elihaun

My thought was that, since she gains Investiture from calories, that she now has WAY more access to food then she ever had. She is not limited by a gem holding the light, so she theoretically has access to a LOT more of it. Also, Cultivation probably has something to do with it, but also maybe cultivation was able to do something with it because she just innately has a lot of spiritual energy? maybe she is just... Awesome Maybe THAT is the part of honor that Ishar has? the wind did not call out to Kaladin from the west until ishar went to the west. It was not 'free' until ishar had his lapse due to Navani's oath. Maybe Ishar could not predict/see kaladin before because Kaladin was to close to himself, or the power of the wind. Ishar thinks of himself as the stormfather, and if he had the wind itself as a spren/prisioner, then that makes a LOT more sense. we know that there was SOME kind of deal made. Meraize gave Rebonial the silver necklace and sand as a gift when trying to make a deal, and it is natural to assume the deal went through.

I think the three primal spren are the 'moons' personified. Over time the 3 became legend, their stories were told over and over until the names were lost to time, and then those legends were associated with the three moons instead

Ah, but Taravangian did not make the deal, the DIAGRAM made the deal (I think the wording was 'the diagram will serve you' or something along those lines). And the diagram is more than just Taravangian, no? So, they WOULD have some power in the contract if Taravangian decided to attack Kabranth.

So, I don't feel like I have seen ANYHTING about Kharbranth in any of the theories. But it is SUPER important I feel. How will Taravangian be able to keep this promise AND the deal made with Dalinar? What if someone from Kharbranth was picked as the champion? What are we overlooking? The fact taht this section where Taravangian made a deal with odium seems super important, and its something that I feel was added on purpose, not just by happenstance

I think this is true, because Illital started talking to shallan in Alethi BEFORE she pulled the hood off. I think she knew before she even left the main room. They were playing her. And she had more than enough opportunity to shoot shallan, but waited. I think they knew what they were doing

I assumed that the blue skinned woman was Syl?

So, I have FINALLY caught up with chapter 30 of the preview chapters. It seems that Illatil is moving in a direction not aligned to the ghost bloods, and that has got me thinking. Why does she want to find BAM? My prediction: if BAM is a investiture with an intent (as all spren are in a way), then could she be 'killed' and picked up? What would happen if someone ascended not to a shard of aldanisum, but to an unmade's power? that person would be equivalent to a demigod (think Perseus, Heracles, etc.), no? Has Brando even mentioned if it was possible to accend to a lesser gods power?

i think this too. First wave went to shinivar, and second+ waves went to the horneater peaks.

im about half your age, but I feel this. My mom died while I was reading RoW, and honestly, I could not listen for a long while. reading about kaladin going through loss and depression was WAY to close to home for me. But when I finally forced myself to finish it 6 months later, it made me feel like a weight was lifted. anyway, I say all this because I had bought my mom the Mistborn audiobook (my favorite brando sando series) to listen to. She will never get to finish the series. it makes me sad to know that I will never get to discuss the ending of hero of ages with her. But its not the destination that matters: its the journey.

I think if you mix cultivation and passion/odium, you get discipline. Think of bootcamp: grueling, emotional training that makes you grow and adjust. Its not quite WAR like Odium+ Honor that is all about KILLING for what you believe, but it is just as dangerous. Discipline would be different from Devotion or domination. a never ending war would be perfect for a discipline shard, as cultivation is more about pruning than anything else. Imagine an army full of Kaladins (not him, but people like him), people with Passion and hatred of light eyes (or in this case, other shards) that are forced to adapt and change or die on a daily basis. It would be an army like the cosmere has never seen

So, crossbows use bolts instead of arrows (I know it is pedantic, but still). I think the 'arrows' are just the parshendi arrows from the Way of Kings when they were running bridges.

I think THIS is the thing that is doing it. The endings/begings of the books should have been pushed forward/back to make the pacing and anticipation between books a bit better. I am loving the preview chapters, but I will agree they do not feel as 'weighty' as the first book. Reading through WoK if FEELS like you are on the platoue for years living through the horrors. THAT is what made the end of the book stand out so much, because it was not about action scene after action scene: it was about one defining moment (one for Kaladin, one for shallan with the assassination attempt). Oathbringer in comparison has 4-5 of those moments (King Elokhar dieing, the fight at Thelana Fields, the Fight with the nightmother, Taravagian and Odium, etc). Instead of the whole book leading up to ONE super important life changing scene, you get a bunch of (arguably just as important plot wise) large scenes crammed into one book, removing the LONG buildup for each edit: Its almost like he is trying to cram the entire plot of Wheel of time, with all of its interconnected plots and characters, into 5 books instead of the WoT's 14 books

