Moons? [AU Spoilers]

[Farnsworth]

My kindle AU just got downloaded and I noticed something. All then interesting/shared worlds have moons. Why might this be?

[Kaymyth]

Well.  I think Scadrial is pretty interesting, and it doesn't have a moon...

 

Edited To Add:  Really, when it comes down to it, moons are generally good gravitational stabilizers to naturally formed planets.  A lot of Earth's habitability comes from the effect our moon has in stabilizing our axial wobble and rotational speed.  Scadrial, of course, is an exception to that because it's not a naturally formed planet; Ruin and Preservation had a pretty heavy hand in putting together that particular solar system.

Edited November 22, 2016 by Kaymyth

[Chaos]

I'm going to be moving these to Cosmere theories for the general stuff, honestly. Also make sure we tag stuff with AU spoilers! 

In about an hour I'll let people post full Edgedancer spoilers.

[Kaymyth]

Just goes to show how tired I am that I didn't even notice I'd responded to a thread that was spoilery for something I haven't read yet.

[Chaos]

Tagging is important

[cometaryorbit]

The orbits of Roshar's moons look potentially interesting. (And potentially problematic physics wise...)

[skaa]

I think Threnody is pretty interesting as well, and yet it also doesn't have a moon. Another interesting thing is that the planet Elegy in the same system does have a moon and they even have a name for it: Coronach. I wonder if Elegy will be a setting for a future short story. Maybe space-faring travelers like The Ones Above could visit planets like Elegy that don't have perpendicularities and interact with people there.

(I was about to state that Nalthis doesn't have a moon, but a quick search in the Warbreaker PDF showed that it does have one.)

Edited November 22, 2016 by skaa

[Windrunner]

38 minutes ago, cometaryorbit said:

The orbits of Roshar's moons look potentially interesting. (And potentially problematic physics wise...)

If I recall correctly, Peter's done some work on the orbits of the moons, and says that they are stable on the order of tens to hundreds of thousands of years, if not millions, which Brandon is fine with. Peter thinks that this may indicate that these are not natural satellites, but he doesn't know for sure.

[soyperson]

8 hours ago, skaa said:

I think Threnody is pretty interesting as well, and yet it also doesn't have a moon. Another interesting thing is that the planet Elegy in the same system does have a moon and they even have a name for it: Coronach. I wonder if Elegy will be a setting for a future short story. Maybe space-faring travelers like The Ones Above could visit planets like Elegy that don't have perpendicularities and interact with people there.

(I was about to state that Nalthis doesn't have a moon, but a quick search in the Warbreaker PDF showed that it does have one.)

I like that the other planet's name is Elegy, because a threnody and an elegy are both similar kinds of song (a lament; especially for the dead).

EDIT: And a coronach is a step of the Scottish funeral wake (particularly when they sing to the deceased). 

EDIT: And a monody is a poem read to lament a death. He's really trying to hint at something here. Maybe a whole system named as a memorial to something?

I'm sensing a theme here.

Edited November 22, 2016 by bleeder

[Argent]

4 hours ago, bleeder said:

I like that the other planet's name is Elegy, because a threnody and an elegy are both similar kinds of song (a lament; especially for the dead).

EDIT: And a coronach is a step of the Scottish funeral wake (particularly when they sing to the deceased). 

EDIT: And a monody is a poem read to lament a death. He's really trying to hint at something here. Maybe a whole system named as a memorial to something?

I'm sensing a theme here.

This naming scheme is my favorite small thing from the entire collection.

[PallonianFire]

5 hours ago, bleeder said:

EDIT: And a monody is a poem read to lament a death. He's really trying to hint at something here. Maybe a whole system named as a memorial to something?

I asked if Threnody were named in memorial of someone back on the Calamity tour, and he said it was. It was a big part of my theory (now *mostly* proven! Hi, Ambition, you foe of Odium!) that the Cognitive Realm craziness on Threnody was caused by Odium splintering another Shard.

[Pagerunner]

1 hour ago, PallonianFire said:

I asked if Threnody were named in memorial of someone back on the Calamity tour, and he said it was. It was a big part of my theory (now *mostly* proven! Hi, Ambition, you foe of Odium!) that the Cognitive Realm craziness on Threnody was caused by Odium splintering another Shard.

That would imply the system wasn't named until after the Shattering, which seems to contradict the implications from elsewhere in the essays that humanity predated the Shattering of Adonalsium and the arrival of the Shards.

[PallonianFire]

5 minutes ago, Pagerunner said:

That would imply the system wasn't named until after the Shattering, which seems to contradict the implications from elsewhere in the essays that humanity predated the Shattering of Adonalsium and the arrival of the Shards.

Humanity could have predated it and not named their system or their planet until worldhopping became more widespread.

[Pagerunner]

5 minutes ago, PallonianFire said:

Humanity could have predated it and not named their system or their planet until worldhopping became more widespread.

