alder24

You forgot the Night Brigade is using Hemalurgy, your art? If Nomad can remove his Torment, they can probably take away what allows him to feed investiture in the first place, if not they can just take a nicrosil spike and remove all of that investiture Nomad holds. It's such a simple solution I'm surprised you didn't think about it. TSM ch 28: Not to mention they can just use A-chromium or a larkin to suck up all of that tasty investiture. Just being invested isn't a problem for the Night Brigade. Yup, they can obliterate entire planets, Nomad can only run away from them. Raw investiture won't make him invincible, at best he could heal a lot of damage before running out of power. Sig is not like Hoid, Hoid was holding a Dawnshard way longer and that affected him more than Sig. That's why Hoid is almost invincible. Investiture alone won't make Sig like that. TSM ch 34:

I don't think that will work, Hemalurgy steals only pieces of a soul and the spirit web of a spren is still there, technically alive (as spren can't be killed, you can't kill an idea). What you're describing is more or less Deadeye, which still can't be burned. You need to remove the entire spirit web of a spren with their cognitive aspect and that's way harder as it's tied to their physical form. Just grab Nightblood and hit a Honorblade a few times - it's easier. Perception won't matter in this case because Shardblade is alive, the investiture making up this god metal is alive, has its own spirit web and cognitive aspect. Perception won't remove it. If you were to kill all of that, you will be left with just a piece of raw investiture. TSM spoilers in case:

If you're not an Allomancer, then pure Lerasium will make you one - that's confirmed because it's not you burning it, it's your body that does it. If you're an Allomancer then Lerasium can have a different effect - we know this from many other WoBs: That's what the WoB suggests, but judging from Wax's case this limit must have been pretty insignificant as if even Lerasium dust can make you into a full Mistborn then it doesn't matter. My point was that pure Lerasium on its own won't make you a Misting even if there is a little amount of it, because it's not "programmed" to do it. It doesn't know how to do it. That's why you have to alloy it with base metals to key it to the specific power. This wasn't about initial investiture levels - Mists didn't target people who could become full Mistborn as they were not a part of 16. Mists target mainly those too weak for any power to manifest in them and Mists invest them with additional power to bring their ability to the surface. To make someone into a Mistborn Mists would require them to invest people much more. The difference in Lerasium and Mists is that Mists were programed to do that autonomously by Preservation, Lerasium is just a mindless piece of metal that can't do anything on its own, that's why you need to alloy it to tell it what power you want to get, otherwise it will just give you everything. Highly disagree, she would become a Mistborn of the same strength as Wax (except for steal). It's like in Hemalurgy, it adds to what you already have. The amount added doesn't depend on your soul, but on the amount of Lerasium used. Lerasium consumed by Vin wouldn't give her more strength just because she already was an Allomancer and her soul was invested, she would get the same effect as someone with low potential. Lerasium directly rewrites the spirit web, but unless you alloy it with base metals, it won't make you into a Misting, because pure Lerasium can only create Mistborn.

No, aluminum just blanks your identity. The problem is that your spirit web remains in your body, not in the cut off ear. Physical injuries don't cut your spirit, and your spirit will always stay in the larger part of your body.

Yes, I agree with it too. That was just the best case scenario, which might happen if the conditions are just right, if the cultural integration is deep enough and enough time has passed - we're talking centuries of time, a very long time frame in which people will slowly develop a new identity.

