Who did the Diagram interview about Nightblood?

[+mdross81]

Came across this intriguing bit in RoW Interlude 12 today and it made me wonder who Taravangian is referring to:

Quote

He racked his brain for anything in the Diagram relating to Nightblood, the sword. But there was nothing. They hadn’t anticipated the sword. Still, he had been given a report by agents he’d sent to research it by interviewing one of its former bearers. Taravangian pulled tidbits from that report from the recesses of his mind, then wrote them on a fresh page of his notebook.

The sword feeds on the essence that makes up all things, he wrote, scribbling by the light of a single ruby sphere. It will draw out Stormlight eagerly, feasting. But if there is no Stormlight, it will feed on one’s own soul. The agent had noted that Nightblood worked like a larkin, the beasts that could feed on Investiture.

So who is this former bearer that they interviewed?

The list of former bearers that the Diagram would potentially have access to seems pretty small. There’s a time-based limit as well because it has to have been someone they had access to after the Diagram became aware of the sword, which seems like it was probably during the Battle of Thaylen Field.

On to potential options.

Warbreaker spoilers for the first two:

Spoiler

So, there’s Vasher, but he seems to be trying to keep a low profile and would be unlikely to let on that he knows about Nightblood. He’s grumpy and distrusting to boot.

Then there’s Vivenna. We know she’s been around Shadesmar and was in Kholinar for a while as Azure. Her willingness to cut a deal with the honorspren in OB - info about her awakened sword in exchange for passage to Lasting Integrity and any info they have on NB’s whereabouts - makes her seem like a pretty likely possibility.

 

Other than those two, I think the only person we know who has borne Nightblood is Nale. I don’t see him as a likely source.

Of course, there may have been others given that the Nightwatcher apparently had access to Nightblood for at least some period of time. Or maybe Nale gave NB to someone else before Szeth?

Would be interesting to ask Brandon. This feels like the kind of thing that is maybe tangential enough to the main plot to avoid a RAFO and maybe at least get a hint of an answer. 

[+Invocation]

Honestly, I know you have him rated as a low possibility, but I think it's Nale. Let's say someone was directed by a ruling authority somewhere to get information about things. Then they find/invite Nale somewhere and grill him with the authority of that nation and Nale may just bend to the questioning because it has legal backing and Nightblood being free and around does bad things.

[Karger]

Vasher makes some sense.  More likely he just intercepted a report by Navani.

[Aspiring Writer]

So, small timeline, Vasher comes to Roshar, at some point gives nightblood to the nightwatcher. She has the sword in her possession when Dalinar comes to speak with her, seeing as she offers it, and then the blade comes to Nale's possession somehow before being lent to Szeth. 

Vasher is unlikely to talk about Nightblood.

Szeth is unlikely to share information about Nightblood, and he also probably doesn't know much in terms of specifics. 

Nale is strange, so I would say 50/50 on that.

So unless there was a wielder we don't know about, which is possible since we don't know how Nale got Nightblood from the Nightwatcher, and it's possible someone else made that deal and Nale got it from this other wielder, Vivenna seems like a likely option.

[+mdross81]

9 minutes ago, Aspiring Writer said:

Vivenna seems like a likely option

This is definitely what I think.

Now we need an Azure interlude in SA5. We know she’s been trying to hunt down NB already. Imagine her finding out that NB took out a Vessel. 

[salka]

Has Nightblood ever talked about Nale? Nightblood seems very open to discussing former bearers but I only recall them talking about Vasher and Shashara (I think..). 

I don't know about Nale, on one hand he seems smart enough not to wield Nightblood, but then he gives it to Szeth pretty much without any explanation. I'm not sure if Nale realizes just how powerful that sword is.

[Honorless]

Nightblood has also talked about Vivenna to Szeth, he mentioned that she did not draw him often but carried him for a "while".

I think Taravangian would've thought of Nale as more than "a former bearer" and he is aware of who Nale was, iirc. I think it's more likely that Nightwatcher and/or Nale offered the sword to other people and it's one of them whom the Diagram interviewed

[Aspiring Writer]

5 hours ago, mdross81 said:

This is definitely what I think.

