Valigus

I’m not sure they are fused like, I think they are likely to be very very weak cognitive shadows with one life, think more returned less fused. At least that’s what I’m imagining I don’t think odium would be willing to invest himself more than that. the best and obvious comparison is Valhalla whose warriors are undead and somewhat powered up but on second death it’s final.

Ok so the theory that the tranquiline halls are somehow real has been going around for a bit on the forums, and I like most people mostly dismissed it as extremely unlikely to be the case, however in light of autonomy’s actions within the lost metal it strikes me that maybe the theory should not be dismissed and I will outline a few reasons for this as well as I think the most logical version of theory goes. 1. Odium’s actions on roshar have been entirely non-conducive to his stated good which are a. Killing shards- it seems like once the fused were made odium had clearly given up on easily or quickly splintering honor or cultivation, clearly this was still on the table but his later stated plans seem to indicate that his main plan had switched from just running around and splintering shards quickly to his cosmere army plan. b. Winning the war- it also further strikes me that in light of how autonomy has just given her people all this advanced technology that Odium’s actions have not been helpful in terms of winning the war at all. If quick victory was what he truly wanted all he would need to do is introduce his forces to guns, even if the resources were somewhat problematic on roshar soulcasting renders that a non-issue. c. Training an army- from here it also seems like Odium’s plan to train an army is also incredibly stupid, because it seems as if without the desolation’s roshar would have nearly 7000 years of advanced civilization, they would be so far ahead of other civilizations it wouldn’t even be fair. now I think it’s fair to say that maybe he expected a quick war, but I think after the first desolation it should’ve become clear that killing 9/10 people on the planet every desolation wouldn’t get you an army, and yet he seemed pretty confident in this plan and taravangian seemingly approved. furthermore Odium’s plan just doesn’t seem to make sense because of those level of casualties, trained soldiers do not contribute to your army if they are dead. I will also grant that now it seems like Odium’s goal has become to just win outright, but I think that may be because it’s gone on longer than he would have liked and he needs it to end. but ultimately there are very few ways in which Odium’s plan can somehow manage to bypass these issues unless his goal was not to own the war but to draw it out as long as possible and the army he trained was made of the dead form the 7000 years of war and only now has he decided it’s time to end it after a far too lengthy gap(because odium was gonna win, if taln hadn’t done his thing). 2. granted all of this does not point to the tranquiline halls and Odium’s undead army so let me explain why I think that is a logical explanation for these discrepancies. my main point here rests on one question- what does the thrill do for odium? the thrill 1. Enhances the combat abilities of the afflicted, and 2. Opens them up to Odium’s influence. but based on what we’ve seen the first seems to hep odium only minimally and the second doesn’t seem to allow him to control them only to influence them and so doesn’t seem to have proved that helpful. however the things that are important here are 1. Where does the thrill manifest and 2. How do shards get the ability to go influence people. the answer to 1 is obvious alethkar and vedenar highly militant vorin nations, the ones with the myth of the tranquiline halls in the first place and the ones with the best most elite militaries. The answer to 2 is also fairly straightforward, by investing people. this leads to the conclusion that what the thrills actual purpose is, it’s to invest an army or the best warriors on roshar as they die and send them to Odium’s undead army. while this is still pretty crackpot, autonomies actions combined with the assumption that odium is not a total idiot and generally has a reason for the things he does/makes lead me to think that it may actually be quite plausible even likely.

So we know that there are many people in the cosmere who know a regrets deal about investiture, the prime people in question being the five scholars, kryss, hoid, rosharan scholars, and rosharan immortals. However I was wondering and I don’t think anyone else has asked this question, but given how much more some people know about the cosmere than rosharans(who are so far very advanced as a people in knowledge of investiture and shards of not the cosmere as a whole)(maybe cosmere literate as opposed to knowledgeable) have any of these notable people previously made this discovery, and if so have they kept it under wraps? I lean onto the idea that it’s been kept under wraps, because none of these individuals have any knowledge of anti-investiture yet. I lean on the idea personally that they would have no knowledge and that this is a brand new discovery.

That’s kind of what I was getting at though not in those words and maybe not that strong. But yeah I think Kaladin may have absorbed tanavast a cognitive shadow and that explains a lot of weirdness.

This theory is essentially predicated on three main premises 1. that tanavasts cognitive shadow was while a part of the storm father in some measure distinct from his main consciousness. 2. That tanavast’s cognitive shadow was what spoke to facials and is responsible for the stormfathers weird behavior. 3. That the stormfather is no longer combined with tanavasts cognitive shadow for these premises the second is a solid enough theory on its own, though Ishar is perhaps a more likely candidate, i personally find that given the supposed recency of his reclaiming an honor blade that he is unlikely to have been able to co-opt the stormfather. the third essentially comes from if the second premise is true then there must be a reason for why we have not seen tanavasts cognitive shadow again, and I will provide an explanation of where it went in a moment. So accepting what I’ve said is true, where did the cognitive shadow go. I think that kaladin absorbed the cognitive shadow of tanavast during the first book. This is a theory I’ve seen elsewhere though I couldn’t find the post, but in way of kings when kaladin is tied up in the storm he claims to feel as it something is forcing it’s way inside him. Shortly after kaladin begins to be referred to as “son of tanavast” which we know is important. This would also explain the change in the stormfathers behavior we see. this is definitely not one of my better put together theories but I just wanted to write it down for now.

