Full Edgedancer Reaction Thread [Edgedancer Spoilers]

[Julio]

On ‎22‎/‎11‎/‎2016 at 5:32 PM, lookingglass said:

I'm still reeling. I need time to gather my thoughts

Well now we know that Khriss is researcher at the University of Starlight. I always thought that she was just doing research for herself since she's been exiled.

Also we know what Lift wanted from the Nightwatcher... Not to change. But this doesn't explain why she gets stormlight from food or that she is partially in the cognitive realm. Any ideas?

So, Lift said that she defined herself by getting food, right? So, Nightwatcher continued that; she needs food for stormlight, and always will, thus staying the same. Her curse may be the fact that she can't suck stormlight out of spheres...

Also, someone on the first page mentioned Shallan having a shardblade for all of WoR... No, she's had it the whole time. It was first mentioned halfway through WoK.... Which I think puts paid to the idea of third oath=shardbearer. For lightweavers, anyway...

On ‎23‎/‎11‎/‎2016 at 7:30 AM, VirtuousTraveller said:

 

Sorry for all the clumsy things here, I'm really new to this forum.... And really sorry if anything I've said has already been said, I didn't have time to read all five pages.

[Iarwainiel I she/her]

I sooooo want to read a scene with Lift and Wayne. That would be the absolute best.

Also (I might need to correct this later when I've got my book handy - going from memory now), I keep telling my cats that I've got "lunks for smalls."

[dionysus]

A couple of quick reactions I have been pondering while reading Edgedancer. I just finished it about an hour ago.

Lift's thoughts seem a lot more mature than one would expect from a 13 year old. I know she has had a tough life, but it is more than that. She is just too wise. When she is finally forced out of her self-deceiving internal monologue we get a glimpse of who she really is. Some of her conversations with Wyndle when things are serious, her answers to the philosopher, and even her funny conversations via spanreed show her depth. I just don't see how a 13 year old has that depth. Yes, I am aware that Roshar's years are longer but there has been a lot of debate on this forum about whether that really translates into maturity at a younger age number. Even so, 13 years would only be 17. A little more explainable but still Lift would be about the only character I can think of where doing the 500 day long year age conversion helps explain the characters maturity level. Everyone else seems about as mature as you would expect if you just took their Roshar ages as earth years in the Renaissance (We delay life milestones in the modern era more than previous eras).

So she asked to remain unchanging and got the ability to get stormlight from food. I wonder if the stormlight was her answer, as long as her self-image remains unchanging she remains unchanging. But as her self-image changes she changes. Remember she admits she feels like she is growing a tiny bit over the last 3 years. Basically maybe the Nightwatcher gave her the ability to remain unchanging in an unrealistic scenario, that of keeping her self-image unchanging. Maybe it is a boon/curse wrapped up in one. If her self-image changes a lot she will change a lot.

 

Edited December 7, 2016 by dionysus

[XenosHg]

I like the fact that radiants need money, aka gemstones, to store Stormlight, but Lift just doesn't do money, because the only function it has for her is getting food, which she can just go for directly, in the first place. So she gets the ability that lets her get Stormlight without spheres.

 

And, as for the reason I came to this thread - I suddenly understood that (someone quoted that) the Nightwatcher couldn't make Lift literally unchanging, so she did something similar.. If you think about it, due to her unique powers Lift is constantly malnourished, and so she doesn't grow as a person should in his childhood/teen years. Being half-spren is not the point, it is the means for reaching it.
 

[Argent he/him]

22 hours ago, dionysus said:

Even so, 13 years would only be 17.

You can't even attribute it to that, actually. While the Rosharan year has 500 days, each one of those is shorter than the Cosmere standard day (which happens to be the same as an Earth day, conveniently). I think they are 20 hours, but don't quote me on that. I've seen the math done a couple of times, and a Rosharan year ends up being about 1.1 Earth years - so Lift is really 14-15. 

But I agree, she can be a lot more mature than what her age would suggest, and there is something fishy going on with that.

[XenosHg]

Jasnah was, as Navani put it, "really born thirty years old", so being MORE mentally mature than your age is not unique among the heroes. The difference is that Lift is putting (semi-)conscious effort to be the opposite. And so the moment of contrast look sharper.

You probably cannot simultaneously be a fool, a madman, an orphan, and alive, but you're allowed to try.
 

[StormingTexan he/him]

1 hour ago, XenosHg said:

Jasnah was, as Navani put it, "really born thirty years old", so being MORE mentally mature than your age is not unique among the heroes. The difference is that Lift is putting (semi-)conscious effort to be the opposite. And so the moment of contrast look sharper.

You probably cannot simultaneously be a fool, a madman, an orphan, and alive, but you're allowed to try.
 

I agree with the contrast we are seeing. Reminiscent of Wayne who always comes across as a joker but we've seen some mature moments in his inner monologue. I'd say a lot of the way she portrays herself is a defense mechanism. 

