Ailvara

Another possibility is, that it will be about as significant for his storyline as Cryptics watching Elhokar... Which is not that much. Unfortunately, I didn't discuss the pre-release chapters here, but on Tor's webpage, it was also spotted and mostly left. However, in the new context of Adolin dodging responsibility where we know, what a bad idea this is... What chances are there, that Adolin just drops this bomb in a moment, where he could easily say anything else about himself, where we can easily dismiss it in the light and comedic context, and, of all signs available on Roshar, he is associated with one of the two that are quite so significant (the other being 10 for Honor)?

Nine is a number associated with Odium. There was even a WoB on that. EDIT: Oh, there, I've found it! https://wob.coppermind.net/events/175-oathbringer-houston-signing/ Questioner [PENDING REVIEW] I have a theory that each one of the Shards is related to a certain number. Preservation really likes 16, Honor likes 10, and Odium likes 9. Am I onto something? Brandon Sanderson [PENDING REVIEW] Yes.

And I'm a sucker for tragic plot twists Anyway, apart from my own wishes, it would be good to discuss it as broadly as possible. Maybe we should have another thread so that people staying away from this topic could contribute? I just wanted to remind about this quote: EDIT: I was thinking about how to reconcile both storylines, as I don't like red herrings and I hope there is something to both of them. And my wild speculation is, that Adolin reviving Maya might result in him gaining Radiant powers without saying the oaths, as he would be already bound to her. It feels like a stretch, but with some work on the details and maybe new information on how these things work, it might be possible.

I don't like Shallan. I don't like to beat her up either. And there is one reason for both: she reminds me too much of myself. Of some good things, but mostly of the bad ones. I was also raised in a somewhat sheltered environment (in a mostly good way though, as much as it can be). The way she turns issues into a joke and can be insensitive when she's nervous is too familiar. The way she escapes problems by applying "I'll think about it tomorrow (or not at all)". How she sometimes gets invested in a task and forgets everything around for better or for worse. Even her prejudices, it's something that I have to actively fight in my mind. The way she grows, but remains somewhat childish and selfish nevertheless. I could probably go on. My point is, she simply makes me cringy and uneasy, because she makes me look these things in the face... And I must admit, it gives her great credit as a literary character.

Who says without any feelings. As I'm in the "this marriage won't end well" camp, I'd rather see this as a source of disagreement between Shallan and Adolin. They might overlook some of their key differences for the honeymoon, but when Adolin, being his loving and compassionate self, sees, for example, how Shallan turns out to be career-oriented and even selfish around the baby, it would get to him more than if she neglected himself. This is pure speculation, but it could go this way and make sense for the story.

Even if there would be no reasons from the story-level point of view, there might still be in-world reasons. I don't know where Roshar stands in terms of contraception, but a baby within a year might be just a natural/inevitable course of events unless explained otherwise. EDIT it might also add to Adolin's story, or someone else's from the family, or the baby might be a character planned for the next 5 books

There are only so many hours in a day. You can raise a child having 9-5 job to some extent, (still with some help ofc), but saving the world tends to be a 24/7 kind of party. It's possible to combine nearly any kind of roles in a lifetime, but not always at the same time. That being said, they're going to have as many babysitters as they need. I'd honestly expect Shallan's commitment to parenting to be possibly not much bigger than Dalinar's... Which would work practically and only practically, so I hope it won't happen. But I personally don't like baby storylines, so I'm biased.

No WoB as far as I know. And it has been discussed somewhere here, but which page exactly, huh, that's the question.

It just hit me, how neatly many of our complaints would be addressed if only leaving Sadeas' murder plot aside was intentional. Wouldn't that leave Adolin somewhat in the place of all those who gave up the guilt for their actions and fell to Odium as a result. "I will take responsibility for what I have done" just sounds so bitter in the context of Adolin.

Well, there are no divorces in Catholic Church either. And yet, if someone would get into a marriage in Shallan's mental state, it would be a matter of formality to have it deemed null and void. (I'm no expert in church laws, but it's not about accuracy, as these are two different religions anyway) Also, I'm turning out to be a terrible devil's advocate, I'll probably keep on sunbathing at the bow and daydreaming thank you very much.

I would rather expect Adolin's death to be partly influenced by Shallan's revelation; now wouldn't that be tragic (and very interesting).

I'm surprised so many people prefer the US cover. It's not bad, but just a bit too much of a... "classic fantasy cover". Those UK editions with reduced color palette are just way more elegant, modern and consistent, even if not every single graphic is great. I must tell you, that the polish ones are quite epic:

I'm really wondering, where they're going to head with this. Moash has now Jezrien's blade and something he captured from him - my guess is, the power he was Invested with? Maybe it will let the fused turn him literally into an anti-Herald. Would explain why they need him, we might have half void/surgebinders, but maybe Heralds' power is exclusive to humans.

