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Wait, Thaidakar is... ?


cometaryorbit

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Hoid call him the Lord of Scars, he has been punched by Hoid and there's currently important trouble on his planet. Only Kel fit the two first description.

The Avatar thing is because he doesn't know how to get offworld (for the same reason Kelek cannot) and appears as an avatar because that's the only way he can speak to people on other stellar systems.

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41 minutes ago, AquaRegia said:

It might be more accurate to say that RoW provided more - and stronger - clues, and that Brandon himself then CONFIRMED it.

I mean, it was as confirmed as it could be without a literal namedrop, I feel. A non-Rosharan Cognitive Shadow known for scars with a loose morality who has been beaten up by Hoid is pretty specific. 

2 hours ago, cometaryorbit said:

There was a discussion of Thaidakar appearing as an 'avatar' which I thought meant it had to be a Shard...

As for this...

Quote
FeatherWriter

I have to ask about using the word "avatar" for Thaidakar sending avatars... does Kelsier actually have anything resembling a real avatar or is he just using the word and lying through his teeth?

Brandon Sanderson

Oh yeah, he's mostly lying through his teeth. Basically — this is not canon, because I might come up with a better [idea] - but in my head, I have him with a large cloak with a seon on top indicating his face [hosts laugh] It was something along those lines. He wants them to think that he is capable of getting to Roshar in a meaningful, physical way.

Spoiler! he can't get off Scadrial, and it's really annoying to him. At least by this point in the continuity, in fact a little past it, because the Wax & Wayne books...

*multiple people*

[Tangent where he forgets where in the timeline Wax & Wayne actually falls, and Chaos corrects him. Answer ends up being that it takes place after Stormlight 5, as he has usually said.]

Brandon Sanderson

As of the Alloy era, he is still unable to get off of Scadrial.

Chaos

Guess we'll learn about that in Era 3, if it's all Kelsier stuff.

Brandon Sanderson

Era 3 will definitely involve some Kelsier stuff. Let's just say he's perturbed.

Shardcast Interview (Jan. 23, 2021)

 

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9 hours ago, cometaryorbit said:

The Coppermind says that RoW revealed that Thaidakar was Kelsier. Where is that???

 

There was a discussion of Thaidakar appearing as an 'avatar' which I thought meant it had to be a Shard...

Within SA we knew:

Thaidakar is a title.

Thaidakar is an offworlder.

Master Thaidakar follows a Scadrian honorific-epithet naming convention

Hoid calls Thaidakar ‘Lord of Scars.’

Hoid has ‘slapped around’ Thaidakar.

Thaidakar is a Cognitive Shadow.

The chapters leading to the first meeting between Shallan and Mraize in WoR were: Scars, Mere Vapors, and Ghostbloods. Scadrial is the Expanse of Vapors.

The Ghostbloods resembled the Mistborn crew in some respects.

Some Ghostbloods have an almost religious like reverence toward Thaidakar. 

We also knew:

Kelsier would lead the GBs in a heartbeat.

Ghostblood referenced specific in-world events.

We had seen the proto-Ghostbloods.

Then Brandon told us:

He expected many of us to know Thaidakar’s real name.

Thaidakar had been seen going to great lengths in other books.

And then Brandon went on the Shardcast and confirmed:

Thaidakar is Kelsier and this was always the plan.

The GBs are supposed to dovetail with Survivorism.

And Kell is lying through his teeth about the Avatar thing.

So yes, we know.

Edited by Kingsdaughter613
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7 hours ago, mathiau said:

 he has been punched by Hoid

Aha, this was the critical bit I missed! Thanks!

The only time I'd seen 'avatar' used in the Cosmere before was for Autonomy, so I immediately started thinking Shards, so it didn't occur to me that 'Lord of Scars' would be Kelsier.

I hadn't seen any of those recent WoB's either...

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On 2/11/2021 at 1:24 PM, cometaryorbit said:

The Coppermind says that RoW revealed that Thaidakar was Kelsier. Where is that???

 

There was a discussion of Thaidakar appearing as an 'avatar' which I thought meant it had to be a Shard...

Avatar could mean in the classical sense, meaning a representation of something.

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5 hours ago, basement_boi said:

Avatar could mean in the classical sense, meaning a representation of something.

Right now the avatar is supposed to be that

Quote

FeatherWriter

I have to ask about using the word "avatar" for Thaidakar sending avatars... does Kelsier actually have anything resembling a real avatar or is he just using the word and lying through his teeth?

Brandon Sanderson

Oh yeah, he's mostly lying through his teeth. Basically — this is not canon, because I might come up with a better [idea] - but in my head, I have him with a large cloak with a Seon on top indicating his face [hosts laugh] It was something along those lines. He wants them to think that he is capable of getting to Roshar in a meaningful, physical way.

Spoiler! he can't get off Scadrial, and it's really annoying to him. At least by this point in the continuity, in fact a little past it, because the Wax & Wayne books...

