there's generally more room to mess around with augmentation and such (a Feruchemist who- technically- has no upper bound on what they can Tap doesn't really fit into 5e as well, in my opinion). Plus, I just generally like that edition more. I was thinking about this, as Feruchemy does have a dangerous potential if played close to how it works canonically; a Feruchemist should, technically speaking, be able to sit around for a week Storing up attributes and become a powerhouse whenever they actually start an adventure. I have a couple things to try and balance this out, though obviously some playtesting may be necessary to make final changes. 1. Feruchemical powers become a lot more expensive the more you Tap; you can, technically, Tap to get a +10 to your strength score as a Brute by Storing up strength over long rests, but that would be a lot more costly than taking a +4 or +5 for several times the length. Basically, you need to be careful with how much you spend on a single encounter, as you may end up leaving yourself without any for later. 2. I'm lowering the amount of charges you can actually Store per long rest; the base mechanic I had for Feruchemy was that you could Store a certain number of charges based on certain factors, such as you ability scores. Originally, I was going to make the number of charges you could Store for something like pewter or steel equal 1 every point of attribute you had over 10 to a minimum of 1. That way a player could invest extra points into making their character stronger in a specific area, which would positively affect their Feruchemy. I'm going to change this a bit though; instead of making it where you can Store 1 charge every 1 point you have over 10, I'm going to make it where you can Store 3 charges plus 1 for every bonus point to you ability modifier. That way all Feruchemists can get a more reasonable charge, and it's harder to try and make your character overpowered. 3. Metalmind limits; yes, a Feruchemist can go out and buy more Metalminds, but they can be Pushed or Pulled on by Allomantic Iron/Steel. Even with them being resistant to such affects based on their number of charges, this can still be a vulnerability to them that they really need to consider. It's actually safer to take smaller Metalminds (which hold a lot fewer charges) since they can't be Pushed or Pulled on as easily. Plus, Metalmind implants are mostly going to have to stay small, and the number of them you can take isn't super high (compared to the number you can carry on the outside). 4. As a DM, I think it would probably be best to consider the length of time your players have in world between adventures. A quest like AoL or BoM usually last around a few days, and there's a time limit on them; they can't just doddle around Storing attributes all the time, as that would mean they fail their quest. This may potentially limit some areas, but I think that there can be usable work-arounds to prevent Feruchemy from being OP. Anyway, thank you guys for you help! I was really struggling with these two powers before, but I now have some really good ideas on how to handle them! I'll post more when I've got more solid ideas or questions

It could go either way from what I can guess at this time; if your motivation is to stop the addiction, Storing might harm your strength of will to stop. If your motivation is to find a way to indulge in your addiction, Storing might possibly be beneficial, at least for a little while. That. . . would be a scary possibility. I suppose if you deliberately had only a very small Electrummind it could be less dangerous though.

The thread I made on balancing Allomantic iron and steel for a D&D Mistborn homebrew went really, really well- thank you so much @Tamriel Wolfsbaine, @Lunamor, @KelsierFortnite, @Returned, and @Duxredux! I really appreciate the ideas and commentary and would love more if you're willing! I've now got a system for these two metals that I think is quite good, and I can't wait to post it once I've gotten the rest of my second draft polished up and finished! However, there are two more powers that are really bothering me. I just can't figure out how to handle Allomantic gold and Feruchemical zinc. Gold is just plain weird; you see a hallucination that is either a vision of how you could have turned out had you made different choices or a past version of yourself. I. . . honestly am kind of stumped on how to use it effectively. Very minor tES spoilers. And F-zinc. . . that's a tough one too. Feruchemical steel has the movement speed bonus, the AC bonus, and the extra actions to be made, and I don't want zinc just to be an inferior version of it. I also don't really see zinc adding a direct attack or damage bonus (especially since F-pewter kind of does that already too), and tin is mostly used for extra perception and awareness, so that's off the table as well. Would anyone who's willing please offer suggestions for how I may form these powers for a 3.5 D&D game?

I can't find the exact quote right now, but yes, a Hemalurgic only needs to make contact with your blood when initially piercing you. After that, it does seem to "remember" you and can be replaced easily. Wax did this with his earring many times. It's an interesting idea that the spike may take something from the recipient as well as the donor. I can't say for certain right now whether it's the case or not. Another possibility could be that it simply becomes attuned to its bearer over time, so it's more willing to go back, or the piercing location on the body is simply adjusted to accept a spike in that location.

