JohnTMS

All of that to say, after some thought: I posit one can take all the above, and apply the concepts to add the following descriptions to each realm: Spiritual: Frequency domain Physical: Time domain Cognitive (vibes): Blend of the two, dependent on the mediators of Intent and Spiritwebs; expressed similarly to Special Relativity. I'm beginning to get attached to thinking of it this way: The Spiritual Realm is the event horizon of a Singularity; the Singularity being that of the realm of the God Beyond, never to be touched. The Physical Realm is just standard spacetime, if you will. The Cognitive Realm acting as the accretion disk, matter (Investiture) getting thrown about in strange and wacky ways.

I completely get getting hung up on the little things, and that leading to an ever-cycling delay on things, don't beat yourself up about that for a second! I appreciate this reply immensely, and in vast swaths I'm in agreement with you! 16-TET was just a fun idea anyway, not core to the framework; as Brandon wished I would've preferred if it could have been so lol. But I think a combination of my secondary restraint regarding the infinite nature of the Harmonic Series, and that of my metaphoric use of harmonic context to explain the interaction with said infinity has led to a major misunderstanding. This video does a much better job of explaining these concepts than I ever could. I highly recommend giving it a full watch if you're at all keen to it, but I'll also be referring to timestamps of it from here on out: 2:33-About 4 Minutes This part is more vibes for me than anything else, but I see the figure above as the relationship that the logicspren shares with higher-order frequencies when exposed to certain stimuli. 1:49-2:28 The correlation between a Realmatic Fundamental or somewhere in its Pure Tone, and low-frequency temporal pulses such as claps, stomps, or the blinking rate of a logicspren, can be explained in a similar fashion. My initial thought of ringing Dyads to produce the Invested nature of Rhythm, as opposed to just performing as a musician, may be a step too complicated under this framework, actually. If a short signal, such as Rhythm, can correlate with such a wide range of frequencies, then attunement is likely manipulated in two ways: 1) The Rhythm itself varying 2) Intent and Connection Think of asking a person with perfect pitch what note a clap makes. Provided they were forced to answer, not just shrugging their shoulders: depending on how they were listening, or the Intent of their ear if you will, any and all answers could and would be correct. So Intent on the user's end cover's where in the frequency band the attunement goes, and Connection anchors the user to the right Realmatic Pure Tone, or Intent. 8:44-10:21 The entire segment on Quantum Mechanics/Special Relativity: This is where things have to be scaled in terms of approaching infinity, though this video does not cover the topic. Take the above figure as a different way to represent Realmatic Pure Tone, with the balls getting smaller with less mass now representing each higher-order frequency as the figure expands outwards. If you take the infinite expanse of Realmatic Pure Tone, or rather a space that has infinite information on it such as the Spiritual Realm, and equate that to an infinite number of discrete pulses in time, does that not make time itself infinite in the Spiritual Realm?

To say that I'm arguing that something is specifically investing the logicspren and I'm needing to know what kind of Light is involved misses the crux of the argument. Spren don't get Invested. They are Investiture. Investiture, as we know, has different Intents, Pure Tones if you will, post-Shattering. If logicspren are comprised of say, for sake of argument remnants of Honor's Investiture, the rate at which it's pulsing, i.e. the gears of the literal clock that logicspren got turned into would be timed to whatever Investiture it is comprised of. Under this framework, whatever the rate that the logicspren blinks at, if it were instead comprised of Odium's Investiture, and leaked Voidlight, would change to reflect the Intent of the Investiture involved.

This is where it begins to feel like me putting on my aluminum-lined hat, as it were. A thought that just crossed my mind. If Realmatic Pure Tone 'goes on forever', then couldn't one argue that in the Spiritual Realm, there is "perfect information" present for any given Pure Tone? While the specific calculus of the litany of options with my limited understanding there prevent me from hammering down the details, I'm aware of a slant to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle that can be applied to the realm of time-frequency analysis, Fourier analysis, whichever discipline one decides is most accurate, known as the Gabor limit. So if you have a realm that for the most part could be described as frequencies, i.e. a frequency domain with perfect information on frequencies and amplitude, would that same realm have zero time domain whatsoever? Ergo, the Spiritual Realm seems timeless in nature because it is timeless.

