Disfunctional shard combination

[king of nowhere]

Honor and odium fit well together, while ruin and preservation don't - though they can be harmony, if well handled. 

I just had a train of thought where I wondered what kind of shard would come from the union of honor and wihmsy? the shard of "uphold oaths, except when you don't feel like it"?

What are other higly disfunctional shard combinations?
 

- odium + devotion: the shard of being really confused about one's feelings

- retribution + mercy: I will find all those who ever wronged me... and forgive them!

- ruin + cultivation: i don't even know how this one could work

- endowment and dominion: I want to give stuff and empower others, but i also want to subjugate them... on second thought, could be the shard of loan sharks

- autonomy and devotion: the shard of open relationships?

 

[Treamayne]

41 minutes ago, king of nowhere said:

Honor and odium fit well together, while ruin and preservation don't - though they can be harmony, if well handled.

Keep in mind that part of the difference is that Taravangian purposely tried merging the two shards into one new Intent (Retribution) - although he does not seem to have been completely successful. However, Sazed purposely did not combine Preservation and Ruin. He uses the name Harmony as how he manages two separate powers, not one combined power (so far). HoA Ch 82:

Spoiler

The Hero will have the power to save the world. But he will also have the power to destroy it

We never understood. He wouldn’t simply bear the power of Preservation. He needed the power of Ruin as well.

The powers were opposites. As he drew them in, they threatened to annihilate each other. And yet, because he was of one mind on how to use them, he could keep them separate. They could touch without destroying each other, if he willed it. For these two powers had been used to create all things. If they fought, they destroyed. If they were used together, they created.

The powers have mingled now, but they were never actually merged into one single Intent (so far). WoB:

Spoiler

Thanatos17901

If Sazed were to die, would he drop the Shards Ruin and Preservation, or would he drop the Shard Harmony?

Brandon Sanderson

Excellent question. The shards are now intermingled, and would take effort to split apart. He would drop Harmony. (This is what Odium feared would happen, by the way.)

/r/fantasy AMA 2013 (April 23, 2013)

 

47 minutes ago, king of nowhere said:

ruin + cultivation: i don't even know how this one could work

This would be one of the more stable Combinations. WoB:

Spoiler

Edited for length and relevance

Brandon Sanderson

Technically, Ruin would be most compatible with Cultivation. Ruin's 'theme' so to speak is that all things must age and pass. An embodiment of entropy. That power, separated from the whole and being held by a person who did not have the willpower to resist its transformation of him, led to something very dangerous. But it was not evil. None of the sixteen technically are, though you may have read that Hoid has specific beef with Rayse. Whether you think of Odium as evil depends upon how much you agree with Hoid's particular view.

That said, Ruin would have been one of the 'safer' of the sixteen for Rayse to take, if he'd been about that. Odium is by its nature selfish, however, and the combination of it and Rayse makes for an entity that fears an additional power would destroy it and make it into something else.

General Reddit 2013 (March 14, 2013)

Hope that helps

[JustQuestin2004 he/him]

1 hour ago, king of nowhere said:

- odium + devotion: the shard of being really confused about one's feelings

The Tsundere Shard. 

-Autonomy and Dominion feel like clear opposites, or with how Dominating Bavadin is, maybe they'd go really well together?

-Reason and Whimsy don't seem like they'd mesh well together. Though that would probably go for a lot of Whimsy combinations. 

-Honor and Mercy might be opposing as well? We've seen how Honor itself thinks, and its the kind of Honor that does not apologize or think itself in the wrong. If its disrespected it can and will result in murder out of 'honor'. Mercy seems pretty antithetical to that kind of honor. 

[CoderDrag0n8 He/They]

3 hours ago, king of nowhere said:

- ruin + cultivation: i don't even know how this one could work

This has been theorized to be Change or Corruption, the extremes cancelling themselves out, and just becoming the exact opposite of Preservation.

[Nitpicking]

Devotion + Odium would be "Fanatical Hatred", wouldn't it?

[Argenti he/him]

35 minutes ago, Nitpicking said:

Devotion + Odium would be "Fanatical Hatred", wouldn't it?

Well- kinda. Devotion has been described as "love" by Brandon. So I think it has more of the soft emotions, like love, loyalty, or enthusiasm for something. 
Odium already kinda is fanatical hatred.

