Diomedes

Hmmm. The Fused need the sacrifice of a host-soul and mind though to keep on living. I guess the passage can be interpreted both in my way and yours. It would just make so much sense, if Shallan had to sacrifice a tiny part of her soul, if she wants to do this. I mean think about the strategical advantage of ten lightweavers well supplied with stormlight, they could raise 10 armies almost indefintly. The enemy would never know, where the real soildiers are. And yes I know Amarams soildiers were blinded by the thrill. Thats why they couldn`t make out the illusions. But still.

but she is not simply lightwaving. She is combining lightweaving with soulcasting. Those are not simply illusions. It is explicitly stated, that a part of her is dying. Which means a part of her goes to the spiritual realm. She cannot just resurrect them. Instead they are "reborn and she sends them out again", which means she uses a new part of her soul to animate the living illusions. If she could recreate the souls, why is she speaking of them dying, not just vanishing and returning to her? Dying implies going away forever, leaving the physical and cognitive realm.

The "illusions" are made up of Shallans soul and are dying by the thousands. Thus always a little part of her sould dies. Edit: it is even clearer here

One quick question, has anyone talked about Shallan losing a decent portion of her soul in the battle in the end? How much of her soul did she loose? a quarter, a third, even half? The thing is her behaviour in the end does not make sense from the perspective of her arc. Her feelings both for Kaladin and Adolin intesify on the ship to Thaylen. The hints on both side get bigger (leering onto Kaladin and more, the dialogue with Adolin). No developement rejecting Kaladin takes place. I think this can be fixed. Dalinar also healed the wounds in his soul by being exposed to the Honorblade. But I think it will take Shallan some time to do that.

To you and to those who think like you, you are in good company, go ahead and read the Wit/ Shallan chapter again. (p.787.) Shallan is actually one of you. But she probably hates herself waaaay more than you ever could. That being said, it is important to note that she is at a pretty dark place right now, like Kaladin just before he fell into the chasms in WoR. Imagine how you would feel about Kaladin, if the book had cut off just then and there. My guess is you wouldn`t really like him. So please withhold your final judgement on Shallan for one or two books until she has pulled herself back together.

I wanted to throw in this little passage after the meeting between Wit and Shallan: Then he rambles a bit about Shallan`s outfit, and Shallan thinks: "Oh, Adolin" .After that Kaladin comes along and we se Shallan only having eyes for him. I think this is significant because in this passage after the meeting with Wit Shallan is arguably the "realest" in all of OB. She is clinging onto Adolin in this chapter physically "relaxing" into him. But Adolin completly misses the emotional state in which Shallan, the real one, is right now. By which I mean she is pretty devasted. Instead he just thinks she`s fine. Worse he thinks she`s basically fine all the time. ("of course"). Still this is not really a decisive pro Shalladin passage. I think Brandon wants to leave real Shallan`s feelings unclear. Instead he leaves us likewise with some pro Shadolin bits. She relaxes into him. This could be read as her finding comfort in the presence of Adolin. Later she thinks to herself "Should I explain?" This refers to her outfit but also could be interpreted as Shallan explaining her emotional state to Adolin. Her just staring at Kaladin is also not a truly decisive argument that she is closer to Kaladin than to Adolin, who is literally holding her right now. So I think, Brandon goes to great length to upholding the ambiguity he has set up in OB regarding Kaladin-Shallan-Adolin. He is not going to destroy that ambiguity by some WoB. Nothing has been decided yet. You nailed it, basically. Though me being a Shalladin shipper think that real Shallan is way closer to Kaladin emotionally than to Adolin.

One big thing to remember is that all of these personas were created to make up for the deficiencies of integrated ("real") Shallan. "Shallan" (I will just call her Princess Shallan) was created because integrated Shallan felt like she could not cope with the needs of Alethi lighteye society. Princess Shallan is a persona perfectly suited for this environment. She exemplifies the social norms pressed on a highborn Alethi woman. This lighteye society does not really value compassion in their women (think about Evi, who is the most compassionate person ever, and how she is treated). So Princess Shallan is not really compassionate. She does not really care about her marriage with Adolin and the bond between them for its own sake. Instead it`s a "celebration of herself". At least the relationship with Adolin is not front and center, where it should be! We also do not see the oaths of the marriage being spoken, which is really odd. Consider also how she treated Bridge Four in WoR, that was pretty snobbish. Now that I think about it, the altruistic drive Veil gets in Kholinar probably stems from her guilty conscience of being self absorbed Princess Shallan. Veil is compensating for this lack of compassion on the side of Princess Shallan. Pattern immediately gets this and calls her out for not genuinly wanting to help people.