 

Not to mention I'd venture to say being completely on your own for a number of years is going to advance your maturity beyond your years.

[BeskarKomrk he/him]

Just now, StormingTexan said:

Not to mention I'd venture to say being completely on your own for a number of years is going to advance your maturity beyond your years.

Not to mention traveling all around the world, seeing different cultures and meeting lots of different people. That tends to make you grow up fast.

[dionysus]

22 hours ago, BeskarKomrk said:

Not to mention traveling all around the world, seeing different cultures and meeting lots of different people. That tends to make you grow up fast.

Lots of different types of maturity. Her understanding hardship and the darker side of life is understandable. I should clarify that I am talking more about wisdom, which I think is harder to obtain in my opinion.

Anyway, I am just wondering how reliable her estimate of how much time has passed is since she saw the Nightwatcher.

[king of nowhere]

I very much disliked Lift before this story, now I love her. It's surprising what difference can make a sprinkle of maturity and a purpose.

I never realized the deep meaning of "Lift had been ten years old for the last three years". And who counld have guessed that in order to get her to grow up, you'd need to stick her inside a palace? all of her wishes fulfilled, so that she was forced to look for something deeper. And she grew up all of a sudden. I didn't even need to throw her out of a window for it!

Ah, Lift, your capacity of loving everyone is what really makes you awesome. the stormlight stuff is just a stunt. Welcome to the club of ficitional characters I'd like to have as little sisters. Meet Shallan.

I wonder what will happen if she gets thrown at mr T.

 

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, king of nowhere said:

I very much disliked Lift before this story, now I love her. It's surprising what difference can make a sprinkle of maturity and a purpose.

I never realized the deep meaning of "Lift had been ten years old for the last three years". And who counld have guessed that in order to get her to grow up, you'd need to stick her inside a palace? all of her wishes fulfilled, so that she was forced to look for something deeper. And she grew up all of a sudden. I didn't even need to throw her out of a window for it!

Ah, Lift, your capacity of loving everyone is what really makes you awesome. the stormlight stuff is just a stunt. Welcome to the club of ficitional characters I'd like to have as little sisters. Meet Shallan.

I wonder what will happen if she gets thrown at mr T.

 

Wow King of Nowhere: I am really happy you read the novella  I recall how difficult Lift was for you as a character. You had so much trouble appreciating her, so it makes me happy this novella was sufficient to help change your perception of her.

I had similar issues as you with the character, prior to reading Edgedancer, and I was pleased to see the novella took care of them. 

[Enigmantis]

A couple of people have questioned what, if any, abilities Nightblood might give to Szeth. People were mentioning that it may be a combination of surges different to the combinations any of the orders have. Noone seems to have mentioned that, since we know metals foreign to Scadrial once taken there can bestow investiture orther than what is already known from the planet (i.e. Paalm's spike), is it not possilbe that Nightblood will give Szeth surges different from the other ten known ones (as the spren is foreign to Roshar)?

[Vissy]

I still kind of don't like Lift. She's brave and sort of sympathetic to others, but also really callous and oftentimes uncaring. I guess I don't like that combination when it's taken so seriously.

[king of nowhere]

15 hours ago, Rob Lucci said:

I still kind of don't like Lift. She's brave and sort of sympathetic to others, but also really callous and oftentimes uncaring. I guess I don't like that combination when it's taken so seriously.

That's also something I don't like about her. the way she messes up with other people without caring for how she's making their lives more difficult. But in the novellla, most of the times she did it, it was for a good reason; for example, when she makes a scene at the guard post to attract nale. In her first appearance, she broke into the middle of the important people to steal their lunch, causing many innocent guards to be punished, and putting in trouble her felllow thieves, just because it felt cool to do it. What to say, in front of her steady progress, I'm willing to cut her some slack on account of her being 13.

[Rasarr she/her]

I finally got my hands on Arcanum Unbounded today and I've just finished reading Edgedancer, so a couple random thoughts (well, a tad more than a couple):

