eveorjoy

Well, we really don't know. We will need to wait until Kaladin gets back before we can see if she drop Brightness Radiant around him.

True most of my thoughts are speculation. I'm just trying to make clear that when I considered Kaladin and Shallan the temporary relationship while Shallan and Adolin were broken up, I was not ignoring Kaladin's feelings in that scenario as some suspected. It bugged me people thought that because Kaladin is in fact my favorite character. Adolin is tied with Lift for second favorite and he moved into the spot largely because of his attempts to help Kaladin in WoR. Also the voice actor who plays Adolin in the Graptic Audio version of SA is just awesome. Tim Gitman is my favorite voice actor of that cast. This person Shallan thinks she is, she has shown to Adolin. Her poop question was all her and she has shown more of this person to Adolin in the last few chapters of OB. Yes, she went all Brightness Radiant when the pragmatic suggestion of learning to use her shardblade came up, but she would have reacted that way if Kaladin had suggested they go train with Zahel. She does need to be able to use that sword and her mask has nothing to do with the person who brought up that fact.

Actually, there is some pretty compelling evidence that she is exhibiting dissociative disorder. Her blackouts in WoR suggest this as does her tendency to make herself someone else, even in private. I don't think we have met the true Shallan, and she will need to face that person if she is to become a full Radiant. However, this would be an issue no matter who she was with. I said the truth of Heleran would break her and Kaladin up, but Shallan's issues might be too much for Kaladin to deal with. He may just want to be friends with her in the end. That isn't mean. Kaladin has his own issues to deal with. And until Shallan deals with herself I don't think she will work in any relationship. I also don't like this idea that Kaladin can't help Shallan with her issues as a really good friend. I think the sequence with go Adolin/Shallan, Kaladin/Shallan, then Adolin/Shallan, because of where the plot and Shallan's character is going. Adolin is either going to go back to Alethkar and be a Highprince, or Brandon is going to use one of the biggest plot twists of WoR and have Adolin face the consequences for his actions. Either path will break up Shallan and Adolin for a while, but not forever. But lets say they somehow stay together. They handle a long distance relationship and Adolin's crime is never discovered (how boring). Even in that situation Shallan's issues will damage the relationship. At some point, Shallan's issues will overwhelm her and she is not be ale to be with anyone for a time. Some say she has opened up to Kaladin, she has but only to another mask. She showed him the person she showed her brothers. Only Pattern has seen the true Shallan and he wonders if he can even remain her spren. So after Adolin leaves, Kaladin will get closer to Shallan. Shallan will think Adolin is no longer and option, so she will grow closer to Kaladin. Then her issues and the fact that Kaladin killed her brother will wreck the relationship. Kaladin will be sad, but he has handled a break up before, Tarah. Kaladin will be mature enough to see why they won't work. He will then stay by Shallan as a friend and help her deal with her issues. I think he will always care for Shallan, but I think he will lose romantic interest in her. Men and women can be good friends, valuable people in each others lives, without being a couple. After Shallan deals with her issues and Adolin returns to Urithru as a KR, will they get back together? I think so, but maybe not. Still, if they do that is the relationship that will work, because Adolin and Shallan will be ready for it then. Kaladin is not a prop for Shallan and Adolin in this scenario. His experience with the broken Shallan will help his character growth as well. And in the end he still gets to be friends with Adolin and Shallan. The scenario where Kaladin and Shallan stay together does not allow for Adolin to stay their friend. I don't think Adolin will break up from Shallan by choice. He will come back to Urithru still in love with her. It would be out of character for him to accept being the third wheel. Kaladin on the other hand could handle it, because he genuinely cares for both of them already as a friend. Not a close one yet, but he does care. I don't think Kaladin would want to lose that friendship even if it didn't work between him and Shallan.