I believe that the storm faker is actually the cognitive shadow of tanavast, the seemingly much stronger definition of personality and the form made of air are very reminiscent of the shadow of leras in mistborn and explains the weird way he is behaving.

That’s fair, my point isn’t that he can win but that we need to be aware that future develops with kaladin specifically could change the outcome of this fight.

But my point is kaladin is not a normal person, I agree normally he cannot but we don’t know the extent of whatever being the “son of tanavast” does and he also has power armor on top of superhuman combat feats, it is entirely possible that the full extent of his weird powers could allow him to win is my point.

He actively displayed this ability in the fight in WoR where he is surrounded by the wind and claims to be able to have dodged as well with his eyes closed. Ishar later displays a similar ability, it appears to be functionally similar to atium.

The thing with kaladin is he has managed to defeat a lot of enemies he really should not be able to and has a lot of abilities that we do not understand, including an ability that appears to be quite comparable to atium he displays most prominently in the due in WoR.

Pretty much no 4th ideal radiant besides a bondsmith and probably kaladin, but kaladin and whatever is going on with him is comparable to vin in terms of bypassing the normal scaling

I maintain and have maintained since I read the book that they are fused, they have glowing red eyes are mistaken for kandra and have no regard for their own lives

That is quite probably what I mean yeah, it’s been a long time since I read oathbringer

Yeah I remember that but I remember it being in the context of her mimicry of people, I don’t have a physical book on me or I’d try and find it, I could be wrong but I though there was something that implied she may have been human before.

I could be wrong but I remember you hat shallan got the impression of like recapturing or reclaiming something or like re-shaphir wanted something back.

Re-shaphir seemed to be heavily implied to be a former human who was attempting to recreate what she once was in her conflict with shallan.

Because they are physically entering through a perpendicularity however the question then is what does a soulcasting person look like?

So this is a post where I tried to puzzle out the different ones based on what we know making as we assumptions as possible and I don’t really wanna type all my arguments out again

He has also used weird abilities that he shouldn’t have my suspicion is kaladin is to honor what vin was to preservation additionally we know that part of the way talent works in the cosmetic st least for kaladin is related to the spiritual realm, in the spiritual realm lasting is always a spear master so he was always talented basically, I think many other abilities he has may be because he will take up a shard or become a bond Aitn or something and they are a similar feedback loop or cultivation somehow enhanced the loop making him better

1. Well I think the reason there isn’t anti void light is because normally that is just devotionlight but there isn’t enough of devotions investiture on roshar to make anything happen- you need to take voidlight then infuse it with devotions intent/rhythm 2. Also I’m actually not talking about the intent I’m saying we know the tone of another shard I think I said earlier that I feel like whimsy is the opposite of honor, honor is consistent and makes binding agreements while whimsy does things largely well on a Whim and often presumably for it down amusement it also stands to reason that the opposite of odium is devotion since usually love is portrayed as the opposite of hate

This would mean we already know the tone for devotion correct, it would be the same as for anti-void light another question what is the opposite then of honor I think. Would be whimsy, they do things with no regard for oaths and all on a whim

So what you are describing is that maybe kinetic investiture exists as a conduit for which to pull investiture from the spiritual realm and is not the actual investiture being used necessarily. you are also indirectly then asserting that light is a form of kinetic investiture and that radiants operate similarly to mistborn by using the light to connect to the spiritual realm not consuming the light for power. I feel like if this is correct it is conceptually kinda big for our understanding of the exact mechanics of magic systems especially investiture and end positive magic systems. however I am skeptical of the sand idea I’m not sure it would be enough assuming it would work and honestly compared to the idea of light as a kinetic form of investiture that only acts as a conduit it seems less important

If they were both fused and buffed a ton by odium I don’t think they would be, in terms of natural ability they outclass anyone else in the cosmere but vin maybe and if you put them on a power plain with those they could probably beat all comers (also I’m not convinced that’s true bondmsitsh are super op and with the surgebinding rules falling apart windrunners may get op connection powers too) (Also plate and blade op and I don’t think an awakened would do very well against a windrunner going all out unless they were like zahel(a lot of knowledge and prep time)

New one- kaladin and dalinar fall to odium and go take over the cosmere- I mean seriously who is gonna stop them they are like the two most dangerous people evrr

I agree I believe cultivation has been manipulating a lot of people on roshar to make perfect shard vessels