*multiple people*

[Tangent where he forgets where in the timeline Wax & Wayne actually falls, and Chaos corrects him. Answer ends up being that it takes place after Stormlight 5, as he has usually said.]

Brandon Sanderson

As of the Alloy era, he is still unable to get off of Scadrial.

Chaos

Guess we'll learn about that in Era 3, if it's all Kelsier stuff.

Brandon Sanderson

Era 3 will definitely involve some Kelsier stuff. Let's just say he's perturbed.

Shardcast Interview (Jan. 23, 2021)
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I'm just starting up here and cba to try searching through older threads, but did anyone else catch that the very name "Ghostbloods" can be linked to Scadrial?

What's a synonym for "ghost"?  "Wraith."  What is 'blood' used to refer to?  Familial connection.  Do we happen to know of any creatures in the Cosmere which could be called 'relatives' of wraiths?  Perhaps creatures which were created with the express purpose of being spies?

I'm sure I'm not the only person to pick up on this, but it made me giggle when it clicked.

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3 hours ago, CruelSadist said:

I'm just starting up here and cba to try searching through older threads, but did anyone else catch that the very name "Ghostbloods" can be linked to Scadrial?

What's a synonym for "ghost"?  "Wraith."  What is 'blood' used to refer to?  Familial connection.  Do we happen to know of any creatures in the Cosmere which could be called 'relatives' of wraiths?  Perhaps creatures which were created with the express purpose of being spies?

I'm sure I'm not the only person to pick up on this, but it made me giggle when it clicked.

also: Cognitive Shadow + Hemalurgy.

Ghost Blood.

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9 hours ago, CruelSadist said:

... the very name "Ghostbloods" can be linked to Scadrial?

What's a synonym for "ghost"?  "Wraith."  What is 'blood' used to refer to?  Familial connection.  Do we happen to know of any creatures in the Cosmere which could be called 'relatives' of wraiths?  Perhaps creatures which were created with the express purpose of being spies?

6 hours ago, Halyo_Alex said:

also: Cognitive Shadow + Hemalurgy.

Ghost Blood.

Mind = BLOWN.  AGAIN.

How many times can Brandon do this to me?  Hopefully many more LOL

 

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24 minutes ago, AquaRegia said:

Mind = BLOWN.  AGAIN.

How many times can Brandon do this to me?  Hopefully many more LOL

 

There’s also Spook, which is yet another name for Ghost. I wouldn’t be surprised if the ‘Ghost’ is a reference to both Kelsier and Spook.

Blood is probably in reference to Hemalurgy, which was something they studied together. It also seems to be reference to how Kelsier was resurrected.

It could also be a reference to Spook’s children, of which he had many. It could also be used metaphorically: the people of Scadrial as Kelsier’s metaphorical children. Or the North as Spook’s ‘children’ and the South as Kelsier’s.

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2 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

Also given that Alloy of Law shows Marsh seemingly being ok with whatever Kelsier is doing 

Not exactly.
 

Questioner

At the end of “Alloy of Law” Marsh tells Marasi he is giving the diary to Wax because “.. he does my brother's work”. At this time it was a reminder of Kelsier, but with Secret History and the third book out why does Marsh think we need someone to do his brother's work? Isn't Kelsier doing that himself?

Brandon Sanderson

Well. (laughs) Marsh is of multiple minds on what's happening with Kelsier at this time. When he's referencing his brother's work, he's specifically tells Marasi speaking to the lore of the Survivor. Like he's specifically talking to somebody, and he does believe this. He may not think that Kelsier is doing Kelsier's work anymore. But that depends on... You will see interaction between Marsh and Kelsier in the future.

Leipzig Book Fair (March 24, 2017)

 

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5 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

Also given that Alloy of Law shows Marsh seemingly being ok with whatever Kelsier is doing and the fact that Vin describes Marsh and Kelsier looking very similar. There might be the possibility that Marsh is Kelsier's "avatar"

Brandon's current headcannon on Kel's avatar is a seon in a msitcloack

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1 minute ago, mathiau said:

Brandon's current headcannon on Kel's avatar is a seon in a msitcloack

The way Brandon says that very much seems like a joke more than actually what he will go with.

4 minutes ago, Raphaborn said:

Not exactly.
 

Questioner

At the end of “Alloy of Law” Marsh tells Marasi he is giving the diary to Wax because “.. he does my brother's work”. At this time it was a reminder of Kelsier, but with Secret History and the third book out why does Marsh think we need someone to do his brother's work? Isn't Kelsier doing that himself?

Brandon Sanderson

Well. (laughs) Marsh is of multiple minds on what's happening with Kelsier at this time. When he's referencing his brother's work, he's specifically tells Marasi speaking to the lore of the Survivor. Like he's specifically talking to somebody, and he does believe this. He may not think that Kelsier is doing Kelsier's work anymore. But that depends on... You will see interaction between Marsh and Kelsier in the future.

Leipzig Book Fair (March 24, 2017)

 

Which is why I said is a possibility. Not necessarily likely. We won't know until we get to actually see what he's like three hundred years later

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