In the case of Turkey yes, for sure there is no prevalent self-identity of being Roman. But it also depends, Byzantines stubbornly called themselves Romans till the very end, even though 1000 years had passed since Rome had fallen and they were vastly different than Romans of the Western Roman Empire. Then many of those "natives" also considered themselves true Romans under Ottoman rule, who viewed themselves as their successors through the conquest for some time. But nations evolve, people change, priorities shift, new identities are developed and the tie to ancient Rome eventually gets diminished in importance. On the other hand we also have Greeks who never stopped considering themselves as Greeks even though they lived for 2000 years under rule of foreign powers (although Greece and its culture was of great influence over the Eastern Roman Empire). If Arelon were to conquer others, then I see no reason why they would try to call themselves someone else's title. This is because their own culture and history is strong enough that they can take pride in it and their tie to Arelon (and most important Elantris) is a key to their identity - just look at the first Aonic people who quickly overcome their fear and moved into the abandoned city of Elantris itself, as the glory of being rulers of it was too vast to be sitting under its walls. Over time they will probably include other conquered nations as Aonic, just like at the beginning Romans were considered to be only the citizens of the city of Rome, despite their vast conquests, then they included every Italic people as true Romans, later that was extended even further. Would that change Aons? No. As I said earlier, I believe Aons are strictly about geography, not people and their perception - it didn't matter that there was nobody living in Arelon before Aonic people migrated there, Aons already existed as they are tied to the land itself - Aons were discovered, not created. Perception has no big impact on Aons because Elantrians didn't know about the Chasm, yet it changed Aons immediately. Because on Sel investiture is trapped in the CR, the self-perception and identity are less important than proximity and location. Even if Fjordell was conquered and successfully integrated by Arelon, to the point that they will identify themselves as true Aonic people, a person from the total opposite of the new Arelon empire would never be taken by Shaod, because they are simply too far away from Elantris and its investiture, lacking any ties to the land of Arelon itself - they may have ties to people and Arelon as a country, but not to the land. In this case their tie to the local land would be stronger than to the distant land on the other side of the massive empire. A better example, if for some reason Teod were to fully conquer the Rose Empire up north, then they will have all the reasons to call themselves as their true successors and true citizens of the Empire (Rosans? ) and change their identity to theirs. That would be politically beneficial to them, improve their status and prestige - just like Ottomans calling themselves Romans after conquering Constantinople. Also they would "feel" closer to the Rose Empire, because traveling and trade between them would blossom, news would be exchanged faster and matters of the northern parts of the empire would be of importance to those in Teod. This change of identity and self-perception might be enough to cut their ties to Arelon and their Aonic descend, preventing them from being taken by Shaod at all. Their geographic proximity didn't change, but their Connection to the land did and they are already close enough to those two lands for their perception to matter a bit. In the case of Shaod and other invested arts, perception still matters (as evident by the first Aonic people who were taken by Shaod only decades after migrating to Arelon, not immediately), but the location seems to be far more important factor (because Aonic people had to live in Arelon for this to work at all and people from Teod are taken only when they are in Arelon) and I think in some cases perception alone can't break through the fact that you're nowhere near the proper geographical location you need to be to be an Elantrian. But Aons are based on geography only - if you want to change them then cut forests, reroute rivers, dry lakes and flatten hills - that will change Aons, not imaginary borders on maps.

It's about geography and that's not some made up lines on a political map. Political borders are separate from a geographical region in which the country of Arelon rose, Aons care only about geography. Aons wouldn't be changed. Only people of Aonic descent can become Elantrians, however it's probably the matter of what they consider to be their homeland. The first Aonic people, who migrated to Arelon and to already standing Elantris, were not taken by the Shaod until several decades later so this implies it's not about genes, it's about self-identification as "Arelonians." If Arelon were to be conquered they would still consider Arelon's region their home, no matter if such country exists or not. If for example Fjordell where to banish everyone and colonize Arelon with their own people, it will probably take decades or centuries before they would be taken by Shaod as well, depending on how they view themselves. Can't help it, I have to point out maybe that's because the term Byzantium was only used more than 100 years after the Eastern Roman Empire fell as a refusal of their status of the Roman Empire successor because HRE claimed to be that and the term Byzantium originated from Germany? Byzantines considered themselves Romans and many Ottoman Turks called themselves Romans as well, as successors of the Eastern Roman Empire and were recognized as such by the Arabic world and even some Europeans.

It seems to be Bavadin, they did have a past relationship. OB ch 42 epigraphs: And if Brandon in his answer to the WoB you've quoted meant that Hoid dated a dragon who was not a vessel at that point, but later became, then it means Koravellium as she is the only Shard-Dragon. But this answer is indirect enough that those two might have been separate people. We don't know which dragon he dated, there are many of them and we know just two others excluding Koravellium. Hoid and Rayse were just friends once: He refers to every Shard by their Vessel's name. Other Vessels do the same tbf. Possible. I agree that Valor is a likely candidate. We will see in SA5 as Valor will be name-dropped: That's WoR ch 55, it's on Koravellium's Coppermind. OB ch 68:

