Pagerunner

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Pagerunner last won the day on June 8 2020

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About Pagerunner

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    Searching for the Mask of Investiture
  • Birthday 04/29/1990

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    Male
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    Texas
  • Interests
    I've read a fair amount of Fantasy: Wheel of Time, Sword of Truth, 1/2 of A Song of Ice and Fire. These days, I don't have time for much more than Cosmere.

    I'm also big into Sci-Fi. I used to be crazy for the Star Wars EU, but recent events have hit me hard.
  1. They're just going in numerical order down the Steel alphabet, so #5 is Alloy-era zinc. https://coppermind.net/wiki/Steel_alphabet I think any thematic ties to the content of the books are purely coincidental.
  2. In The Lost Metal, we are introduced to the concept of purified Dor. (I haven't reread Secret History with it in mind, but even if the Ire use it there, I'll call this its introduction. Secret History was more like creeping on it through a window, rather than being properly introduced.) Standard Dor, you have to access through AonDor or some other Invested art from Sel; but purified Dor can be used by TwinSoul or by Armal and the other kidnapped allomancers. It's still Dor (which is why they still call it Dor), but now it's in a form that anybody can ingest it an apply it to their Invested art. Impure Investiture If this is "pure Dor," then what is the impurity in regular Dor? There's some retconning going on right now around atium versus pure atium, and I don't think that's the same situation as Dor versus pure Dor. The impurity in atium is electrium; it manifested in the pits as an alloy of "true atium." I don't think that Dor has a material contaminant, but it's going to be more like a property of the substantial Investiture, why it's only able to be used within the context of its Invested Arts. Think of it like Identity on an unkeyed metalmind. Normally, the Identity associated with that metalmind prevents anybody from accessing it through their Feruchemy. When you strip the Identity off of it, anybody can access it Feruchemically. Now, take that a step back: Investiture like the Dor is inherently tied to its Invested arts, and it can only be accessed through them. I'm going to go out on a limb and call it "Connection to a magic system" up front, and I'll make callbacks to the concept in later sections as it becomes relevant. Pure Investiture has that Connection stripped away from it so that it can be used by anybody, even if they don't have access to the appropriate magic system. This also kind of gets into why Rysn, as a Dawnshard, isn't permitted to bond a spren. She's the flip side of the coin; the Dawnshard allowed her to manifest Investiture with dangerous flexibility, so she's not allowed to gain the ability to breath in Stormlight. Pure Dor, on the other hand, can be used by anybody, but it doesn't do anything on its own. (As far as I know, it doesn't innately heal you like Stormlight does.) But, by the nature of the purified Investiture, it has been stripped free of the "locks" that normally prevent anyone from Investing themselves with it. But is this actually the first time we've seen pure Investiture in the cosmere? Medallions Did you know Brandon alluded to medallions containing pure Investiture six years ago? Relevant portions bolded below There is a parallel between pure Dor and medallions in that you can access it without already being its magic user. There's something special about the piece of Investiture stored in the nicrosil portion of a medallion. (Which is a discrete piece, like what is stored in a coppermind.) So, you've got this piece of Investiture that grants, say, iron Feruchemy and brass Feruchemy. Not only is it unkeyed (no Identity), it is also pure (no Connection to Feruchemy), so anybody is able to tap it. (I don't think it needs to also grant nicrosil Feruchemy, but that's just my gut feel.) But hold up, isn't this getting too complicated? Why put pure Investiture in nicrosil, instead of just doing it to the brass metalmind, for example? That gives you something anyone can tap, but the Bands are more complicated than that. And the weight medallions; you need a medallion anyone can fill. And it also wouldn't let you make allomancy medallions; nothing to tap there. So, practically speaking, you wouldn't be able to replicate all the observed effects without pure Investiture in a nicrosilmind. But beyond that, it also begs the question of the specific mechanism for removing this Connection and whether it could be done to other metalminds, or if the phenomenon can only be accomplished on nicrosilminds. We know how to blank the Identity. But how to remove the Connection? Well, this touches on the mystery of why Feruchemical duralumin (i.e. storing Connection) is relevant to the creation of medallions: I don't have a grat handle on exactly how it's relevant yet, but I think it's something a Feruchemist does to themself while they are in the process of creating a medallion. Because nicrosil Feruchemy is the only type of Feruchemy where there is no conversion of an attribute into Investiture. For pewter Feruchemy, you can't "purify" your strentgh, because your physical strength isn't Connected to a Shard. You convert that strength into Investiture and store it in pewter, but then the Investiture is in pewter; if you tap it to manipulate it, it turns right back into Strength. But Investiture that you store in nicrosil, you can manipulate