Are chasmfiends Larkin?

[KaladinWorldsinger]

Is there any possibility that Larkin grow into chasmfiends?

Obviously Larkin have wings, but could they perhaps pupate into chasmfiends with legs?

And then a chasmfiend pupates into the crab dragon that we all are waiting chiri chiri to become.

I know it's unlikely, but I can't leave this idea behind. Chasmfiends pupate and look like giant crab caterpillars , so what would their pupated butterfly version look like? The only thing I can think of is crab dragon because if they are not, why have 2 very similar flying crab creatures? That would reduce the novelty of each.

In my 'theory', why does Larkin pupate twice? Simple. Dragons need to have both strong legs and wings, unlike butterflies.

Please rip this apart to shreds

[SpinningSky he/him]

Well for one thing Larkins are known to be original from Aimia, which is very distant, and have a whole history about them, I think the two species are as similiar as many other creatures on Roshar.
Besides, Larkins' main feature is that they feed on investiture, which isn't a thing with chasmfiends.
On the other side, I don't believe that Larkins have gemhearts, which chasmfiends do.

But I don't consider myself an expert on the topic, I'm curious to see what others think

 

As further food for thought on the topic of connections between rosharian creatues, I think that there might be something regarding the difference between greatshells\creatures with gemhearts and Ryshadium\Larkins creatures which exhibit spren-bond like traits, they mighty be tied to ancient radiants and fused.
I like to think that 5th level radiants got a cool ride (after they got blade and armor), but I've got nothing to support it 

[Quantus he/him]

2 hours ago, SpinningSky said:

Well for one thing Larkins are known to be original from Aimia, which is very distant, and have a whole history about them, I think the two species are as similiar as many other creatures on Roshar.
Besides, Larkins' main feature is that they feed on investiture, which isn't a thing with chasmfiends.
On the other side, I don't believe that Larkins have gemhearts, which chasmfiends do.

But I don't consider myself an expert on the topic, I'm curious to see what others think

 

As further food for thought on the topic of connections between rosharian creatues, I think that there might be something regarding the difference between greatshells\creatures with gemhearts and Ryshadium\Larkins creatures which exhibit spren-bond like traits, they mighty be tied to ancient radiants and fused.
I like to think that 5th level radiants got a cool ride (after they got blade and armor), but I've got nothing to support it 

 

Im pretty sure Larkin have a Gemheart, since they require a Luckspren as part of their lifecycle like so many gemheart crustaceans (we should really get a term for the Gemheart Phylum).  They also resemble both Chulls and Axehounds in appearance.

That being said, my pet Tinfoil on this is that the gemheart ecosystem is the Dragon ecosystem, and Larkin (which Brando refers to as Dragon Bugs) are anything from distant dragon cousins to actual larval dragons themselves.  Which might explain why they were trusted as the "Ancient Guardians" of a Dawnshard.  

 

[KaladinWorldsinger]

4 hours ago, SpinningSky said:

Well for one thing Larkins are known to be original from Aimia, which is very distant, and have a whole history about them

And we don't know where chasmfiends come from.... They pupate on  the shattered plains but no one knows where their place of origin actually is.

 

4 hours ago, SpinningSky said:

I like to think that 5th level radiants got a cool ride (after they got blade and armor), but I've got nothing to support it 

That is one of my favourite headcanons too, i really want 5th ideal to give radiants a horse, but also seems unlikely.

1 hour ago, Quantus said:

That being said, my pet Tinfoil on this is that the gemheart ecosystem is the Dragon ecosystem, and Larkin (which Brando refers to as Dragon Bugs) are anything from distant dragon cousins to actual larval dragons themselves.  Which might explain why they were trusted as the "Ancient Guardians" of a Dawnshard.  

I don't understand what the tinfoil is here. Isn't this widely believed? (I do anyway)

[Quantus he/him]

44 minutes ago, KaladinWorldsinger said:

 

I don't understand what the tinfoil is here. Isn't this widely believed? (I do anyway)

Ive been sprinkling it in conversations for a long while and Im probably not the only one, but as far as I know there's no actual evidence of any Larkin/Dragon connection (other than the Dragon Bug name), or any evidence that Dragons have any connection to the Gemheart ecosystem (which could well be a Roshar only thing, and is a pre-shattering thing).  