This^. I have a feeling that Shallan will have some weird stuff happening in the next book. Also, in the contract with Odium, how will corrupted spren fit in? the spren use odium's power (it is implied), but if someone is acting against odium, how will that affect the contract? Could that be a loophole? If Renarien takes control of, say, thelania, then Odium (not teravangium; ODIUM) has some control of the country. Would that satisfy the contract? Not saying it will (Highly doubt it), but it is a thought

Reading the title, I thought you were going to suggest that Radiant (Shallan's alter ego) was a full-blooded ghostblood. That would be an interesting idea! Not just in the killing of Ialai, but imagine if she has been able to manifest physically for a while? she could have been working counter to what shallan/veil wanted the whole time, and since Radient does not need to be bound to shallans body, it would be VERY subtle. Also, does Radient ever use Pattern, or does she just use testament? could it be possible that she has oaths separate from Shallan? (reminds me of the Ted Dekker book 'Thr3e'. Not a great book, but a novel idea). As for the actual ideas, I think that the ghost bloods would want powers that could be 'masked' in other lands. Highspren/honor spren would work on scadrial, since they can pretend to be misborn (flying especially, but also the windrunners ability to use 'gravity' to fake coinshots with spren-coins), but truthwatchers or edgedancers would work well on Nalthis. I think they would try their best to pick spren based on how well they could hide on other planets. heck, a Truth watcher would be PERFECT on first of the sun due to their future sight.

So... Where does it actually say that Honor can only be picked up by someone who does not want power? I feel that this line of thinking is starting to go along the lines of the one ring (wanting the power will corrupt you) or the Sorcerers stone (or philosophers stone) from Harry Potter, where wanting the power means you cant find it The thing is, Kaladin has shown MANY times that he DOES want power: the power to save the ones he loves. Yes, his oath makes him admit that he CANT save everyone, but that does not mean that he does not want to. I feel that if kaladin DID get the shard, then he will pull a lord ruler and mess things up more but with good intentions. It is against his nature to get the power and do nothing with it

I shall create "Bonk", a duel hammer user with everything put into my physical abilities, and my friend spren will be a Concentration spren. The friendly little spren will appear EVERY time Bonk tries to speak with others, as doing so takes a LOT of concentration for him (usually he just grunts)

Szeth is not Nomad though? Isn't nomad Sigzil?

This part makes a lot of sense, because in Oathbringer the stormfather says that honor in his last days raved about the dawnshards, 'ancient weapons used to destroy the tranqualine halls'. It would make sense that Ishar had one of the dawn shards

I wonder if it is racism against humans in general, or humans that serve Honor? I think some of it (the desire to wipe them out) has to do with the fact that humans are unpredictable. they cant control them like they can the singers. I am not 100% set on how it would work, but we DO have a president for it (dalinar, and the void-spren that appear human). As for the Contest of champions, Dalinar would be an avatar, right? so, by winning Odium gains the abilty to leave the system without leaving the system. Also, since Dalinar is defacto leader of the coalition and leader of Urithiru, if Odium wins doesnt that also mean he kind of wins those by default?

This is the think I think is wrong with the assumptions. Odium wants to make dalinar a fused that will serve him forever. That implies that humans CAN be fuzed. so, maybe all of the fuzed are humans? I have thought for a long time that the fuzed are hiding something. When the parsmen see the voidspren they have noted that they take the form of men. I think that is the thing people are missing: the servents of odium ARE men.

I am rereading oathbringer (listening on audible, but whatever) for the 3rd or 4rd time in prep for WaT (should finish RoW again around thanksgiving!). Anyway! i JUST noticed that the area around Thaylan city is called the longbrow straights. Long brow. Because the Thaylans have long eyebrows. I should have noticed this right away, but didn't until YEARS later. Anyone else have some super obvious things they missed?

I had an idea: what if the 'unite them' is not in reference to the orders of radients, or honor, or even the nations. What if it is in reference to something that only a bondsmith can unite: something that was broken: the unmade. What if Dalinar is meant to unite the unmade, returning/transforming them. the unmade can change spren, so why couldn't a bondsmith change them as well? at least SOME of the visions are focused on the unmade, but what if they all were? The doubt that Noadon feels? the midnight essence? the battle rage that the men in the vision (the one gawks sees) experience? what if the point is Honor is expecting a war with the unmade, and wants his new bondsmith to unite/fix the unmade? (and this second idea is even more stupid) could the unmade be related to the heralds? There are 9 unmade, one for each Herald that broke their oath. Maybe Dailnar is meant to reunite the Heralds with unmade? (like I said, this one is almost 100% not what is going to happen, but it is an idea)

