Frustration

There is more Ruin than Preservation so that's probably why only Atium is made. And just making Atium isn't of Ruin, and even if it was he finds any action difficult.

yes, but there is no investiture that isn't assigned to a shard

Atium is still being produced, so following TLM Atium is once again in circulation, whereas Lerasium is not.

@bmcclure7 I don't often do this, but this is my thread, and the premise is that Roshar is given the ten years to advance up to the point it is at during TLM. That is how this discussion has been going, and it will continue to do so, please stop arguing about this particular point.

Has Scadrial built a FTL spaceship?

Are there any plans to make browsing public collections possible in the future?

No, but he is my example on how it is both possible and already done. @alder24 here's my designs for Rosharans to prevent spies/assassins. Set up alter fabrials, which are set to ignore the Rosharan forces, which is shown to be possible(WoK 432). If anyone unrecognized is approaching the device will blink while simultaneously acting as a painrail on the invader. Anyone attempting to invade will be found and incapacitated. To drain the morale of the Scadrain forces fabrials set to augment fear, anger, agony, and anxiety, along with plague will be flown into population centers at night, and stonewards will bury them inside buildings. Even with seekers able to sense them finding and removing them would be both difficult and time consuming, not to mention the fact that it wouldn't stop the devices effects while it's in use.

They are a mercenary group from Threnody. It's possible that they are hunting the Dawnshard/Hoid for their own ends, but equally likely that they have an employer.