If we're going off crackpot ideas... (Spoilers all Cosmere)

Just off the top, thank you so much! Lots of thought and feeling so to speak, the notes I have that birthed all that are just ridiculous. I think that leap in logic stems from the lack of ability to use the redefined Realmatic terminology such as the distinction between Realmatic Fundamental and Realmatic Pure Tone, prior to having reason to define them. n being a whole integer just makes the math much simpler, but that would likely only work if the logicspren is 'attuning' to a Realmatic Fundamental, rather than a higher-order frequency elsewhere in its Pure Tone. The mathematical relationship in that case would still let the model function as far as I can tell. This is actually in line with where some of my further reasoning has taken me in my notes; just with a different slant away from say Ambition and Whimsy's tone being in the key of C, for the sake of argument. Let's do some makeshift Realmatic Music Theory! Western tuning has our chromatic scale at 12 distinct tones before repeating; 16 Shards of Adonalsium (cherrypicked from His Realmatic Pure Tone), 16 new Realmatic Pure Tones, 16 notes on a novel Hexadecimal chromatic scale? Now as for the types of chord progressions and new styles of interval this noveau Equal-Temperament Tuning, and thusly all the kinds of music made off of this hypothetical harmonic framework, that is far beyond my current level of diving in. I'm sure someone's played around with the idea musically before, the 20th century had some veeeerrry experimental music, even prior to the popularization of distortion. No need to apologize! Taking this concept I just introduced of all Realmatic Pure Tones being squeezed into the range of a single octave, this actually explains that there could be multiple mechanisms for the formation of hybrid Shards. Realmatic Fundamentals that lock well together, while with as not as many voices as in this example, should produce similar results. The absolutely screaming overtone here being the new hybrid Realmatic Fundamental. Ones that don't mesh as well result in sum or difference tones appearing underneath both Realmatic Fundamentals to make a new one, that while still functional lives in the shadow of the original two. Like Harmony's experience as a Shard, for instance. Funny, that. Pretty much, yes! However, for simplicity's sake I find the term triad to be interchangable in this context; playing further into harmonic interaction in the Spiritual Realm. Waves of sound transfer through, or resonate, differently depending on the medium they're being transferred through. Let's say you have Vin swallowing a vial of copper. Burning the metal introduces a new medium for which the resonance of the Investiture to, put reductively, modulate, which order in the sequence of Realmatic Pure Tone is being expressed the most. Burning Steel changes the resonance to either a higher or lower-order partial/overtone in the Realmatic Pure Tone, the rest of the Allomantic metals differing the same.

When this is what's been rummaging through your head, it begins to feel more necessary, I think. I acknowledge the light of truth I wield, and that the shadows cast elsewhere from it may instead cast doubt.

