WhiteLeeopard

Mraize was probably purchasing famous Shallash art works hoping she would come to destroy them. He seemed quite happy (for him) that she finally sneaked in disguised as a washwoman. Also, can I say that she likely destroyed the original of THIS, which should definetely count as a crime... Break the Oathpact, whatever, break this piece, nononono .

The part I highlighted seems a bit harsh. The way I see it organizations often start off fresh and hopeful, and with time they become stiff, arrogant, unyielding, and slightly corrupted, if for no other reason than that procedure becomes firmly entrenched and open mindedness is shot down. What this means for the skybreakers is that they have likely been around for 6000 years, become harder and more corrupted with the years. This is seen in Roshar in the kingdoms, all with their problems, the older the kingdom the more stupid traditions. When the original Radiants left Urithiru some said they were sick and tired of all the politics and were happy to leave. The reason the other 9 orders seem so great right now is we are seing the orders in their pure essence without all the baggage and traditions they will doubtlessly gain with the centuries. All in all, I'd say its impressive the Skybreakers are as well organized as they are considering they have had millenia to gather vices. The current Skybreakers seem quite impeded by their leader and structure, but I am hopeful that so many of them admired Szeth, and his differences instead of being jaleous of the extra attention he got and trying to shoot him down. I also respected that even after Szeth said he would fight for humanity against them, Nale said he was still one of them and they would train him. This made me hope that eventually a group of Skybreakers will splinter off to go to Urithiru. They have some hurdles but they are hardly all bad. P.s. I'd also argue Dustbringers are not looking too hot right now.

The radiants left Urithiru for some reason long before the Recreance. Urithiru currently is at the least not functioning. Its incredibly cold, the water and sewers aren't flowing and working, the fields are not yielding crops because its so high up. I bet if they could get the pillar working all of those issues and more would be fixed. Currently one of the biggest advantages which the heroes have is a highly defensible base of operations, which unfortunately isn't working and that they don't understand. Considering Urithiru probably fits the entire population of Roshar, the KR may want to figure it out fast, as having to retreat fully is not entirely improbable.

It was indeed disturbing to read, I remember a WoB where Brandon said OB would be hard to read for Dalinar fans. OB truly made me realize why it was meant to be book 5, and then as an exception was moved to book3. Can you imagine reading OB flashbacks as book 1 or 2? Dalinar would be one of the most hated protagonists ever. This was a good reminder of how Navani thought Evi was viewed by the alethi. Its an interesting contrast. Evi said she was mocked for not been cutting or trampling others verbally, while Navani says Evi was loved by all by her sweetness. Wonder if one of them was grossly skewed, or if simply Evi focused on the bad, which Navani never saw. Personally, I think everyone in the Rift did stupid decisions, comparing who was smarter is an exercise in futility as they all were very dumb. Tanavan was given yet ANOTHER chance to yield, save his people and come away as a highprince and one of the most influential people in Alethkar, he tossed it aside for pride. Evi conviced Dalinar to show mercy, Tanavan betrayed him and Evi thought Dalinar was killed, did she seriously expect honor from the Rift after that or the Blackthorn to show mercy? Dalinar killed the messengers without hearing them and walked into the original trap that almost killed them, wouldn't it be better to hear the message then kill them? Sadeas was just plain old Sadeas. In summary, everyone was stupid in the Rift, just because one was stupider than the other, doesn't mean anyone made a smart decision.

Four words. Nightblood for the win! In all seriousness I suspect the war may be a back and forth between the two sides. OB was likely the biggest wave forth from Odium. The other side was unprepared, had zero idea what to expect, unorganized and with no knowledge from the past. Half of the Fused are nutjobs. Not to say they are not dangerous though. Nightblood is a permanent solution to Fused. And possibly whatever weapon was used to kill Jezrien. T tried his all to undermine humanity and even without trying the heroes kept his schemes in check, After been aware that sweet, doddering T is not so sweet and doddering I'd expect them to keep an eye on him. The Heralds so far have done nothing to help humanity, so their deaths are not directly such an issue. The bigger threat is what their deaths will mean for the Oathpact, as I don't think the Oathpact is as irrelevant as rosharans seem to think. Its even possible the threat of true death may make some of them get off their heraldic butts and help. Corrupted Urithiru is actually imo the biggest threat our heroes face. Part of the reason I don't find the current circumstances so dire is...whats the big deal of armies and nations if 7 radiants kept back a whole army by themselves on Thaylenah? ^^. I know it was exceptional circumstances, and even then they only held the army back for a while, but still...7 Radiants, seriously. Another point is that Venli is poised to move to a neutral position a portion of the Singers. Many of them don't actually want war, they just want to live, all they need is a small push/voice to split out. This is a loss/loss for Odium, as if he tries to stop them from leaving more would likely rebel seing they are as much slaves as they were before. The parsh is actually the group I am most sympathetic towards, as they just come out losing no matter what they do, and have been the ones to suffer the most in the first 3 books.

