marianmi

OK, maybe she couldn't use her powers - just like Kaladin couldn't use his powers sometimes, before Syl wend "dead", and couldn't use them at all, when Syl was "dead". Still, the point was that she didn't "level down", just like Kaladin didn't "level down". EDIT: she was probably "out of sync" with Pattern, summoning him synchronised them and she could soulcast. So again, a process similar to dead spren ressurection.

Because the azir were worshipping Jezrien, which he knew to be a drooling broken man, nothing like the Herald he used to be, and Jezrien living long won't benefit anyone in his current state?

I don't think she *regressed* in the sense that she went level down, I don't think it works like that. We see Kaladin "regressing" in a way, but without a level down. You can say he broke his oath, but next time he didn't have to re-swear that oath (like I broke it, now i need to swear a new one and not break this one, to get to the same level). Similarly, I don't think Shallan leveled-down, she could use her powers just like she could when she was small - but she *denied herself* those powers, because they would bring back the memories. She knew she had a shardblade, and she thought it appears with 10 seconds delay - so it's a matter of *perception* - her *perception* was that she had no powers, so she had no powers. Most probably, as a child, she never soulcasted. She could do illusions, as Pattern said, but I think the first time she soulcasted was after meeting Jasnah. So probably lighweavers need to be level 3 to soulcast, she was probably level 2 as a child, and became level 3 when soulcasting after saying the "I am terrified" truth.

Yes, I was careless. Honor did not make spren for that. In fact, I don't think spren could mimic the Honorblades if they were made only by Honor, I believe being part Cultivation allowed them *the ability* to copy (or to cultivate this ability), whereas being part Honor allowed them to copy *Honorblades* (and give access to the same surges as Honorblades). I believe that WoB was that they would get some abilities different than the 10 surges. And yes I think the same applies to Nightblood - will get some abilities *different than the 10 surges*. In Elantris and Mistborn, not everyone could do magic - elantrians changed physically (and I say that changed their Identity too), whereas on Scadrial you had to be a descendent of someone with power (again, sDNA and Identity). Hemalurgy allows "stealing" a part of the soul, which I see it as "cut the part of Identity that allows using X metal and patch it to another person", just like the Bond is "patch this person's soul with the spren's part of Identity that allows using stormlight and access <X,Y> surges". On Scadrial the focus was metal, but it had to match the Identity bit that allows burning that metal. Similarly, the focus on Roshar is the bond/the type of spren, which is also related to the Identity forged after the Bond. Hemalurgy works in all magic systems, because it can steal any part of the soul that give access to the magic.

I don't mean to look at the skin color in that picture, but at the general features. I am assuming they are based on Earth races, and for example if shin features are asian, then since none of the figures there look asian I take it that no Herald was shin-like. With the same reasoning, looking as Kalak's hair - it doesn't look like a dark-skinned Earth person's kind of hair. Jezrien's facial hair and straight angle face look more caucasian (and yes, I know Alethi are not exactly caucasian), whereas Taln and Nale have more rounded faces. Maybe because of the extra shadow from their hoods - but also because of Taln's moustache and Nale's cheek shadows - I have impression that they are dark-skinned just by looking at their faces. But mine is a mapping to Earth types, so I might be way off. For example Shallash does not look dark skinned in the picture. Is she described as dark skinned, or tanned (not to mention she might be a mulatto)? Again, this is my mental image of them, based on Earth types and those pictures - and I don't claim to have it right But this was a bit besides the point. The point was that I believe Nale was referring to Yaezir as drooling, not to Gawx. Why was Gawx drooling?

It's not clear if her father was abusive before she killed her mother. It's implied they were a happy family, then she killed her mom + that guy, her father took the blame, and this destroyed him. He became abusive probably because he was believed to have killed his wife. So if EVERYONE (including your kids) think you're a monster, it's hard not to become one. While I do believe she was at least level 2, I'm saying that it's possible lightweavers could get access to shardblade at level 1.

I used the term "shardblade" as meaning "Rosharan shardblade", to differentiate them from Nightblood, which would be a "Nalthis shardblade" Being a shardblade on Roshar won't give you access to surges. I find it pretty obvious that Szeth won't have surges. Each bond with a spren modify a person's Identity, and the spren adds the bit that: a. allows them to invest, and b. grants them surges. Each type of spren has a "key" which "opens" different abilities. Just like a honorspren will never give access to the Illumination surge, Nightblood will never give access to any surge (there's a chance it may not even allow Szeth to invest). "Bonding" is the process in which a person's Identity is changed. With rosharan spren, more oaths will "strengthen this bond" => meaning the bond will change => the Identity will slightly change after each level up => the "key cuts" will fit better and unlock more. What is not clear is how Nightblood's bond works, if indeed Nightblood has a Bond (the kind of Bond that alters a person's Identity). If it does (and i think there's WoB that it does), this Bond would be different than a rosharan spren Bond: there would be only 1 change of the Identity (instead of 5), and it's not clear what this change of Identity would "unlock". Maybe it would just give the ability of Invest (so Szeth will be able to suck stormlight and heal). Maybe something different. Maybe it would give access to all 10 surges, maybe to 2 surges each from a different KR order, maybe to 1 surge. We'll have to RAFO Sanderson can do whatever here and it would still fit the magic system. But Honor knew Roshar, and made the 10 spren to "unlock" 2 surges each, and I doubt Nightblood's Indentity (created on Nalthis) would fit so well on Roshar's magic system. So I believe Nightblood giving access to surges would be similar to a person finding a key on the streets that can unlock the door to their house Possible, but extremely unlikely.

YOU find the spren.