For sake of simplicity, assume full spoilers for the Cosmere to date of writing. Abstract (TL;DR): An observation made in Rhythm of War led to the craft of a falsifiable hypothesis, and a logical, in-universe experiment that can be crafted to test the hypothesis. If the hypothesis is eventually proven true, it allows numerous real-world harmonic and acoustic phenomena to be applied to phenomena derived from Investiture in nearly seamless fashion, from the bottom up. Scope: There is a critical distinction that must be made regarding the scope of this work. I am not here to assert specific frequencies etc. in terms of raw numbers, e.g. A=440 and similarly derived phenomena. As is with all (western) music, especially for those not of the 2nd Heightening, things will be described and derived, generally, from principles of harmonic relativity. With that in mind: Observation: Rhythm of War, Chapter 15 Epigraph: A light blinking in a regular, one could say intervallic period, could be expressed as a number, one that can be converted into an, albeit low, frequency in Hz. Label this frequency as f2. Take a measurable source of the Pure Tone (for now using real-world terms as opposed to Realmatic, this should clear up shortly), in this case the Pure Tone of what is Investing the logicspren. Take that and use it as a constant, label it f1. Hypothesis: Fundamental, f1 will have a neat mathematical relationship with the pulse of the logicspren, f2. Specifically: If this mathematical relationship holds true for the logicspren, it can then be extrapolated to say any localized, periodic oscillation of Investiture is a direct translation from the source Intent's frequency. Therefore, this gives birth to a new principle of Realmatic Theory: The Harmonic Series, when translated into musical terms, reflect the series of phenomena known as overtones. This topic alone is a rabbit hole unto itself, so to avoid falling in, let me quickly annotate an additional constraint to the scope of my portion of the discussion; The Harmonic Series, and thusly the possible consequences of Invested action, go on upward infinitely and forever. My discussion on it should not. Let's take the real-world term pure tone, referring to merely the waveform of a given fundamental pitch, or tone. Pure Tone, in the Realmatic sense, likely refers to the combination of two things: The Realmatic Fundamental; the Realmatic equivalent to the real-world pure tone. The infinite Invested Harmonic Series resonating off the Realmatic Fundamental in totality. Below is the same diagram of the Harmonic Series from before, now representing the whole of Realmatic Pure Tone, with the Realmatic Fundamental traced briefly (shoutout to MS Paint): Subharmonics and Everyday Sounds: Every sound we hear has a frequency. From the shining overtones of an immaculate choir, booming low brass, and the rat-a-tat-tat of a snare drum; to the whirring of engines, human speech, and rapping one's knuckles upon a desk. There are essentially entire subgenres of music dedicated to making definitive tones out of manipulating ordinary sounds digitally. What are the other implications of this hypothesis, if correct? Singer Rhythms: The lateral move of applying this notion of subharmonics to the Rhythms Singers use adds a layer of complexity, as Rhythms seem, per the text, to be almost universally asymmetrical. How then, do they attune to somewhere in the sequence of the respective Realmatic Pure Tone? Let's first analyze the form that is the Singer Rhythm: Like real-world rhythmic patterns, Singer Rhythms have an internal structure, and can be ever repeated. Take, for instance, a relatively simple real-world rhythm that could feasibly mimic that of a Singer Rhythm: This can easily be split into two sections: This may produce, when sped up in a similar fashion to that of the hypothesis' logicspren, or that of Gabe the Dog (R.I.P.), the presentation of two oscillating tones. Tones that, if sped up further, oscillate fast enough to form a dyad, or interval in musical terms. Dyads, like a properly resonant (lower case) pure tone, or Realmatic Fundamental, also end up 'ringing' their own Harmonic Series, with the segment, or overtone, that becomes acoustically strongest depending on the delta, or interval, of the frequencies in the dyad. The dyad formed through the expression of the Singer Rhythm, for this framework to hold, would have its strongest overtone be in line with somewhere in the sequence of Realmatic Pure Tone, be it the Realmatic Fundamental, or somewhere else in the Pure Tone. Resolution of Ambiguity: This model, however, produces an complex, yet solvable, logistics problem. If one gives each Intent a specific, unknown to us for the purposes of this work frequency aka Realmatic Fundamental with which Pure Tone rings out of their own infinitely scaling Harmonic Series, one will inevitably run into overlap. That problem suggests the possibility of recipes for in-universe confusion like powers not working as intended, or deriving the wrong Invested Art altogether. The distinct lack of those problems being prevalent at any relevant scale in the Cosmere suggests the system already found a solution. I propose that this solution too mimics real-world phenomena, in this case harmonic context. For simplicity's sake, let's take a segment of the series that comprises a Realmatic Pure Tone, and analyze the role of shared frequencies between Intents. In other words, as the Harmonic Series goes on forever, any given Realmatic Pure Tone contains common chord tones with others: Each of the chords presented here are sharing one tone. Meaning, put in Realmatic Terms, this ambiguity can be solved with a combination of Intent and Connection. F major is different from C major is different than A-flat major. Dominion is different from Ruin is different from Odium, or whichever combination is deemed relevant; despite any similarities or overlap. Throw this back to the Singer Rhythms. It's no wonder that humans cannot be taught them, they lack the right Connection and/or hardware in the form of gemhearts to attune properly. The Novel Nature of Hybrid Shards: Hybrid Shards, such as Harmony, are said not to be a combination of its original Intents, but more of a novel being, or Pure Tone, derived from them. Take the Realmatic Fundamental of each Intent involved in the synthesis. Once together they form, like asymmetric Singer Rhythms sped up, a dyad. But rather than changing the tones forming the dyad to align with differing portions of Realmatic Pure Tone; the dyad rings out, of which the strongest overtone formed becomes the new Realmatic Fundamental which will then ring out its novel Pure Tone. Alternatively, some interaction with combination tones of some sort better reflect the phenomena. However, the specifics of the math even in relative terms, and the descriptions of underlying mechanisms in that realm escape me. Perhaps that is where my ability as attempted Realmatic translator meets its limit. Regardless: I am fully aware of the sheer massive scale in terms of new information, let alone recontextualization of existing canon, that lies above. I commend beyond measure anyone willing to go through this journey of a post, bearing with my own attempt at putting knowledge we have under new contexts and lights. I can only hope the Surges of Illumination and Progression, so to speak, have served me well. As with many other theories out there, there's bound to be mistakes, misconceptions, and/or misapplication of concepts and ideas. Regardless of perceived innate error-this has been some of the most fun I've had writing in my entire life. Journey Before Destination.