it while it's still part of your own spiritweb, and then that purified Investiture can merely be moved out of your soul (or compounded to duplicate it) and placed in nicrosil for anybody else to use. So, a lot of details there. But take a step back and think of the big picture: both pure Dor and medallions are types of magic that anybody can draw on, even if they are not a magic user. I think that's the big takeaway of what pure Investiture is and why it's important to the future of the cosmere. Other pure Investiture Where else have we seen Investiture that can be used by anybody? There's a WoB making a direct parallel between medallions and Honorblades. I think the "same princple" is that they are both pure Investiture; Honor made ten pieces of pure Investiture that anybody could use to Surgebind. Breath is another candidate for inherently pure Investiture. Which would be kind of a revolutionary concept; can you use Breath to power Allomancy without any hoops to jump through? I suspect you can, but the utility of Breath is greater than just using up as an Investiture source (i.e. holding Breath doesn't run out, and it grants you Heightenings). But three things make me wonder in that direction. First is how anybody can be invested by it, same as pure Dor. Second is the mother-of-pearl description it gets, same as the pure Dor. And the last is how it can be transported offworld, made intentionally by Endowment without some of its otherwise-expected Connection. And I think pure Stormlight is where we're heading in the books, with everybody trying to get it off-world. The same WoB I shared for Breath ends with a bit about Stormlight, that it needs to be "refined" before anybody can ues it. And Kelsier knows how to purify some forms of Investiture (since he made the Bands of Mourning), but if we ever get the full medallion creation flowchart, I think we'll see that his mechanism for creating the Bands of Mourning and the medallions won't quite work for Stormlight (somehow). They need a new mechanism, one that could work on both Stormlight and on spren. Autonomy? Bonus theory that I came up with while researching purified Investiture. The perpendicularity that Autonomy was creating may have been made through pure Dor, as well. It's described as being visually similar, and it gets used up by allomancers in the exact same way. Combined with two of our Ghostbloods in Rhythm of War being Selish exiles, I'm worried Autonomy has already gone to war with Sel. And won. And now she's got access to all of this purified Dor to use to make perpendicularities, but her adversaries just have little bits and pieces of it that they save in jars. And, out-of-universe, that's the reason Brandon's still saying that Elantris sequels are important to Mistborn Era Three. Because Autonomy is the antagonist for both of them.
  3. I had a fun time at the con. It was great being able to argue about theories with everybody in-person, instead of doing it over the internet. Although it was a little frustrating to have to keep track of who had read TLM previews, who had read the SA5 prologue, who had read Secret Project sample chapters, etc. (If any of you were in the Radisson bar on Sunday night, I was the spoiler police who was keeping a very well-read and very inebriated fellow fan from blurting out everything that popped into his head.) Also a highlight was the long Monday night for those of us who were not going to sleep until we'd finished the book. (Although I did have to crash for a few hours at 3:00 AM, I managed to get up early and still finish it before the con started on Tuesday.) Shoutout to the other night owls who ruined their sleep schedules to get answers. Airport con was fun, too. Everyone was wearing their con shirt for their flights home, so we were all just walking up to each other and talking about the book. I had, like, a dozen other fans on my flight. I picked up a few WoBs: Spoiler Q&A: I was one of the lucky ones who got my name selected, and I have my transcription up on Arcanum already. It's a question about internal/external and pushing/pulling Surges, and the answer is unfortunately a little less concrete than I had hoped. There is a pattern there, but it might be more like Hybrid Feruchemy, where the pattern breaks down as Brandon needs to make all corners of the magic system actually useful. Brotherwise panel: There were four of the miniatures that are candidates to get turned into painted figurines: Shardplate Kaladin, Syl, Navani, and Leshwi. Brotherwise plans to make two of those four into figurines, and they polled the crowd as to which two they wanted the most. The crowd began to chant "All Four!" Kickstarter panel: The Words of Radiance Kickstarter will have Radiant Order-themed swag, in the same vein as the WoK Kickstarter. I also got to chat with Johnny from Brotherwise in the game room. The next Cosmere board game they are working on is not a Stormlight game. Hmmm... Karen has "KAFO" cards, now, which she will give you when she looks up something for you in the wiki. I took a few WoBs where Brandon said "I'll have to have Karen look that up later," but had never been followed up on. The one I got an answer for at the time was: the basic form that parshmen awakened to after the Everstorm (which is not workform) doesn't have a canonical name yet, and is referred to in the wiki as the "awakened parshman basic form." There are a few more that would have taken a little longer to get answers for, which I'm going to email to her later. I don't expect I'll be at next year's con, but I'm planning to go to Stormlight Five's in 2024. Looking forward to seeing everyone there!