I agree with @maxal. If Adolin was going to show jealousy toward the Radiants he would have done so by now. I thought he would resent Kaladin in WoR, largely because I didn't understand his character. He did, but not from jealousy. He didn't trust Kaladin because he knew something was up. He got over that pretty quickly and before the end he was actively trying to help Kaladin. Which is most likely why the Kaldolin bromance is the most popular choice on the poll so far. After Adolin learned everyone around him was becoming a Radiant he seemed pleased, not jealous. I think he will have to deal with it his powerlessness compared to the others, but that plot will its course in OB. His insecurities about not being who everyone excepts him to be will be his story arc. And when he falls and his crime is discovered, I don't think he will be able to fight along side the others. Meaning he won't be able to fight at all, because as amazing as he is put him up against someone like Szeth and he is child fighting with a stick. The enemies that are coming are as strong or stronger than Szeth. Adolin will not be able to keep up as he is. In Dalinar's visions the Radiants and their squires were the successful fighters. People like Adolin were cannon fodder. And all those bad@sses I compared Adolin to normally either gained more power or became redundant as the stakes grew. Consider Han Solo in the Return of the Jedi. He was mostly getting rescued in that movie. As for Batman, when he has to deal with super enemies, he hides and then uses their weakness or a gadget to bring down his enemy. That is not Adolin's style. He is too direct currently for that kind of fighting. I do think Adolin needs a spren to stay relevant in the books. Once the fall of Adolin arc runs its course in OB, I think he will be out in Roshar reviving his blade. As for @maxal arguments that he could work fine as an Edgedancer, he convinced me. Not a hard thing to do though. I want Adolin to revive his shardblade.

Consider all the times he spoke about what his severed arm was doing. He was aware he had one arm, but this claimed the other one and so got it back.

If the spren even remembers. I think once it gets it mind back all it will remember from the time it was dead is pain if anything at all. Personally, I hope it just forgets all that and has fun teaching Adolin to slip and slide.

I don't know. I hope we find out in a month and a half.

If the pain is ceaseless then I hope they can restore all the blades. But do they feel it when they aren't summoned? I know Syl said that they live a little only when they are summoned. I would think in an un-summoned state they wouldn't feel anything. There is no way to know for sure.

@Calderis You are right, Pattern and Shallan are not talking about restoring shardblades in that scene, but they do discuss restoring killed spren. If I remember correctly, Pattern said his kind had tried to restore dead spren and then speculated it would be possible if their Radiants still lived, but for they had never been successful in restoring them. I don't have time to look it up now, but I believe they had this conversation at Dalinar's complex just after Shallan returned from the chasms. Thank you for looking up the WOB. Yes restoring them would free them from pain, but awaking them up to reset them so a new data jack could be installed would likely hurt. Agree, I am mostly speculating. Still Brandon would need to give us new information on how restoring a blade would work. Fortunately this is coming Nov. 14th. This does not solve the issue as to whether or not Adolin could be an Edgedancer.

1. It has always been my favorite. 2. I find it less interesting and slightly redundant within the existing narrative. We do not need another "traditional" Radiant within our viewpoints, let's make Adolin the "unusual one". Actually Roshar needs a plethora of traditional Radiants if it is to survive. I share your preference. I'd like Adolin to bring his blade back to life and learn his or her name. It's just Shallan asked if such things were possible and Pattern said it was unlikely without the Radiant the spren originally bonded with. A WOB said waking up one of those blade would be agony for the spren. Their would not work right. Like a computer that has had it's hard drive ripped out. I think when the spren bond, they gain part of the mind and personality of their Radiant. Pattern says he is getting his sense of humor from Shallan. Now it is not impossible for Adolin to revive his blade, but considering this information it is highly improbable. My guess is the blade would need to be resist some how and then choose Adolin of it's own free will. This could be a problem because we know that blade is a cultivation spren from WOB again. Adolin might not be Edgedancer material. He is a bit more broadminded than Lift, so I don't know if he shares the Edgedancer temperament. Also, do we want Adolin as the second Edgedancer? Lift will be the main Edgedancer. She already has her own novella and another novel is coming in the back 5. Adolin would end up as Lift's foil, yet again. It might better if he draws a spren from an order we have not seen yet. Then Adolin could stand as the audience's representative of that order. Adolin could be an Edgedancer, and it would be awesome if he restored his blade, but I want him to be of another order. Oh well, in the end I will be happy no matter what. I trust Brandon.