I believe I know the words of the 5th Ideal... perhaps even the 6th...and I believe them with every axon of my being... But I know they cannot be accepted, until the most resonant portions of my search for Truth has been transcribed, preferably cast in metal. Until then, they ring hollower than a cracked bell.

Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination.

Truly, it does! Walk with me still:

Moderate-to-Heavy Spoilers for Isles of the Emberdark lie ahead!! BEWARE!!! Have a handful of questions and lines of reasoning that have been wracking my brain as of late; walk with me? It is my understanding that the Eidolon, Nephalim, Evil, whatever one desires to call them, are Splinters of Ambition comprised nearly wholly of Anti-Investiture. This alone begs the question, in terms of Intent, what could/would Anti-Ambition Investiture do, precisely? Pulling from Khriss's essay on the Threnodite System, prefacing Shadows for Silence in the Forests of Hell: If these waves of destruction were twisting the people and the planet, I find it reasonable to assume it could twist any chunks of Ambition's power it carried with it; inverting these splinters into Anti-Investiture if they were not already. Additionally, the turn of phrase waves of destruction, seems to be intentional. Given what we know about The Grand Knell, in both origin and modern function in the Cosmere as of Emberdark, the Knell could be what Khriss refers to in their essay here. And in regard to the Evil on Threnody specifically: In conjunction, these quotes read to me as this Anti-Ambition Investiture being keyed towards consumption. In other words taking the measured, stable, and sustainable model of growth that standard Ambition Investiture may arguably lean toward.. and simply removing its own guardrails, so to speak, and inverting the growth inward. ALL of this to ask.. The Evil on Threnody grew to consume roughly an entire continent. What made it stop? Anti-Ambition Investiture aka 'consumption' as an Intent does not explain the Evil's current behavior, such as that of the shades, the Three Simple Rules, and other oddities. What else then, could? The "waves of destruction" as noted by Khriss shortly after Ambition's death, seem in description and consequences described to be far more powerful than how The Grand Knell appears to be, powerful still it may be, in the modern Cosmere. What changed? Now, I have my own thought on all of these, but I'm dying to hear what you all think! Be well, all

All-time favorite would have to go to Wayne, hands down. On the flipside of that, #stormmoash For a long time I would have answered your latter question with Sazed, pre or post-Ascension doesn't really matter to me. But given some recent rumblings in my noggin, I would change my answer to Khriss. Honestly that's such a solid answer, that I'm having a hard time coming up with one that I prefer over it. I'll have to mull over that one further! Thank you! I only figured some MTG-related fanart of one of my favorite characters would pair well with my MTG-slanted username! (Jace, The Mind Sculptor is the parallel, if anyone happening to mosey by is going 'huh?') Series as a whole so far, Stormlight not even close. I will go to my storming grave defending W&T - it's only the halfway point, people! While I find it impossible to pick a singular book, I do have an all-time favorite reveal, and I guess therefore one could argue favorite book since it's everything that folds into the reveal that made it so phenomenal for me on a first read, and to this day... Love em'! Adore the rusting man even more!

Hello all, Super excited to finally join up here on the forums! Suppose I'm done being that much of a hermit to pop out of the woodwork every once in a while to throw out my 2 steel coins, so to speak. Still have a handful more Cosmere books to read before I'm fully caught up, Yumi and the Nightmare Painter The Sunlit Man Isles of the Emberdark but sans anything from Fires of December, I don't mind spoilers in the slightest! Hope everyone reading has a phenomenal day