Yeah, I was thinking feats would be a nice way to upgrade one's powers without just getting a numerical increase, especially since getting an increase in raw power is just not how Allomancy and Feruchemy works (though Hemalurgy shenanigans certainly could help with raw power, if you want it ). I was thinking that a Lurcher could use a special kind of heavily padded armor that gave them a damage reduction, which would mostly only be useful for their abilities due to how thick it would need to be. Interesting. I was thinking of doing it where Coinshots and Lurchers have a static Push/Pull force (PF, for short) where they either can or can't affect things with their power. If they use Hemalurgic spikes to double (or more) up on their powers, they increase their PF, thus increasing their range, the size of objects they can affect (smaller objects are harder), and the power/damage they can potentially deal. Pushing or Pulling on multiple objects I feel should be harder though, meaning they take a penalty based on the number of objects they are Pushing/Pulling on. I do like the sound of all or one target though, with the ability to choose more selectively as they learn. I'll have to think about factoring that in. Naw, almost everyone I know who plays D&D plays 5e since it's more modern and it's definitely more streamlined . I just prefer 3.5 because of the versatility it provides. Yeah, I like that! It would mean that, despite steel and iron Allomancy's obvious power and versatility, it isn't the best metal to choose for every situation, and other powers should definitely be considered. Oh, yeah, I didn't mean to imply that you were implying that, merely that I happened to have come up with a few ways since starting the conversation to use iron effectively Absolutely! In fact, there's a very, very, very rough first draft I made on the creator's corner called Mistborn D&d Adaptation. On the topic about keeping track of metal reserves, I was thinking that you could have a standard amount of 30 charges in a vial (though you can modify it if you want by adding in more flakes). You can expend 1 charge to use your Allomancy's abilities for that round, benefitting from the effects until the beginning of your next turn (so things like pewter will still give you extra AC). Flaring is more difficult, requiring 3 charges on top of the 1 standard charge, and it is only maintained for one action instead of a full round (though you keep the benefits of Burning regularly after the Flare). What's more, you can only Flare your metal(s) once per round, preventing you from just spamming it. You can take a feat to improve your Flaring abilities, but I figure this is a good way to balance it out a bit. Some abilities just don't work well with this shorter version of Buring however (as a standard vial of metals would be gone in about 3 minutes in real time), so some metals such as pewter and tin can also benefit from low Burning, allowing for them doing things like increasing your passive perception and keeping you alive from injuries you sustained long enough to actually be useful. The reason I want there to be a shorter general Burn time is so that Allomantic charges feel like a somewhat limited resource; you're supposed to worry at least a little about running out, and fights (in general) just don't last long enough to instill that feeling if your metals were to last as long as they canonically do. So, I made a little compromise. True. Honestly, in an urban setting a Lurcher probably wouldn't have that much trouble getting around compared to a Coinshot. You know, that's so funny, I've been writing up a bunch of random ideas on a word document for Mistborn D&D baddies, and one of them was a Lurcher pickpocket, but they use their powers to scurry up walls and Lurch belongings from people . Oooo, those are some good ideas. I was thinking of a feat that lets a Lurcher curve their bullets so that they can be more accurate or hit opponents behind cover, which would compliment a Coinshot's ability to give their bullets extra force. Since this thread started (and since everybody here contributed some nice ideas- thank you guys ) I've been able to come up with some modifications that might just make iron as good as steel. Better in some cases, such as defending your group.

Yeah, some things just have to be fudged a little in order to make gameplay possible, and there are only so many details you can get into before it drags gameplay into the ground. Also, I probably should have mentioned this before, but I'm really trying to focus on D&D 3.5 instead of 5e, as there is more room for enhancing abilities and getting higher numbers in that edition (plus, me and my cousins discovered that we happen to like that edition better ). Interesting. I was originally just going to go for a limited version of flight (kind of like the totem of the egal barbarian's flight ability) with iron and steel, but making it so that you have to move in certain ways with your extra movement could prove a useful mechanic, even if it needs to be simplified in many cases. Ah, I like the idea of a "metal richness", where places like a city have a higher potential for these powers and areas out in the wilderness are naturally more limited (though it doesn't totally remove the usefulness of their powers). Having a few known objects that can be Pushed or Pulled on could prove a useful game mechanic as well, as it gives players something to focus on. Yeah, that's definitely a possibility. I think I've come up with a few ways that iron could be more useful though, such as being able to provide some extra defense to allies from attacks (instead of just yourself) or being able to Pull and steal objects from someone instead of just shoving them out of their grasp. Hmmm, that seems like a good idea: having access to both metals you can have a little extra attack bonus to your Pushing or Pulling, maybe giving your attacks with steel more finesse, as you can Pull on a projectile to turn it as well as Push for more force. I had the idea for a feat that Coinshots could have where they Push on a bullet they fire to give their guns more damage and range (like Wax does), so maybe Lurchers could take a feat that lets them curve the trajectory of their bullet, making it more accurate or able to hit opponents behind partial cover. Mistborn often used iron to compliment their steel after all, such as Kelsier using both to attack the Hazekillers in book one. Yeah, you really can't fully account for every little detail in D&D, but at least you can get a good experience. What I'm aiming to achieve is to get a fuller, more comprehensive experience with a Mistborn styled game, where you can really feel like you're playing in the world of Scadrial with all the Misting, Ferrings, Hemalurgists, Koloss, Mistwraiths and whatnot (and the MAG didn't really look like it filled that quota to me, so I decided to take matters into my own hands). In any case, these are some good ideas. Thanks for your input friend!