Is Kaladin literally just Jesus?

[Schizoposting]

1. He's the son of god (Tanavast).
2. He has supernatural powers.
3. He (metaphorically) dies and is reborn multiple times, but most notably, the scene where he's strung up before the highstorm is analogous to crucifixion 
4. He dedicates his life to the spiritually pure purposes of healing and protecting the weak and needy.
5. He's an extremely effective, charismatic leader
6. He has a large and growing cult following among the lower classes.
7. He is seen as a threat by the powers that be
8. He's tempted by the devil (Odium), and the antichrist (Vyre).
9. At the end of WAT, he becomes a demigod and ascends directly to heaven (spiritual Alaswha).
10. Finally, in the back half, he will descend from the heavens to free Roshar from the beasts' tyranny in the final battle.
Am I missing something, or is Kaladin basically just Jesus?

Edited December 18, 2025 by Schizoposting

[Myst He/Him]

So, I always interpreted the son of tanavast thing as being figurative, showing that he stood for the same things as him. I wouldn’t say he has a cult, not any more than Dalinar or Shallan or Adolin would have. But otherwise yeah, pretty much

[Schizoposting]

23 minutes ago, Ookla the Broken said:

So, I always interpreted the son of tanavast thing as being figurative, showing that he stood for the same things as him. I wouldn’t say he has a cult, not any more than Dalinar or Shallan or Adolin would have. But otherwise yeah, pretty much

Well... in ROW we see that Kaladin has a very large following, at least in Urithiru—people literally drew the shash glyphs on their foreheads as a sign of resistance during the occupation. And now, after WAT, where Kaladin literally becomes divine, we can expect his cult to become more explicitly religious in the back half.   

[Guest]

I agree with you. All of your reasons make sense and you took time to think through any mistakes. Do you go to church?

[NerdSandwich she/her]

That's a cool theory. Obviously, there are some differences, but I see the parallels.

[CoderDrag0n8 He/They]

8 hours ago, Schizoposting said:

1. He's the son of god (Tanavast).
2. He has supernatural powers.
3. He (metaphorically) dies and is reborn multiple times, but most notably, the scene where he's strung up before the highstorm is analogous to crucifixion 
4. He dedicates his life to the spiritually pure purposes of healing and protecting the weak and needy.
5. He's an extremely effective, charismatic leader
6. He has a large and growing cult following among the lower classes.
7. He is seen as a threat by the powers that be
8. He's tempted by the devil (Odium), and the antichrist (Vyre).
9. At the end of WAT, he becomes a demigod and ascends directly to heaven (spiritual Alaswha).
10. Finally, in the back half, he will descend from the heavens to free Roshar from the beasts' tyranny in the final battle.
Am I missing something, or is Kaladin basically just Jesus?

Kelsier is

1. Killed by ruler of the major world power at the time

2. In front of everyone

3. Is rumored to have come back from the dead

4. Starts a major religous movement that becomes the main religon incredibly fast

5. Followers wear a necklace with his symbol

I just dont see Kaladin gaining as major a following as we see kelsier.

[alder24]

8 hours ago, Schizoposting said:

1. He's the son of god (Tanavast).
2. He has supernatural powers.
3. He (metaphorically) dies and is reborn multiple times, but most notably, the scene where he's strung up before the highstorm is analogous to crucifixion 
4. He dedicates his life to the spiritually pure purposes of healing and protecting the weak and needy.
5. He's an extremely effective, charismatic leader
6. He has a large and growing cult following among the lower classes.
7. He is seen as a threat by the powers that be
8. He's tempted by the devil (Odium), and the antichrist (Vyre).
9. At the end of WAT, he becomes a demigod and ascends directly to heaven (spiritual Alaswha).
10. Finally, in the back half, he will descend from the heavens to free Roshar from the beasts' tyranny in the final battle.
Am I missing something, or is Kaladin basically just Jesus?

We actually have WoBs on this. Any similarities between Kaladin and Jesus aren't intentional. However, Kelsier from the Mistborn series was deliberately written as a Christ-like figure.

