Pathfinder

No worries. I bear you no ill will either and I wish you luck with your theories!

I would like to understand your statement better. From what I recall from the book and WoB, Elantris acts as an amplifier. I thought the Dor flowed through the Elantrian when they draw an aon that then determines what the Dor does. I thought that was why Raoden was experiencing pain, it kept trying to flow through him. Without the chasm line, a blockage was put on the Dor from coming through aons, but once the line was added, the blockage was removed, so it could go back to flowing as it was. Could you explain how Elantris would be "widening the hole"? I am genuinely asking and would like to understand what you mean.

Give me like 10 minutes or so and I will add the WoB, but Brandon has confirmed it screws up the person's soul/spiritweb that gets it ripped out of them. So you could anesthetize them all you want when they die, the version of them that pops up into the cognitive realm before they pass on is definitely damaged. So knowing despite the physical not seeming effected, but the cognitive clearly is, can it still be seen as ethical? And would that then be deemed cruel and unusual punishment during executions? edit: posted a few below. bolded what i think is pertinent. Steeldancer [PENDING REVIEW] Given a situation where they have perfect knowledge of Hemalurgy--everything is known. Is it possible they could use a Shard-scalpel and spike to carefully... Brandon Sanderson [PENDING REVIEW] To excise without killing somebody? The real damage is to the soul... Steeldancer [PENDING REVIEW] I'm imagining taking out toxic sort of things. Brandon Sanderson [PENDING REVIEW] You've seen Vasher do something similar, so it's not off books that that's possible. Questioner Are Hemalurgic spikes fabrials? Is a body that has been spiked a fabrial? Are koloss and kandra also something similar? Brandon Sanderson No, actually. Fabrial means specifically a bit of Investiture that has been trapped by a gemstone and then modified to do something else. Hemalurgy is its own thing--though there is a slight similarity. In most Hemalurgy, Investiture keyed to the Identity of someone (a bit of a soul) is ripped off, and then magically grafted onto someone else's soul. Not the same, though I can see the confusion. Koloss and kandra are similar, though in this case, the soul is mostly just being distorted by using an Invested spike. In the cosmere, the body will attempt to match the soul, and so a twisted soul (Spiritual aspect of a person) can have profound effects on both mind and body. Questioner (on behalf of Yata) When someone is spiked, and dies, does that affect the time they spend in the Cognitive? Brandon Sanderson If they are spiked, yes because if you are extra Invested, which spiking technically does, if you have a spike stapling a bit of someone else's soul to yours-- Questioner The other way. Someone spikes through you and you die-- Brandon Sanderson Ohhhhh, oh okay, no, that might make you go faster. Questioner Is that why Harmony doesn’t know who's spiking people? Or-- Brandon Sanderson Hmm. Yeah. Okay. I had not considered that. But yeah, sure. *laughter* Suuureee. You added to the canon. I mean, the actual answer was, when you're spiking somebody, you're ripping of the soul, so kind of, there's not enough left to talk. I mean, you're ripping off enough of the soul, so it's a bad thing. It's a very bad thing. So you go "Who killed you?" and it's just somebody who is essentially-- But yes, they would go faster too.

I am not personally weighing in in either direction, just the discussion caused me to recall a WoB that I think could add to the discussion and foster some thought so I have posted it below: Questioner [PENDING REVIEW] Do the Dustbringers have a propensity toward evilness? Brandon Sanderson [PENDING REVIEW] I would not call them evil, but certain members of the Knights Radiant would say they're on the edge, and did not get along with them. Let's just say Skybreakers have not gotten along with Dustbringers, even though they are very near each other in a lot of ways.

