Lord Meeker he/him Posted November 27, 2018 Author Posted November 27, 2018 Sephtis woke on the brig of the Malevolence, smiling. He walked over to the large pained windows. He grasped his hands behind his back. "You completed the scan?" "Yessir." The firsthand said. "Ready the machine." "Sir, the machine is only one way. You'd be stuck." "Perfectly aware, son." Sephtis said. He returned his attention to the planet below. With a clear view of the planet, he channeled a abnormally powerful burst of telekinetic power. Such power he had only upon waking from a death. The planet cracked, and split. Then it exploded with powerful force. "Obrobye." Sephtis said.
kenod Posted November 27, 2018 Posted November 27, 2018 (edited) Quote ... Wait, what just happened? Edit: Also, that pun... Edited November 27, 2018 by Ookla the Foxed
+Ark1002 Posted November 27, 2018 Posted November 27, 2018 14 hours ago, Ookla the spearman said: Quote I hope not. I want to kill people first. I've only got one (player character) kill so far, Mara.
Lord Meeker he/him Posted November 27, 2018 Author Posted November 27, 2018 Quote Doth AdOokla need explain for the simple minded, @Ookla the Foxed?
Gancho Libre he/him Posted November 27, 2018 Posted November 27, 2018 Quote Wait, so I kill you? YAAAAY! Wait, you can reincarnate? Ioc grinned. YAAAAY! Then stopped yelling as the planet exploded. Because, obviously, explosions are usually life-ending experiences Ioc floated through space, eyes closed, breathing softly with Cadmium. Its body began to disintegrate, falling away into pieces, those pieces breaking into dust, that dust fading away. Ioc's eyes opened as it faces broke away. Its body was gone. But Ioc wasn't dead. Ioc's only natural form was the mind. The body and Spirit needed to be borrowed. But, when Ioc faced a strong enough enemy... Its investiture was enough to put its mind into the Physical Realm, like a Spren. But only much, much more powerful. Ioc was, in it's most powerful form, only the beige cloud. Unheeded by body or spirit. Ioc floated towards the large ship. The 'beige cloud' that Ioc emitted, a physical representation of Connection that Ioc sometimes put forth, lead to the ship. It lead to Solace. Ioc drifted through the walls of the ship, an incorporeal form of Investiture. A mind. A power. Something... Unique. Both Mind and Investiture. Ioc. Ioc was... finally Ioc. How it should have always been. Ioc followed the trail to the brig of the ship, a beige smudge in the air. There, it found Solace, or Sephtis. Ioc would have grinned if it had a face. The beige smudge accumulated into a human shape. "Solace..." Ioc said in a stereotypical ghost voice. "Our fight is not over... dai..."
Lord Meeker he/him Posted November 27, 2018 Author Posted November 27, 2018 (edited) Sephtis touched the consolidating smudge as it grew into human form. "You can join the rest of my voices." Ioc's mind was ripped from the attachment of Investiture. Sephtis held up a special spike and the investiture the Ioc left over was absorbed. Edited November 29, 2018 by AdOokla
xinoehp512 he/him Posted November 27, 2018 Posted November 27, 2018 Quote You're going to time travel? Have you talked about this with everyone else?
kenod Posted November 27, 2018 Posted November 27, 2018 Quote I don't think the time travel adventures are actually going to be live? The basics of what he did are detailed in the Investure for a Better Life thread though.
Voidus Posted November 27, 2018 Posted November 27, 2018 Quote Personally I'd rather we didn't start messing with time travel. Otherwise it becomes the default fix-all option for any problem, causes paradox issues, potentially invalidates other characters choices (which is functionally godmodding), etc.
kenod Posted November 27, 2018 Posted November 27, 2018 Quote True, perhaps we could at least reign in the damage by saying that any time travel will create a stable time loop, and that time travel can never actually change the past and present?
whattheHoid she/her Posted November 28, 2018 Posted November 28, 2018 Quote Are we really allowing time travel? How is that possible. Do we want time travel? Time can get super confusing real fast!
xinoehp512 he/him Posted November 28, 2018 Posted November 28, 2018 Quote I think that if we set down ground rules, and make sure time travel is cleared if it affects the story, we should be alright.