I agree with others. However I don't think this is a fair comparison - the migration from Ashyn to Roshar is more comparable to the creation of Scadrial by Preservation and Ruin - in both cases Shards settled on a planet, bringing with them humans and sparking conflict between Shards that will last for millenia with humanity paying with blood. Catacendre vastly overshadows both of them because Sazed merging two Shards together is probably one of the most important thing that happened after the Shattering itself - it gives hope that Adonalsium can be recombined in one form or the other and it directly frightened numerous other Shards like Autonomy or Odium himself. Compare it to Odium being more annoyed by the cycle of Desolations and his imprisonment on Roshar rather than scared and despite that, he still managed to Splinter Honor, which had happened before with Ambition and Devotion/Dominion and the Splintering of Ambition, Dominion and Devotion is in my opinion slightly more impactful than what happened on Roshar (especially the Selish Splintering as it set a precedent of killing Shards). However the Catacendre was the end of the story started by Ruin and Preservation creating Scadrial, Odium settling on Roshar with Ashynite is the beginning or Rosharan arc, which is still ongoing and until we know how it ends, we can't say how impactful it was.

Yes and no. Taravangian said to Dalinar that he did all of this and Odium promised to spare Kharbranth, but he didn't fully explain what words were used - that Odium won't harm anyone born in Kharbranth with their spouses etc. RoW ch 66:

So, person A is a Tineye, person B is a Seeker, B steals A-tin from A killing them, then person C wants to steal all powers person B have with a spike? Then C can only steal A-bronze from B, as that's their natural ability. For C to take A-tin from B, they would have to just remove B's spike and spike themselves with it. Every ability stolen with a spike remains in it (it invests the spike), even if implanted into a Hemalurgist. It's not directly a part of a Hemalurgist's soul, it's "hot-wired" into their soul, but the stolen piece of a soul remains all the time in a spike. You can't steal it by driving another spike through a person - you need to remove a spike and place it in your own body. Plus, as it's currently understood by Scadrians, you can't steal several powers with a single spike. One spike can steal only one power - in the future it might change as Brandon hinted it might be possible to steal multiple powers with a single spike. Technically speaking, there is a way to steal powers granted by a spike, said by Brandon in a WoB below - either he was talking about just removing spikes, or using a second spike to steal the power granted by the first spike, we don't know, but even if the latter was possible, it's probably a overly complicated way, which is hard to do, and not practical at all. Anyway it won't be as simple as taking another spike and driving it through a Hemalurgist's heart, like it's normally done. Not like that. Identity messes everything up. You can't reuse spikes like that. Maybe if you blank everyone's Identity it would be somewhat achievable.

That's correct. You can't sense anyone inside of it, or if it's your Coppercloud, you can't sense anyone at all. TFE ch 7: TFE ch 20: Possibly for those who were just Seekers before transformation, but I expect in most cases they weren't burning copper when they were using bronze. But even when piercing a Coppercloud the Allomantic pulses detected are weakened, so it's better for Inquisitors not to do that (especially that they would have to pierce through 2 Copperclouds in some cases, their own and another Smoker, which would definitely prevent them from sensing anything). TFE ch 31: Possibly, but that would require them to focus to even detect those pulses so I don't think it's that useful. It's better to use A-tin and slightly hitting two coins together in a morse code to create sounds detectable only to others using A-tin. Or just jump around to contact other inquisitors directly - they didn't really care about being stealthy. Fear was a far more useful tool for them to use.