So starting this thread to hear everyone's thoughts on the new FE game! Any mechanics you hope they carry over from prior games? Any you hope they don't? Anything in the trailer you are particularly excited about or dreading? Here are my thoughts. I hope they keep the personal skills from Fire Emblem Fates. I like making builds that fit the character, so taking a personal skill and building a whole series of skills to amplify that was always a lot of fun. I hope they also keep the class variety/range of reclassing that was in Fates. I think the trailer hints that they will, though without involving marriages having to be prerequisites. I think you could potentially train anyone into any class depending on their weapon ranks, which if the case, I think is an awesome idea. Finally I really hope they carry over the greater depth in story from Fire Emblem Awakening, and make the Avatar have a greater personality as seen in Awakening than Fates. Let me know what you all think!

Ba-Ado-Mishram caused the False Desolation because it was fueling the singers with voidlight to continue to battle after the last desolation ended. That implies to me that the Unmade can stick around normally. There is also the vision where the midnight essences show up, which are a product of the midnight mother, during which a radiant in the vision states it is not a desolation, but it could hint at one soon coming. There is also Odium's commentary that he had the Thrill set up in Alethkar for quite some time, and Dalinar was confirmed to be using the Thrill in his flashback chapters when they united Alethkar. So I think it is the fused that gets locked away, and maybe the Unmade are weakened but stick around. Either that, or as you posit, the weakening of the Oathpact lets them still hang around. I do lean towards your theory. Interesting theory. Not sure I agree, but interesting way of viewing the events. So basically all this time humanity has been experiencing a desolation, but because it wasn't kicked off with an attack, everyone thought everything was ok? (genuinely asking) edit: sorry re-read your and equinox's post closer. Again very interesting theory. Don't have much to further add at this moment, but could make a lot of sense. Good work! Honestly I don't know the answer to what Jezrien being permanently killed means. Though I did find these two WoB that may be of interest. Questioner (paraphrased) Was Odium able to Splinter Honor because the Heralds abandoned the Oathpact? Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) Good question. Um, their abandonment of the Oathpact is related... but mostly tangentially. If I was pinned down on that, I would say no. Questioner (paraphrased) Is there any of the Oathpact still functioning because of Taln's continued participation? Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) Yes, indeed. Questioner With the Heralds we know that there's only one left... one Herald that's still bound to the Oathpact-- Brandon Sanderson OK, only one Herald was about, was abandoned-- You'll find out the mechanics of that in the next book. Questioner So are we going to see more of Taln... Brandon Sanderson You will see more of-- the Oathpact is not completely broken, the others are still bound to the Oathpact. Questioner Even though they kind of sort of said they were abandoning it? Brandon Sanderson Yes, so there's still connection there, so you'll find out more about all of this and how it works

I am not a metalurgist, but if I recall correctly, isn't pure aluminum too soft? I think I recall WoB where people ask if a shardblade could cut aluminum, and Brandon responded that it could cut it, but not by phasing through. That to keep in mind, it is still a sword. So making armor out of wood, clay or what have you, and soulcasting it into pure aluminum without alloying it with something to strengthen it could potentially still result with you getting run through. But again, a lot of this is based on recollection, so I will need to dig.

It certainly could potentially be something more, but for myself I think it is because aluminum is expensive on Roshar, so a necklace of it would be worth a lot. It is incredibly difficult to mine, and after something is soulcasted into aluminum, it can never be soulcasted again. So aluminum is highly prized for its rarity and uniqueness. For me it would be the equivalency of on Earth saying she tried to use a gold or platinum necklace to buy back her brother.

What kind of radiant do you think Adolin could become? Is there a version you would like to see him become?

I thought @Chaos said @Sedside could create a new one? I do not want to get involved in that, but wouldn't starting fresh be good for all parties who do want to be involved? Start from square one without all the old pages of arguments?

Actually the Everstorm isn't that directly physical destructive unless Odium directs it to be. The lightning strikes hit specific targets, otherwise it has been remarked the storm itself isn't as upfront destructive as a highstorm that is indiscriminate. We do not know for sure that a fused would be reborn in the everstorm even if a herald is killed. We know a fused can come back directly through the everstorm and bond a parshmen open to it, but we do not conclusively know whether or not a herald dying would not stop a fused from returning. If the herald's existence no longer threatened Odium, then there would be no reason to kill them to the point of preventing their rebirth. At least to me. But again I respect that you think otherwise. Guess we will RAFO!