[Sophrosyne he/him]

One of my favorite topics! 

I think that finding the most dysfunctional dual shards is less to do with finding opposites and more to do with shards that don’t interact at all. Mercy & Virtuosity come to mind. Mercy The force of release and endings? And Virtuosity self-expression and creativity? They’re not opposites, they have very little interaction outside of the suffering artist which Mercy wants to help in some way and Virtuosity wants to create.  And maybe artistic catharsis. Outside of that how do they blend?

[a Faceless Immortal he/him]

On 8/20/2025 at 8:14 AM, king of nowhere said:

endowment and dominion

Gives me strong Colonialism/Imperialism vibes - "we bring enlightenment and knowledge, in return you give us servitude and your natural resources" - or maybe really any form of 'benevolent' authoritarianism.

On 8/20/2025 at 9:51 AM, JustQuestin2004 said:

Reason and Whimsy

And surely this is just the shard of creative writing, or maybe just the arts in general? Possibly even the shard of cool math teachers

[Nitpicking]

3 hours ago, a Faceless Immortal said:

Gives me strong Colonialism/Imperialism vibes - "we bring enlightenment and knowledge, in return you give us servitude and your natural resources" - or maybe really any form of 'benevolent' authoritarianism.

And surely this is just the shard of creative writing, or maybe just the arts in general? Possibly even the shard of cool math teachers

Ruin and Endowment would be almost as difficult to hold as Ruin and Preservation.

[JustQuestin2004 he/him]

On 8/22/2025 at 12:21 PM, Nitpicking said:

Ruin and Endowment would be almost as difficult to hold as Ruin and Preservation.

I dunno, Endowment is confirmed by WOB as capable of Smiting people, so maybe it could work if you 'Endow' people to death.

Maybe the Endowment/Ruin's modus operandi is to fill a world with so much Investiture that it explodes? So, there'd be a brief time where everyone on that world is a super powerful god, and then the world ends? 

[Nitpicking]

I would argue that Cultivation/Preservation would be very like Ruin/Preservation, because Cultivation implies change.

[NoToTheAm]

On 8/20/2025 at 7:13 AM, Nitpicking said:

Devotion + Odium would be "Fanatical Hatred", wouldn't it?

Or (hear me out), Passion, but for real?

[Ink and Embers Any pronouns]

Preservation and Whimsy - everything is the same, except when you feel like it.

Virtuosity and Odium - "I HATE EVERYONE but I'm a good person, promise!"

[JustQuestin2004 he/him]

1 hour ago, Ink and Embers said:

Virtuosity and Odium - "I HATE EVERYONE but I'm a good person, promise!"

Virtuosity is about art, virtuoso's, not about virtues.

What you really get is the Cosmere's biggest art critic.

[Ink and Embers Any pronouns]

2 hours ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

Virtuosity is about art, virtuoso's, not about virtues.

What you really get is the Cosmere's biggest art critic.

Ah, sorry!

So basically Shai should get those Shards?

[Nitpicking]

29 minutes ago, Ink and Embers said:

Ah, sorry!

So basically Shai should get those Shards?

Shai is (as I recall) only critical of art that she feels lacks virtuosity (that is, that is lazy and not original). So, maybe?

[redundant]

Reason + Whimsy would work decently imo. It basically just gives the Doctor from Doctor Who.

[Qianweilian He/him]

On 8/24/2025 at 8:03 AM, Nitpicking said:

I would argue that Cultivation/Preservation would be very like Ruin/Preservation, because Cultivation implies change.

Ruin implies change as well. This would be the shard of volcanic eruption leaving fertile soils, chopping down the forest to create a settlement, bringing down systems and creating new ones. They would be very compatible.

[Nitpicking]

3 hours ago, Qianweilian said:

Ruin implies change as well. This would be the shard of volcanic eruption leaving fertile soils, chopping down the forest to create a settlement, bringing down systems and creating new ones. They would be very compatible.

That was my point, that Cultivation/Preservation would be a lot like Ruin/Preservation.

[Through The Living Ash he/him]

I feel that Whimsy and Honor wouldn't work very well. 