  4. That's when the book releases, midnight EST. For any other physical location that's distributing the book (i.e. bookstores that haven't broken release date), you'd have to wait until Tuesday morning, so getting it Monday night is already giving it out early. If you're not able to stay that late, I'm sure that you'll be able to pick it up when you return to the con the next day.
  5. I think we need to be a little more specific than anti-Investiture. Stormlight spoilers:
  6. I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that these shavings are not iron. Keep an eye out for where this Chekovium dust comes up again later in the book. I've got a sneaking suspicion it's something else "important to the cosmere and to Scadrial," per this WoB from a few years back. Still not sure what the byproduct could actually be, though.
  7. I've been negligent in participating in discussion so far, so I'll lead off with my latest observations and then drop in all the stuff from prior chapters. Chapters 14-15 Hey, there's our Hemalurgy chart appearance. But not quite, no more info on linchpin spikes. There have been a few comments about linchpin spikes in the preview chapters, so maybe we'll finally get the detailed Hemalurgy chart poster to go along with the book. Strange reactions with a lot of ettmetal in one place – I guess it’s gonna start punching through to Cognitive and Spiritual realms. Disagreements between VenDell and Harmony as to Bleeder’s madness. Hopefully another loose end for the book to tidy up. Dividing harmonium – we see Towerlight get split, why not harmonium? Trellium… it isn’t anti-Investiture, is it? The explosion and the response, they are reacting in ways that mists and atium notably didn't. The mists did pull away from Vin when she was spiked, but I don't recall atium driving back the mists on its own. So this more severe reaction (both pushing away spikes and in causing the explosion) seem very much more like Rhythm of War's anti-Investiture experiments. Chapters 1-2 Old metal door that got forgotten through "bureaucratic nonsense" and the Terriswoman vice governor pushing for the vote - certainly seems to me like there's something more nefarious going on behind the scenes. “Anything Varlance accomplished… was probably her doing.” I'm betting she's Set. How does Wax Push on a medallion? Shouldn't it be too Invested for that? Chapters 3-4 Well, we've got Nazh and what are apparently "hellguns" flying around. I guess this doesn't bode well for his Stonward aspirations. I'm still not quite sold on this gang stuff. It seems like a really bad cover to pretend to be normal criminals while you're actually a different kind of criminal. Just draws police attention to yourself. I'm wondering if this is bait of some sort. New Allomantic grenades. All power goes into the box; it’s not resonating with a power, it’s just absorbing and delaying the manifestation. But how does it actually work? And what does the ettmetal actually do? The grenades now seem different than when they were called "primer cubes." Now, they're batteries for an Investiture manifestation, but before they would tie in an ettmetal power source to a particular kind of manifestation. “Just like the Lord Ruler when he’d lost the Bands of Mourning centuries earlier.” Here we go with the casual inaccuracies. Chapters 5-8 The earring. “You’ll need to make a second, once the proper metal arrives.” Is it actually from Harmony? Or is this Trell reaching out to Wax? “These brick walls were so old. Who had built them, centuries ago?” As an author, why does Brandon have Marasi ask this question? Could they be from an unexpected source, like ancient Trell followers? Trell from White Sand had plenty of time to Ascend to an Avatar before the time of the Final Empire. Eyes glowing red, Trell choosing avatars. The Cycle isn’t an avatar yet; so what’s going on with the red eyes? Is there a Trellish spren or something Investing him? Is it a new kind of compounding (which is why he wasn’t worried about running out of strength), powering Feruchemy directly from Trell? “A shot to the head should stop a Bloodmaker from healing.” Didn’t Miles take a shot to the head in AoL? Is it getting retconned to have been unusual, now? Radiants don’t have a problem healing from head wounds, either. “The ash comes again. The world will fall to it. You will get what you deserve, and all will wither beneath a cloud of blackness and a