Spoiler

Questioner

So Kaladin, he has a lot of Christ-like qualities being the who protects those who can't protect themselves. When you were writing the character of Kaladin did you ever make a conscious decision to make him a Christ figure or--

Brandon Sanderson

The question is... Kaladin has some Christ-figure feel to him, was that intentional when I was writing the character. Actually it wasn't, there's nothing really intentional about that allusion.  But I can definitely see it. Being Christian myself a lot of what I find heroic is related to my faith. But I very rarely do conscious things like that, mostly-- This is for English majors, "I bet he got it from here" and things like that. So it was not intentional but I can totally see where you are making that connection.

Firefight Atlanta signing (Jan. 24, 2015)

 

Spoiler

Brandon Sanderson

This is the most overt and obvious of my savior-imagery scenes for Kelsier. I hope you didn't feel like I was hitting you over the head with it. (I didn't actually realize the similarity between Survivor and Savior until I was part of the way through the book.) Either way, yes, the Christian imagery is intentional. I didn't put it in simply because I'm religious (after all, if you look at it, Kelsier isn't really all that Christian in the way he deals with people.) I put it in because I think that the images and metaphors of Christianity are deeply-seated in our culture, and drawing upon them provides for a more powerful story.

Part of this is to intentionally make people uncomfortable–for discomfort (when used right) leads to tension. The Christians who read this might be made uncomfortable by how strikingly un-divine Kelsier is. He's acting in some of the same roles as Christ did, but he's not the man that Christ was. He's kind of a pale imitation. The non-Christians, in turn, might be made uncomfortable by the fact that Kelsier is manipulating the people in the way that religions often do, giving hope in something that could very well prove to be false.

Either way, he is what he is. The truest Kelsier is the one we see near the end, where he's standing in the kitchen, smoldering in his black clothing. He is a dangerous man with powerful beliefs.

Mistborn: The Final Empire Annotations (April 2, 2007)

 

[NerdSandwich she/her]

Oh yeah I haven't drawn the parallels-

I'm kinda deterred by the very un-Christlike personality

[Returned he/him]

No? I mean, the list seems mostly OK so far as it goes (with some liberties taken), but it's a pretty sparse one for capturing either personality or for defining their lives and works. There is a lot of thematic overlap but with savior tropes being so well-worn I tend to say that characters from contemporary fiction are playing to the trope rather than a specific story (unless the author states otherwise, which is not the case as alder24 demonstrated with the WoBs). To say that Kaladin is literally just Jesus sounds about as reasonable to me as saying that he's literally just a Crip (he wears blue, is part of an organization of people that wear blue, and kills people associated with the color red in a self-perpetuating violent conflict). "Literally just" overstates similarities in most cases.

Edited December 18, 2025 by Returned

[FroggerCollectsHats they/them]

52 minutes ago, Ookla the Intelligent said:

Oh yeah I haven't drawn the parallels-

I'm kinda deterred by the very un-Christlike personality

No, Jesus was actually really grumpy and depressed. He was perfect, but he was grumpy about it.

[Schizoposting]

22 minutes ago, Returned said:

No? I mean, the list seems mostly OK so far as it goes (with some liberties taken), but it's a pretty sparse one for capturing either personality or for defining their lives and works. There is a lot of thematic overlap but with savior tropes being so well-worn I tend to say that characters from contemporary fiction are playing to the trope rather than a specific story (unless the author states otherwise, which is not the case as alder24 demonstrated with the WoBs). To say that Kaladin is literally just Jesus sounds about as reasonable to me as saying that he's literally just a Crip (he wears blue, is part of an organization of people that wear blue, and kills people associated with the color red in a self-perpetuating violent conflict). "Literally just" overstates similarities in most cases.

The difference between the two is that the similarities I point out are essential to Kaladin and his arc, while your comparisons are based un superficial characteristics (e.g. Kaladin could wear green, and it wouldn't change a thing). Obviously, Kaladin isn't identical to Jesus, but he is far more similar than other examples of savior archetypes, such as Harry Potter, or even Luke Skywalker. I don't necessarily claim that Brandon Sanderson explicitly based Kaladin off Jesus, but authorial intent does not actually matter in literary analysis.

3 hours ago, Ookla the Dokja said:

Kelsier is

1. Killed by ruler of the major world power at the time

2. In front of everyone

3. Is rumored to have come back from the dead

4. Starts a major religous movement that becomes the main religon incredibly fast

5. Followers wear a necklace with his symbol

I just dont see Kaladin gaining as major a following as we see kelsier.

