SwordNimiForPresident

A Fullborn could easily rip drones out of the sky, Wax anchored an entire airship. Why would a Fullborn have to stop? That’s literally what makes them so powerful, the fact that they never have to stop. Their abilities form an infinite power loop. To be clear, your plan is to shoot someone moving at hundreds of miles per hour with long range artillery? I don’t know if you have any real life experience with artillery, but I can tell you that it doesn’t work that way. The FO spots the target and calls in a location to the Fire Control Center. The FCC calculates the angles and distance using maps and GPS (neither of which will be available). The FCC relays the targeting info to the Fire Team, who then load and fire the shot. The FO then spots that shot and calls the FCC to either repeat or adjust their angles. It would be utterly useless against a single person running faster than the human eye can track. An even more pressing issue. How did you manage to set up several brigades worth of artillery pieces without anyone noticing. We are talking about hundreds or even low thousands in terms of soldiers, and several thousand tons of equipment. You wouldn’t even get a sandbag filled before the Fullborn was in your midst killing you like ants, let alone get a shot off. edit: I also realized that I was ignoring Scadrials scariest weapon, the faceless immortals. They could infiltrate is with ease and replace our leaders. From there they just start an internal conflict with another world power (who is also controlled by a Kandra). Mire us in internal conflict to the point that we are even more useless than usual. It wouldn’t even be a challenge, half of us are looking for an excuse to destroy anyone different from us to begin with.

I didn’t even consider using Aon Tia. They could use it to drop a rock on us and sit back to enjoy the show.

To be clear, I said nukes can’t break Aons. This is a fact, it is literally in the text. We later learn that the Gradget of Dakhor can also break Aons with their magic. I suspect a chromium misting might also be able to do it. Elantrians don’t need to fear nukes because nukes can’t break their magic system. If you don’t break their magic system, you cannot kill them short of complete anihalation. Mistborn worry about stone arrows because they do not have the unlimited healing abilities of Elantrians or gold compounders. If anything, a war that threatens to kill their families is more likely to motivate them to live, even if it’s just to save the people they care about.

Sure we don't see them use Aon Dor outside of Sel, it's very nature makes that impossible. But in Secret History they demonstrate the power to steal a Shard. I can't think of something more powerful than that. It doesn't matter how rare they are, you only really need one. The issue is that you are talking about targeting them with artillery and aircraft. In real life both of these things depend on forward observers. If the FO literally can't see the Fullborn because they can move faster than sight. How are you going to target them? You literally cannot hit them with your conventional weapons. Rashek worried about guns because he was a lazy slob. He recognized that any idiot can shoot a gun with very little training. He didn't want to put such a powerful weapon into the hands of potential revolutionaries who might be able to overpower his armies. If they beat his armies, he is stuck killing them all himself. Like I said, lazy slob. Again, bombing from altitude only works if you have eyes on the ground. Artillery rounds are actually pretty much hollow shells filled with high explosive. They mostly depend on the environment for shrapnel. Thermite would be effective if you could land a hit (you can't) Napalm would be useless. It would be our death while inflicting zero cuts. We literally could not hit them, we do not have the means to do so. Without them the rest of the planet poses a logistical nightmare. How do you run supply lines for millions of soldiers across space? At our current tech levels, its a challenge to keep the handful of people in the ISS supplied. We established that we have FTL not that we also invented space elevators with billion ton weight limits.

