Spikes in TLM

[Immortal Platypus]

Alright, so in TLM we see people get spiked who aren't Allomancers. We also see them claim that the spike can be filled with 20-30 people. They also say that they haven't figured out how to key it to a specific ability. Do we know what those are? My current theory is that they are stealing the Connection to Preservation that causes Allomancy. 

[Tamriel Wolfsbaine]

26 minutes ago, Being of Cacophony said:

Alright, so in TLM we see people get spiked who aren't Allomancers. We also see them claim that the spike can be filled with 20-30 people. They also say that they haven't figured out how to key it to a specific ability. Do we know what those are? My current theory is that they are stealing the Connection to Preservation that causes Allomancy. 

I thought it was more of an innate investiture thing. Potentially enough in a full spike to grant a heightening or twos worth of effects?  

 

[Through The Living Grub He/Him]

I don't think they are stealing Connection per se, more like the Investiture itself.

[The flying spider he/him]

The words of founding have a bit about this.

Quote

Hemalurgic spike can also be created by killing a normal person, one who is neither an Allomancer nor a Feruchemist. In that case, the spike instead steals the very power of Preservation existing within the soul of the people. (The power that, in fact, gives all people sentience.)

A Hemalurgic spike can extract this power, then transfer it to another, granting them residual abilities similar to those of Allomancy. After all, Preservation's body—a tiny trace of which is carried by every human being—is the very same essence that fuels allomancy.

After rereading hero of Ages I found the discovery of these new spikes to be a bit less cool.

Edited September 11, 2023 by The flying spider

[alder24]

2 hours ago, Being of Cacophony said:

Alright, so in TLM we see people get spiked who aren't Allomancers. We also see them claim that the spike can be filled with 20-30 people. They also say that they haven't figured out how to key it to a specific ability. Do we know what those are? My current theory is that they are stealing the Connection to Preservation that causes Allomancy. 

Yes, that's what they are doing. Not connection specifically, but raw investiture coming from Preservation's fragment (innate investiture) in them. TLM ch 47:

Spoiler

“Ah, my lord,” the woman said. “This woman isn’t Metalborn. We’ve Invested a spike—a tiny bit, granted—using an ordinary person. All people are Invested by Ruin and Preservation as part of our very makeup—and we have a little extra Preservation, blessed by the Shards upon our creation. We’re pulling some of that out.
“The percentage you get depends on the person. We think it might have to do with how likely they were, genetically, to be Metalborn. But they don’t need that extra if the powers didn’t manifest in them. It’s vestigial. We simply slice it off and use it in a spike. Fully Investing one takes between twenty and thirty people.”
[...]
“Can you make me Allomancers?” he demanded. “Now. Today. To show Autonomy.”
“No,” Labcoat admitted. “We think we need to code this in some way to give a specific Metallic Art blessing. We’re working on that. We’ve had some few gain a power for a short time using one of these spikes, but it gives out soon after.
[...]
“You don’t understand,” Moonlight said. “If they’re even close to forging Metalborn out of the raw power of souls—if they’ve had tests that resulted in an Allomancer, no matter how fleeting … Marasi, that path could lead to creating spikes using pure Investiture instead of souls.” She tapped her rucksack, indicating the glowing jars inside.

That would be a nicrosil spike. This is not a connection, because that connection isn't formed yet (that's what Snapping and Lerasium do)

There are two problems with getting Metalborn powers out of that. First is that it is just raw investiture, that needs to be somehow programmed to a corresponding power (possibly Navani's method of creating anit-light could be applied here to change raw investiture into specific type of investiture corresponding to a specific power which all have distinguishable tones). Second is the identity contamination - this spike contains 20-30 different identities, and if modern spikes with their single identity is enough to prevent compounding from working, the investiture in that spike wouldn't want to combine together and would remain separate because of different identities. You need to blank either the spike, or people who you're spiking.