That's a LOT to think over! I have read some of the WoB, but there are so many that I have not seen. Thank you for all the info! I do have some follow-ups: on point 3: I was referring to the line in WoK, Chapter1: "That's one of Hallaw's officers. He might be the one" ... " regardless, he is a batallionlord, if we kill an officer that high, we are all but guaranteed to be in the next group sent to the shattered plains" That 'regardless' makes it seem that the reason to kill him in PARTICULAR was not because he was a brightlord, but because he was one of hallaw's officers. The being sent to the shattered plains was not the main objective, he was searching for 'the one'. I have assumed it was Kaladin trying to hunt down the brighteyes that lead the charge that killed Tien, but am not 100% sure On point 5: Where are you reading the chapters of WaT? I have read the prologue, but have not seen any other chapters. On point 6: you said 'They already have much better ways of using fabrials to create motion - the Bridge Four." But that wont help much. I am thinking more of actual ships: steam style engines, Internal combustion, etc. The issue with bridge four is the logistics. you have to have teams on the shattered plains to move the ship. Could 'wire' like the sibling uses in the tower be moved through a ship, and a soulcaster (person, not object) use it like one of the airships on Scadrial? instead of a machine to amplify pushing, you could use the ship to alternate states of matter powered by the soulcaster, giving thrust without the inherit issue with the bridge 4 fabrial on point 31: I think I was more interested in the idea of: can a spren change? Are they fated to be what they are, or is it possible to become a different kind of spren? It seems to me that the spren name themselves, but what if the idea changes over time? Men view honor differently then they did 4000 years ago, and I do think that is why some of the spren in Shadesmar in RoW act in ways we might consider dishonorable: because the way men view the concept has changed, the spren themselves have changed. the deadeyes don't change because they are dead, but what of others? COULD the spren become plate spren? On point 48: something seems off with that. Not ALL of the people affected by Ashertmarn are driven to mindlessly revel. The cult of moments walk around town and preach, telling people to give up their emotions. The guards don't revel, instead standing and feeling nothing but emptiness, proably because they don't wat to think of how they failed the people of the city (like moash and bridge 4). seems to me that the unmade works like alcohol: to some people it makes them excited and willing to partake in excess, and in others it dulls everything, leaving you numb on the inside. Other than those, I really like all the answers! I need to take time to just read ALL of the WoB, but it is a bit hard to find the time. I am hoping to finish my re-read around the time WaT comes out, so I am a bit excited.