Now we need an Azure interlude in SA5. We know she’s been trying to hunt down NB already. Imagine her finding out that NB took out a Vessel. 

The thing is Nightblood doesn't seem to be her goal. Nightblood is just her only clue to finding Vasher, her actual target. 

[Honorless]

2 hours ago, Aspiring Writer said:

The thing is Nightblood doesn't seem to be her goal. Nightblood is just her only clue to finding Vasher, her actual target. 

Did she mention who the "criminal" she was hunting was? She could've been talking about Nightblood

Quote

“Yes, please,” Adolin replied. “You’ve traveled in this place before?”
“I’m from a far land, and I came to Roshar by crossing this place, Shadesmar.”
“All right,” Adolin said. “But why?”
“I came chasing someone.”
“A friend?”
“A criminal,” she said softly.
“You’re a soldier though,” Kaladin said.
“Not really...

Quote

“I’m not your soldier, or even Adolin’s subject. I’m going to do what gets me to the perpendicularity—and, barring that, I’m going to find out what these people know about the criminal I’m hunting.”
“You’d throw away honor for a bounty?”
“I’m only here because you two—through no fault of your own, I admit—trapped me. I don’t blame you, but I’m also not indebted to your mission.”
“Traitor,” he said softly.
Azure gave him a flat look.

She didn't really react to Kaladin and Adolin moving to the same kata, though she seemed to realize who their master was. Could be she doesn't really want to catch Vasher too, and someone just put her up to this (Endowment, perhaps?)

[+mdross81]

2 hours ago, Aspiring Writer said:

The thing is Nightblood doesn't seem to be her goal. Nightblood is just her only clue to finding Vasher, her actual target. 

I’m not so sure about this.

1 minute ago, Honorless said:

Did she mention who the "criminal" she was hunting was? She could've been talking about Nightblood

I feel like it’s hinted that it’s really NB. Not long after the quote you included about the criminal she’s hunting, there’s this exchange:

Quote

Shallan nodded, then glanced again at Azure’s sword. “You said … the honorspren have information on your bounty?”

“Yeah. Borea thinks the weapon I’m chasing passed through their fortress a few years ago.”

“Your bounty is a … weapon?”

“And the one who brought it to your land. A Shardblade that bleeds black smoke.”

Also this line to Kal and Adolin before they part ways sorta seems like she’s going after NB first but will get around Zahel:

Quote

“I simply have a different thread to chase

…

When you boys next meet the swordsman who taught you that morning kata, warn him that I’m looking for him.”

“Zahel?” Adolin said. “You know Zahel?”

“We’re old friends,” she said.

She doesn’t press them for more info on Zahel’s whereabouts, but instead continues on to Lasting Integrity chasing leads about NB.

Speaking of which, who would have carried NB through Lasting Integrity “a few years ago?”  Maybe Nale paying a visit to Kalak?

[Honorless]

39 minutes ago, mdross81 said:

I feel like it’s hinted that it’s really NB. Not long after the quote you included about the criminal she’s hunting, there’s this exchange:

Quote

Shallan nodded, then glanced again at Azure’s sword. “You said … the honorspren have information on your bounty?”

“Yeah. Borea thinks the weapon I’m chasing passed through their fortress a few years ago.”

“Your bounty is a … weapon?”

“And the one who brought it to your land. A Shardblade that bleeds black smoke.”

Also this line to Kal and Adolin before they part ways sorta seems like she’s going after NB first but will get around Zahel:

Quote

“I simply have a different thread to chase

…

When you boys next meet the swordsman who taught you that morning kata, warn him that I’m looking for him.”

“Zahel?” Adolin said. “You know Zahel?”

“We’re old friends,” she said.

She doesn’t press them for more info on Zahel’s whereabouts, but instead continues on to Lasting Integrity chasing leads about NB.

Speaking of which, who would have carried NB through Lasting Integrity “a few years ago?”  Maybe Nale paying a visit to Kalak?

Could be! Thanks for hunting for the extracts!