Again, not true. Per given WoB, Mistborn are as invested as Radiants, and Kaladin at 3rd Ideal was comparable to someone with some Heightenings, per Riino in OB. So at the very low end, Both Mistborn and the 3rd Ideal Radiant are invested with 50 BEUs, just from the fact that they have access to an invested art, which is 16-25 times more than 2-3 BEUs of those normal people from high investiture worlds and 50 times more than Threnodites from Canticle. OB ch 97: TSM ch 23: The fact that both Radiants and Mistborns are comparable invested is even more evident when comparing the death of Kelsier and Eshonai - both were predicted to last similar amounts of time, while normal people stumbled into CR and disappeared within seconds, sometimes even immediately. This proves that a Mistborn is vastly more invested than a regular human. That's still vastly more than 2-3 BEUs you proposed and that's my point - Mistborn and Mistings are more invested than normal people. Threnodites aren't Cognitive Shadows YET. This Shade attached to their soul is just a twisted innate investiture, which on its own isn't that invested - worth just 1 BEU. Something is happening when they are turned into Shades that invests them, making them into Cognitive Shadows. Threnodites aren't heavily invested (not everyone), while Shades are, which means something invest them when they are turned into a Shade. I didn't ignore it - both Allomancy and Radiance come from Connection. A spirit web is made out of both Connections and raw investiture and by increasing one of those things, you get the same effect as being more invested. So having a strong Connection, like the one that provides Allomancy, or a Nahel Bond, manifests in the same way as having a lot of raw investiture, like Breaths. There is no Radiant bond between them. I didn't propose that Mistborn are 1000 times more invested than normal people, just that they are more invested than 2-3 BEUs. Charred may fall in this range, I don't think we have a direct quote saying how invested they are (they are invested enough to be supernaturally fast and strong), but I specifically said that numbers will differ and I believe Mistborn will be less invested, a few dozens, maybe low hundreds BEUs at best - but nowhere near a 1000 BEUs. They are innate investiture, which also is gaseous when transferred between people/objects. So yes, Breaths are pieces of a soul. You don't need to grow an entire body to make an artificial meat, you don't need to create a fully sapient entity to grow an artificial soul, as Brandon directly compared those two together. While you may avoid harming others, you will still deal a significant harm to your own soul, cracking it and exposing yourself to outside powers to some degree. Hemalurgy is always damaging.

Most people, not most invested people. Most people in Cosmere do not have access to any invested ability. The spear that made Charred was worth 2000-4000 BEUs of investiture alone, Charred are therefore significantly invested and the same applies to anyone who has access to some kind of invested art (of course numbers will differ but they are significantly more than 2-3 BEUs). TSM ch 24: TSM ch 4: You've cut a very significant part of that WoB, a correction to his previous words - a Mistborn is as invested as a Radiant is, even if he doesn't burn metals - full WoB: Well, except it is (last WoB). Snapping invests people. Unsnapped Mistborn would fall into the range of 2-3 BEU and there is a difference between having a potential for being a Mistborn, or a Misting. But Snapped people would be much higher invested because the idea of Snapping is that investiture is filling cracks in their soul, adding to it. That's how it was hinted from the beginning, even with the Identity, so Brandon 100% delivered on that foreshadowing. TFE ch 29: Moreover we already have proof in Yumi that you can replace pieces of soul - Breaths - with other types of investiture to perform the art. I don't doubt that there will be limiatations, but Brandon is very open about this possibility being real in Cosmere for any invested art. We know you can grow artificial souls, that's the very same thing that was hinted in TLM. With this I agree, but you won't avoid Ruin. I don't doubt it will be bound by restrictions, however it's still Hemalurgy, it will still hurt your soul when spiking yourself. Why would you grow a soul (which probably would be a difficult process) and hurt yourself, when you can just use a non-invasive medallion, or a primer cube?

While I do agree with your previous statement, this is not true. Pure Lerasium will always make you a Mistborn. To become a Misting you must alloy it with one of 16 base metals. But per this WoB it seems like you need a certain amount of Lerasium for it to make you into a Mistborn/Misting.

No, because those cells don't carry the Spiritual DNA with them, as that stays with the Surgebinder's soul from which those cells got separated during this process. Not to mention that another person can't use Surgebinder's powers cause of Connection and Identity differences and other factors. A Surgebinder's cells or body parts in another person's body are no longer "his" and perception can't change it all due to the fact that the soul stays with the larger portion of a body. I don't think you can Forge just your individual cells to have Radiant powers, as that's coming from your Spirit Web, not from cells. Forging yourself to become Radiant to heal is extremely difficult and requires a ton of investiture. If you want to use Forgery just use Resealing, which heals physical damage.