Given that lightweavers only have to say 1 oath, my feeling is that lightweavers (and probably only lightweavers) can get shardblade right after that first oath.

Yeah, I agree with this. The way they were created was totally different. One was splintered from a shard (or two :D), so the intent was "inherited" from the shard(s), one was heavily invested and given an intent by a human. This is also why Nightblood and spren-blades end up being used in a totally different way - one destroys "evil" but does not know the concept of "evil", so a human mind needs to define (the intent is constantly shaped by the wielder), the other (the spren) has a thorough concept of intent and the human has to match that intent. In other words, with Nightblood the human shapes that actions of the blade, whereas with shardblades, the spren shapes the actions of the human. This makes Nightblood and shardblades *extremely* different. Not to mention they are invested from different shards - if Endowment would come to Roshar, it would probably have a different power set than Honor. I am looking forward tho` to see what power Szeth will have with Nightblood. I think Szeth + Nightblood should have overall power equal to a KR + shardblade. Blade vs. blade, Nightblood is more powerful than a shardblade, so this should mean that Szeth himself should get powers less powerful than 2 surges.

I think he was playing with words, talking towards Gawx but actually referring to Jezrien. If you look at the Herald images from the surge diagram, you can see heralds have different looks. Jezrien does not look dark skinned. Nale and Talenel look dark-skinned, but Jezrien and Kalak look definitively more of what I think is alethi-like. Kalak at least I imagine him blond, close in looks with how I imagine Adolin. http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/stormlightarchive/images/e/eb/Surgebinders.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20141103012851 Interestingly, none of them look shin. PS: is it weird that the top half is men, bottom half women? Was this discussed?? Can it mean something? (e.g. top half spren are closer to Honor, bottom half closer to Cultivation?) Also that Shalash is directly on the diagonal (opposed?) from her father?? And that none of the female heralds look dark-skinned?

The Diagram was not a bad plan to save the world. You can argue that his actions are "evil", but in the grand scheme of things (best case: 90% of human population dies, worst case: all humans die) he's doing good. The problem with the Diagram is that while there are small variations that while they don't matter individually, their *compounding* matter on a large scale. Each small change now introduces an exponential effect later. I think Brandon is thinking of giving us a Diagram butterfly effect. Unfortunately, Taravangian was not "thousands of times" smarter when he wrote the Diagram, but something like "billions of billions of times". And while coming from Nightwatcher, which is good with predicting the future, the Diagram is not about *predicting* the future as is more about *calculating* the future. And while now Taravangian has some days when he's "thousands" or "millions" of times smarter than average, unfortunately he's so set on *following* the diagram and afraid of changing it (probably because he's incapable of calculating the consequence of a small change) that he's not considering the effect of *compounding* changes.

To be fair, he was not aware of the subtext or he would have kept his mouth shut and survive the night

I agree with @Spoolofwhool above. Szeth's stone had nothing magical in it. Also, the sphere is not a Dawnshard. Let's go our way back towards a Dawnshard: parshendi are upset that the spren don't bind with them, they feel betrayed by the gods (Honor and Cultivation). The only god that "accepts" them is Odium, with his forms of power - although it changes parshendi to voidbringers, a form in which they are controlled by Odium. Now, spren copied what Honor with with the Honorshards => a Honorblade can't bond with parshendi either. I have used here the term "Honorshard', because it helps understand what Dawnshards are: objects similar to Honorblades created probably by Adonalsium (probably swords, until proven wrong.- the assumption being just like spren copied Honor, Honor copied Adonalsium), which can bond with any creature - human or parshendi (unlike Honorblades, which can bond only with humans). Unless that sphere can bond with humans and parshendi, and gives them access to some powers at least comparative to surges, it's not a Dawnshard. I think the important bit with that sphere is the black stormlight inside, not necessary the sphere itself, so I would incline to believe the sphere contains one of the Unmade. Gavilar probably showed the sphere to the parshendi, and, being a son of Honor, said something along the lines of: "Hey, here's one of your gods, I want to set him free because this will bring the Heralds back. You guys get your gods back, we get our Heralds back, it's a win-win!".

As I see it, there are 3 possible ways: * stormfather was bonded, and he survived because his KR did not abandon his oath (part of the 10th order) (UNLIKELY) * stormfather was not bonded (VERY UNLIKELY) * stormfather was bonded, and he survived because of Honor's cognitive shadow. Based on the stormfather's words that he almost did not survive, this one can go in two ways: it was the spren talking - the spren survived because of the shadow, or it was Honor's shadow speaking, and the shadow survived because of the spren.

wasn't me gave you an upvote for the lost one

Maybe the great subterfuge was not employed by the order itself, but by Brandon Sanderson - he's written that vision specifically with Stonewards to trick us

Using shardblade was also against his character.

I think the scene is pretty well described in WoR.

Yup, that makes sense. Although I would assume that after some time (long time) the spren would naturally escape the gem, since nothing is a pure container.

My impression reading Brandon's words was that Nightblood's smoke is corrupted investiture, and *people* associate "corrupted" investiture with "mixed" investiture, so I can draw the conclusion that Brandon himself does not consider "corrupted" investiture and "mixed" investiture to be the same thing. But hey, english is my 2nd language.

So, my question is - why didn't it go dun? It's been quite a while probably since it was invested ... just how much is in there??? Can a sphere contain that much? (because with regular stormlight it would be dun pretty fast).

Heralds being from Braize would make more sense than Nalthis/other planet, and would fit the rosharan mythology. Was this asked/discussed already?

I thought it was revealed they are gonna use it as oathgate key, such that non KR can use the oathgates.

The blade her father put in the safe is described quite differently, it was more like a knife - to fit Shallan's small size at the time probably.