blanket of burned bodies made ash. Your end. Your end comes. Either in ash, or at the hands of the men of gold and red. Gold and—” I think there are two things going on here. Gold and red is Trell. Ashfall is Discord. Trell is fighting Harmony to take over the place, Discord wants the world and its inhabitants to meet their rightful end that they escaped three hundred years ago. I've always been partial to Discord theories, but I couldn't reconcile them with Trell coming from White Sand. Two separate catastrophes - Harmony's losing it and Trell is coming in. “One day, the men of gold and red, bearers of the final metal, will come to you. And you will be ruled by them.” Trell's group doesn’t want destruction under ashfalls, they want to rule the world. Chapter 9 No ability to maintain medallions. That’s refilling, right? My thoughts have always been that it needs to involve compounding. Not refilling nicrosil, but refilling heat and Connection and such. Can't store it quick enough the old-fashioned way. “Why weren’t there Feruchemical soldiers in the Malwish army with extremely heightened strength, mental speed, or other dangerous Feruchemical talents? Why weren’t there Allomancer medallions? The more they learned, the more certain Wax became that there was a secret there, indicating the medallions were not as effective or as versatile as the Malwish would like people to believe.” Questions I’ve wondered about. They’re obviously possible, since the Bands do all that and more. Did the medallion creation devices come from a Fullborn (read: Kelsier), and he only gave them the ‘templates’ to create a limited number, so to speak? That’s why they want the Bands back, so they can make any medallions they want? Small bathroom. Is it a child bathroom as a cultural thing? Or are there little people among the Southerners? Chapters 10-11 Smuggling into Elendel. Trying to sneak people in, would be my guess. They’re gonna try to overthrow Elendel. Not just break away with rebellions. A typical Sanderson super-escalation at the end of a trilogy. “And is this all?” Is this a hint of Marasi freezing herself and showing up in the Era 3 books? “Why would Harmony tell him to make a second earring, presumably out of Trell’s metal?” Because the letter didn’t come from Harmony. From the way MeLaan talks, she’s not the kandra on Roshar in SA. Chapters 12-13 “first kandra to go out there long-term, with an official mission.” So the kandra on Roshar isn’t sent by Harmony. Malli, Felt’s wife, is still my best guess; the couple is just traveling and vibing. Wayne's breakup. He's gonna become an immortal worldhopper, isn't he... “God metals were the source of the mists back in anteverdant days.” What? Spectroscopy is very reminiscent of RoW experiments with Light. Which are both just… very odd. Trellish Light through a prism would have an extra large red band. Or is it infrared? It looks like harmonium... how similar to harmonium? Weird spectrum like harmonium, or exactly (anti-Investiture) like harmonium? “Harmonium wasn’t affected by acids” now what on earth does that mean? The reaction of alkali metals with water is because water is an acid with a pH of 7. More acidic solutions will react more violently. Why does harmonium behave this way?
  8. Regarding individual miniatures: you can't get individual miniatures, but you can get just the RoW set (for example). From the Kickstarter's FAQ: EDIT: Also worth mentioning is the upcoming Taln miniature, which isn't on the campaign yet but will be available as an add-on. It will be part of the Secret Project Kickstarter's Stormlight merch box, for those who are pledged at that level to the other campaign. But anyone will be able to add it to this new campaign.
  9. Brandon will be making appearances at both of these conventions this fall. We are not allowed to put recorders on the signing line table anymore, but there's a good chance he'll be doing readings or Q&A panels, so it would be good to get those recorded. Is anybody planning on attending either convention who could get audio on your phone? FanX, historically, has been a good place to get some facetime with Brandon, since he's had several signing timeslots in past years. NYCC could go either way; he's much less of a celebrity in New York than he is in Utah (smaller fish in a bigger pond), so there might not be as much demand for his signing lines there. But there are going to be a lot of people there.