How do you know it's possible? What you want is type 1 entity - Returned - in which the Divine Breaths serves the function of sustaining the deceased body. Because you're Awakening a dead body, you need a constant supply of power to keep it alive. I don't see a way of doing it as you described it - separately Awakening multiple organs won’t make a single sentient entity (and won’t make those organs alive). He has his own Identity, that's why it's impossible to recover the Breaths he was Awakened with, as they are stick to his new Identity (just like with Lifeless). Vivenne's sword doesn't corrupt investiture. That's a way to avoid what Nightblood does. Nightblood's corruption is partially from the fact that it's about investiture trying to become sentient but being held back by something. This is a specific thing, shared by multiple other entities (like Midnight Essence or the Father Machine). Theoretically yes, practically no. Nightblood is more invested than Unmades, he's the most invested object in Cosmere. Shards may be able to do it and maybe a Bondsmitch unchained (if that would be considered command breaking). That's an interesting question. I think yes because Fused are dead anyway and they are fully sustained by Odium's power directly, so the state of the host's body shouldn't matter, as long as it's somewhat alive. There might be some complications, they would probably function as a drab-Fused - now that I mentioned this there is a WoB which states a Lifeless can become a Returned and they would be a drab-Returned. It should work the same with Fused as they're both Cognitive Shadows.

Possibly, Vivenne's blade is a step towards it. I personally believe that "destroy evil" was a sub-Command that only specify the purpose of Nightblood, while the Awakening to sentience was done by a similar method as Awakening Lifeless - it's a two stage process, you first Awaken a body to be a Lifeless with a Command "Awaken to my Breath, serve my needs, live at my Command and at my word," then you give it Commands to carry a box, or fight etc. I think a similar thing should apply to type 4 entities because "destroy evil" doesn't tell it to be sentient, it only tells Nightblood what to do with that sentience. I don't think so, but you can certainly make them cooperate - Lifeless city guards are working together. I think it can work like our body, each organ doing its own thing while also responding to signals sent out by the Awakened brain, which makes decisions based on senses etc. I wouldn't say the brain is in control, more like it would be coordinating the rest of Awakened organs. You don't need spoken Commands, Vasher can Awaken a rope that responds to the taps of his fingers. Lifeless are already responding to their senses and their surroundings. Yes, just like our brain sends signals via the nervous system, Awakened organs can do the same in a similar way. An Awakened brain can send a physical signal, which will mean a specific thing and a heart will receive it, responding with a pre-programmed way - like by increasing the heartbeat rate. All of this is kind of pointless, because Lifeless doesn't need any organ, not even a brain. It just adds unnecessary complexity for no reason at all, when all you should do is Awaken a body, bones. or a brain and put it in a mech-suit.

Yes, I was writing it with that WoB in mind, that's why I didn't say Rosharans have souls made only out of investiture of Honor and Cultivation. For that reason they probably contain a whole spectrum of Shardic investiture in their soul, but the trio of local Shardic power most likely dominates their spirit web composition - the entire Rosharan system is saturated by their investiture, Navani was able to hear Honor's pure tone from deep within her. Rosharans have a piece of Honor in them, but that's not the only piece and because their ancestors likely predate the Shattering (they weren't created by any Shard) their souls most likely contain small pieces of every Shard, with Honor, Cultivation and Odium's investiture dominating over the rest and being the mixture that makes up their innate investiture. At least that's my view on this, we don't know precisely what their soul is made of (unlike with Nalthians and Scadrians) - Brandon didn't tell us.

I see no reason why not - you can Awaken just bones, so you can Awaken just heart or lungs. It will cost more Breaths and require some maintenance, but that should work. That's what Kalad's Phantoms were. It did require additional Breaths and Awakening to provide movement for the stone body that Lifeless bones were encased in, but that's more or less the same thing you're asking for, except the Phantoms were made by Awakening all bones as one Lifeless. You don't need organs - Lifeless is dead anyway - you just need a Lifeless at the core of the Construct. But you can Awaken a Lifeless and put it in an artificial body - Kalad's Phantoms. The problem with your approach is that it doesn't matter if the organs are all there working or not - the Lifeless is dead, it's not sentient enough and sentience is all that matters. This won't change with adding more organs, which you propose to separately Awaken each, which means each organ is its own Lifeless. You will end up with a body that's made out of several Lifeless, each Commanded to act as a single being, while each is not sentient enough to be alive. So you can make it like this, it's an overly complicated way of creating a Lifeless in an artificial body - just arrange a set of bones in the correct shape, Awaken it and plant it in a metal body and you have far better Construct. You probably can Awaken a body part without making it Lifeless - it's most likely a matter of Command and Intent. So that can be done, but you don't need to Awaken each organ separately, just one thing will work (like nervous system, muscles, or something). That won't work that well, because the organ is dead and Awakening it won't change it - it will drain it out of color if you're making a Lifeless which will make it even worse. It can still function like a heart, but it's dead now, it will break after some time, just like every Lifeless does (and it requires ichor-alcohol for preservation, as Lifeless bodies with it last longer than without it). It's not as perfect as transplanting a living heart, which will be sustained by your body. Yup, it would be. It's not about the body, it's about the mind. Lifeless is not sentient yet, they are self-aware, but not fully sentient. Apparently some unsealed medallions can make Lifeless alive again, so there are ways of making people out of Lifeless. That's type 4 Awakening, Nightblood. Or rather depending on what you want to achieve, Commanding it to "be like a person" won't make it sentient, it will be just masquerading as a person (which is fine if that’s what you want it to do). If you want to Awaken a person, create sentience, you need to do what was done to Nightblood - which doesn't require a human body.