Kelsier isn't so much Jesus, as someone trying to be Jesus; the critical difference is that Kelsier intentionally martyrs himself for the selfish purposes, so that he will be worshipped as a god.   

[NerdSandwich she/her]

Yes. Kaladin ACTUALLY sacrifices himself

[Returned he/him]

25 minutes ago, Schizoposting said:

The difference between the two is that the similarities I point out are essential to Kaladin and his arc, while your comparisons are based un superficial characteristics (e.g. Kaladin could wear green, and it wouldn't change a thing).

My point was more that there are other features to both which really distinguish them from one another, and a list of only similarities doesn't capture that. I used an exaggerated example to highlight that, and even if the details were integral to the character the three similarities fall pretty far short of "literally just".

25 minutes ago, Schizoposting said:

Obviously, Kaladin isn't identical to Jesus

Hence my response, which seems like a fair answer to the question (and which you agree with, apparently).

23 minutes ago, Ookla the Intelligent said:

Yes. Kaladin ACTUALLY sacrifices himself

Kelsier did too, right? He didn't know that he would have a chance to exist indefinitely as a cognitive shadow. The book seems clear enough that Kelsier's plan to free the skaa and overthrow the Final Empire (backup plan, which is probably a fair consideration too-- he'd hoped to survive the normal way) required the religious trappings he set up (though they also flattered his ego). There isn't an obvious substitute for that if Kelsier dies, which obviously he did, but I don't know how things would have shaken out had Kelsier survived that encounter. I doubt he'd have played up the I'm-a-deity angle since he doesn't seem to have done that, generally, as a cognitive shadow (Sovereign aside, if it was truly him, but it's a pretty relevant event). But how else could you handle the mysticism and legend he set up?

Kaladin also hadn't exactly planned to sacrifice himself, but did when was necessary, but knew that his sacrifice would accomplish what he wanted and that he'd continue to exist afterwards. I definitely would agree that Kaladin's sacrifice was more selfless, I just don't get the argument that Kelsier's sacrifice doesn't count.

Edited December 18, 2025 by Returned

[NerdSandwich she/her]

Yeah no I'm not saying that they are both accurate I'm just saying I personally think Kaladin's is more so.

[Schizoposting]

7 minutes ago, Returned said:

35 minutes ago, Schizoposting said:

The difference between the two is that the similarities I point out are essential to Kaladin and his arc, while your comparisons are based un superficial characteristics (e.g. Kaladin could wear green, and it wouldn't change a thing).

My point was more that there are other features to both which really distinguish them from one another, and a list of only similarities doesn't capture that. I used an exaggerated example to highlight that, and even if the details were integral to the character the three similarities fall pretty far short of "literally just".

33 minutes ago, Schizoposting said:

Obviously, Kaladin isn't identical to Jesus

Hence my response, which seems like a fair answer to the question (and which you agree with, apparently).

Honestly, I don't think that you are engaging with my post(s) in a substantive way. You're just criticizing the specific form in which I presented my argument, instead of criticizing the argument itself. If you have specific issues with my interpretation of the similarities between Kaladin and Jesus, or if you see substantial thematic differences between the two, then I welcome you to share them. But otherwise, I don't really see the point of this discussion.

[First of the Tide He/him]

Is Yumi literally Jesus?

Spoiler

1. She's made of god.
2. She has supernatural powers.
3. She (metaphorically) dies and is reborn multiple times, over and over again, every day
4. She dedicates her life to the spiritually pure purposes ofproviding help to the weak and needy.
5. She's an extremely effective miracle worker
6. She has a large and growing cult following among the lower classes.
7. She is seen as a threat by the powers that be (The Machine)
8. She's tempted by the devil (The machine).
9. At the end of YatNP, she rises up to heaven, and then is called back down(analogous to jesus's resurrection).
10. Finally, in future books, she will beat the bad guy.
Am I missing something, or is Yumi basically just Jesus?

Are spores Jesus?