I guess it would come down to whether on not he can eat his own "body weight" (or nearly as much) in Investiture. Personally I think he would get "drunk" first, though that would probably leave the Unmade in a pretty bad way.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree on Elantrians. I found it on the web. Looks like the authors name is Benjamin Hill. All credit to him. There is nothing that you can do to Arelon that Elantrians can't fix. Nuclear fallout can be transformed into literally anything else. Biological weapons can be wiped out with even a basic healing Aon. There is ample evidence that Elantrians can leave Elantris, Arelon, and even Sel and still use their magics. We have seen them in Teod, and the CRs of Scadrial and Roshar. They use their magic in one form or another in all three places. They are certainly hindered by their tether to Elantris, but they are hardly stuck there. We have zero protection from their attacks. They could just play the long game and kill us slowly. It wouldn't even be hard. Break into one of our nuclear facilities, launch a nuke at another country, watch us destroy ourselves. Game over. You're using conventional weapons with aluminum ammo against someone that can almost outrun bullets. How do you trap someone with compounded zinc? They can basically stop time and evaluate a situation. Fire absolutely does not kill them. Remember that Rashek (the most incompetent Fullborn) walked out of a burning building as little more than a skeleton and regrew his flesh in seconds. Miles blew himself up with tnt and was fully healed seconds later. You will run out of fuel before they run out of health. Aluminum only presents a mild problem, assuming that you managed to hit them in the first place, they simply have to rip the bullet out before the wound will close. They can store their sense of touch in a tinmind and use pewter enhanced fingers to rip out any aluminum. Roshar - No way to contend with the Highstorm. The Radiants could raid you in every Highstorm as well. Unlimited Stormlight and your whole army is stuck taking shelter. They either come out and fight, and die in the storm, or they stay hidden and die to Jasnah. Nukes would be useless, literally everyone lives in bunkers. Also, once they realized nukes were possible, Jasnah and Dalinar could combo their powers and start Soulcasting them onto your armies. Try to win that arms race. Nalthis - Maybe. D'denir seem pretty resilient. You wouldn't get any value out of your nukes against an army of stone dudes, the radiation would be meaningless for them. If they start mass producing type fours, things could get really bad. I'd say we stand a chance here. Taldain - Honestly don't know enough to weigh in. From what I've seen, we could probably take them. First - Haven't seen enough of the magic. Don't know how powerful it can get. From what we have seen so far, we could take them. Threnody - I don't think we could deal with the Shades. I think the story in Arcanum takes place pretty far in the past too. By the time Era 2 rolls around I think Threnody has advanced quite a bit. There's the bit in Secret History where the Ire think that Threnody can pose a threat (anyone that is a threat to Elantrians is worth worrying about), and the part in the Broadsheets where whats his face encounters a "Shade Blaster Pistol". Seems to me like they have some potential. Need more info to judge.

He is referring to Galadon's father, who died of hearth failure if memory serves. He effectively decided to stop living. I imagine it has to do with the whole "Being an Elantrian is harder" thing. He is not saying that they are susceptible to disease and other mundane injuries, hence the whole "surviving decapitation" thing.

The can survive decapitation as @Truthless of Shinovar noted in his post. We have nukes that can level buildings and kill people with radiation burns at those distances. Neither of those things would hurt an Elantrian who, as previously noted can survive nearly any injury up to and including decapitation. After the first attack they would be aware of the threat and use AonDor to eradicate any hostiles. I have no way to estimate how many people a Fullborn could kill in a day, there are to many variables. It depends on how you arrange them and what they are wearing. As for the soldiers, our troops are kind enough to wear little metal chains around their necks with a pair of stamped metal tags hanging right over their hearts. A duralumin powered push in the middle of a formation would launch two metal projectiles through everyone's heart, and decapitate them. Again, the Fullborns would not need to burn gold, as we have no way to target them with our weapons. They move faster than human eyes are capable of processing. Air superiority last for exactly as long as it takes a Fullborn to rip your entire airforce out of the sky with double iron and duralumin. As I have pointed out on several occasions, they would not need gold. If they did, they idea that they could use an entire planets supply within a human lifetime is ridiculous. As to becoming a savant, they would really only be burning metals in short bursts to kill our armies. Everything else would be pre stored attributes that any compounder would have simply by virtue of their arts. If for some reason they needed to refill a metalmind, it would take a very small amount of metal to do it. edit: I have no idea why this double posted. I'm not sure how to remove it. Mods plez halp.

They would probably survive it with F-gold as long as they weren't directly in the vaporization zone. As we have seen with Wax, they can tap gold even when dead as long as they are still in the Cognitive realm. I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion. In your own post you note that they can survive "fatal injuries".

I never implied that a steelrunner could outrun a nuclear explosion, simply outrun the missile. We see Paalm run fast enough that she is nothing more than a blur at multiple points in Era 2. Someone moving that fast through an army and blowing it to pieces with steel and duralumin would destroy it in seconds. Everything in there about Elantrians only proves my point. Basically unkillable. The bit about Raoden going fuzzy was before he fixed AonDor.