  10. You can look on the About page: https://wob.coppermind.net/about/ It has some high level info, and some links to more detailed guides for searching or editing.
  11. A little late, but a very happy birthday to you!

  12. *looks around* who's not wishing this aranist happy bday? happy birthday guy who I've never really talked to on the shard.

  13. That's how they looked for the Oathbringer previews on Tor.com. The formatting doesn't get finalized until the end of the process.
  14. Hoo, boy, I work on transcribing the thing, and I miss a whole bunch of pages of discussion. (Transcription is here, by the way. https://wob.coppermind.net/events/495-prologue-to-stormlight-book-five/#e15580) I've got a few things back from my first post to expound on. First is the bit about Mishram that gets a little funky. Gavilar assumes that the "him" in "one who could rival him" is Thaidakar. But Mishram is the "other god." In contrast to whom? Not Thaidakar; the timelines don't work out, and also that's ridiculous. Odium? That's what seems to be implied by the Stormfather later. Or, perhaps, is it the Rider of Storms who betrayed the singers so long ago? And he's just lying to Gavilar again? And second are the peculiar bits about the Stormfather's presentation to Gavilar, unlike how it manifested to Dalinar, that make me think there's something else going on, that perhaps a piece of Tanavast is hiding inside the Stormfather and manifesting himself on occasion. Note how the Stormfather sometimes acts human (Tanavast), sometimes inhuman (real Stormfather). And the way it says "I have decided," which is a task that Honor set the Stormfather upon. And the eyeless infinity, reminding me of other times people have come face-to-face with actual, full Shards. Oh, and the connection to the Oathpact. It was between Honor and the Heralds; the Stormfather had no place in it. Honor himself would feel the pain of a Herald death, not the Stormfather. Lots of little circumstantial things, but I think they're all pointing towards Honor, the Shard, being around a little more than we'd thought.
  15. I'm looking forward to spending some time tonight going through it again in detail. A few thoughts and impressions (aside from the Chana Davar bit): I'm not sure if this Stormfather was really the Stormfather. Obviously, Gavilar's visions and the way the prologue Stormfather talks about Dalinar are points in favor of it being the true Stormfather. On the other hand, there are some notable differences with how he's manifesting: as an individual, and the distinctly Shard-like infinity sensation I seem to recall at the end. (That's one of the lines I want to get the exact wording.) I don't see it being Odium or another Herald manipulating Gavilar; I think, if this isn't the Stormfather, it's something very close to the Stormfather. A remnant of Honor, somehow; there's another line about "choosing to" vs "being commanded to" that make me think it's Tanavast pretending to be the Stormfather. But if it is the real Stormfather, his mission of choosing a new Herald (and then lying about stuff) and his active lying to Gavilar also throw a lot of his later interactions with Dalinar into question. Where did Gavilar get the anti-Voidlight? Also, what was the information that Gavilar tricked out of Thaidakar? I'm thinking they're one and the same, that Kelsier gave Gavilar the secret to creating anti-Voidlight. The Everstorm is still a bit of a mystery. I've gotta refresh myself a little bit on it; the storm was already in Shadesmar, I believe, back here when the Alethi first met the Parshendi, and it didn't get pulled into the Physical Realm into Words of Radiance. It allows transportation between Braize and Roshar, even from where it is in Shadesmar. But where did it come from in the first place? I had something else, but now I can't think of it, so I'll edit it in here after the transcription gets done and I can do some digging. But it was a good one, I promise. EDIT: I got it. It was Ba-Ado-Mishram as a "puzzle piece that doesn't fit," which is exactly how I've felt since RoW. Is Thaidakar interested in her, or was Kalak rambling about Odium or the Stormfather or someone when it came to "someone who could challenge him" or whatever that line was? (Ooooh, this makes me think of Stormfather as a secret villain again, like the first bullet point.) EDIT2: Here are some longer thoughts on my first and last bullet points, with the actual quotes.