This seems to be the common interpretation of the story so far. But what if the place, where the girls comes from, actually refers to Braize Ashyn. This would explain why it is dark all the time there and why there is no stormlight. On Braize Ashyn there is no Stormlight and Honor`s intent was not situated there. So it was both literally dark, because there was no stormlight and metaphorically dark because people had only Odium as a shard, which makes for a pretty dark society. The girl was a human, who travelled from Braize Ashyn to Roshar and somehow brought Stormlight and Honor`s intent with it. This also ties up a different thing. Braize Ashyn was destroyed by surgebinding, which requires Stormlight. Somehow humans on Braize Ashyn must have been able to bind surges there.

I got a theory about Odiums written here on the more immediate secret plans of Odium, you might be interested. So my answer to your questions would be that he wants to escape his prison, rule Roshar with his chosen people the Humans and purge the intent of all other shards, for now. After that he surely will go on conquering other planets and shattering other shards.

So on a different note altogether, I found this little passage of Shallan Ough. So Shallan thinks Adolin likes being around her because she is pretty? This entire relationship seems to be a means to feed Shallan`s ego. Adolin gives her a reason to feel special; Having a prince as boyfriend and being told she is pretty. Everyone interpreted this wedding scene as a sign that she has accepted herself now (or not). But this is Shallan`s wedding. This is a celebration of the bond between husband and wife. This should not be about Shallan herself! Shallan reeally needs to get out off the ego trip. Until she doesn`t do that... well a newly born baby would not be helpful.

So this makes my point even stronger, doesn`t it? Through the new technological advances the role of "normal" combattants is enhanced, while the advantage of the supernatural powers can be diminished. At the end we see a new fabrial that can block shardblades. That is a huge deal. And again if we go only according to conventional weapons... then the Parshendi are toast.

So, idk, if this has been already mentioned.... But the one of the first Adolin/ Shallan chapter is entitled: "Set Up to Fail" (p.220). It is the "No Mating" one. This sums up my thoughts on the Adolin/Shallan ship neatly. Edit: It is actually the chapter before the meeting with Mraize and Ialai

This was my least favorite SA book. I think it was due to my feeling that the characters were swept away by the plot rather then them making decisions and shaping their future. In one earlier Kaladin chapter one parshman says: This kind of apllies to all characters. They are compulsed by external factors into doing, what they are doing. Shallan gives in her psychological problems. Kaladin is baffled and just lets King Elokhar be killed. Venli just gets bullied around by Odium. Dalinar is haunted by his past, though he has arguably some agency. Teft gives in his addiction. This is all somewhat subverted in book 5 but not completly. The best arc was Szeth´s, he at least made some good decisions. Ah, and people just dont talk to each other about their problems. They are just swallowing it up and brooding over it. This makes up severe lack of good dialog. So this books will probably make a lot more sense after the sequels have been published. It seems to set up many good things in the future. It`s also still a SA book, it has capital A Awsome worldbuilding and we get to see the answers to so many questions. The Dalinar flashbacks were also insanly well crafted. I gave it an 8/10

I disagree. An all out free for all 100 factions against each other would blurr the lines between Parshendi and humans. Humans would need to ally themselves with Parshendi and vice versa. This would diminish racial tensions. It has been said somewhere,that Sel is the setting of religious conflict, on Scadrial the focus is on social conflict and Roshar is the setting of racial conflict. And attempted mass genocide of an entire race would be the ultimate feat of Hatred. I do think this would be the ideal "end game" for Odium. We do not know how Odium feels about anyone for sure. We do know, however, that Odium speaks to Taravangian in an amused paternal manner. He even seems to be somewhat proud of the feats of Dalinar and Taravangian. The voidspren, who are of the essence of Odium, treat the Parshendi like cremlings. They simply do not give a damnation. Best example is how the one voidspren reacts to Eshonais death. yes, obviously. The question is, how he plans to get there. And in the scene with Taravangian he seems still pretty confident that everything goes more or less according to plan. He will want to conquer other planets and splinter all shards. But this is all past SA, I think? This is still seven SA books and many more cosmere books ahead. We cannot reasonably theorize about so far in the future. We should probably change the threat name to Odiums endgame in SA. How do I do this? Sure he has a few thousand plans, but what would be the ideal plan, that serves as a backdrop for all the others? I think it is invoking a fierce hatred for all Parshendi in as much humans as possible. Yes I think it would be possible for Odium to brute force his way against the Alethi and their allies with all his forces, that he got, be it human or Parshendi. But it is still a battle that he could very well lose. Why take that risk? Odium had 4000 years to plan for this war. Consider in contrast to Ruin, Hatred is long and calculating. I think he did not want to leave anything to be decided by luck. I also got the feeling in OB that our characters are beeing swept away by the plot. Like they were witnessing the plot happening to them rather than acting according to free will. This might be worth exploring in a new threat. I think this is due to them not knowing what on Roshar is going on and being mere pawns in Odiums plan.