Yes they can. Hoid has already done it. Yes they can, see Hoid. Mraize says that it is a simple Connection issue, so any Bondsmith could make it work. With Cohesion they can make perfect gems. The only technology more advanced that Scadrial has is firearms. Rosharan sanitation is better, their medicine is better, their transportation is better, they have FTL communication. When it comes to infrastructure Roshar is far ahead of Scadrial even when AoL takes place after SA 5. They don't have a registry of metalborn so they would have to rely exclusively on volunteers to get those powers, further reducing the pool of candidates. And training for assassination takes years. Shardplate will absorb the impact. N. Scadrian guns can't even hit airships, much less Windrunners who can exit the atmosphere. They have maybe 12 or so grenades in the north, and about as many leechers without the Malwish the number used would be so small as to be inconsequential. And to top it off a Radiant in plate can't be leeched. And to counter that what happens when Radiants have fabrials that will suck the blood out of anyone that isn't wearing shardplate? WoR 993. Radiants and blood makers can heal but no one else can. And how do they sneak in when a massive alerter fabrial tells the Rosharans when anyone not from their army enters their camp? WoK 432-433. And there is a massive army of spren able to search out anyone at anytime. As of right now they have fabrials that can read emotions, in ten years I fully expect them to be able to regulate emotions as well Why on earth would they enter through Harmony's perpendicularity? They can just make a portal straight from Urithiru to the front lines. 1. The cold wasn't deadly, Kaladin remarks in RoW that it didn't deserve to be called a plague. 2. Rosharans have heightened immune system 1. Why would they walk through the CR when they have portals? 2. Why can't they steal supplies? Spanreeds are infinitely faster than radio, they can mechanically replicate steel pushing and ironpulling on not just metal, but liquids, stone, air, plants and dozens of other things as well. Roshar isn't behind, it's ahead. Using Raysium,(which the coalition does have, both Navani's dagger, and Shallan's) they can make their ships much faster, in conjunction with Navani's windmill idea, and a replication of Kaladin's glove, and the fact that fourth bridge is essentially a barge with three layers not a one/two man fighter they can easily make 12-15 fighter jet style aircraft in ten years. All with much higher speed and maneuverability than Scadrian versions. The metal is only a key, the power comes from Preservation the same way the surges come from the spren. Honor is just as omnipresent as Preservation, so the Stormfather's Bondsmith can use their powers anywhere an allomancer can. I right now am ready to swear the first 4(and possibly 5 depending on which oath I take for my third) Skybreaker ideals. And I'm not that unusual. I could probably also do several in Truthwatcher, but without knowing exactly what those are I won't make any promises. And spren can find the people who are ready for their ideals, like how Syl found Kaladin, and people will seek out the orders, just as the orders will seek out new members. Why connect them to Scadrial when you can just remove the one to Roshar? And when did Dalinar ever have to touch someone mid conversation to continue speaking? Ishar mastered Bondsmithing in his mortal lifetime. Ten years is easily enough. You forget this is Roshar, Crem will settle to the bottom and become stone. And between shardplate, stormlight and Windrunners ability to alter pressure they will be fine. And why would they spend weeks down their, an hour at most. Syl, Rua, Phrendorana, Notum, Seekir, and dozens of other honorspren all have different opinions and views on humans. They have similarities, but they are far from the same. 1.So if they are there with weapons then they are threats, if someone else is threatening them for a tactical advantage they will lose popular support of their own people. 2. The CR isn't that shrunk except in the vertical. And Animal souls are small and dim compared to human ones. They would never work as a distraction. Roshar is old enough, he literally said 'yours might have some buried deep," and Roshar is thousands of years older than Scadrial. There is so much stormlight that using it everywhere isn't a problem. It had notes on range, but not the complicated ballistics needed to make it work. That was all destroyed. Grenades have to be charged by a misting pretty regularly. And if Scadrial gets all these precautions against spies Roshar definitely knows about seekers, and even if not they are used to dealing with Secretspren who have basically the same power. Scadrial doesn't have a way to remove moisture from the air, otherwise Steris would have added it to the lab. And I don't think the reaction would work in a vacuum, there would be no blast wave as it can't heat the air. This might just make a bunch of light without an explosion. As stated above spren are different. You cannot treat them as all the same. And the lightspren have no problem bonding, they just didn't want to bond humans because of their betrayal, but now that that's known to not be the case they will be willing to bond humans. The war with fused ended ten years ago. The ignition would be instant, as soon as the device combined them it would immediately go off, and they could use portal delivery for more high profile targets. Let's also not forget that handheld grenades could be made, as even chip sized gems would be more powerful than the scadrian equivelent. Navani made it in a few days just by taking the original plate and making alterations according to math until she got it. It is a purely mathematical equation, any scholar on Roshar could do it. And there is plenty of Stormlight they can make large amounts easily. Only the Alethi, the Azish can, and that's never caused the trouble before, they are prepared to work around this, and it's not even slowing them down by any appreciable margin. They have portals, why would they go through the CR at all? Koloss aren't much of a theat, the small ones are weaker than plate, and the big ones are about dead, both of them can be take out easily with a shardblade. New plan, Bondsmith connects Radiant to preservation and they start using the mists as fuel, hypercharging their surges.

SA

I wouldn't call omitting the fact that one person made Lerasium, but no one else has a lie.

@duladen please don't double post, you can edit your previous posts to add new memes.

"I burned the children of Rathalas, you may have been influencing me, but it was my choice." -Dalinar OB. Being under Odium's influence doesn't take away agency. Moash is still responsible. And he felt sorry for it. Which Moash, even when not under Odium's influence clearly states that he is not.

@Marabout Moash said he wasn't sorry for what he did, only that it hurt him. He killed Men who had been locked away in Hearthstone just because he knew it would hurt Kal, he killed a comatose radiant simply because Teft wasn't fighting him. He killed Jezrien simply because he was asked to. He feels no remorse for his actions, even when Odium isn't influencing him.