[Tamriel Wolfsbaine]

1 hour ago, alder24 said:

You need to blank either the spike, or people who you're spiking.

Aluminum medallions if they ever become a thing? 

We already see a culture in the cosmere where people are willing to sacrifice themselves and their spark of life in the form of biochromatic breath for a years worth of living expenses. 

A desperate lower class could lead to something similar in Scadrial for sure. 

[Trusk'our he/him]

37 minutes ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said:

Aluminum medallions if they ever become a thing? 

We already see a culture in the cosmere where people are willing to sacrifice themselves and their spark of life in the form of biochromatic breath for a years worth of living expenses. 

As of yet, we haven't seen any Aluminum Medallions on screen, but if they could be created it almost certainly would allow Hemalurgic donors to Blank their Identity long enough to let the harvested power become Blanked too. A Hemalurgic spike holding that power would likely work too.

37 minutes ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said:

A desperate lower class could lead to something similar in Scadrial for sure. 

Unfortunately, yes, I could see that happening in Scadrial's future, especially if the Southern continent declares war on the North. Then there would be a new level of desperation for any advantage that could be brought to bear, and desperation often causes people to do extreme things. . .

Edited September 11, 2023 by Trusk'our

[Tamriel Wolfsbaine]

42 minutes ago, Trusk'our said:

As of yet, we haven't seen any Aluminum Medallions on screen, but if they could be created it almost certainly would allow Hemalurgic donors to Blank their Identity long enough to let the harvested power become Blanked too. A Hemalurgic spike holding that power would likely work too.

Unfortunately, yes, I could see that happening in Scadrial's future, especially if the Southern continent declares war on the North. Then there would be a new level of desperation for any advantage that could be brought to bear, and desperation often causes people to do extreme things. . .

Spooky to think of some false flag operations by The Set in Elendel government convincing people to line up signing their lives away banking hemalurgic charges into the powerful and the powerful selected military and police force.  

"Uncle Saz wants you to give what you can!  Doesnt require you to go die on the front lines. Just let us skim some of your soul to fuel our super soldiers!" 

[Trusk'our he/him]

20 minutes ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said:

"Uncle Saz wants you to give what you can!  Doesnt require you to go die on the front lines. Just let us skim some of your soul to fuel our super soldiers!" 

Totally going to make a meme out of that 

[JustQuestin2004 he/him]

19 hours ago, alder24 said:

You need to blank either the spike, or people who you're spiking.

 

18 hours ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said:

Aluminum medallions if they ever become a thing? 

Better idea, Harmonium Grenades charged with F-Aluminum. They're already used to store the weight of Airships so it should be possible to force people to have their Identity blanked. No consent needed and that is honestly even more terrifying.

[Trusk'our he/him]

18 minutes ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

Better idea, Harmonium Grenades charged with F-Aluminum. They're already used to store the weight of Airships so it should be possible to force people to have their Identity blanked. No consent needed and that is honestly even more terrifying.

Interesting. That might work.

It makes me wonder if you could create special handcuffs that used that mechanic to force a prisoner to store strengh, speed, or some other attribute to make them easy to overcome and/or transport.

[JustQuestin2004 he/him]

28 minutes ago, Trusk'our said:

Interesting. That might work.

It makes me wonder if you could create special handcuffs that used that mechanic to force a prisoner to store strengh, speed, or some other attribute to make them easy to overcome and/or transport.

That would honestly be pretty OP on it's own. Just have Invested people store their ability to use Investiture, basically kryptonite.

It could be like a collar instead like the BS power-suppressors from DC.

 

[Trusk'our he/him]

8 hours ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

That would honestly be pretty OP on it's own. Just have Invested people store their ability to use Investiture, basically kryptonite.

It could be like a collar instead like the BS power-suppressors from DC.

Yeah, or if Feruchemy via Harmonium doesn't work on sapient beings that way you could still modify a Harmonium device to use Allomantic chromium to Leech their powers anytime they tried to use them.