I think you are missunderstanding how nuclear weapons work. There is a very small space directly beneath where it is detonated where people that are out doors could be vaporized. The rest of the death is due to radiation burns/poisoning and building collapse/fires. None of those things pose even a minor threat to an Elantrian. They wouldn't need any Aons to survive, their passive ability to heal would be way more than enough. All you would succeed in doing is killing their friends and loved ones, though even then it would only be the ones that died before the Elantrians could heal them. Really all you would be doing is making the most powerful non Shard magic users in the Cosmere extremely angry. That an all of the cosmetic damage to the city. If you killed all of the people, then all of their stuff would just being lying around for the Fullborns to use, including any metal they owned. Again, you've succeeded in provoking one of the most power beings in the Cosmere into driving your species to extinction.

A single Elantrian could kill a limitless number of human soldiers. The solders could not harm the Elantrians in a meaningful way. As I previously established, nuking Elantris would probably not kill any of the Aon Dor users, excluding if one somehow managed to be outside and close enough to the epicenter to be vaporized. Anything less than that can not kill them. They have an almost unlimited ability to heal passively. They can simply tap electrum if the trauma of killing gets to them (not that they would need to, Marsh and Kelsier have seen some seriously messed up stuff). They literally never need to store Feruchemical powers, they are compounders. I can't actually imagine any of them ever needing to tap gold. They could completely dismantle our armies with allomantic steel and duralumin. One push and thousands of soldiers are killed. Add to this that they can move between groups at the speed of compounded steel and it is unlikely that our soldiers would ever even encounter theirs before being killed by something that they cant see. Again, they wouldn't even need to worry about gold because our armies would be dead almost the instant they came into conflict with Scadrial's protectors. For the reasons I have already listed, this is not an accurate depiction of the conflict. There would be no drawn out war of attrition. A few of their most powerful people would kill our entire force in minutes. As I said in my original response, a single Elantrian or Fullborn could likely drive our entire species to extinction in a matter of days.

This is not correct. A quick google will tell you that there are approximately 3750 active nuclear weapons on Earth. While this is certainly enough to end our civilization, it is not enough to have any real impact on the geography of our world. Even a hypothetical nuclear winter wouldn’t hold a candle to the bonfire of volcanic or impact event winters. Why would lack of food or radiation harm an Elantian or Fullborn?Elantrians do not require food and can heal from nearly any injury without even making an Aon. Fullborn do not require food either. All they would need is gold and cadmium. If it’s Kelsier we’re talking about, he doesn’t even need that. You literally can’t kill him. If you destroy his body he will just return to the Cognitive realm and plot your demise. No matter what, we lose.

In order to get the element of surprise you would need real time intel on this individuals location. It’s just not believable. Especially for the only confirmed Fullborn that is currently alive in the Cosmere. Being hypersonic would necessitate ceramics for the outside of the missile. If you can invent a rocket engine that doesn’t contain any metal though, there is probably a Nobel prize in it for you. Rashek is not the only Fullborn. There’s Kelsier, literally anyone holding the Bands of Morning, maybe Spook, and Marsh, who is close enough that he gets a T-shirt. As for the rest, my understanding was that it was our world as it is now plus FTL vs the Cosmere. Not Starfleet vs the Cosmere, not the United Nations of Earth vs the Cosmere and not the Defiant vs the Cosmere. North Korea doesn’t have hypersonic weapons. Yes, one MAGIC user who is capable of blocking Investiture should be able to disrupt an Aon, though on as large as Elantris may be beyond their scope. A completely non magical nuclear weapon will have absolutely zero impact on the magic. The city was built in the shape of the Aon. The Aon can be drawn on anything, the ground, a city wall, dust, air or even vacuum I imagine. Destroying the city will destroy the city. Without magic, you cannot destroy the Aon. I don’t know where you got the information that they don’t go outside the city. We see almost the entire population go to Teod to fight a battle. I imagine many of them will view the city as a prison and want to spend time away from it from time to time. Either way, catching all of them in the vaporization zone seems like a pipe dream. The difference between Arelon and Elantris is that there’s a big Aon drawn on Elantris, and a city built in the same shape. Why would the Elantians be Hoed? They would simply revert to their “zombie” selves for as long as it took one of them to place a dot at the right spot in the Elantris crater. edit: Speaking craters, I encourage you to google the Sedan Crater. At 390 meters it is the largest one in the United States caused by a nuclear bomb. It is nowhere near large enough to change the shape of the region in which it resides. Additionally, it is the result of a ground detonation. You normally air burst nuclear weapons to maximize their effectiveness. The do not leave craters when detonated in this way. Essentially your stuck with blowing it up on the ground in hopes of destroying Aon Dor (effectively impossible given the scale) and significantly reducing the impact of the bomb, or air bursting it and leaving all of the Elantrians alive and at full power.