• Character development for everyone! Lift gets some, Szeth gets some, Wyndle gets some, even Nale gets some character development!
• I'm starting to like Szeth. Weirdly enough, going crazy seems to have made him a better person. Or maybe it's Nightblood. 
• I'm trying to picture the other half of Szeth-Nightblood conversations, and it's hilarious.
• When other mad people call you mad, it's probably time to dial it down a bit (looking at you, Nale).
• I absolutely thought that the guard captain from the beginning would end up a Skybreaker. Guess point-of-view doesn't mean plot importance.
• So, are Stormform Parshendi/Voidbringers immortal? Nale was convinced that the Shattered Plains ones were the last vestiges of the previous Desolation, which would put them at four and a half thousand years old. I mean, Nale's pretty mad, but he'd notice that, right?
• The third Edgedancer oath is... a bit too much like the second one, for me. In my opinion, it doesn't really add anything to the second the way the third Windrunner oath added to the first. Maybe I'm just bad at reading between the lines, though.
• I really liked the final scene with Lift and Nale. It's not like she could fight him, so that was some good thinking on Lift's part. And the hug was very sweet.
• Nale's reaction to seeing the Parshmen turning Void-y gives me hope for the rest of the Heralds.
• I did not expect this to happen, but I'm extraordinarily happy to see Nale snap out of his Radiant-killing funk. My biggest hope right now is that we'll have a "Nale confronts Ishar" interlude in Oathbringer (and I hope if such interlude happens, Nale survives the encounter). I want more Heralds on the side of light!
• Actually, I want any Nale POV section, period. Doesn't have to include any other Heralds.
• I absolutely agree with everyone who's been saying that Ishar is a traitor. The prelude, coupled with this, pretty much spell out for me that he lied to his fellow Heralds. Which of course begs questions. Number 1, did he do this because he was tired of constant fighting and Braize-visiting, or is there something more sinister going on? And number 2, does he still remember that he lied, or does he believe his own lies now?

I've been pondering as to what happened to those Parshmen who were turned by the storm, and I'm pretty sure I know the answer - Nale killed them. Lift probably didn't stick around in the storm after he made his getaway, and who else could disappear so many turned Parshmen if not a Herald? The only weird thing is that no-one mentions this afterwards.

Edited December 26, 2016 by Rasarr

[djammmer]

11 hours ago, Rasarr said:

 

• I really liked the final scene with Lift and Nale. It's not like she could fight him, so that was some good thinking on Lift's part. And the hug was very sweet.

Exactly.  This part gave me a broader excitement for the rest of SA. I was always looking forward to learning about the 10 KR classes... And their diversity and differences.  But I used to be myoptic in that thinking... Just thing about thier diversity in combat skills/styles.  But this ending with lift showed me that the diversity is way beyond that... That Lift could transform Nale with just a hug.  (Or help him to grow.... A 10 or 13 year old pro-radiant could help thousands year old herald to grow.... Because of her unique approach.  And there's no way I see any of the other character radiant we know about using that approach and getting that result.)  imagine diversity of approaches and skill sets we will get will all 10 KR classes working together.

 

 

 

 

 

[Yata he/him]

13 hours ago, Rasarr said:

• I'm starting to like Szeth. Weirdly enough, going crazy seems to have made him a better person. Or maybe it's Nightblood. 
• I'm trying to picture the other half of Szeth-Nightblood conversations, and it's hilarious.

Honestly, I think this is the first look to Szeth as character, until now we saw only what his status pushes him to be, not him. I hope we may see much of the true Szeth

PS: notice that Lift is still alive only because She is a funny character...so funny that Nightblood likes her, It will be really fun if Nightblood the next time Szeth try to tap into its powers (whatever they are) say something like

Nightblood: "Ok Szeth, I will give you some of my Awesomeness"

Szeth: "Please, Sword-nim stops call it in that way...It's embarassing"

[The One Who Connects he/him]

17 hours ago, Rasarr said:

So, are Stormform Parshendi/Voidbringers immortal? Nale was convinced that the Shattered Plains ones were the last vestiges of the previous Desolation, which would put them at four and a half thousand years old. I mean, Nale's pretty mad, but he'd notice that, right?

Well, The Alethi (and likely others) breed Parshmen slaves. The Parshendi have Mateform. Is it too much to believe that these "last vestiges" are descendants of the survivors? Although, we shouldn't put it past an Immortal to lose his sense of time passing. Days become weeks, etc..

[Rasarr she/her]

21 hours ago, The One Who Connects said:

Well, The Alethi (and likely others) breed Parshmen slaves. The Parshendi have Mateform. Is it too much to believe that these "last vestiges" are descendants of the survivors?

I must admit, I didn't think of that. On the other hand, if the various "Voidforms" are dependent on bonding with Voidspren, then wouldn't the descendants of the Voidbringers be regular Parshendi? After all, without desolations, there aren't any more voidspren to bond. Or maybe, by Nale's reasoning, the Parshendi would "inherit" the voidspren?

We know too little about the Parshendi and Voidbringers, unfortunately.

[Yata he/him]

13 minutes ago, Rasarr said:

I must admit, I didn't think of that. On the other hand, if the various "Voidforms" are dependent on bonding with Voidspren, then wouldn't the descendants of the Voidbringers be regular Parshendi? After all, without desolations, there aren't any more voidspren to bond. Or maybe, by Nale's reasoning, the Parshendi would "inherit" the voidspren?

We know too little about the Parshendi and Voidbringers, unfortunately.

I think the whole Nale's point wasn't about the Listener but instead of the Voidspren.
To him the Voidbringer Szeth saw, are the Voidspren stucked on Roshar from the last Desolation, with new Listener host...but nothing new on Roshar's History (as some Dalinar's Vision showed)

Edited December 28, 2016 by Yata