I'm a bit wary of Eshonai's flashbacks. I suspect they will be different to the ones we have seen so far. With all the others there was a secret buried deep in their past that affected them greatly in the present and drove many of their actions without our knowledge. Kaladin the way Tien died, Shallan that she killed her mother, Dalinar Cultivation's meddling. I find it hard to believe there will be a deep secret in Eshonai's past, since she is dead. I am certain the flashbacks will be interesting to see the Listeners, but at the moment I don't expect the flashback rollercoaster the others were.

Nothing is ever confirmed in the shard until it happens in-book . But I agree we are as sure as can be without it happening.

Probably Lightweaver, maybe Elsecaller. But to be honest I could probably shape up to any order except Bondsmith. While the ideals are admirable and I can get followers, I have zero patience with those that don't want to follow me, and my idea of uniting would be "follow me or die because the Voidbringers destroy you" . And maybe I'm not a suitable Windrunner, because while I can be very protective the pure honesty and not even misdirection allowed might trip me up. Ergo, Lightweavers .

I found this to be quite interesting, guess we'll see what we can figure out in the next few years. My guess is that they want information primarily, power secondarily. And possibly helping worlds survive not exactly as a goal but as something which they do if it doesn't inconvenience them too much. Not out of the goodness of their hearts, but simply because for every world that gets destroyed their potential power and playground gets smaller. Much of this is a shot in the dark when putting what we see of them in SA together with this WoB.

Gavilar may have been on the path to a Bondsmith, but I have considered him to be big-bad-guy #1 well above Sadeas and Amaram for a while. And nothing I saw on OB disproved that from my mind. I get what you mean of humanized villains, and while I hope we get some more Moash pov I also don't see everyone having a redemption path. Moash, my gut feeling says he is one of those that won't get redemption, or if he does it will be Darth Vader style with his death as payment/sacrifice. Of course that's just my perspective . Not so sure we should expect Moash morals though, considering he has given all his passion to Odium.

Nahn and Dahn are both determined by money. Lighteyed landowners would be 5th dahn or higher, and darkeyes with money can buy nahn. First and second nahn can marry lighteyes, and possibly speak to lighteyes in almost equal terms so long as they are polite. An example of this is seen by Lirin sitting at Roshone's table without invitation and saying it was his right. Right of travel seems to be pretty common, although lower nahns won't have it. Lighteyes over 7th dahn seem to be sort of normal people just making a living. Of course I think darkeyes over 7th nahn are practically slaves. The other thing linked to social ranking is military standing. Serving with distintion means getting higher nahn and dahn both. Officers are automatically 5th dahn or higher, with how many men they command changing their dahn. As an extreme example, if a highlord lost his lands and money his rank would still be the same due to the number of troops he commanded.

Its been confirmed that Odium was having influence around Shallan's family, but it is unclear who came first, the Odium influence or Shallan's nahel bond. It could however be an option that when Odium influences people he leaves behind more broken people, leaving more candidates for Nahel bonds. Dalinar was very high profile, as such I'm not sure he can be used to define a pattern. It is a good theory though .

I think Odium will give Moash a crash course on becoming his champion. It almost makes me feel bad for Odium. He spends decades grooming the Blackthorn, Dalinar shakes off his influence, and he is left with Moash as his champion in the Blackthorn's place. Talk about stepping down in levels. Because no matter how many powers Moash is given I just can't see him ever eclipsing the Blackthorn.

That would be good .

In the middle of the fight no, but later on when they have time to cool off probably yes. At the very least to share all the different information they have (Shin, Honorblades, Skybreakers, etc).

I think you accidentally quoted me with a phrase from one of the ooklas.

I find it hard to believe Dalinar can shrug off all that Szeth has done to him in 30 seconds. He would need at least 2min.

There are so many loose threads at the end that I won't lose hope of seing them until SA 4 is out and the scenes are not there. Mainly with Szeth, a bit with coalition stuff, Jasnah and the wedding. Extra chapters or novella would be ideal. Because never seeing the conversation between Szeth and Dalinar...horrible thought.

