Invocation
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If the Evil is THE ultimate evil of all...
Invocation replied to Ripheus23's topic in Cosmere Discussion
Mistborn Era 1 is before Stormlight. If you want full details, message me and I'll give you the verifiable reason(s) why, but I'm not gonna put it down where anyone can read that hasn't gotten done with Era 1 or Way of Kings yet. Hoid is immortal, though. He's the second-oldest being in the cosmere, the first being a dragon (and that list includes the Shards) -
The difference is, when a normal person has all those Intents, they can prioritize them within themselves and choose what to do at any given time. If each Intent is all-encompassing, they can't do that. No one person would be able to get along with each Shard enough to not be warped by that Shard, and some singular Shard holders are fighting their Intents even with just the one overpowering thing. 16 would be even worse.
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Could be useful for handling someone that's a majorly dangerous criminal that has a good amount of Investiture, sure. It doesn't have to be just powers. You can take other stuff, like strength and senses, plus there's some interesting ideas there with spiked Elantrians and other multi-Investiture spike subjects.
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That's my point. It would be extremely difficult to find that balance with all 16 without some other ways of doing it than just cramming them all together.
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Why didn't Odium trigger the everstorm before?
Invocation replied to Luinedhel's topic in Stormlight Archive
Part of it was probably that he was trying not to Invest himself too heavily onto Roshar so he could pull himself away a lot easier once he was able to do so, but now he's determined to pretty much wipe out Rosharan civilization to free himself, so he needed more active resources to use. -
Like Bigmikey said, it's because he recognizes the need for both and they're direct opposites, leaving him stuck. It's been likened to being pulled between two supermassive stars and just barely being able to find the balance, but still being pulled immensely to both sides.
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If you've gotten to the points where you're successfully spiking people and drawing their power out, you're going to do something with the spike, regardless of how good of a person you were to start with. Why would they be uncontrollable by Harmony? Theoretically, not every godmetal spike would react like Paalm's spike did and hide you from Harmony, and if you're over the limit and Harmony is focused on you, that's not going to help anyway. Plus not everyone is going to have a godmetal spike. Scadrial and Roshar are spoiled when it comes to godmetal usage compared to everywhere else.
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Hemalurgy's limitations are built in: too many spikes is dangerous without a linchpin spike, and you can even overload the linchpin and end up killing yourself, plus the direct control from Ruin/Harmony. Plus, y'know, murdering people with the appropriate powers to make yourself stronger is morally abhorrent.
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You are correct. The fact that one man that doesn't have a vow not to harm people has access to that many different magic systems at any given time is terrifying. Also worth noting about the spread of Hemalurgy is that there's at least one worldhopping kandra somewhere, plus Felt and Demoux, all in addition to Iyatil and another Terriswoman that's hanging around somewhere. Hemalurgy could propagate at any time, from any direction.
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They already are. Mraize has everything he needs to get ahold of everything he could possibly want on any world between resources and Investiture sources. Dude has a storming Aviar. If he finds out about Hemalurgy, all that happens is he'll being harvesting the people he kills and leaving their spikes in jars of blood to quell the decay. That's definitely a use. I think the biggest use would probably be taking the Investiture from prisoners so they can't accidentally get out via an aluminum spike, or even a Lerasium one if you want to regift it. Long story short, if Mraize wanted Hemalurgy, he could have it at any time now just by popping into Scadrial.
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Some of them are hypotheticals, some of them are just fanart. People do it because they like to make art and are excited, same reason any fanart is made.
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None of the Metallic Arts require Scadrian metals to work, just the correct metal in the correct ratio for the alloys. Anyone anywhere with the right knowledge and spikes can do it. Iyatil? It is unclear what she knows, but she is Southern, so depending on what the Excisors are, she might know, she might not. If she knows, though, Mraize knows. That could be...problematic.
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I would argue that just cramming them together would not do that. One person absorbing all of them is just that: one person, 16 Shards. At the very least, they wouldn't reform immediately into Adonalsium, nor would it be the same Adonalsium as there was before the Shattering. I say this because of the massive amount of time and radical changes that have happened in the interim. It was something like 6,000 years Shattering --> Final Desolation, with another 4,000 after that. The Shards really don't perceive themselves as Shards of Adonalsium anymore, but more as their separate entities. It would take time to overcome that, and active effort from the holder.. Spiritual Adhesion might be a way around that, but we haven't seen Spiritual Adhesion except for once. For all we know, Adonalsium might have had the issues that could come about from just jamming all 16 back together.
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To make a spike, you need to want to make the spike (the Intent of the action is incredibly important) and you need to know the bindpoints and, of course, you need to have a spike of the right kind for what you're trying. Knowledge, Intent, and resource.
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Yep. Copper and zinc do things that would be in high demand across the cosmere as well. Copper takes "mental fortitude, memory, and intelligence" and zinc takes emotional fortitude. Pretty much all the Spiritual metals would be useful cross-cosmere.
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Yeah, sorry, we're all waiting, Breath bated, for it to release. It's been delayed a few times, which is why there's art in some places for it. Right now, the release is looking to be somewhere either in 2020 or 2021.
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The thing about Autonomy is, that is one of the ones that is less hard-line "This Intent means exactly one thing," so different Vessels will act differently with Autonomy's interpretation. The current Autonomy thinks it means isolation from everyone else, which would be it's own issue with a 16-combo Shard, but it could also be interpreted as only listening to one will, which locks the vessel of all 16 Shards up because there's 16 different directions happening there and no real unified path. It is possible that enough time would fix the issue of differing Intents, though that would be an absolutely absurd amount of time. Millennia, maybe longer. Spiritual Adhesion would be easier.
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Yes, but they're not all-encompassing forces within me. Shardic Intents are very literally the only thing that Shard can do (under normal circumstances) and having 2 opposites creates major issues, so imagine what 16 conflicting ones would do?
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It'd be a lot more than detrimental. You'd be stuck, essentially, unable to do anything, pulled between 16 different Intents that you can't disobey, only able to act within the small sliver of that Venn diagram that supports them all. Issues indeed. (Spiritual Adhesion might be able to get around this, which is one of the prevailing theories on this stuff)
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There's been theories about this probably ever since Hero of Ages. General consensus is it would be difficult, but possible, though it might not turn out with direct Adonalsium itself, but more likely 16 different Intents in one vessel.
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Yeah, Hemalurgy is probably the most interesting to deal with through the larger cosmere, with the power stealing (Khriss herself notes this in one of the Ars Arcanums) and Feruchemy, once anyone can use it, will be a close runner-up.
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Probably has. I get the feeling he'd probably try it just because that's what he does.
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The plants are probably Invested, and when mixed in certain ways forms the gateway to channel the Dor.
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Why not both?
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I mean that's literally what I was talking about. You can't tell me that wouldn't be a two birds, one stone situation: break the plate, kill the guy.
