Kasimir

1. That SAUDI ARABIA UPSET. 100% worth postponing meds for. 2. RP still going to be postponed, RIP. 3. Thoughts before I forget, since tomorrow will be a mess: Hasn't played this. No baseline. /shrug because that was a lot of Alv obsession earlier and I wondered if it was overanchoring on the poke. Moot now but I'm trawling in search of the quotes I do want and it still stood out to me on re-read. Like the feel of the first part better on re-read, more free-wheeling than I've gotten the sense off E!Mat. Feel :| about the bolded part, felt like a restrained response if you suspect doc communication (given no existing PMs and Cash's first game.) Washes out again I guess. Hmm. Not interested in litigating Bookwyrm/Insanity again, but this is a less measured and thought-through response than later and I'm curious what changed, @InfiniteInsanity. Later response linked for reference: Still not fond of this. Why think about the future cycles now when we're really focused on right here and right now and current grounds for suspicion? Opportunistic af. Dislike. Best vod. This is a nonsensical response from: A. Someone who hasn't played with me in late game to the point of mentioning needing to go look up my games, and B. Someone who won QF63. I don't understand where this is coming from, and dislike it mildly on principle where it feels like wanting to keep the option on the table. Actually why? I want to read this in a positive light, but I can't. I think this particular one just ends up being a solid blank for me. First para: This sparks joy. Second para: This does not spark joy. Hesitancy to go after a top suspect feels ? but we've litigated this. I don't know how to feel about this. Araris seems more off the ball than I've usually seen him and I don't understand what is going on. Part of me keeps thinking about Araris's willingness to switch up. Part of me wonders if E!Araris does that. All of me knows E!Araris is tough to read and I usually read Araris wanting him to be Village so I am going to move on at this point. Kind of not sure I see E!Xino doing this. I think it's time for me to re-open my Xino Study again. As Mat points out, this is...mid-cycle? I feel a bit eh about this. But it's probably understandably prompted by Xino. I don't disagree with the sentiment either. If I haven't yet asked this: bro is there a reason of all the players you are especially hellbent on summoning Alv. And what do you plan to do now you have summoned him? I am struggling to understand how this line of reasoning works. I actually like this a bit. I feel it's a slip a Villager is more likely to make than an Elim. Ok, misread this the first time. Fair enough. Bro you literally V read me for this for all of one hot second when we were in a lylo together after proceeding to paranoid on me all game (admittedly I played very badly) and saying I was Evil even after I flipped Village -.- I am not quoting something this long. I liked this post, although I'm aware it's Archer's new style so technically I shouldn't effort clear but he still gets a positive point from it, sure. I've made comments on what I feel to be genuine V effort before. Not fully sure this is it, but I like it. What can I say, my experiences with my teams were that they tended to be a bit more tight about how loose you run. In retrospect this is an odd response to me. The original premise was based on a misapprehension of the vote as a self-pres vote. Discovering it wasn't a self-pres vote should have eroded the grounds for suspicion, and I dislike that this was swept under the carpet. Don't disagree with a vote like this midcycle but it feels odd: ties can at least be informative midcycle, so there's the part where I'm wondering if it's a good place to park. Would like to watch this and Archer. Not quoting Illwei either. Too long. I do get a positive vibe off this post - related to my LG90 thoughts. In general, I haven't known E!Illwei to play to this niche. You could argue it's effort clearing and that one day I'll get bitten, but that engagement currently feels positive to me. See, the thing is, this reads like normal Alv to me. Except on re-reading, I have no idea where my baseline for normal Alv comes from anymore. There's probably a decent answer to be made along the lines that it comes from say, 2014 but damned if I know. The TUN classic. I've mentioned my thoughts on this subsequently. Wonderful, a philosophical dispute on causation with quibbling, the one thing I wanted to sign in to the Shard to read Do not understand where this comes from. *crickets* Do not like this. Feels like Illwei can't deal with Chaos!Silho. Must you make it so hard. I don't see why you could have anything to complain about at all! I see my future and I dislike this. I feel it's a bit odd to go straight past Silho and to go for TUN. Do not like the shift from 'weird maybe sus' to following me on a vote. I don't know how I feel about this. Tempting to read this a very slight bit positively. Easy enough to pull back without too much condemnation. Flip side is that it's easy to park, but still. Hmm. Ok. So the thing that was holding me up with regard to Wiz is that he just didn't really seem engaged or interested in the game. I'm not sure he is even here, but I stand by what I said in QF63 when defending him to JNV that I think the attitude switch between V!Wiz and E!Wiz was visceral. I don't know how much of that was a function of being busy and how much of that was just a function of being a big difference from his Evil play. I also think that the difference was less sharp in BT3, but it was still a departure there. That being said; Whoops. I am in principle fine with the Szeth train, but Szeth is on my no go list because I don't D1 returning players, and oh, speaking of which, yeah. Theoretically this can be said performatively, but like when Conq said it in MR59: I like this. I like this attitude, and I tend to read it as being more Village, even as I disregard it because sorry Elk, not exactly going to break policy here. No birthday vote for you. Sad And finally, since I actually set out to do this by tracking returning players who mentioned this and then got distracted by flagging and commenting on posts along the way: I read the focus on the relocation aspect of the Shaman as more likely to emerge from a Village perspective. I do feel like I'm reaching the place where I am comfortable doing this. I don't know if I'll stay there because I feel conflicted about overriding my policy. Wiz, Alvron. P.S. The Sacred Coin picked Alv over Wiz. But that's not really the decision factor here, just thought it was odd given RNGesus. Edited to add: Forgot the most important thing - gonna disappear for quite a bit as I'm doubling sedatives. Should be ok but may not really be able to head back for rollover. Depends on how out of it I am. Apologies in advance.