So to be clear, you’re going to invent a device that will tell exactly where all of the burnable metal on the planet is, and the nuke those places. Good plan, though it does have the small snag of being completely and comically impossible. Why would they allow us time to stockpile weapons? They would just send their demigod to kill us all. For Elantris, how hard is it to locate a giant crater where your city used to be? Even if it did break Aons, it wouldn’t kill the Elantians because they would just revert to Reod era Elantriants. I guess you’re assuming that you will somehow catch all of them in the vaporization zone? Again, good plan. Good luck pulling it off.

At most that would create a crater. Even if that did alter the shape of Aons, it would be a simple matter of adding a dot.

There aren’t enough nukes in existence to “burn a continent”. The “vaporization zone” of even our most powerful nukes aren’t all that big when talking on planetary scale. Most of the deaths happen from radiation poisoning and internal thermal burns. Neither of those things presents a problem to a gold compounder.

How exactly are you planing on targeting this person with your weapons? They move faster than sight and might even be able to move faster than your hypothetical hypersonic nukes. Additionally, those nukes have metal components and could easy be ripped to shreds by a Fullborn.

For the first part about Scadrial, I would never use Rashek as an example. He is grossly incompetent. Easily the worst possible candidate for an power, let alone Fullborn status. Secondly, your idea seems to center on the idea of a surprise attack, so where did we get all this intel that lets us know exactly where we should be attacking? Thirdly, wtf prompted us to launch apocalypse level surprise attack against another civilization? Fourth, how did one of our nuclear powers manage to get hypersonic nuclear weapons into space without prompting nuclear destruction of our own planet? As to nuking Elantris, destroying the city would have zero impact on the underlying Aon. It was drawn by Elantrians and can only be broken by them (or a massive change in the shape of Arelon, the Gradget of Dakhor, or maybe someone burning chromium). Wiping away an Aon does not destroy it.

I see no reason that Aon Edo wouldn’t block a nuke. Additionally, nuking Elantris wouldn’t break the Aon or kill the Elantrians, only civilians would die. As for a Fullborn, they could kill tirelessly, basically forever, at the speed of compounded steel. They could probably kill everyone on the planet in less that a year.

Everyone saying that we could beat the Cosmere in a war is high. A single fullborn or Elantrian could make our entire species extinct. Surgebinders literally destroyed their home planet. That's not even counting what happens when the Shards get involved. Sazed could probably delete our entire solar system with a thought.

I’m curious about what your criteria for the characters from The Silmarillion was. They’re the only ones I’m familiar with.

I imagined it as medieval style armor. I was very surprised by the animu style in Shallan’s drawings. I’m hoping that since living blades can change their shape the plate can too. I wanna see a Radiant running around in the Doom Marine’s armor.

Use Abrasion on a projectile and it will penetrate through an almost limitless number of targets. Use Gravity on a spiked log to roll it through an enemy formation. Combo time. Use lateral Gravity on two weights at slightly oblique angles to one another. Connect them with a fine metal wire and coat it with Abrasion. Directed at the enemy ranks, it should cut them all in half or decapitate them depending on how high off the ground you launched it.

I'm a little late to the party, but I want to point out that during Dilaf's PoV at the battle in Teoras he remarks to himself that he is the only one of the monks capable to breaking and resisting Aons. If it was easy to make more like him, it's hard to imagine them not doing it. It is also worth noting that he isn't actually immune to Aons, but rather just more resistant that a regular monk. He even dodges out of the way of the Aon Daas that killed most of his men because he knows he cant survive them. A final point, we never see Dilaf break a full power Aon. Instead, he break Raoden's illusion before Elantris is restored, and breaks Raoden Aon Edo while in Teod, which is in the outer limit of Elantris' range.