So, I am doing a re-read (well, listen, as I am listening to the audiobooks as I work), and have been jotting down questions/thoughs as I move through the books. Sorry for the spellings, as I am listening and dont KNOW the spellings. Here we go... 1) Was the breaking of the oath pack (start of the way of kings) reminiscent of the shattering of aldanisum? They left, and agreed to not search out the others, just like the shards did. A literatury device? 2) Did Jasana start studying Urithiu/the knights radiant because of her spren, or did the spren find her because of the research? which came first, the chicken or the egg.....? 3) In all of Kaladins killings of brightlords while in Amarans army, did he actually kill the lighteyes that he was hunting for? Would he even know them when he saw them? 4) There is VERY little known of shalans mother. Could she had been a ghostblood, but NOT from roshar? Could she have been a worldhopper, and perhaps a twinborn (Sazed is known to store memories in his metalmind, then write it down when tapping it. could shalan be doing the same with her drawings?). I have also seen a theory that shallans mother is a herald 5) Related to the last point, could shalan be a gold misting/twinborn? It seems to be very similar to how she made veil and radiant: she imagined how she could have ended up if she had a different life. that sounds like what a gold misting does. It is also what she does with Bluth (the slaver): it says (paraphrasing) that she drew the man that Bluth COULD have been. that sounds like a gold misting 6) In WoK, we see that soul casting can displace the smoke, pushing it out due to difference in density. If you tried to turn something into, say, lead or perhaps plutonium, would it do the opposite, pulling air in? Could that be used to power engines? changing states of matter rapidly to achieve pulpulsion? (Turning air to a solid in the front of the ship and back into a gas at the aft, so that it sucks in and then pushes out, kind of how a turbine engine works) 7) In WoK, Syll can barely tote the Blackbane leaf. Now that she has spent more time in the physical realm, would she be able to move it easier, either by the fact that she is more in the physical realm/oaths, or perhaps due to just straight body training (muscle growth)? Could it be possible to take the gemheart from a singer or chasemfiend with a spren still trapped inside? Could they do that as a way to study the odd gravity spren that inhabits a chasemfiend? 9) Are the rocks that Tien finds with the paterns related to uritheru? There are also odd stratta in Kolinar. 10) In the first vision (WoK chapter 19: starfalls) the female edgedancer states that alethela learns to fight so that all other kingdoms might have peace. Were all/most of the radiants alethe? 11) Did the Stormfather pick dalinar (and gavilar?) because he was one of the only alethli who followed the codes? or just that they led? 12) What is the logistics of infusing gemstones inside the panalaem? it is underground, so they need the light to see, but to take all of the gems (which shallan belives is the royal treasury) outside every weeks seems dangerous. same for the kohlin emerald reserve. You would be forced to leave your treasury outside once every few weeks to keep them infused, but that seems off 13) Is stormlight addictive? investature in general? It sounds like people are going through withdrawls when they lose their powers. Kaladin seems to want to keep using the stormlight in WoR Ch. 68, when syl is acting weird due to moash and the shardblades. so is it like cocaine, where it gives you energy but the more you use it the more you WANT to use it? how would the addictiveness of stormlight have affected Teft if he had lived? in the same vain, could one become a 'savant' like spook, getting so used to the power that when it is taken away it numbs you? 14) Who did sigzil try to kill that caused him to be a Bridgeman? 15) Why did Jassna using the 'fake' soulcaster cause the smokestone to break if she was not actually using it? Nowhere else that I can think of has drawing stormlight resulting in broken gems (not many non-sphere gems at lease. I know that the gem beads in the parshendi beards are not covered in glass, and the ones they use to grow food often shatter, but cant remember any breaking that are encased in glass) 16) The gems used in buttons are 'cut', but do they hold light? i cant remember if the suit buttons/necklaces that the light eyes wear to feasts are said to glow 17) When would Jasanna have told shallan that she (jasanna) was a radiant? I assume she knows that a ward might figure it out in time. was she hoping to get her trained so that she could convince an ink spren to bond her? was she trying to, whether on purpose or not, found an order of radiant instead of just being a lone elsecaller? 18) Was there anything going on with the garnet brhome that kapsal tried to give shallan in return for her drawing? it seems a bit odd the way he insist she takes it. 19) Is there a 'limit' to how long before a spren comes you can say the words? if you say the words at age 5, will they still be acceptable at age 70? or do they have to be within a certain time frame. How FAST can a radiant advance? If someone who lived a long life of reflection said the oaths (Budha for example), would it be possible to just say the oaths quickly, or is there an internal timer before the next level can be spoken and accepted. 20) When entering shadesmar with an item, does the bead leave, or can be bead persist? can you use stormlight to grow an item from a bead while HAVING the original item there with you? does the bead follow you, or stay where you first transitioned into shadesmar? If you brought a chunk of ice, and then used the water making machine with the bead of that chunk of ice, would the machine stop working when the real ice melted, or would it continue? 21) How many bridge runs did kaladin do? was the final one, where they saved Dalinar, the 100th? 22) WoK, Chapter 61 - Could the legend of the woman climbing the mountain and making 10 children out of rocks be about cultivation opening the perpendulatiry in the horn eater mountains and allowing humans to enter roshar? It is implied over and over that honor was closely related to humans, but the storms and therefore the parshendi are related to him. Cultivation does not seem to have a 'connection' as it were with any of the native populations, unlike odium and honor. 