@maxal I agree that his personality is not like Han Solo's. I did say Batman as well and Han Solo and Bruce Wayne are nothing alike. That choice is asking if you want Adolin to stay the normal one among the magic users who can fight on their level because he is just that good. Black Widow from the Avengers and Perrin and Matrim from the Wheel of Time series could also be examples of trope. However, I agree, unless he becomes a radiant, I don't see how his story progresses. Brandon could surprise me, but it would have to be one heck of a surprise. Adolin has always been a foil to one of the other characters. For Dalinar he was there to point out where Dalinar could be wrong. For Shallan, he is a tie to the Kholin family. They are cute together, but that was his main purpose with Shallan. Finally, with Kaladin he was someone who could be a friendly revival and yet another lightteyes who proved people with his eye color were not all corrupt jerks. But Adolin has never really had an arc that wasn't tied to someone else, except when he killed Sadeas. I think the only way he will stay relevant in this new world of thunderclasts and voidbinders is for him to become a radiant. Also, I will be annoyed if all the hints of Adolin becoming a radiant lead to nothing. I think it will happen one of two ways. 1. He revives his shardblade,though Brandon will need to have a good explanation on how this is possible. Everything we learned in WoR about shardblades and some WOBs have lead me to believe this is unlikely. It is the method I hope for, but I will not be surprised if it does not happen. 2. Adolin is exiled and he gives his father his shardblade before he leaves. After he has broken the bond another spren comes along, who had been waiting for him to get rid of the blade. The only two characters with the Nale bond have had another shardblade at the same time. Renarin was bonded to Glys before he got his first shardblade. He was writing on the wall before Adolin won the blade, which suggests he already had some radiant ablitlies. The other is Dalinar and the stormfather was very reluctant to bond him and demanded he break the bond with his shardblade soon after. Adolin may have a spren waiting for him to let go of the dead blade so it can bond with him.

He did not compare Syl cheering him up the way Tien did, but he has compared Syl to Tien before. WoK chapter 46 "Child of Tanavast" pg 593 He has also watched Syl many times and felt better afterward. But I may have confused the above statement with him thinking the same thing of Syl that he thought of Shallan. Still, being like is brother is not enough for a good relationship. However, if Brandon makes it work, I wouldn't mind. That was the point of this thread. But until then I prefer Adolin and Shallan.

Fair enough, but that makes her no more special than Syl. I think it was seeing someone broken able to still smile that made him happy. I agree he has a crush on her because of this, but he has had other women in his life who could do that, including his spren.

She can be a good friend and help him feel good. Because she can push back the gloom does not mean they would make a good couple. Syl can also push back Kaladin's gloom. I guess they are meant to be.

So you want him to be a KR @maxal?

What do you want to happen to Adolin. I want him to remain a relevant character in the story. I don't like the idea of everything going great for him and him just being a highprince happily married to Shallan. That would be boring. Want him to face consequences for killing Sadeas both good and bad. I want him to be exiled, but then revive his Blade and become an Edgedancer. Then he can return to Urithru as a fellow Knight Radiant and get back together with a more mentally healthy Shallan. That's what I want. What do you want to happen?

Very true. If it were a simple matter of breathing in Stormlight, Kaladin would no longer have scars on his forehead. Lopen regrew his arm because he never saw himself as not having that arm as a part of him in someway. Kaladin healed because he still saw himself as a spearman and a surgeon when Szeth cut his arm. So self perception is important. Also, Oathbringer spoilers.

When I wrote the original post it was to Shadolin shippers showing they need not fear the idea of Kaladin and Shallan together. So the post might have had a bit of a Shadolin lens when looking at the three characters in romantic relationships. That does not mean Kaladin is just a prop for those of us who prefer Adolin and Shallan together. The preference is like flavors of ice cream. Saying I prefer chocolate to strawberry ice cream does not mean that I hate strawberries in general. SA is not a romance. Kaladin is not defined as a character by whether or not he ends up with Shallan. He is only now getting to a place where he could think of courting someone. Kaladin is fantastic no matter who he ends up with. I was giving the Shadolin shippers a way for Shalladin to exist and still have the story end up with their favorite pairing. But just so you Shalladin shippers feel represented, here is your happy ending. Adolin gets exiled. Kaladin courts Shallan but Shallan learns that he killed Heleran and breaks up with him. They both learn from the experience. Adolin returns as a KR. He and Shallan get together again. At same time she forgives Kaladin and they become good friends. Adolin goes on a mission with Kaladin and both are assumed lost. Shallan is heart broken to think she lost both of them. Then Kaladin returns with Adolin's body. They mourn this great loss together, but Shallan is glad that Kaladin survived. In their grief over Adolin they find love. They get married and have ten babies. And then somewhere along the way they solve that desolation problem. There, a scenario with a Shalladin happy ending. Okay. That's all from me. I'll let Brandon take it from here.