[SpinningSky he/him]

2 hours ago, Quantus said:

Im pretty sure Larkin have a Gemheart, since they require a Luckspren as part of their lifecycle like so many gemheart crustaceans (we should really get a term for the Gemheart Phylum). 

that's a good point! it makes sense to assume that native Rosharians needa gemheart to bond spren

 

1 hour ago, KaladinWorldsinger said:

 

I don't understand what the tinfoil is here. Isn't this widely believed? (I do anyway)

Well actually this is not something I've ever thought of. But I'm confused, is there some canonic concept of Dragon in SA? like, I just think "important and big creatures on Roshar have a gemheart, and that's what allows them to be big and important"

edit:

of course I mean Dragon outside or Hoid's stories 

Edited October 19, 2022 by SpinningSky
added detail on dragon

[ChesterBlack]

Do skyeels have a gemheart? So far the only creatures we've seen confirmed with gemhearts are crustacean-like, which skyeels most definitely are not, but I seem to remember them having to bond some kind of spren to assist with their flight. If they don't have a gemheart, does this mean that they're non-native and came over with humans like hogs, minks and horses and so bond with spren in a similar manner to Ryshadium? I can't imagine them existing without the ability to fly though as I wouldn't have thought the handful of millennia since the human incursion would be long enough for them to evolve from water-breathing to air-breathing.

[Frustration he/him]

Chiri-Chiri is the only Larkin since the scouring of Aimia to grow large enough to return there. Chasmfiends cannot be Lanceryn as a result.

[Brgst13]

7 hours ago, Quantus said:

 

Im pretty sure Larkin have a Gemheart, since they require a Luckspren as part of their lifecycle like so many gemheart crustaceans (we should really get a term for the Gemheart Phylum).  They also resemble both Chulls and Axehounds in appearance.

 

I propose Phylum Coronuscia. I think it is more likely a class of the Phylum Chordata than its own Phylum.  The distinctive feature of Chordata is a spinal column or notochord.  Many of these creatures seem to have some level of intelligence and central control of their bodies, which suggests a spinal cord-type structure.  Also, the Parshendi are members of this class as well and they definitely have a nervous system similar to humans.  Placing it at the Class level puts Coronuscia on par with Mammalia, Amphibia, Insectivora, etc.

[Letryx13]

5 hours ago, KaladinWorldsinger said:

That is one of my favourite headcanons too, i really want 5th ideal to give radiants a horse, but also seems unlikely.

I think there's a reference to Radiants having Ryshadium during the desolations in WoR.  It doesn't feel right for all the orders, since two orders (arguably four) have a means of transportation superior to that of Ryshadium. But I do like the idea of them gaining them at the fifth ideal.

4 hours ago, Quantus said:

Ive been sprinkling it in conversations for a long while and Im probably not the only one, but as far as I know there's no actual evidence of any Larkin/Dragon connection (other than the Dragon Bug name), or any evidence that Dragons have any connection to the Gemheart ecosystem (which could well be a Roshar only thing, and is a pre-shattering thing).  

Wit commented that there's only one dragon on Roshar that he knows of, but I think that's supposed to be a dig at Cultivation.

[SpinningSky he/him]

On 19/10/2022 at 9:58 PM, Letryx13 said:

I think there's a reference to Radiants having Ryshadium during the desolations in WoR.  It doesn't feel right for all the orders, since two orders (arguably four) have a means of transportation superior to that of Ryshadium. But I do like the idea of them gaining them at the fifth ideal.

My head canon would be most major creatures are born as companions to their respective order, so a dustbringer might get like, a chasmfiend, skybreaker a larkin, but again no evidence for it I just wish that was the case

 

It should be canon that horses came with the pesky voidbringers from Raise, so it's more likely that simply horses of important radiants became squires of sorts

[Letryx13]

2 hours ago, SpinningSky said:

My head canon would be most major creatures are born as companions to their respective order, so a dustbringer might get like, a chasmfiend, skybreaker a larkin, but again no evidence for it I just wish that was the case

 

It should be canon that horses came with the pesky voidbringers from Raise, so it's more likely that simply horses of important radiants became squires of sorts

Actually, having some sort of animal companion that varies among the orders might work. And it would suggest that some intelligent breeds of animals are the "reward" of achieving the fifth ideal. Larkin are intelligent, along with Ryshadium and apparently Chasmfiends.  If we can find 7 other intelligent animals on Roshar, it could work.

But I think Renarin points out that Ryshadium are better suited to Roshar, so I think they are the ones native to Roshar, while regular horses are descended from Ashyn horses. Shinovar breeds horses that seem more normal, which supports that.

[SpinningSky he/him]

15 minutes ago, Letryx13 said:

Actually, having some sort of animal companion that varies among the orders might work. And it would suggest that some intelligent breeds of animals are the "reward" of achieving the fifth ideal. Larkin are intelligent, along with Ryshadium and apparently Chasmfiends.  If we can find 7 other intelligent animals on Roshar, it could work.

I guess you would wanna start with known greatshells

Tai-na, the Reshi islands greatshells, I think have a nice connection with Edgedancers. Lift aside, they slide around and literally give life entire villages.

I do not know how to place the Marabethia deep see greatshells