Basically it shows you can go about this conflict diplomatically while before you could not. Prior to this information, you could become as friendly as you want with a parshmen, but then tomorrow they show up possessed by a fused trying to kill you. After this information, by negotiating with the parshmen, and showing it is in their best interests to refuse the bond with the fused as it effectively kills them, then you 1. offer another option to the conflict and 2. begin to deplete the enemy of their primary resource. I think that is not a negligible hit to Odium Never said it would strengthen the oathpact. I theorized that Jasnah's logic was that the oathpact still worked just enough to hold back the fused that are killed, which would prevent more parsh from being possessed, and allow for some kind of negotiation, or even just a little more time to research more options. At that time the fused is a never ending flood. Time (like the stormfather told Dalinar) is nothing to Odium, but everything to the humans. But all of this would be mute had they known in the meeting that the parsh have to open themselves up to the bond, which rlain knows, and says no one cares about because they all think he is suddenly going to change into the enemy at any moment.

One could potentially put forward that Szeth uses his powers much like But I see what you are getting at. We haven't seen anything to indicate Szeth is actually a savant. He does seem to overuse his surges in great quantities, but that by itself does not confirm savantism or not.

I am inclined to agree with Jasnah's interpretation of the Stormfather's words. He said it was weakened to near annihilation. That still does not mean destroyed, which still does not mean the function won't work at all. I also maintain had Kaladin talked to Rlain at that point and listened to him (Rlain brings this up), Kaladin would know that the parshmen require being open to the change in order for it to take place. I think that had Kaladin brought that up, that would have changed the entire meeting. Then Jasnah could take in this new information regarding the mechanism of fused possessing the parshmen. She could then theorize that if they could convince the parshmen that the fused did not have the parshmens best interests in mind, and refuse the change, Odium would lose his never ending army. 1. Ba-Ado-Mishram attempted this by powering the listeners with voidlight to continue the desolation longer. it was termed the false desolation 2. like Scion said, I don't think we truly know.

Thing is, and this is theoretical mind you, a soulcaster with the fabrial reaches a limit to what they can soulcaster. That is why they need multiple soulcasters (the people with the fabrial) to make a wind break in the warcamps. Szeth on the other hand can channel as much stormlight as he has to add as many lashes to something as he wishes. So while with soulcasters, there seems to be a power limit, so their savantism relies on frequency, Szeth could have used his powers over a lesser number of times, but channeled greater quantities and thereby potentially reach savantism quicker. Basically the difference between

Interesting point. Nightblood could end up being a war of escalation. True, though the result is still the same. The investiture maintaining the entity is removed or destroyed resulting in permadeath.

I disagree. If you would refer to quite a few pages back, the reason I started was to point out Maya healing is being presented as a fact is in error. I then, to illustrate why that is, gave examples that could dispute that assertion to show that Maya healing as a starting point is a theory. We can both agree shardblades cut stones, and then someone can build a theory on it. We do not however agree maya is healing. People can still build theories on that, but that does not preclude theories that think something else is happening with Maya. I feel if you would take the time to read my original post in this thread you would understand that. The theory that Maya is healing is perfectly valid. People can feel entitled to disagree and say why. What I disagree with is when someone specifically says "no, it does not work that way" "no, it cannot work that way" "no this won't happen" "no, if it works that way then the narrative would be bad for Adolin". Those are all assertions that I have shown that what that person is using to back up those statements are not as concrete as they claim. I view that as shutting down possibilities, rather than discussing them. You are perfectly entitled not to like it, and I respect that. Going forward I can not respond to your posts and you not respond to mine to respect that if you like. But otherwise I will continue doing as I have done. Thank you. edit: for reference, if you would refer to page 4, my conversation with StrikerEZ. I thought it was quite enjoyable, where we both stated our theories, why we disagreed with each others and respected each other's views and ended it wishing each other luck. That is what I strive for, or at least what I feel I strive for. Typically we have seen when an individual uses a power set often (soulcasters), or in great quanties (flaring metals), it widens the cracks in their spirit webs resulting in more utility in their abilities. I agreed and conceded that summoning a shardblade repeatedly probably does not result in a strong enough amount of investiture to widen those cracks. But thought it was an interesting thought to toss around all the same. Might cause a thought to be triggered that although unrelated, might lead to something. Good point about Dalinar, though I did bring up earlier that Dalinar did have a similar moment with oathbringer where it actively hated him less. Also on my re-read of Way of Kings, Dalinar comments to himself that he felt an eagerness and energy from his shardblade as he fought the chasmfiend. So there have been instances where he has felt something (albeit uncertain what that something is) from his shardblade.