Spoiler

1. Made of the most powerful thing(investiture).
2. Give supernatural powers.
3. Dies(is used up), and is reborn (falls from aethers) lots of times
4. Dedicates his life to doing what a higher power demands of it.
5. Anyone who comes into contact with them for a long time becomes utterly dedicated
6. might literally be able to turn water into wine
7. Is seen as a threat by the powers that be
8. He's tempted by the devil (The sorceress), and the antichrist (Xisis), but ultimately stays true to the "good one"(Tress).
9. descends from the heavens(moons).
10. Finally, in later books, it will descend from the heavens to free somebody from somebody's tyranny in the final battle.
Am I missing something, or is Kaladin basically just Jesus?

I have some more for vivenna, Jasnah, and 3/4 for moash. also have some for non-cosmere fantasy characters.

Literally any fantasy character fits at least a good portion of these, as well as other christ-like qualities. You're not really making very significant connections imo, just pointing out a quirk of the genre as a whole?

Edited December 18, 2025 by First of the Tide

[Schizoposting]

29 minutes ago, First of the Tide said:

Is Yumi literally Jesus?

  Reveal hidden contents

1. She's made of god.
2. She has supernatural powers.
3. She (metaphorically) dies and is reborn multiple times, over and over again, every day
4. She dedicates her life to the spiritually pure purposes ofproviding help to the weak and needy.
5. She's an extremely effective miracle worker
6. She has a large and growing cult following among the lower classes.
7. She is seen as a threat by the powers that be (The Machine)
8. She's tempted by the devil (The machine).
9. At the end of YatNP, she rises up to heaven, and then is called back down(analogous to jesus's resurrection).
10. Finally, in future books, she will beat the bad guy.
Am I missing something, or is Yumi basically just Jesus?

Are spores Jesus?

  Reveal hidden contents

1. Made of the most powerful thing(investiture).
2. Give supernatural powers.
3. Dies(is used up), and is reborn (falls from aethers) lots of times
4. Dedicates his life to doing what a higher power demands of it.
5. Anyone who comes into contact with them for a long time becomes utterly dedicated
6. might literally be able to turn water into wine
7. Is seen as a threat by the powers that be
8. He's tempted by the devil (The sorceress), and the antichrist (Xisis), but ultimately stays true to the "good one"(Tress).
9. descends from the heavens(moons).
10. Finally, in later books, it will descend from the heavens to free somebody from somebody's tyranny in the final battle.
Am I missing something, or is Kaladin basically just Jesus?

I have some more for vivenna, Jasnah, and 3/4 for moash. also have some for non-cosmere fantasy characters.

Literally any fantasy character fits at least a good portion of these, as well as other christ-like qualities. You're not really making very significant connections imo, just pointing out a quirk of the genre as a whole?

I'm sorry, but this does not come off as a post in good faith. You are just insinuating that I am cherry picking, without actually showing it. Again, if you have substantive criticisms of my argument, feel free to make them. But here, you're just saying "look, I can make bad faith arguments, so therefore you are wrong!"

[Treamayne]

54 minutes ago, Schizoposting said:

I'm sorry, but this does not come off as a post in good faith. You are just insinuating that I am cherry picking, without actually showing it. Again, if you have substantive criticisms of my argument, feel free to make them. But here, you're just saying "look, I can make bad faith arguments, so therefore you are wrong!"

Can you please explain what good faith looks like in your mind? Your initial post is simply a list of characteristics and the question of "is Kaladin a Jesus Allegory?" (paraphrased). Multiple people have responded to show that if there is an allegory it is not intentional on Brandon's part - and  - that a similar list of characteristics can be made for many characters both in and non-Cosmere because Fantasy Tropes tend toward the same charactistics you are listing. 

I'm confused on what, to you, consititutes a good-faith or bad-faith post. Or even if this thread is meant to be [Support] or [Discuss]; because the thread title is not tagged for what type of thread you intended. If you would like to edit the thread title, just edit the first post to make that available. for more information, please consider checking out the Sharder FAQ for more info and some useful forum info and tips. 

Thank you for your time and consideration. 

[Schizoposting]

23 minutes ago, Treamayne said:

Can you please explain what good faith looks like in your mind? Your initial post is simply a list of characteristics and the question of "is Kaladin a Jesus Allegory?" (paraphrased). Multiple people have responded to show that if there is an allegory it is not intentional on Brandon's part - and  - that a similar list of characteristics can be made for many characters both in and non-Cosmere because Fantasy Tropes tend toward the same charactistics you are listing. 