Gancho Libre he/him Posted November 28, 2018 Posted November 28, 2018 16 hours ago, AdOokla said: Sephtis touched the consolidating smudge as it grew into human form. "You can join the rest of my voices." Ioc's mind was ripped from the attachment of Investiture. Sephtis held up a special spike and the investiture the Ioc left over was absorbed. "The machine is ready." They led him into a small side chamber from the main consoles and room. He lay down in the machine. "We are sending you to before the Shattering. Hopefully you can figure out what happened and do your other personal agenda things." the woman said nervously. "This is a one way trip." "Yes I know. for you it will be an eyeblink! I'll have to stay under cover. Use my power to live and nothing else. Engage the machine." The lid closed and a bright light filled the room. It subsided and the lid lifted. Sephtis was gone. "I'm back. There is a lot to do." Sephtis' voice rung from the door way. "Call Emperor Dread. I need to know his progress." Quote ow. How do you touch a mind anywho? It's like a spren. But, hey. I'm not against being a voice to Solace. In fact, Ioc is kinda salty right now. "HEY SOLACE! SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACESOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACESOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACESOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACESOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE!!!!! SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACESOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACESOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE!!!!! IS THIS DISTRACTING YOU AT ALL?????????? CAN YOU CONCENTRATE ON WHAT YOU ARE DOING????? HEY SOLACE!!! SOLACE??? ARE YOU LISTENING????????? HEY SOLACE!!!!!" 7
whattheHoid she/her Posted November 28, 2018 Posted November 28, 2018 1 hour ago, Ookla the Libre said: "HEY SOLACE! SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACESOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACESOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACESOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACESOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE!!!!! SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACESOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACESOLACE SOLACE SOLACE SOLACE!!!!! IS THIS DISTRACTING YOU AT ALL?????????? CAN YOU CONCENTRATE ON WHAT YOU ARE DOING????? HEY SOLACE!!! SOLACE??? ARE YOU LISTENING????????? HEY SOLACE!!!!!" Solace!!!!????? Are you listening?
Voidus Posted November 28, 2018 Posted November 28, 2018 Quote I'm still really iffy on time travel. It rately adds anything to story other than confusion. It's also one of the few powers not ever used in the cosmere, and for good reason. 2
whattheHoid she/her Posted November 28, 2018 Posted November 28, 2018 Quote Ditto. Time travel when done right is great, but that rarely happens.
xinoehp512 he/him Posted November 28, 2018 Posted November 28, 2018 Quote I've thought about it a lot, actually. I think I have a way for it to work inside the alleyverse with minimal issues, but it should be cleared with everyone else first.
Voidus Posted November 29, 2018 Posted November 29, 2018 6 minutes ago, Ookla the Phoenix said: I've thought about it a lot, actually. I think I have a way for it to work inside the alleyverse with minimal issues, but it should be cleared with everyone else first. Quote Honestly, I don't think there's a way it can possibly work. Either people can change history, (in which case there's never any threat to anything), or you can't change history in which case there's a paradox because it means you've already done the thing you're trying to do but then that was part of what motivated you to go back and do the thing you're trying to do so how did you initially become motivated to do the thing you're trying to do? And also it would mean time travel is entirely pointless other than for a dramatic reveal moment of 'Aha! Voidus was actually Solace all along he just travelled back in time!' and honestly those moments are very rarely pulled off well. I think we can do without. The crux of it for me is: What do we gain from adding time travel? I can't think of a single thing it adds to the story other than just 'having time travel' 1
xinoehp512 he/him Posted November 29, 2018 Posted November 29, 2018 Quote You can't change what's already happened, but you can change what's going to happen. That is to say, you can't travel into the past and rewrite history, but you can travel from the future and change what winds up happening. 5 minutes ago, Ookla the Lurker said: you've already done the thing you're trying to do but then that was part of what motivated you to go back and do the thing you're trying to do so how did you initially become motivated to do the thing you're trying to do This is what's known as a causal loop. While it may seem strange, it's perfectly self-consistent. It doesn't really bother me, personally. If it really bothers you, though, we can deny them whenever someone suggests one.