Leaning towards the latter, but potentially more powers as well. If Autonomy likes and respects Kelsier, and Autonomy can offer Kelsier some version of what he wants, what happens then? Does Kelsier take that as some way of protecting the people of Scadrial? Do they cut a deal? I think we don't see that as plausible for Kelsier at this juncture, or I would lean so, but I wonder if Harmony trusted Kelsier as much on this score or just had some kind of niggling fear about it. There's the comment about Autonomy also liking Wax, but Harmony got there first in a way he can't solidly say is true for Kelsier, and Kelsier as you point out has a stronger individual/independent streak than Wax does.

That WoB is what I had in mind, yes. I find it plausible that Autonomy was induced to withdraw because the Scadrians had proved themselves, but I also find it plausible that Kelsier did in fact have a chat with her and might have been one of several considerations. Incidentally, I do wonder if one reason Harmony was so keen on keeping Kelsier out of the loop was that he wasn't unaware of what you spoilered, and that was in fact part of the reason for distrust. What happens if she offers him a seat at the table?

Is there a chance this is connected to Autonomy having a powerful like of/respect for Kelsier? If there was one person on Scadrial who could convince Autonomy to turn around, especially in light of the Set failing her, the artificial perpendicularity being drained, and the harmonium bomb being neutralised, I feel it would probably be Kelsier. Edited to add: I feel he would have to take at least partial responsibility for the Scadrian defense, which I suppose is true insofar as the Ghostbloods count, but it might be sufficient to satisfy Autonomy and her Intent. Would've used the Capaldi gif but unfortunately Google fails me today:

General agreement here. My bro and I both think future Scadrial just goes cyberpunk as a whole.

I don't understand. I was going to say the numbers are off but there are - Right, I'm a fool, I doublecounted Xino. Should be: Willing/Don't Care: <Alv, Mat, Stick, Xino, TUN, Bookwyrm, JNV, Silho, Wiz, Araris> Not Willing: <Elk, Insanity, Tani, Szeth, Cash, Chantara, Archer, Turtle, Illwei> There we go.

The title of this thread just gave me massive Bleach and JoJo vibes and made me consider what would happen if characters in TLM behaved that way

How do you go from 'Kas is oddly active' to sheeping me on a vote though?

