The Bands of Mourning chapter three discussion

[.S.A.M.K.M]

Hematology looses power over time, but could compounding in some manner, allow the energy to be preserves. If identity allows for metal minds usable for all, what if one of the other attributes allows hematology to work better. It does not need to be perfect, just viable.

Ever since I heard about this art and bind points, I always thought of acupuncture.

Will we see a list of compounding abilities, or simply how powers can work in concert? Is it even possible to use all three arts at once?

Edited December 23, 2015 by .S.A.M.K.M

[Stormgate]

Apparently, Hemalurgy was based loosely on acupuncture, anyway.

[Landis963]

Will we see a list of compounding abilities, or simply how powers can work in concert? Is it even possible to use all three arts at once?

 

Certainly.  Tap weight (Feruchemy), while burning Steel (Allomancy), to Push a Hemalurgic spike through a victim into a recipient (Hemalurgy-duh).  The problem of course being that one doesn't benefit from the Hemalurgy unless one can compound Iron (to Pull instead of Push the spike)  

[Copperkeep]

Hematology looses power over time, but could compounding in some manner, allow the energy to be preserves. If identity allows for metal minds usable for all, what if one of the other attributes allows hematology to work better. It does not need to be perfect, just viable.

Ever since I heard about this art and bind points, I always thought of acupuncture.

Will we see a list of compounding abilities, or simply how powers can work in concert? Is it even possible to use all three arts at once?

I personally don't think I'd expand the term Compounding to cover all the possible interactions between the Arts. So far it sounds to me like it refers to one very specific action.

We do know that burning a hemalurgical spike "splices" your sDNA with that of the "donor," and I think that WoB also hinted that doing that when there was a feruchemical charge stored in the spike would do something even more interesting.

On the topic of hemalurgic decay, an attribute stored in an Atium spike doesn't decay and is never reduced- and you can store *any* attribute in an Atium spike, if you know how. A lot of people have wondered if there's an imbalance between what Lerasium does and what Atium does in terms of power, but I think that's because they're just comparing Allomancy. Atium is for Hemalurgy what Lerasium is for Allomancy. Which is why I'm even more curious to know what Malatium does hemalurgically than what it does feruchemically.

[Stormgate]

I'm looking forward to when we see someone burn a Hemalurgic spike.

[Voidus]

I'm not sure about "damage", but any memories stored in a coppermind definitely aren't in your head anymore, from what the books show us.

It doesn't have to though, when Brandon did the forum Q&A that was my question, if a skilled Archivist could partially store a memory and he said they could.

[Stormgate]

I think I have figured out why memories extracted from copperminds degrade so quickly. When you store a memory, you are basically storing your ability to access it and cause it to degrade. So, you store its ability to degrade. When you tap it, you tap its ability to degrade.

[natc]

More on point of the Bands and VenDell's theories though . . . if it truly works that way, can you imagine it? A Mistborn with full compounding. There'll be no stopping them.

And they could just presumably make a second set of bands by compounding the charge too. Man I kind of hope VenDell is wrong.

[Voidus]

More on point of the Bands and VenDell's theories though . . . if it truly works that way, can you imagine it? A Mistborn with full compounding. There'll be no stopping them.

And they could just presumably make a second set of bands by compounding the charge too. Man I kind of hope VenDell is wrong.

I think that at the least it's going to be impossible for now (Bands will be destroyed or something similar), otherwise I don't see how by the next era there would still be someone who was only a Misting.

[Stormgate]

But how would you do this in the first place? Get a Nicrosil Ferring and an Aluminum Ferring together, I suppose. Then get approximately sixteen Twinborn with F-nicrosil, and... Do something about the Ferrings. Give them blank Nicrosil metalminds with Nicrosil and Aluminum Feruchemy?

[natc]

The only way to keep the saga sane is to destroy the bands, I suppose.

Otherwise you could easily end up with 5 million Lord Rulers running around.

[DreamEternal]

The only way to keep the saga sane is to destroy the bands, I suppose.

That is the boring way. It would be more fun if the person who took the bands started to think he was the reincarnation of Rashek, and it was all a plot from the men of red and gold to ressurect TLR.

Which would make them the Sliverist Sons of Honor, I guess.

So the ghostbloods serve Trell?

[Kurkistan]

It doesn't have to though, when Brandon did the forum Q&A that was my question, if a skilled Archivist could partially store a memory and he said they could.

 

The point still stands, I believe. The idea was that you'd store part of the memory, leaving both the stored and the retained bits "vague". So the Archivist is still missing something that they once had once they stop storing.

[natc]

That is the boring way. It would be more fun if the person who took the bands started to think he was the reincarnation of Rashek, and it was all a plot from the men of red and gold to ressurect TLR.

Which would make them the Sliverist Sons of Honor, I guess.

So the ghostbloods serve Trell?

But the issue is it's the power set of the Lord Ruler that created those Bands. And the Bands grant those very powers. There's no reason you can't make more using the original set, and you'll end up with a small army of invincible demigods on your hands. Each strong enough to probably conquer nations with little help.