I'm confused on what, to you, consititutes a good-faith or bad-faith post. Or even if this thread is meant to be [Support] or [Discuss]; because the thread title is not tagged for what type of thread you intended. If you would like to edit the thread title, just edit the first post to make that available. for more information, please consider checking out the Sharder FAQ for more info and some useful forum info and tips. 

Thank you for your time and consideration. 

If you look at @First of the Tide's post, as an example, they just dismissed my post in a very aggressive and sarcastic manner, without adding anything to the discussion. I made this post with the intent of fostering a discussion of, to what extent Kaladin is a Jesus figure, and what does this mean in relation to the rest of the SA. I am perfectly willing to accept criticism (even aggressive criticism), but I'd rather it be something more substantive than "ur wrong lol".

[Treamayne]

25 minutes ago, Schizoposting said:

If you look at @First of the Tide's post, as an example, they just dismissed my post in a very aggressive and sarcastic manner, without adding anything to the discussion. I made this post with the intent of fostering a discussion of, to what extent Kaladin is a Jesus figure, and what does this mean in relation to the rest of the SA. I am perfectly willing to accept criticism (even aggressive criticism), but I'd rather it be something more substantive than "ur wrong lol".

So, you may want to edit the Title with a [Support] tag (as linked above) to make it more clear that the point is to support to what extent the OP is accurate and/or discuss examples. I will say that from the outside, your first post does not imply what you have just mentioned - so many Sharders may think it is meant for a [Discuss] thread (which is about refuting and debating the topic - again, please see the linked Admin post).

And, if nobody else has yet said it: 
   Welcome to the Shard. Please consider an Intro Post to let us know what you have or have-not read (whichever list is shorter). 

Hope that helps.

Edited December 18, 2025 by Treamayne
SPAG

[Schizoposting]

15 minutes ago, Treamayne said:

So, you may want to edit the Title with a [Support] tag (as linked above) to make it more clear that the point is to support to what extent the OP is accurate and/or discuss examples. I will say that from the outside, your first post does not imply what you have just mentioned - so many Sharders may think it is meant for a [Discuss] thread (which is about refuting and debating the topic - again, please see the linked Admin post).

And, if nobody else has yet said it: 
   Welcome to the Shard. Please consider an Intro Post to let us know what you have or have-not read (whichever list is shorter). 

Hope that helps.

I am willing to debate, it's just that I want people to engage with my post, instead of just dismissing outright.

[First of the Tide He/him]

18 minutes ago, Schizoposting said:

If you look at @First of the Tide's post, as an example, they just dismissed my post in a very aggressive and sarcastic manner, without adding anything to the discussion. I made this post with the intent of fostering a discussion of, to what extent Kaladin is a Jesus figure, and what does this mean in relation to the rest of the SA. I am perfectly willing to accept criticism (even aggressive criticism), but I'd rather it be something more substantive than "ur wrong lol".

You're right. my post was not worded well, and was moderately adversarial. I should have arranged and worded my post in a nicer way, and one that more directly adresses the prompt, such as: 

Quote

Yes, I do think you are missing something. A common hero trope across fantasy is modeled very similarly to that of the story of Jesus, and as a result, many or most fantasy characters can be put into a system that looks a lot like this. some examples are {examples}  I would argue that your post does not show enough correlation beyond that of normal fantasy to be more than a coincidence(how do you spell that argh). If you have further examples, though, this could be an argument with some meat on it.

But, you have to keep in mind a few things. Firstly, this is text-only communication. That means that a lot of things will accidently take on negative connotations that are not intended. The second thing is a result of the worlds we're all fans of. Since the magics and world building are so solid, we, as a community tend to want hard evidence or a lot of evidence. With so much info out about Kal, and so many fans of him, a lot of theories are going to be shut down quick, since everybody is so familiar with the topic. As a result, to work in this community, you need to respond to critique one of two ways.(we're all guilty of not doing this, but to foster a good community it's good to try) Either provide more evidence to support your claim, or actively disprove others' critiques.