Actually spren can break the bond if it's stolen. How dare you. Feel this Preservation serves the same role, it's just everywhere. Just like how the Stormfather is everywhere. I literally showed you the WoB you are mentioning, and it says the only way Kelsier wins is by assassination. If Kaladin can fight Kelsier loses. It's not illogical, Szeth's spren said that the fifth oath supercedes the third, which is just a crutch for the knight until they move on. There are tens to hundreds of millions of people on Roshar, even if it was 1 in a thousand there would be thousands of potential candidates. Why would it be harder than speaking other languages, or connecting Kaladin to Tien, a man Dalinar has never known or heard about? They never had unchained Bondsmiths. The stone will guide people using Cohesion. See Venli finding Lift's prison. All they need to do is get to the bottom, and have the stone guide them. That's like saying if you asked two Americans about something and they gave you the same answer that every American thinks that. 1. Who is forcing people to stand near windows? 2. It's not that hard to compare distance. Look at where the souls are in the CR and compare them to the PR location. 1. Why would they use coal, stormlight is much more efficient. 2. That's Nalthis he was talking about, he said Roshar might have some, but I doubt it has the conditions for coal, too much crem. That still doesn't solve the fact that there are so few leechers. And while possible that some seekers could find them, they would be killed as the Lightweaver fled, so that number will quickly dwindle. Supplies might get counted in whatever they do to drop the ship's weight. He didn't find the bomb with it, most of the notes were destroyed, he found the rocket because he spotted the ship from the top of the Shaw. It doesn't matter how big you make the bomb, or when. At some point you HAVE to take it out of oil and expose it to air. And there will be some water vapor in that air. If you make it on Scadrial then you have to have the generator running for a long time, and you risk the bomb detonating the longer you leave it like that. If you take it out of the oil on Roshar it will probably detonate as soon as it leaves the oil. 1. Any Elsecaller or Willshaper could do it. 2. Anti-stormlight can't kill fused, and you can make as much as you want why would you ration it? It's a wavelength, with measurable effects it would be easy to reproduce, especially since it's already a known(if old) part of music theory.

How do you prevent the Thrill? And nightly attacks by creatures that are made of shadows will wear down morale. The firing mechanism can be reduced to simple wires, and they can copy scadrian metal alloys. The only thing left is the reloading mechanism.

Thanks for filling that role. No problem. About 5 is enough for adequate vision. Well capture Re-Shephir, and releases midnight essence in Elendel. And the Thrill to, because why not. SA 5 is before AoL, not the other way around. But even if they had it shardplate would still be just as useful. And a shardmace backed by shardplates strength will break aluminum. Why would they use gunpowder? I have a number of ways they could do it with fabrials. I actually have an entire thread about it Shameless self plug https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/108457-fabrial-firearms/