@Elena.. I just find it frustrating that some who read my original post assume that I don't care about Kaladin because I have a slight preference for Adolin and Shallan being together. They make a cute couple and it is refreshing to not have the main hero end up with the main heroine. The point of my thread was, IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO ENDS UP WITH WHOM BECAUSE BRANDON WILL MAKE THE STORY AWESOME ANYWAY! That those demanding Brandon not consider pairing Kaladin and Shallan for even a paragraph should chill. Brandon could make it work and not make it dull and trite. That was my point. I personally do not think Kaladin and Shallan will work for reasons I have stated several times now. That said if they end up together, great. I would be sad for Adolin, but I would be happy for Shallan and Kaladin if they could make it work. So I am sorry my post offended you in any way. SA are awesome books, currently my favorites, but they are just books. I should have kept my shardplate on. Shippers. Oy Vey.

Sigh.... Anyone who thinks I was advocating Shalladin would just be a prop to help Shadolin missed my point. My point was to avoid the dreaded love triangle and allow Shallan a chance to be with both Adolin and Kalladin in turn. If Kaladin and Shallan were in a relationship, I'd be very disappointed in Shallan if she just dumped Kal for no reason. I think Kaladin and Shallan are doomed to fail in a relationship because Kaladin hasn't told Shallan "by the way, I killed your brother." I'm certain she will not find out the truth from Kaladin. When Shallan finds out from someone else that it was Kaladin who killed Heleran that will end his chance at courting her. Kaladin will be hurt by this, but he will grow from it. He will learn he need to admit to the people he cares about the truth. The relationship will help Kaladin as much as Shallan. I wouldn't want them together if that were not the case. So Kaladin's feelings weren't being ignored by me. I just don't believe they can make it unless Kaladin tells Shallan the truth and I don't think he will. It wouldn't be as good of a story if he did and it would be out of character for him. How would he even start the conversation? "Sit down Shallan. Now your brother was a murdering jerk and I had to protect Amaram so I killed him." Yeah that will go over well with her. I worry about them being able to stay friends once she learns the truth, let alone be in a relationship. Yeah, I was a bit shocked when this idea was suggested as well. I think there are a lot of Shadolin shippers who would still prefer Adolin dead over Kaladin. Actually, I don't want either of them dead if it can be avoided. I think it is funny how these forums have changed. Their was a lot of Adolin hate on the forums before WoR. I think when Adolin did the exact opposite of what Amaram did and allowed Kaladin to give away his shards, many who once disliked Adolin loved him. He had helped Kaladin heal just a little and allowed Kaladin to start to have a friend who was an equal. This is where a lot of the Kaladolin shipping came from as well. So we began to realize he was the great guy the Adolin fans had yelled he was for years. The Adolin haters melted away, but the Adolin defenders, hardened by years of having to defend their guy stayed as loud as ever. I see why new posters might assume the majority here are pro-Adolin and anti-Kal. I know this is not the case, but I understand the misconception.

This was my original idea. Kal courts her, they don't work out, Shallan realizes she loved Adolin all along. And then he returns with his revived blad...okay enough of that.

I call them all listeners. That is what they called themselves before they were given their literal slave name, parshmen. Parshendi is derogatory if you think about it: parshmen who can think. Well they can all think now. So they are listeners. Even if they can't hear the rhythms, which I personally think that can but I'm guessing, that doesn't change their species. They are still listeners. So, I call them the listeners. However, others may call them what they wish. It's personal preference as long as everyone understands what you mean. If you start calling them green gorillas the rest of us might get a bit lost.

I don't think Kaladin cares so much about Gaz anymore. He doesn't think about as much as he does other people. He doesn't like him, but he is more indifferent to him at this point. I think deep down Kaladin knows Gaz is the way he is because of the pressures that were placed on him. Now Shallmaram that would cause a storm in Kaladin.

Burn it! Burn it with fire!

Coming?