While bringing up that my and returned's critique were made in bad faith is valid, in such an evidence-based community, it's important to respond to the arguments made, as simply claiming that someone should not have made the argument in the way they did does not invalidate their point. 

Lastly, (I'll admit I'm quite guilty of this) as a result of the way the community functions, and it's identity as a forum, it's important to try your best to avoid sounding as though you are personally attacking someone, and admit when you're wrong.

I promise, nobody's trying to attack you, just communicate with you.

[Schizoposting]

26 minutes ago, First of the Tide said:

You're right. my post was not worded well, and was moderately adversarial. I should have arranged and worded my post in a nicer way, and one that more directly adresses the prompt, such as: 

But, you have to keep in mind a few things. Firstly, this is text-only communication. That means that a lot of things will accidently take on negative connotations that are not intended. The second thing is a result of the worlds we're all fans of. Since the magics and world building are so solid, we, as a community tend to want hard evidence or a lot of evidence. With so much info out about Kal, and so many fans of him, a lot of theories are going to be shut down quick, since everybody is so familiar with the topic. As a result, to work in this community, you need to respond to critique one of two ways.(we're all guilty of not doing this, but to foster a good community it's good to try) Either provide more evidence to support your claim, or actively disprove others' critiques.

While bringing up that my and returned's critique were made in bad faith is valid, in such an evidence-based community, it's important to respond to the arguments made, as simply claiming that someone should not have made the argument in the way they did does not invalidate their point. 

Lastly, (I'll admit I'm quite guilty of this) as a result of the way the community functions, and it's identity as a forum, it's important to try your best to avoid sounding as though you are personally attacking someone, and admit when you're wrong.

I promise, nobody's trying to attack you, just communicate with you.

It's alright man; I wasn't offended.

[Returned he/him]

On 12/18/2025 at 1:37 PM, Schizoposting said:

Honestly, I don't think that you are engaging with my post(s) in a substantive way. You're just criticizing the specific form in which I presented my argument, instead of criticizing the argument itself. If you have specific issues with my interpretation of the similarities between Kaladin and Jesus, or if you see substantial thematic differences between the two, then I welcome you to share them. But otherwise, I don't really see the point of this discussion.

What engagement are you hoping for, and what arguments are you referring to? Absolutely Kaladin is Jesus-like, in his savior-trope arc. I don't think that's an unusual perspective, and it's not one that I would argue against. On reading the OP I was legitimately uncertain about what sort of discussion you wanted here-- how many degrees of similarity there are between the two? Discussion of how well the items on your list match each character, or which ones people find less sound? More similarities between the two? I did try to answer directly and clearly: no, they aren't really the same though they do share many similarities, roles, and archetypes. I think that the differences between them tell more about them than the similarities and that they are more different than similar despite the list, and said so. If that's not what you were looking for then I suppose that's on me for misunderstanding your post, but I do think that my interpretation of the OP is a fair and reasonable one even if not accurate.

If you're interested in specific critiques of the list I think that items 1, 2, 3, 8, 9, and 10 are not very sound, though some are definitely debatable. If you are interested in characteristics that differ between the two I think that their contexts, challenges, and goals are radically different, enough that similarities in things they did and how they did them are more coincidental or convergent than strong similarities between two people. Kaladin's embrace of violence is also a pretty important differentiator between them, though his renunciation of violence does eventually align them better. I'll hold off on any more detail in case this, too, is off-target or simply not something you are interested in.

20 hours ago, First of the Tide said:

While bringing up that my and returned's critique were made in bad faith is valid

I'll agree that alleging bad faith is a valid claim when someone thinks it's true, but I do not agree that my post was made in bad faith.

Edited December 19, 2025 by Returned

[First of the Tide He/him]

6 minutes ago, Returned said:

I'll agree that alleging bad faith is a valid claim when someone thinks it's true, but I do not agree that my post was made in bad faith.

Yeah, I didn't think so either, but didn't want to talk for you without knowing for sure.

Btw, I wasn't trying to avoid bad feelings cuz I thought I offended OP, I was about to go off on a rant about how they can't accept criticism gracefully, but chose peace instead and tried to help him avoid similar situations in the future, and they just brushed me off, which kinda PMOed, but whatever. *sigh*

Edited December 19, 2025 by First of the Tide