Honor is just as omnipresent as Preservation is, if the Stormfather's Bondsmith can't surgebind anywhere neither can allomancers. But both can. Only by killing Kaladin in his sleep. If Kaladin could fight he would wipe the floor with Kelsier Kaladin could beat Vin, how on earth would Kelsier win? Hoid does it, why would he not tell Jasnah? He doesn't they do. The spren say that the fifth ideal means no longer following the third, which most swear to Nale. The Skybreakers love and respect Nale, and they don't need to progress, so why leave him? That is strictly not true, there are people willing to say all five ideals on the spot, along with spren who will actively seek them out. Promises and payoff. I've listened to Brandon's lectures and I know how writing works, if the duel is foiled it undoes everything the coalition has worked for for three books. That won't happen. The duel will take place despite Taravangian's best attempts. Book 5 happens before AoL, if you refuse to give Roshar anything past RoW we can set Scadrial back to before AoL and they get completely annihilated. Why on earth would they try to invade through it? Just soulcast a massive block of aluminum on top of it and call it a day. Invade through your own perpendicularities and Oathgates. 1. The Oathgate spren can be moved off world as easily as any other 2. The aimians don't have surgebinding to make moving the Oathgate easy. 3. The Sibling is present throughout all the stone of Urithiru, but that's cut away and removed, or manipulated with Cohesion all the time. None of them are harder to move than giant shardblades. Q. Why are the Ghostbloods looking for BAM? A. Because she can disconnect Voidlight from Roshar. Any Bondsmith can do the same. Just collect the gemhearts that are on the seafloor. It's not like the dead ones need them. And why would they not spend time figuring out perfect gems? They are more important now than ever. With cohesion they can try as many times as they like, turning the gemstone soft, and shaping it until it stops leaking. You have ONE example and use that as the baseline for the entire species? I'm the one who started the discussion I know better then anyone what it is for. It's pretty easy to find people who are dangerous from those hiding based on position. Near the window = threat. Away in the basement holding onto family = not threat. And while no not every Rosharan is a radiant, there are more than enough of them to do most of the work, like capturing Scadrian weapons and replicating firearms for the rest of the army. Lightweavers can't be found by secretspren, and there are only a handful of leechers, as seen by how they had to call in one from a different octent in SoS. It would be impossible to touch everyone in the entire command structure in any reasonable time, much less the entire army. Yes, but they were still given them. If it didn't matter why bother? They were only going to be there a short time. The papers they ripped to shreds and then soaked in water? Then how did Wayne get the water in the barrels? They have to be exposed to air at some point, it would be too dangerous to bring it all the way from Scadrial like that, so they have to take the Harmonium out of the oil on Roshar. Anti-light is far more powerful than anything Scadrial has, fist sized gems could easily take out Elendel. And delivery is easy, build the bomb, set up a timer to mix the lights and drop it from the CR into the physical. And Stormlight is so common why would they need to conserve it? You can make instruments that hit it for you. Like the sound plates Navani used. Roshar has higher population and can soulcast everything they need to make guns. Steal a few, reverse engineer them, and boom. Alternatively they could make fabrial firearms after seeing guns for the first time. Easy Roshar win. No, it was stopped because Autonomy decided that Scadrial had earned being left alone.

Not everyone has reddit.

Nope, I have only read a single non-cosmere work from Brandon.