Because I wanted to kill you You're in luck because I have just three Elim games in current SE, so it is very easy to go through all of them Collected in this post in LG90, which is fine as it's V!me If so, why TUN, given that Silho inaugurated it? I just find this a very weird diagnosis considered I confirmed both actively in QF63 and tacitly in prior games that I directly respond to games I've played directly before the one I'm currently in, and had no reason to lie about it given I was a Villager in QF63. I came out of a game where I got blindsided by E!Turtle, as did Xino - do you seriously think that's not something I'd feel is worthy of learning from? I just came out of two games (QF63, LG90) where I repeatedly formed wrong suspicions and fell to my tendency to go One Thing on fellow Village players - do you seriously think I shouldn't take it as a learning point and actively enter this game being more careful of my thoughts and impulses? What's the point of playing these games if you are going to do the same things over and over again and not actually learn? Spelling it out since I'm less tired now: I guess the thing that struck me about your recent games (LG86, LG90, LG78, and LG73 - though the outlier) is that there's a similar thread through them that I sort of see in Zunn and Klaas Vaak. Zuun and Klaas Vaak remind me more of me when I'm going full-throated RP style. (SIGH. I really owe RP huh.) You actively comment on thread things as Zunn, just within Zunn constraints. You alternated between you things and a side of Village things as Vaak. At the same time, I'm not sure I get the same sense Illwei does that you're deliberately playing up the chaotic. I was honestly more or less filing it away as 'regular Alv' until you linked the Zunn game and the other games and I went to backread and compare to the other four I was looking at. Another hand (so many) is that you're another player I dislike going after on D1 or actively want to be Village which influences me as well. And finally, I suppose: I think it would be hypocritical to agree with your post about playstyle change and to also go after you for a difference in...for what feels like a fundamental difference in engagement and orientation with the game. This is important. Willing/Don't Care: <Alv, Mat, Stick, Xino, TUN, Bookwyrm, JNV, Xino, Wiz, Araris> Not Willing: <Elk, Insanity, Tani, Szeth, Cash, Chantara, Archer, Turtle, Illwei> Wiz feels off.

No problem, shifted! Edited: Oh dear Force I forgot this is my first time dealing with Ooklas. I feel Wyrm's pain now. I will take my policy from Wyrm: Essentially, please use normal/RP name when referring to each other, I'm not accepting any Ookla votes, and if you'd be so kind, if you're a playing Ookla who also has a different profile picture, then please set your member title to your previous name so I know who you are at one glance. If you have the same profile picture, then that's fine, I'll remember you anyway. Did you go into Demolitions instead :eyes:

To be honest, I was going to mention Zunn the Mad but I got bogged down skimming LG73, LG78, and LG86. QF27 and MR51... Sort of do point to a difference in how you engage with the game. No idea about Facemask as I only remember the Orlok lawyer incident and it's late. Nor Joxter. At the same time, nothing was pinging me prior to this exchange and I don't know I want to go here. I suppose the same problem as always isn't it. It is amazing, the things you won't see. I don't know how to not be a hypocrite here because I like and agreed with that post of yours I shared. But I figured I should at least point this out for anyone who didn't want to do the busywork, though you still should.

..................................... @Elkanah I'll burn a prayer glyph for you, that your soul will find respite in the Beyond. Edited to add: Oh. Huh. Araris killed Alv in the last version of this game. So much makes sense to me now.

How does this line of reasoning work - basically he could've let that go through as LHF?

Tbh I wouldn't believe me either because I burned a lot of pewter and rage-powered through it in the hours before night classes and skipped dinner, as everyone who insisted it was urgent also insisted "I've got night classes and the mid-term exam is coming out" wasn't a sufficiently good reason for not answering four exact queries on digital twins. The net result is that I'm too moody to sleep, too moody to focus on the thread, and too annoyed to do my ML homework so I just kind of sit in the thread like Smaug and blurt out the thoughts that get stuck in my head and then get obdurately stuck on random people who apparently include Mat this cycle. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ So ist das Leben.

Ok, fair enough. I take it you have for a moment a V!read of Mat, then. Would it help if I told you some of that volume is quokkas? Chantara.

I don't disagree with this perspective - I just think that I'd prefer not to go into one at EoD, leaving it to RNGesus and/or a vote manip player to decide, who could easily be hostile. It's not that reading the tea leaves from vote manip can't be helpful, but I guess my views have shifted a bit from when I was okay with baiting it. I now think it's the consolation prize. Sorry I missed this. I get it, I'm just curious how you think not voting Alv will convey the idea you don't care to hear what he says. There's also the option of starting a new train - the cycle is young yet. But this is also kind of moot as you shifted your vote. Can someone explain to me where the Alv summoning via Mat argument came from. I'm legit confused now >> Edited to add: @Elkanah - I'll grant it could be a meta deal since the meta in our heydays was very poke vote centric, but I do see poke votes as a way to vote and to not need to be terribly controversial in contributing to trains, so I tend to want to pay attention to them.