[Aspiring Writer]

@Honorless @mdross81 I am very sure that she tells Adolin to tell Vasher that she is looking for him. Nightblood being a fugitive makes no sense, Nightblood doesn't have any agency to be considered a criminal. 

[Honorless]

1 hour ago, Aspiring Writer said:

@Honorless @mdross81 I am very sure that she tells Adolin to tell Vasher that she is looking for him. Nightblood being a fugitive makes no sense, Nightblood doesn't have any agency to be considered a criminal. 

That is a good ethical argument for why Nightblood shouldn't be considered a criminal but assuming someone sent Azure to capture him, they might not really care

[Mason Wheeler]

Azure finally confronts Zahel.  There's a tense moment as the two draw their blades, eyeing one another across several feet of open ground. "I've been waiting for you, Vasher. We meet again at last. The circle is now complete. When I left you I was but the learner. Now, I am the master!"

"Only a master of Awakening, Vivenna."

[Aspiring Writer]

23 hours ago, Honorless said:

That is a good ethical argument for why Nightblood shouldn't be considered a criminal but assuming someone sent Azure to capture him, they might not really care

Again, she said she was hunting for Vasher, not Nightblood.

[Honorless]

8 minutes ago, Aspiring Writer said:

Again, she said she was hunting for Vasher, not Nightblood.

Quote

Shallan nodded, then glanced again at Azure’s sword. “You said … the honorspren have information on your bounty?”

“Yeah. Borea thinks the weapon I’m chasing passed through their fortress a few years ago.”

“Your bounty is a … weapon?”

“And the one who brought it to your land. A Shardblade that bleeds black smoke.”

 

[RedBlue]

On my initial read, I assumed that the person Azure is hunting (the one who brought Nightblood to Roshar) was Zahel. On reflection, that doesn’t make sense. If Azure were hunting Zahel, she would surely have tried to get more info from Adolin and Kaladin when she learned that they know Zahel.

Now, I think Azure must be after someone else. Possibly someone we haven’t heard of yet. And that person, not Zahel, brought Nightblood to Roshar for purposes we don’t yet know. 

[AquaRegia]

I've also been wondering about this.  The word "bearer" implies someone who could not only carry Nightblood, but WIELD Nightblood... which could only be someone Invested (or capable of being Invested); that narrows the field of possible candidates considerably.  While "to bear" could also simply mean "to carry", I have a really hard time imagining a non-Invested person carrying Nightblood around without ever drawing it.

Also interesting is a close examination of Azure's word choices: she says she's hunting a "criminal", described as "the one who brought it to your land", and later says about Zahel "warn him I'm looking for him."   I assumed Zahel WAS the criminal... but there's nothing there to rule out the possibility that she's actually on the lookout for two different people.

[Zoey]

My current timeline for Nightblood is

 

793: Nightblood Created

1070: Pahn Khal Rebellion

1070-???: Vasher, Nightblood, and Vivennia travel together (Ends before 1121)

???: Vasher arrives on Roshar with Nightblood

???: The two have a "falling out" and separate

???: Nightblood winds up in the Nightwatcher's Possession

1168.05.02.05: Nightblood offered to Dalinar

???: Nale gets Nightblood

???: Nightblood passes through Lasting Integrity

1173.02.03.03: Vivenna arrives on Roshar looking for Nightblood

1173.10.10.03: Nightblood given to Szeth

1174.01.01.05: Nightblood carried through Yeddaw

1175.04.10.05: Nightblood used to kill Rayse

 

The 793 is based on an assumption of 4-5 Generations between Warbreaker and WoK. Which we know is a gap of a few generations. And guessing Nalthian years are equal to Earth Years. 

The rest is based on various statements and events, and on this calander: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1zq5bJoKE83ggDCjH43i1hZi0CIpB2iAx7v37zQPVFK0/edit#gid=856252766

 

We know that it was possessed by Nale at some point between 1168.05.02.05 and 1173.10.10.03, though if the Interview happened after the events of Edgedancer, and even moreso after Oathbringer, which they did, he would be unlikely to help. 