both Azure's blade and nightblood were based on shardblades on Roshar, so although they used another magic system to make them, they do have a lot in common with them. Brandon has even called Nightblood a "robot spren" Personally I think if fully revived Maya would be a normal spren in all ways. I just have a personal theory on how the process would go. I think a bondsmith would need to be involved.

I want to learn more about Inkspren too! Yeah I am the one that thinks a bondsmith could restore dead spren with the help of the shardblade wielder. I think since we see Bondsmiths able to boost other radaint's surges plus their entire schtick being about Connection and investiture, potentially hints towards that. Fingers crossed our theory is right! lol

Thank you! Well said! Now back to the OP's post I think it would be very interesting to see how Adolin could use the powers you posit he would gain, while trying to handle the limitations you put forward that other radiants wouldn't run into. I always love Brandon's magic systems, and how the characters use what they have to accomplish goals despite limitations is what I enjoy most about it!

No worries. I respect that you interpret that way. Personally I think it is a combination of three factors. First, they are operating on information they have in world. Second, spren, including the Stormfather, information in my opinion tends to be suspect unless explicitly verified by another source as we see their memory or even how they see things can alter their recollection and or even the accuracy of their statements. Third, I took Jasnah's rationale is going on the minimal information they have, they need to be proactive during an extinction level event and research any means of stemming or even remotely slowing down the tide. They know heralds can and have repeatedly returned to life, so asking one to return, or killing one, would lose nothing even if they returned immediately. That possibility is worth the risk considering what they were dealing with. At least that is how I read it. As I said, you are perfectly entitled to disagree with my reading, and or disagree with her potential rationale

Great theory and good luck! I have my own I cling to but I am sure whatever Brandon works out, it will be great!

Whether or not the in-world inhabitants of Scadrial know this, i do not know, but it has been confirmed via WoB that any hemalurgy (which involves the tearing off of someone's spirit web), no matter how it is done (except potentially gold healing regrowing it) is traumatic and horribly affects the individual. This is especially noticeable when they die and are viewed from the cognitive realm. So for that reason alone, for myself, I do not believe there is a way to possibly have hemalurgy be ethical in any shape or form. I do not even think we can conclusively determine that there aren't any potential negative effects when used with gold healing to regrow the portion of the spirit web torn away.

Great catch! Thanks for finding and posting it!

Hmmm, not sure we can say there is no investiture going through the person with the shardblade, though I do agree the amounts wouldn't be great. We know a living radiant bond involves the spren filling the cracks in the Radiant's spirit web. When you force open those cracks further, causing more investiture to fill it, you are termed a savant. So if we were going on the premise that the bond with a dead shardblade is like a living shardblade bond (this is completely separate from my theory about involving a bondsmith, so interpreting information completely different), then one could reason that the dead shardblade is filling up those cracks with the bond. Though again, like I said, there still runs into the problem of being unable to "flare" summoning a shardblade, or at least I do not think we have seen that occur on screen. Interesting thoughts!