Thanks. I'm leaning suspend judgement at the moment, because I think Mat was more willing to jump the gun on my admittedly bad habit of withholding reasons D1 than he was in LG90, so I would concur with the overall position. I'd actually say I found him pretty reactive in that LG - which is where I am not sure if my judgements map well over to yours. Not exclusively so, but it has been a two game trend (yes Mat, I know, two games.) I don't think that's relevant here at this juncture anymore as this isn't a live issue though I'd still be curious about Stick's thoughts on the matter, so I don't think it's worth explicating the difference. Thanks >> @Alvron :eyes: But also, ehhhhhhh kinda maybe ish sorta. I like them better mid-cycle to EoD than I do at actual EoD. Though my views on that have shifted.

You say that as if I didn't do...pages....of post analysis...in your QF... or in LG89... :eyes: Gotta learn new tricks to keep up with you young'uns. And I feel VC analysis is more helpful with a flip, so I almost never do it D1 unless I see a vote that catches my attention. Bookwyrm's vote meets that criteria, yeah, but it's early D1 so it doesn't feel protective, just opportunistic. Edited to add: Nevermind I just saw that edit.

Oh. Right. No, I'm not actually looking at the train. Just like the kayana fourth vote on you, and the way he jumped on and off Insanity. Part of me thinks that a team would've been "no don't do this." I don't know how much to attribute to Bookwyrm's nature and how much to Turtle being handsoff in your game. Again, maybe this means I'm too absurdly present in an Elim doc, or a bit too willing to ask things of teammates, but I just struggle to see Bookwyrm's team being ok with what he's done so far. I nearly reflex unvoted you as a response to that vote, that's just how kayana it was in my eyes, But as I pointed out to Elk, truth to be told that kind of happened in QF63 as well so I don't know if the lesson I draw from that game should be to just take the direct layer with newer players, not just Turtle, since maybe I'm overthinking what I should and did find obviously suspicious before rationalising that way. Ah, sorry to disappoint. I will say this reaction does improve my read of you somewhat in that you were more willing to ascribe a negative response to my doing the same thing, because fundamentally it's the same thing, my D1 MO. I like to get reactions and sometimes I feel if I put my thoughts out too early, it's just not as informative. It's the reason behind a lot of my D1 naked voting, at the very least. You were more ready to explain it away in LG90, so I guess that's a positive point in comparison. Mat for the moment, I think. Ngl by this point I feel that Araris is pulling some sort of character playstyle thing where he lies all game in the thread. Sort of like Honest Drake. Oh. Nevermind

Why not just vote for him if you think he's your top suspect? Or let me rephrase this: what about Alv makes you think that a statement like "I'm not going to unvote Alv until Alv shows up" is going to one way or another alter his calculations towards you? I think my problem with Bookwyrm is just that part of me feels like a five player team should have reined this in more. Part of me also recognises that 80% of my QF63 problems came from arguing that a five player team should've reined everything in a lot more except that didn't happen, and I was looking at the wrong layer, so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

It was right the last two times, and you acknowledged as well it's a problem with E!you ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I do think I'm not seeing the connection case, but I've already said I felt it needed to be done so I think my view on that matter washes out. I could also say the same back to you: maybe when I flip Village this time, just as I did in LG89, you'll figure your D1 guts aren't reliable when it comes to me. But let's face it, that just lowers the tone of the conversation because it starts to become a 'no u' fight. I've said what I'm saying, and that's just where my views are right here and right now. You're welcome to change my mind on it, or not if you feel it's a waste of your time. I see you're currently leaning towards the latter, which is fine. You're also welcome to start a train on me if you feel that's the correct thing for you to do. We both agree this is how the game should be played, so I don't see a problem with my being okay with this.

Right, and I suppose the addendum is: I really want a SAN check? This feels like the sort of thing I want a SAN check on. I could spell out why, but I think we know why: Silho, Devo, Bort, Wiz... I think it's worth getting one. I grant it's early in the cycle but given how I've fared over the last couple of games, I like SAN checks. In an ideal world, I get SAN checks in my PMs so the thread doesn't have to deal with that. This isn't an ideal world, unfortunately. And if the people I'm getting SAN checks from are Evil, that's fine. It still goes in the thread with a paper trail and I have faith in the Village. Wir schaffen das. So that's about it, @Matrim's Dice.

Sorry, that line wasn't directed at you. General disclaimer. Same thing in what sense?

I wouldn't advise reading me off the basis of a meme, when there are better indicators. But this had to be made anyway because of our differing views of MR59

I can't deny it because Bookwyrm going onto Mat was enough to make me want to reflexively go off Mat... >>