1. I'm not talking about making new ones 2. Why would they be harder to move that simply shifting the platform? Shardblades can move easily. Even the Sibling can be moved without trouble. Why would the Oathgates be different? The Ghostbloods know how to do it(same RoW discussion as quoted earlier) they just don't have a way to do it. You know, like a certain spren already known for stealing Connection, and has the ability to generate Voidlight. 1. Dozens of Honorspren we're immediately willing to bond. Why on earth would not a single Inkspren change their minds? That's like assuming there wasn't a single Soviet sympathizer in the USA during the cold war. I guarantee you there were. 2. Even if only a few bonded they can make more. Rarer. You forget that Higher Skybreaker ideals require them to act outside of Nale, which they don't want to do. Where is that WoB about Kaladin I've never seen it. And regardless Kaladin is an outlier case, not all Radiants are suicidal. It's been shown, via the Sapphire we saw in the epigraphs, that higher oathed Radiants will encourage those at lower levels. Once one individual gets it it will be easier for those coming after On the contrary most of Bondsmiths powers have been locked during that time, Ishar has been a Bondsmith unchained for maybe 30-60 years at most. Brandon has one last book to show off Bondsmiths and he gave Dalinar ten days to learn, it must be possible. As stated above they are less invested that Shardblades. They are simple metalminds, just really full ones. For a few seconds. Marasi only did that for a short time, realized how fast she was moving, slowed down, and then ran to Wax, which used almost all the speed in the bands(BoM 407) 1. TLR used the Well of Ascension to make himself that powerful. 2. Soulcasting is instant, so unless the Fullborn can teleport they can't outrun it. 3. Soulcasters can easily make building sized objects, the Fullborn would run out of strength long before they managed to get out. It doesn't need to be hidden, but it's tucked in a hard to reach location in the mountains, and serves as a choke point. If Roshar captures that it's the end of Scadrials CR influence. Compare this to Roshar who could lose over thirty perpendicularities, and would still have access. Not likely. The pits aren't active, so I doubt the Well of Ascension is either. Non invested objects sink, the mists aren't water. There's a reason Hoid used a Cognitive Shadow, and an oar he had slapped Investiture on. And while land does exist, it only does so on water bodies, which are far away from the perpendicularity The Honorspren who have had maybe 1500 years, and with only ten original members already number in the thousands. There were hundreds of Inkspren and they had 2,000 years to grow their numbers. The reason that Windrunners had the largest order are twofold. One is that they had a lot of squires, but two was that every Honorspren bonded. Additionally Maya said the words, she clearly wants Radiance to continue, therefore some will be convinced, either this time or as Maya continues to speak. Considering that there were several secret allomancers, and that the Military has existed for a few years at most, with only a few thousand members, Iwould be surprised if there were 100 trained allomancers with useful metals. And the new radiant would likely be a squire of the last, meaning they would already be trained. Tai-na gemhearts are easily the size of houses, they would last the trip, especially if they used Oathgates. And with Cohesion they can make gemstones perfect. With the CR they can easily find resistance, so no hiding out. And with Cohesion and division they can simply collapse buildings, or walk right through them. With gravitation they can use aerial bombardment etc. Taking a city would be easy. How would they be found? Shallan, who is probably the most incompetent spy ever managed to avoid one of the Ghostbloods most senior members. On the contrary, it can be used anywhere the Bondsmith is along with anyone nearby. OB 62. In HoA Vin literally says that the only reason to use electrum is to counter Atium. Electrum only shows you 1-3 seconds into the future. And Atium would be blocked by anyone who hung out near a Truthwatcher. Not to mention the fact that it burns out so quickly that the Radiant would still be alive at the end. Source? Elendel has only a single skimmer (the smaller ships). Yes but why did they wait six years if they already had it functioning? It would explode but their delivery method, and blasting power weren't up to what they needed. You mean the scientists he and Marasi killed? There might be some that are still alive but they will have lost most of them. Not to mention that Autonomy had to give them most of it. No, the increased water content would detonate the Harmonium before the Trellium could. The same thing can just be scaled up, use larger gems, and speed increases proportionally. And given that it's more powerful than anti-matter I don't think the amount produced is a problem. Anyone can do it, all of the scientific principles already exist. And the only thing they need to do is make the plates and vacuum tube. With that anyone can make it. That's Dalinar Kaladin and Szeth's entire plot in KoW. What would they do if they didn't get Ishar to teach Dalinar? All Orders can move faster than Scadrial can aim, and I don't care how precise you gun is eyeslits are a few mm wide. The bullet can't fit through that. Electrum can only see 1-3 seconds into the future, and only the users future. They won't see anything worth reporting. Um, no. Without compounding they would never exceed maybe 30 mph. And even with compounding it would take them years to get enough speed to hold it for long. The lightweavers were dealing with the Sons of Honor instead. And even if they were trying to spy on the Fused they couldn't communicate their discoveries because Secretspren would reveal their use of spanreeds. Thanks for those WoB's man.