[Noblehunter]

Thinking on if the script is from the south continent, could one look at a 10th century latin script and recognize it as the same alphabet as 19th century handwriting (as an example)? Generically, how easy is it to tell two scripts are related if they're a thousand years apart? The kandra could know the ancestor of the script and still not recognize it's modern version.

[natc]

Well if you've ever tried to look at old English . . . it's hard to read, and that's the latin alphabet version. Don't bother trying to read English written in runes . . . it also actually sounds like elvish apparently.

There will be noticeable grammar and syntax parallels though, surely, at least to an actual linguists expert. It'll be a completely new language otherwise. A Cryptic will probably recognize both as the same immediately.

[DreamEternal]

But the issue is it's the power set of the Lord Ruler that created those Bands. And the Bands grant those very powers. There's no reason you can't make more using the original set, and you'll end up with a small army of invincible demigods on your hands. Each strong enough to probably conquer nations with little help.

Ha! You think Rashek would be willing to do such a thing as sharing?

Besides, maybe for some reason one cannot compound nicrosil for a permanent power increase, so every new set of Bands would be progressively weaker, and the Bands of Mourning only hold 40% of Rashek's power.

[TwelfthOfSnackTime]

I get the feeling its going to end up that wax uses the Bands to defeat the set or -insert bad guy here- then realizes the terrible power that the Bands have and he either hides or destroys them to keep them getting used ever again.

 

Hehe I just realized there will probably be a Battle of the Bands in this book too.

[natc]

Ha! You think Rashek would be willing to do such a thing as sharing?

Besides, maybe for some reason one cannot compound nicrosil for a permanent power increase, so every new set of Bands would be progressively weaker, and the Bands of Mourning only hold 40% of Rashek's power.

Well assuming he did create the Bands in the way VenDell theorizes he clearly doesn't mind.

Even if you're only at half power or something you can presumably just tap it twice as fast and compound off of that level. Like I said in the first place, there better be a flaw in some part of VenDell's theory or everyone is doomed.

[Argent]

I get the feeling its going to end up that wax uses the Bands to defeat the set or -insert bad guy here- then realizes the terrible power that the Bands have and he either hides or destroys them to keep them getting used ever again.

 

Hehe I just realized there will probably be a Battle of the Bands in this book too.

 

Eh, sounds too cliched for Brandon. I would rather put my money on Wayne snatching the Bands and running circles around Harmony, not giving them to him, just for kicks.

[DreamEternal]

Well assuming he did create the Bands in the way VenDell theorizes he clearly doesn't mind.

Having the possibility of a sucessor if he dies is different from sharing his powers while he lives.

Even if you're only at half power or something you can presumably just tap it twice as fast and compound off of that level. Like I said in the first place, there better be a flaw in some part of VenDell's theory or everyone is doomed.

Tap what twice as fast? If storing investiture works the way VenDell says it does, what you propose is like tapping cooper faster to see the future.

Plus, my theory on how to make the Bands less extreme relies on nicrosil compounding either not being a thing or only giving a temporary boost.

[natc]

Did VenDell ever actually say Nicrosil storage was permanent loss?

I don't believe he actually said anything about that. Considering a lot of other abilities innate investiture is clearly capable of regenerating.

[DreamEternal]

Did VenDell ever actually say Nicrosil storage was permanent loss?

I don't believe he actually said anything about that. Considering a lot of other abilities innate investiture is clearly capable of regenerating.

But if TLR's power only got lower while he was storing, then it would be like other feruchemical attributes and tapping the Bands would only give a temporary power increase that would then fade away, making them a one-use trinket.

Plus while he didn't say anything about it(my mistake) being either temporary or permanent, so I'd rather believe in the option that gives the Bands greater long-term significance while keeping you from becoming as powerful, if not more powerful than Rashek and gifting those powers to others.

EDIT: Also, what makes you think the parts of your spiritweb responsible for allomancy and feruchemy can just grow back to full power if you divide them into two smaller sets of spiritweb fragments and store one of them?

Edited December 24, 2015 by DreamEternal

[natc]

Nothing makes me think that. Neither does anything make me think the opposite so far either. You do realize the points you're making concern things we don't actually know anything about that will potentially become clear in this very book . . .

That's why speculation on possibilities occurs. And why I said "I hope VenDell is wrong about something" because this is the last thing I want to see happen in an era with relatively not-broken characters.

Being potentially temporary isn't much of a hindrance if it temporarily gives you the ability to compound anything, including the power that gave you the compounding and allomancy in the first place. Would really suck if it worked that way, though considering just how much more powerful Rashek was than Elend in allomancy any conceivable power buff makes sense for him to have.

Edited December 24, 2015 by natc

[DreamEternal]

The problem is that you said you hope VenDell is wrong about something, but the conclusions you draw from what he said were as dependent on your personal interpretation and assumptions as mine were.

I was just proposing an alternative reading that allows the Bands to be powerful, long term effective(since it would be more interesting as a demi-god maker than as an one-use weapon), and yet not be capable of making an army of fullborns.

Edited December 24, 2015 by DreamEternal