I am not entirely sure Vivennia or Vasher are known to be wielders. But if they were, they could likely be interviewed. We know that Vasher was not present at Urithiru during the occupation, he could have been busy being interviewed/interrogated over it. He would also have the deepest knowledge of how it works. 

 

 

Edited September 27, 2021 by Zoey

[+mdross81]

1 hour ago, Zoey said:

???: Vasher arrives on Roshar with Nightblood

I've got a response in another thread where I went through my thinking on this. I think we can at least place an outer bound on Vasher's arrival as likely no later than 1163 because we know Adolin studied with Zahel in his youth, and that is when he left the front with Dalinar to go back to Kholinar and train with the swordmasters.

Here's the other thread if you're interested.

More generally, nice work on the timeline @Zoey

Edit: Of course you already know about that thread, duh, because we traded comments there earlier today

Edited September 27, 2021 by mdross81

[Zoey]

42 minutes ago, mdross81 said:

I've got a response in another thread where I went through my thinking on this. I think we can at least place an outer bound on Vasher's arrival as likely no later than 1163 because we know Adolin studied with Zahel in his youth, and that is when he left the front with Dalinar to go back to Kholinar and train with the swordmasters.

Here's the other thread if you're interested.

More generally, nice work on the timeline @Zoey

Edit: Of course you already know about that thread, duh, because we traded comments there earlier today

Updated List

???: Vasher and Shashara go to Roshar and see Shardblades, getting inspiration for Nightblood

793: Nightblood Created

1070: Pahn Khal Rebellion

1070-???: Vasher, Nightblood, and Vivennia travel together (Ends before 1121)

???: Vasher arrives on Roshar with Nightblood (Likely Before 1163)

???: The two have a "falling out" and separate

???: Nightblood winds up in the Nightwatcher's Possession

1168.05.02.05: Nightblood offered to Dalinar

???: Nale gets Nightblood

???: Nightblood passes through Lasting Integrity (A few years before 1174)

1173.02.03.03: Vivenna arrives on Roshar looking for Nightblood

1173.10.10.03: Nightblood given to Szeth

1174.01.01.05: Nightblood carried through Yeddaw

???: Nightblood carried near the Purelake

1174.02.07.05: Nightblood's power revealed at Battle of Thaylen Field

???: Nightblood brought to the Battle at Emul

1175.04.10.05: Nightblood used to kill Rayse

[BinarySecond]

On 26/09/2021 at 4:59 AM, Honorless said:

That is a good ethical argument for why Nightblood shouldn't be considered a criminal but assuming someone sent Azure to capture him, they might not really care

Could it be Endowment? Or some kind of...Breath export comission?

There is the concern that it's very easy for a Worldhopper to arrive on Nalthis, buy a bunch of breaths and then leave. Leaving Nalthis at a deficit that can only be replenished through population spikes.

Nightblood is 1000 breaths IIRC?

[Zoey]

5 hours ago, BinarySecond said:

Could it be Endowment? Or some kind of...Breath export comission?

There is the concern that it's very easy for a Worldhopper to arrive on Nalthis, buy a bunch of breaths and then leave. Leaving Nalthis at a deficit that can only be replenished through population spikes.

Nightblood is 1000 breaths IIRC?

Nightblood was made with 1000 Breaths, but it currently holds far, far, FAR more Investiture than that. Enough so that it literally cannot hold all of it in itself and leaks out. But yes, it was created with 1000 Breaths. 

[Mason Wheeler]

29 minutes ago, Zoey said:

Nightblood was made with 1000 Breaths, but it currently holds far, far, FAR more Investiture than that. Enough so that it literally cannot hold all of it in itself and leaks out. But yes, it was created with 1000 Breaths. 

Officially confirmed to have grown more Invested over time.

[Zoey]

2 hours ago, Mason Wheeler said:

Officially confirmed to have grown more Invested over time.

I know, it adsorbs Investiture, and has did so over around 400 Years by the time of SA, so yeah, it ate a lot of Investiture. And added a stupid amount of added Investiture in RoW from the Perpendicularity and eating a lot when used to attack a bloody Shard.