Hello, so happy to be back to our support group! Huh, last time I restored my activity in this thread, I was so agitated to come back for responses, aaand... I just sat there blinking in surprise for a moment. My first thought was that we had reached the post count limit xD Back to the thread. After our discussions, I shifted fully to "denial" and started to believe the theory of this being not nearly over. However, yesterday I was rereading the ending and it struck me, that emotionally, this ending seems proper. Maybe it's the constant exploration of other people's opinions or a different pace of reading, but it felt to me like a natural progress and final resolution, which I could almost agree with. Now, before you get the wrong idea, if you think I'm jumping ship, that's not this at all. Looking at all the books, and not just the OB ending, I'm still all on Shalladin board. This change of heart just got me worried, that Brandon did his best resolving the triangle and there really isn't more to it. It scares me much more than it should, that we are developing some unreasonable expectations that will ruin book 4 for us, so I would like to keep challenging our assumptions and really try to get to the bottom of it. So, as a newly self-appointed SS Shalladin's devil's advocate, I would like to put to discussion this quote: I would really hate that, but this feels like by dismissing Veil and Radiant, Shallan reclaimed some amount of her confidence from them. Could that actually mean, that she actually is on the best way to reintegrate them and we'll see her whole after the 1-year gap?

All arguments against these words being three oaths are valid, and my gut feeling is, that it was indeed just one. I only have one problem with this approach - if "I am Unity" is not the Bondsmiths' third ideal, then what is...?

I wonder, why is it a thing for Bondsmiths in the first place. Could it be, that since Honor's splintering the spren that originate from him rather than Cultivation are more powerful and every oath progress from these three orders is a smaller version of Dalinar's ascension?

Welcome to SS Shalladin. It's a small (but graceful) yacht, so sailing just nearly straight into the wind is what it does best. "Sailing before landing"

But shardblades don't cut each other either, which means spren are capable of hardening themselves this way. So I'm not sure if there is a need for an entirely different mechanism for the plate.

I just wanted to add, how uplifting Kaladin's arc was for me personally. It shows how even a superhero can go from epic wins to fail without it necessary meaning that somewhere in the meantime he himself became a worse or weaker person. Fantastic contrast to Dalinar, one of them needs to acknowledge his responsibility for his failures to move forward, the other one needs to let it go.

So, since Honor's death didn't cause the Recreance, maybe it was the other way round? Such a huge blow against his Intent might have weakened him in a way?

Actually, could you pm me too if you have time? The thing is, I usually have a decent nose for romantic storylines - of course, I don't always ship canon! But when I don't I usually either know it from the start, or at the end everybody is equally shocked (usually due to some sloppy last-minute trope avoidance). This time I feel like I was sailing for a moment on this super high-end ship with storage full of hints and evidence... and suddenly it turns out that we're crashed into the rocks on good weather, most of the passengers are evacuating happily to the ferry passing by at full speed, the cargo is sinking and nobody knows if we took any emergency boats. It's just so confusing. Like my brain started working on some alien frequencies (fortunately shared by the lovely group here) and I never even noticed. @DeployParachute You put in more detailed and clearer words something I was aiming at back in our old thread, thank you. This idea is so dramatic, compelling and heartbreaking... Maybe I'm a bit of a book masochist, but I desperately want to read it and cry my eyes out. And I am so worried, that there is such a potential development gem in this story and if it's not going to happen, it'll be way, way worse than any ship sinking. So MUCH potential. If I still have to be bitter (I should get a life, but for now I only have exams), I'm glad I'm not alone. I blame my lack of knowledge of other Sanderson's books at that time, but when I saw an arranged relationship not supported by any love-hate kind of trope but just... meh, I only saw it as a temporary excuse for keeping Shallan around other main characters for the time being... it didn't even scream to me "not gonna happen", just... nothing. Another post I can't upvote enough.

I was just reading the annotations to WoK and I hoped we could discuss this: So, once Shallan figures out her problems, who is she going to be? Can she heal enough to fully become this person of "flaring passion"? Or are the scars from childhood an integral part of her current true self, for better or for worse, and she'll always keep her timid side? Thoughts? Sidenote: I really like how it resonates with the way she is fascinated by Kaladin's passion; she seems to feel subconsciously, that it's something she should have, but had lost.

If I had any doubts about Jasnah having feelings, they evaporated as soon as I saw her crying at the Gavilar's funeral. Not to mention the brilliant goodbye ritual with the all day reading of The Way Of Kings.

A lot of confusing negation in this one, so I'm not sure, but shouldn't that be "not so lively that I would mind a seat" or maybe "not so lively that I wouldn't need/want a seat"? Kindle UK version, page 1058