Voidus Posted November 29, 2018 Posted November 29, 2018 4 minutes ago, Ookla the Phoenix said: You can't change what's already happened, but you can change what's going to happen. That is to say, you can't travel into the past and rewrite history, but you can travel from the future and change what winds up happening. Quote Mechanically that's exactly the same thing. Sure we can forbid players from retconning history but there's not reason then that a character wouldn't want to. Foresight solves this problem a lot easier if that's what someone wants to do and is already canonical. 4 minutes ago, Ookla the Phoenix said: This is what's known as a causal loop. While it may seem strange, it's perfectly self-consistent. It doesn't really bother me, personally. If it really bothers you, though, we can deny them whenever someone suggests one. Quote Yes but something needs to initiate the first loop that isn't inside it, otherwise the timeline where you don't time travel is equally probable and then you've split the timeline. Which is a whole other mess I don't want to get into. And again, we don't actually get anything out of this other than just having time travel for the sake of having time travel. Seeing the future is already possible, changing the past needs to be impossible even with it, so it doesn't actually add anything to the story and has the potential to cause a lot of complications.
xinoehp512 he/him Posted November 29, 2018 Posted November 29, 2018 Quote I think that the basic idea behind what Solace tried was a good one. He probably should have checked first, but that doesn't mean we should ban it altogether, just that we should limit it. 4 minutes ago, Ookla the Lurker said: Yes but something needs to initiate the first loop that isn't inside it, otherwise the timeline where you don't time travel is equally probable and then you've split the timeline. Which is a whole other mess I don't want to get into. The way I have it working, there's only one timeline, so it can't split. If you've gone back in time, you've gone back in time. 7 minutes ago, Ookla the Lurker said: Mechanically that's exactly the same thing. Sure we can forbid players from retconning history but there's not reason then that a character wouldn't want to. I don't really understand what you're trying to say here. Could you explain in more detail?
Voidus Posted November 29, 2018 Posted November 29, 2018 Just now, Ookla the Phoenix said: The way I have it working, there's only one timeline, so it can't split. If you've gone back in time, you've gone back in time. Quote Then you can't have a self-contained, self-causing time loop. Just now, Ookla the Phoenix said: I don't really understand what you're trying to say here. Could you explain in more detail? Quote Going from the future to the present and from the present to the past are exactly the same things, just happening at different points in time. They're both traveling to the past. We can ban a player from going from the present to the past but if time travel is available in the universe then the characters have no logical requirement to follow that restriction. Laurelai would want to go back and find her parents, maybe stop herself from going to the Nightwatcher, people would want to resurrect characters who died, etc. So then we can either just say that characters don't do that but never explain it, which then hollows the personality of characters, or we allow it and then have to deal with history changing. And again, I'm still not seeing any convincing reason we should allow it, what does it actually add to the story? If it doesn't add anything then we shouldn't allow it because it's just needless additional complexity. I'm seeing a bunch of negatives, some of which we might be able to minimize but not all of them, and 0 positives.
xinoehp512 he/him Posted November 29, 2018 Posted November 29, 2018 Quote I think that there are several potential applications. A couple of my characters' plot arcs depend on time travel that follows these rules. 4 minutes ago, Ookla the Lurker said: Going from the future to the present and from the present to the past are exactly the same things, just happening at different points in time. They're both traveling to the past. It's not, actually, because of the NOW clock. That defines a specific moment in time, constantly moving forwards, that separates past from future. It's much more difficult to travel from the future, and you usually lose all or most of your memories, but you can change things. 8 minutes ago, Ookla the Lurker said: Then you can't have a self-contained, self-causing time loop. Sure you can. It's a bit confusing, but it's possible. Yes, the cause came from nowhere. Is that really a problem?
Voidus Posted November 29, 2018 Posted November 29, 2018 10 minutes ago, Ookla the Phoenix said: It's not, actually, because of the NOW clock. That defines a specific moment in time, constantly moving forwards, that separates past from future. It's much more difficult to travel from the future, and you usually lose all or most of your memories, but you can change things. Quote But at the point in time that people actually travel, that point will be now, so it's functionally identical. And even then, people could travel from the future to a point further in the past than the present, again it's functionally identical. 11 minutes ago, Ookla the Phoenix said: Sure you can. It's a bit confusing, but it's possible. Yes, the cause came from nowhere. Is that really a problem? Quote 1. Yes it is a problem, it violates basic causality. 2. Then why did they time travel instead of not time travelling, both possible without outside influence, what is the causal factor that initiates the loop? If there is none then every moment in time that could conceivably loop, does loop, not all of them are simultaneously possible in the same timeline so the timeline splits. 15 minutes ago, Ookla the Phoenix said: I think that there are several potential applications. A couple of my characters' plot arcs depend on time travel that follows these rules. Quote Which part of their arc couldn't be fulfilled in exactly the same way with foresight instead of physical time travel?
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