[Trusk'our he/him]

I think Autonomy and Honor would struggle to work cohesively. 

Sure, Bavadin is a control freak and hasn't lost hold of it yet, but the Shard itself supports others fighting against its own Vessel from what I can gather. Honor itself is highly offended when someone turns away from its rules.

Spoiler

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/50-calamity-denver-signing/#e776

Nashan'Elin (paraphrased)

Could Honor and Autonomy be considered opposites, like, Autonomy freeing from Honor's oaths?

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

Yes, you could definitely think of it that way. Those two are more likely to be opposed than some others.

Heck, Odium can be weilded more in line with Autonomy's freedom of agency than Honor, at least from what I gather.

Spoiler

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/498-youtube-spoiler-stream-4/#e15736

Striker_EZ

Why didn't Odium take the Investiture away from the Fused that rebelled against him at the end of Rhythm of War? At the end of Oathbringer, Odium tells one Fused that questioned him that he could take "that which gave [the Fused] life." So why didn't he do that to Leshwi and the others?

Brandon Sanderson

This is actually an excellent question. Odium, in his previous incarnation-- we'll see how he acts now-- part of the driving force of Odium is this kind of belief, mistaken or otherwise, that Odium represents all emotion, and strength of emotion, and basically the Passions in lore. Rebelling against him in the way that they did is actually in line with Odium's personal directives. The Vessel may not like it, in fact the power may not like it, but at the same time, there's a part of both of them that acknowledges, this is what they set in motion, and this is an appropriate use of the agency of the agents they chose. And so, unilaterally destroying those who turn against him is actually not an Odium thing. It's more an Honor thing than it would be an Odium thing. It's just not in line with how Odium acts or thinks, even though it's possible and there's threats and... That's not saying Odium wouldn't do it. But acting like Honor is not something Odium would necessarily want to do.

 

[TacoBellChoutaMeal]

Virtuosity and Autonomy would stack. Call it “Originality” or something. 

[Nitpicking]

Virtuosity and Ruin or Virtuosity and Odium would be terrifying.

[ign__o male, 24]

4 hours ago, Nitpicking said:

Virtuosity and Ruin or Virtuosity and Odium would be terrifying.

Speaking of really scary combinations I always thought Odium and Ruin (“Destruction”?) would be pretty bad news as well; or, given Odium and Honor’s compatibility, Retribution and Ruin?

[Treamayne]

1 hour ago, ign__o said:

Speaking of really scary combinations I always thought Odium and Ruin (“Destruction”?) would be pretty bad news as well; or, given Odium and Honor’s compatibility, Retribution and Ruin?

Scary, yes. Compatible, Partially. WoB:

Spoiler

Autarchk

If I can ask a question, I just read the Mistborn trilogy and, were Preservation and Ruin two different shards or a single one with their power split somehow? If they were two shards, does that mean a single person can hold more than one, since Harmony apparently holds both now?

Brandon Sanderson

They were two shards.

Yes, one entity can hold more than one. Remember that holding a shard changes you, over time. Rayse knows this, and prefers to leave behind destroyed rivals as opposed to taking their power and potentially being overwhelmed by it.

Nepene

I have a question, if you are willing. Would Ruin be more compatible with Rayse, would he pick up that shard had he visited Scadrial and shattered him? All the shards we have seen that he has shattered seem rather different in intent than him- Honor, Cultivation, Love, Dominion. But Ruin seems more in line with Odium. Rayse has ruined the days of quite a few people.

Brandon Sanderson

Technically, Ruin would be most compatible with Cultivation. Ruin's 'theme' so to speak is that all things must age and pass. An embodiment of entropy. That power, separated from the whole and being held by a person who did not have the willpower to resist its transformation of him, led to something very dangerous. But it was not evil. None of the sixteen technically are, though you may have read that Hoid has specific beef with Rayse. Whether you think of Odium as evil depends upon how much you agree with Hoid's particular view.

That said, Ruin would have been one of the 'safer' of the sixteen for Rayse to take, if he'd been about that. Odium is by its nature selfish, however, and the combination of it and Rayse makes for an entity that fears an additional power would destroy it and make it into something else.

General Reddit 2013 (March 14, 2013)

 

Edited September 12, 2025 by Treamayne