Here's another quote from Brandon that says the planets were named before the Shards got there. We had a name for our planet before we even knew it was a planet. (If you say that it was renamed to Threnody, that I don't have anything against.)

[PallonianFire]

All I know is that Brandon himself said it was named in memorial of someone, so...

Could very well be that it was renamed after Ambition went down.

 

EDIT: Interesting thing to note in that WoB. All the planets existed before they got there? Khriss certainly seems to think that Ruin and Preservation created Scadrial.

Edited November 22, 2016 by PallonianFire

[Pagerunner]

4 minutes ago, PallonianFire said:

All I know is that Brandon himself said it was named in memorial of someone, so...

Could very well be that it was renamed after Ambition went down.

 

EDIT: Interesting thing to note in that WoB. All the planets existed before they got there? Khriss certainly seems to think that Ruin and Preservation created Scadrial.

The exception that proves the rule. Before that info was widespread (there have always been WoBs about it, but nothing published or in annotations), Brandon wouldn't have any reason to go out of his way to offer that fact on Scadrial.

[PallonianFire]

Very true. It's funny, cuz I was always under the impression that they created the whole planet. I got in a little debate about it recently, on Facebook, and went hunting for WoBs on it, finding that I had made it up. And then Khriss's essay comes out and supports my idea haha

[WeiryWriter]

3 hours ago, Argent said:

This naming scheme is my favorite small thing from the entire collection.

Oi! Now you get out of my head!

[Argent]

27 minutes ago, WeiryWriter said:

Oi! Now you get out of my head!

Are we... are we the same person!?

[Oversleep]

On 22.11.2016 at 9:26 PM, Argent said:

Are we... are we the same person!?

More importantly, has any of you two started a widespread organization of underground fighting rings?

On 22.11.2016 at 1:02 PM, bleeder said:

I like that the other planet's name is Elegy, because a threnody and an elegy are both similar kinds of song (a lament; especially for the dead).

EDIT: And a coronach is a step of the Scottish funeral wake (particularly when they sing to the deceased). 

EDIT: And a monody is a poem read to lament a death. He's really trying to hint at something here. Maybe a whole system named as a memorial to something?

I'm sensing a theme here.

The first thing after I've seen Threnodite System was to go to google and check what monody and coronach is (cause I already knew that elegy is a thing :P)

Edited November 27, 2016 by Ookla the Sunrise Watcher
double post :(

[thegatorgirl00]

14 hours ago, bleeder said:

I like that the other planet's name is Elegy, because a threnody and an elegy are both similar kinds of song (a lament; especially for the dead).

EDIT: And a coronach is a step of the Scottish funeral wake (particularly when they sing to the deceased). 

EDIT: And a monody is a poem read to lament a death. He's really trying to hint at something here. Maybe a whole system named as a memorial to something?

I'm sensing a theme here.

 

2 hours ago, Oversleep said:

The first thing after I've seen Threnodite System was to go to google and check what monody and coronach is (cause I already knew that elegy is a thing :P)

This begs the question, why purity? The rest of the system follows a pattern, why break it there? 

Note: a quick search of dictionary.com found no definitions of purity that had anything to do with death or funerals. 

[soyperson]

Just now, thegatorgirl00 said:

 

This begs the question, why purity? The rest of the system follows a pattern, why break it there? 

Note: a quick search of dictionary.com found no definitions of purity that had anything to do with death or funerals. 

Could Purity be a Shard?

[Oversleep]

17 minutes ago, bleeder said:

Could Purity be a Shard?

Sharders are all like "Can _ be a Shard?" XD If there was another Shard there I'm sure it would have way more influence on things and Khriss would definitely have mentioned it

[cometaryorbit]

22 hours ago, Windrunner said:

If I recall correctly, Peter's done some work on the orbits of the moons, and says that they are stable on the order of tens to hundreds of thousands of years, if not millions, which Brandon is fine with. Peter thinks that this may indicate that these are not natural satellites, but he doesn't know for sure.

Interesting.

I believe all three are described as rising in the east/setting in the west from Roshar's perspective, which implies they're at least roughly coplanar (no weird orbits tilted 60 degrees out of plane relative to each other).

The orbits appear to cross on the map, so they pretty much have to be in an orbital resonance so they never actually meet. (This is why Neptune doesn't crash into Pluto or pitch it into the sun or out of the solar system, despite the orbits crossing.)

Since all three moons appear once per day per Peter Ahlstrom, they have to have the same orbital period, and thus be in a 1:1 resonance ("co-orbital"). The simple way would be to put the two smaller moons at the larger moon's L4 and L5 Lagrangian points, but I question whether this would work for orbits this elliptical.
So it's likely something weirder. Saturn has two moons in a co-orbital configuration (Janus and Epimetheus) but they swap places every few years, so it doesn't seem to be the same thing happening at Roshar.

[natc]

Does anyone have an image of the actual orbits? I keep wanting to check back on it but I can't carry a hardcover out of the house too easily . . .