That's not the same as having a piece of your soul made out of Virtuosity investiture, granting the Father Machine that strong Connection it could have used. While over hundreds of years those nomads that survived on Komashi would likely be getting closer and closer to Virtuosity, eventually having their soul draw from and be made out of her investiture, the Father Machine drew investiture from people only for the initial activation period and stopped doing that after it got strong enough to drew from the Spirits. Humans are no longer at risk. Similarly Rosharans have their soul made out of investiture of primarily 2 Shards, Scadrians have their investiture made entirely out of Ruin and Preservation's power, Nalthians are infused with Endowment's investiture etc, people on Komashi were invested with Virtuosity's investiture. Rosharans literally have a piece of Honor in their souls. Hoid on the other hand was recognized by the Father Machine as Yoki Hijo (because of how invested he was) and it tried to trap him in and continuously remove his memories, just like it did with other Yoki Hijo.

I've been summoned! WoBs incoming. No, because the ear is no longer part of your body, it's separated, so it doesn't matter that the spike is still in it, it's not connected to your body anymore. If you regrow the entire cut off limb, then there is no spike there, so you don't have any powers from it. Then I believe it would reseal the wound, reconnecting your ear to your body, thus giving you back your powers from spikes in it. But if you don't hold your ear next to you, you would just regrow it entirely, if you have enough healing (which shouldn't take that much, considering wounds Wayne was able to heal). No, the larger part of your spirit web is what remains you. Cutting off your ear disconnects it from your spirit web (but it's not a spiritual cut, your spirit web isn't cut, it's still whole). Moreover, Hemalurgy (and all Metallic Arts) works through the Physical Realm, so you have to have metals close to your body (though a touch), thus close to your soul. Cutting off your ear cuts it off from your body, thus from your soul (as your entire soul stays with the larger portion of your body), which in turn takes away powers, which spikes in the ear were giving you. A physical cut servers that ear from your soul, so there is no soul that a spike in that ear is piercing anymore - that's why Inquisitors die when their heads are cut off (one of the reasons), as spikes are getting disconnected from their spirit webs. WoBs you've all been waiting for, on which I based this opinion: SA spoilers: Perception doesn't matter here, because it can't force your soul to remain with your separated ear. The ear simply stops being a part of you and perception can only decide whether or not you regrow it with healing, not if it’s still with your soul. The soul remains intact with the larger portion of you - physical wounds don't cut the soul in half.

It seems like this is a somewhat plausible way to stop a ship breach, or at least slow down a rapid decompression. The air still flows through time bubbles, just like bullets it gots deflected because a bubble changes air's momentum. There are WoBs supporting your proposition.

Unless the wound is directly in a proper binding point, in which you can fit a spike and stop the bleeding with a piece of metal, organs won't be healed when rearranged by Hemalurgy, because Hemalurgy doesn't heal. You would still be wounded, lethally if the wound was that serious, but the wound would be just shifted into a different place, without being healed in the slightest. The only advantage of Hemalurgy would be increased investment of your soul, which in terms boosts your immune system and your body's natural ability to heal, but that won't help you in the immediate aftermath of being wounded.

I think yes, as you don't need to create a fake source of investiture to feed on, you need to suppress some parts of your spirit web, mainly the Connection to an Aether and spores, so at most you would need to overcome the resistance your soul (because it's a bit more invested), but that's something that Forgery can do easily. I think you can do that and it won’t require a lot of investiture.