Happy to help. To an extent. While they don't need Connection manipulation to leave they also don't have access to the CR without Harmony's perpendicularity. Additionally they don't have a way to traverse the CR, which on Scadrial takes the form of mists and requires invested objects in order to sail on(as described in SH) I don't know that on its own Scadrial has a way to navigate the CR without walking on the floor and trying not to drown. There are more spren alive now than there were during the Recreance (WoR 888). And during their peak some orders had members in the low thousands There are probably thousands to tens of thousands of Inkspren. Is 10-20 of them being willing to bond humans after Maya's revelation really that unlikely? Which makes them irreplaceable. While they could see all three realms it would practically drain them for the user to actually get to the CR. Pushing on an invested individual while they are in the CR is probably not something they could do, they could likely push on metal they had, but that's about it. And a regular soulcaster could soulcast a full metalmind I only have my notes at the moment, if you can please remind me in a few days and I'll go dig it out. Transportation is actually a really low Investiture way to access the CR. That would certainly be helpful, but I think it would be a waste unless you have a metalborn with much more useful powers that needs protection. Nothing Scadrial has can outrun a Windrunner. Even their trains are slow enough horses can catch them. Windrunners can easily hit 200mph. Why would they attempt a siege? They can both fly over and tunnel under fortifications as easily as walking. Between Lightweaver and spren spies and CR observation no attack will be a surprise, they will have at least a half-hour warning. With the Stormfather's ability to slow time Roshar has the same advantage. Feruchemy maybe, but that would require medallions, and a lot of them, though you could make some decent kill squads with it. I'm not sure what advantages you see to A-electrum though, it could maybe help you aim better, but that's hardly a game changer. That can't fly if anyone on them isn't storing weight. Fair. While he had an outlet nearby, and only used .3 ounces of Harmonium. How do you carefully balance electrical imput and stretching the Harmonium, as well as the total size of the bomb while still making it portable? The Set didn't spend 6 years making it, they spent 6 years making it useable. Anti-light on the other hand is already portable and is already as efficient as it can get. Well there's 10 years to practice. That is true, but I will say that they don't have a reason to make metal ships yet, so of course they wouldn't make one. You're welcome. Yes. Hard is right, it won't work through plate, and Radiants have 7 foot long instant death sticks.

And my point on spaceships? Sazed isn't talking about their complacency in exploring, but that if given advanced technology they won't know how to properly apply replicate or advance from it. Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

Yes because fan love and moral character are perfectly interchangeable. You will note I said this in response to someone saying Moash needed no redemption, which both Dalinar and Szeth did.

Why would they try to move them? All the ones they control are in strategically important areas, removing them would be foolish, and without portals it would be time consuming. And how would the Oathgate spren and the Sibling not know it was possible? Bringing the spren into the physical realm was permanent, as is the Oathpact. And how would Ishar have taken the Stormfather's bond if it would revert to normal after a few minutes? Both Shallan and Jasnah know and are in contact with Hoid who is definitely aware of the problem, and desires a way to solve it. I'd say it would be less likely for them to not find a solution in the next ten years that for them to do so. You assume all Inkspren are the same as Blended. Ivory came already, and just like there were those more willing among the Honorspren there will be those more willing among the Inkspren. You assume that all of the oath 4+5 we're there, but no one below? Why would they separate by Oath level in such a way? Especially when the Windrunners are so focused oh hierarchy, if that was all of them third oaths and below would be there too. That's probably only a small amount of them. KoW will be the last time we will get to focus on Bondsmiths, and Brandon only gave Dalinar ten days. Bondsmithing can't be that difficult to learn. Even if he doesn't master it in ten days enough of the basics should be there for them to master it in the next ten years, especially at higher oath levels. The Siblings Bondsmith would likely be stuck, but the Nightwatcher isn't necessary for the planet, and the Stormfather doesn't need to leave for his Bondsmith to keep their powers Additionally they could send squires who are using Connection hacks to maintain their powers. Even if both of them had to do it to keep the bond functioning the squire should have the power. Scadrial has no way to resupply anyone in the CR, and their perpendicularity is far from anything important. Additionally they lack the ability to maneuver effectively there, as they can't coat oars with Investiture in order to row. Roshar will control the CR in this fight, there is just no way for them to lose. How? I don't think there is any visible indication when someone peers into the CR, but even if their was they can't communicate with the PR from the Cognitive. And any elsecaller wanting to could easily kill them by turning them to stone. Both Venli and Jasnah use it all the time. There's even some indication that Kaladin could do it(WoR 470). That one is just outright impossible, there is no way for them to get within hundreds of miles of Urithiru in the PR, and on the CR they would both be easily noticed. Additionally where are they getting the electricity from? Compounding has strict upper limits, and besides it's linear, not multiplicative. And an Elsecaller could kill them easily. Shift to the CR, and soulcast away the bands, or place them inside a solid aluminum cube.