You are probably right. I have never cared much for Elhokar, he always did bad decision after bad decision. He always only cared about image, not about honor, or morality or what is right. He always ignored all chances to better himself. Until the end. At the end he might have started pulling his weight, and even if it was only when his back was to the wall he started growing. Which is what gave us the shock at his death, if Elhokar from end of WoR had died most people would have shrugged at most. At the same time, even if Elhokar had grown, he was unfortunately unlikely to ever be the best or even one of the best at anything. He might have been an adequate king, but nowhere near as stunning as Jasnah will likely be. He might have been an alright lightweaver, but always overshadowed by Shallan. At the end of the day his death was probably for the best. Both for the story and for his character. Its entirely possible he might have reached a peak then gone down again in a spiral of jaleousy, or simply that his doing an "adequate job" while the world is ending would not have been enough, not when what you need then is doing "a great job" to save the world. Elhokar died a hero, and gave us all an emotional punch, but sadly I don't think his character had enough awesome chips for the position he was in. The fact that Elhokar died protecting his son is what makes his death at Moash's hands so egregious. Killing someone protecting a child is probably the worst action I can imagine. Unfortunately, little Gav was 3-4 years old, so he is likely going to remember his father's death with no help needed. I'd bet he already has a cracked spirit web. Only way for children to not remember is to be under 1.5 years, maybe 2. Over 2 years he will definetely have scars, even if not memories. And over 3-4 years he will have memories of memories, specially if it is of a traumatic or memorable event. His father's death definetely counts as traumatic and memorable.

I'd prefer Szeth's book for 4, but I suspect it will be Venli/Eshonai. Thing is, if book 4 is Venli it basically forces the Singers to splinter in book 4 and a group to join the KR in Urithiru. As I find it hard to believe we'd get a flashback book and a large character arc that ends with that character and her people still enslaved to Odium and the Fused's whims. I'm eager to see this, but at the same time I'm not too warm over Venli.

Its an interesting idea. I could see it happening, or at the very least Shallan's brothers been a cause of problems. I'm not sure if Szeth would be the first to have issues with them, since his idea of right and wrong are hazy. Since he has tied Dalinar as his anchor he may not consider anythig to be wrong unless Dalinar says so. I suspect Shallan's brothers will cause trouble, since they still think of Shallan as their younger sister, sheltered and unimportant. The change in mindset to accepting she is the wife of a highprince and a KR may take them some time to accept. All of her brothers seemed a walking disaster for me. One was a sadist, another had gaming addiction and the last wanted to commit suicide. Walking around Urithiru with all the mix of cultures, societies and changing rules it just seems like a problem waiting to explode. The only reason I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt is its almost certain an Unmade was influencing most of their lives, and we saw how badly Dalinar handled that in his time.

Honestly, after the great uselessness of the coalition what does it matter. Tell them to play semi-nice and Dalinar will save them when the Voidbringers come and shut up. They have granted zero help when they were needed, and 7 KR saved the day, so why dance for the till-now greatly useless coalition? Then again I've said before I'd be a horrible Bondsmith, got no aptitude for that order .

I feel you. I think Dalinar was a monster with all his savagery, lack of empathy, etc etc. But. Evi was indeed an idiot. She should have seen Dalinar was totally lost into bloodthirst, and if she should have begged of anyone it was of him and not the city. Plus she just thought Dalinar was dead, killed by the treachery of a lordling who Dalinar had given several opportunities of peacefully coming into the fold as a highlord. Did she really expect anything out of any of the two combatants in the field? That been said, what Dalinar did was terrible. Burning an entire city alive? Killing every single person in it? And even if acidentally killing his wife? Its not easy to stomach. I simply think Dalinar was a monster and Evi was a moron. Nice catch .

I'm not sure Vivenna agreed to tell the spren how to make more swords, she could have just agreed to give them some basic information on her sword. I haven't reread OB yet, so not sure. In any case I doubt she would teach anyone how to make Nightbloods for two reasons. Vasher would almost certainly hunt her down and kill her, and there may be other cosmere groups to do so too. Secondly she is chasing Nightblood as a criminal. She knows Nightblood isn't normal, and if she thinks of him as a criminal she won't be likely to teach others to make more criminals who supposedly would be unable to not be criminals. (Since its literally their purpose for been). Now, it is possible Vivenna doesn't know how to make Nightblood, and just knows how to make invested swords which are not "wrong". Whatever is going on with Nightblood we don't know everything of its creation. Finally, as soon as they said the Fused are reborn on the everstorm I had a vision of Szeth flying in with Nightblood into the Everstorm. Fused souls destroyed + lots of investure in the Everstorm to feed Nightblood = Perfect evil destruction

I'm not entirely decided on this point. But at the end of the day I tend to not apply our world's, time's and society's rules to epics. Simply because they are other worlds, times and societies. Currently their entire world's options are to die and become slaves, or to follow men that would be considered criminals in our world. Following our world's morality in those situations won't even be an option. And to be perfectly honest, when chosing survival of their race over destruction people will not care who they follow so long as it leads to victory. Moash broke any claim to morality when he killed a man whose main focus was on protecting a child at the time. Basically it showed who and what he was at the deepest recesses of his soul. He cared nothing for the humans, the alethi, the darkeyes, the innocent or anyone when he did that. He just killed Elhokar for his petty revenge, even though the world was kind of ending and there were problems magnitudes larger to deal with.