23) The storms in the east are powerful enough to throw boulders and whip kaladin around like a rag doll. So, how do the wagons not get flipped? if it is like a normal wagon it would just tip over. it it was wider instead of tall but still had wheels it would cause a pocket underneath that would result in the wagon flying off like a kite. are there any illustrations of the slave wagons? 24) The soul cast meat/grains kind of sound/fell like soylent green. few WANT to eat it, but it is often all there is. 25) In WoR (CH18), an ardent states that Elokhar's second set of plate/blades were inherited from his father. How about the first set? Did he inherit both sets from his father (one given before his death and one taken after), or did he win them in a duel? (nevermind. It was a gift from Dalinar the day he almost attacked Gavilar and swore to never take the throne himself. Found it myself) 26) Other than Dalinar and Adolin, who in the war camps have a Roshadium? It never really mentions any other than those two and High Prince Hatham 27) By Rhythm of war, does Shallans brothers know that she killed their mother. They know she killed their dad, but do they know she killed the mother as well? 28) How is so little known about aluminum on roshar, considering it can be soulcast? 29) What happened to Hav? He was with amaran on the shattered plains, but not mentioned after. Also, What happened to the the Parshend's daughter that gave Kaladin the water skin? 30) Continuity error in the audiobooks - Words of Radiance, Chapter 52, 31:48 - Shallan says that even on tippy toes, she is shorter than the 'high prince', but amaran is a brightlord, not a high prince (well, not YET). Just a fun little accidental foreshadow I found 31) Once windspren become shardplate, are they still windspren, or are they now shardplate spren? is that why they dont care if they stay as plate, because they are no longer wind, and changing WOULD actually kill them (because they would be nothing)? 32) Was the Cremling that Marize killed with the blowgun (WoR, Ch 54) a part of one of the sleepless? are they watching the ghostbloods, and if so, why? 33) When did Kaladin say the first oath? 34) Of all of the times that Kaladin advanced his oaths, twice was when he thought he was going to lose syl (either fading because of Kaladin leting Moash assassinate Elokhar, or suppressed in the tower. second oath was when he thought he was about to lose all his men. Is there something to that? He has to be on the VERY close to losing everything to say the next words. Compare this to Teft, who only says his oaths when he is super down on himself, or lopen, who says it when he is incapable of being the center of attention. 35) What was the thing that kaladin saw in the storm when he and shallan was marooned 36) Szeth did not disobey Taravangian. The orders were: "stay away from the man with the honor blade, kill dalinar". As far as I can tell, Szeth has not ever face another with an honor blade, and he DID try to kill Dalinar. So, while he did fail the mission, he did not disobey 37) What happened to Redden (the Jakaved highprinces/king's bastart son)? will he make a play for the throne, now that Teravagian has gone missing? I always like him. He might have been hard, but he seemed to CARE about the Davar murder plot, and was emotional even delivering the killing blow to his father 38) We know that Jasana has killed or taken hits on MANY people. It is stated in the WoR prologue that she hires many assassins. How many of the ghost bloods did she kill before they decided to take her out? Marize implies that SHE was the first one to start the killing. Did they have spies that she killed, or was it an accidental coincidence, where the people that she thought were threating to her family just so happened to be part of the ghost bloods? 39) Who was the woman with king gavilar when eshonai found him in the palace while exploring? 40) Gavilar says that 'this world is traped, stuck in a dull lifeless state of transition'. That sounds a lot like what Raodon says about Elantris and the elantrians, being stuck mid-transition. did gavilar know about Sel? 41) Durring Dalinar and Navanis wedding, the storm father says that Navini has broken oaths before. What oaths? is it the "to love and cherish" part to her oath to Gavilar, or something deeper? 42) Shallan often notes that Pattern hums to different patterns that she interprets as confusion, joy, etc. Is pattern humming/pulsing to the rhythms of Roshar? 43) Abjectly speaking, are pain spren like the Cenobites? 44) As someone online one stated, the 'shin' sounds like the back of the work the "ashean" (not sure on spelling). Maybe, the shin WERE invited to roshar by the singers, but maybe the rest (alethi, vaden, etc), came from the horneater peaks by cultivation. that would make sense in the creation myth (woman makes people from mud at top of mountain). everyone always assumes that all humans have the same origins. Maybe they are NOT the same people. it is often stated that shin look different. well, maybe they ARE. To add to this, when Dalinar meets Odium for the first time in the feverstone keep vision (oathbrinager chapter 56) dalinar notes that odium looks shin 45) Maybe the Shin come not from Ashyn, but from Elantris? It is stated that the voidbringers brought their god, well, maybe the shin fled after the Destruction of D&D, and Odium followed? that could be why in art the shin resemble the elantrians more that other rosharians 46) In Oathbringer, Dalinar has to touch oathbringer (the sword) and notes that it does not scream, but 'whimper, the sound of a man backed into a corner". is this like Maya? could dalinar have renewed/healed Oathbringer if he didnt bond the stormfather? 47) How far up does the highstorm restore stormlight? is it at the edge of the atmosphere? the surface of the moons? Or does the investiture 'taper off', thinning out like the air getting thinner the further into the sky you go? 48) Could Moash be affected by the 'heart of the revel' MORE than just odium? In Oathbringer, Shallan hears it call to her to give it her pain, her fears, etc. That is what moash does. Maybe he is 'posessed' by the heart the same way Lin Davar was affected?

Gavilar also had void light. Heck, Kallidin had stormlight for months before he said the words or knew what to do consciously. It would not be a stretch that, even without saying the words, Gavilar could have been invested just due to his budding bond to the stormfather. But if Odium was watching (which I assume he was, as olum the voidspren knew what he was trying to do) HE could have saved him if he desired, as fuzz often welcomed people when they died. It also takes a strong force of will, which kelsier and gavilar both have. I know it is not likely, but it IS possible, right?