Thoughout OB we have seen Team Odium on a winning streak. They have basically rushed Alethkar and taken over most of Roshar. This sure looks bad on paper. But compare for a minute not the land that is under control, but the armies of Odium and the coalition. Then we come to a different conclusion altogether. On the one hand we have lots of Parshendi. Sure there are a lot of them. But they all had minimal training. Numbers are not everything in warfare. Then we have the Fused. The name alone sounds terrifing. But their battlefield performance is abysmal. We see multiple times in OB, how one Radiant fights off multiple Fused. And storms even Moash kills one of them, even though he just had few months of basic training. He sure is talented, but still this says a lot about the quality of the Fused as fighters. This is because they are not used to their new physical bodies. Then we got Thunderclasts. They are a tough nut to crack, but Radiants with their healing abilities don’t seem to have great problems taking them down. So… what do we have on the other side? We got roughly 70.000 Alethi warriors, who are known across Roshar for their experience in warfare. They are veterans hardened by years of battles on the Shattered Plains. They also got shards, lots of them. And they are pissed that the Parshendi have taken their homeland. So it stands now lots of armed peasant Parshendi against the fiercest war machine Roshar probably has ever known. Then we got the Knights Radiants, who are only increasing in numbers. Did I mention that not a single high-tier Radiant has been killed in OB? These guys just have the habit of surviving. You could make an argument that the Fused are just such brilliant commanders that they will win anyways. I have serious doubts about that considering that the ablest Fused have not even manifested yet. This might not be a coincidence. What I am going to argue here is that subduing almost all of Roshar under Parshendi rule has never been Odium`s end game. Instead it has been to invoke Hatred inside the humans and the Alethi in particular. This makes a lot of thematic sense. Humans are his original people from Braize after all. They are the original Voidbringers. He also chose Dalinar, a human, as his champion. Let me project a probable future that would happen, if Odium gets his way. The Alethi want to take back their homeland, they are constantly worrying what is happening to their loved ones back at home (and their property…..). So hatred begins to boil toward the Parshendi. After their initial campaign in Tu Bayla they march in direction of their beloved home. At the first encounters with the Parshendi at the border to Jah Keved they gain victory. They are surprised how easy these wins have been. The Radiants have kept Fused and Thunderclasts off and they, though outnumbered, could punch through the enemy lines quite easily. Then they see what the parshendi, who were motivated by Odium have done to the Alethi in the borderlands. Slavery might have been the gentlest fortune a Alethi civilian could have gotten. Also lots of horror stories about the Parshendi are being shared. Most of them are untrue, but some of them are not. Now a then crazy seeming plan brought forth back a year ago by Jasnah Kholin begins to get supporters; To exterminate all Parshendi that the plague of the Fused may be stopped once and for all. At least this is how they rationalize their genocidal plans. If Odium had gotten his way then Dalinar would have been his champion feeding these ideas. Kaladin and all Radiants in their right mind quit the Alethi expedition. Still after their initial decisive victories even this mostly Radiant-less force, which posses still a significant amount of shards goes on and mobs up all Parshendi resistance left in Alethkar. This is a war of extermination. Parshendi are systematically killed by the enraged Alethi. When the mass-genocide has been completed all of the Alethi armies have fallen into Odiums hand. They turn their attention now to the rest of Roshar. With the help of the Thunderclasts and newly formed human voidbinder, they can subdue all of Roshar. The Radiants make a desperate last stand but, ultimately, they are on the losing side. All living Parshendi on Roshar are hunted and killed. They merely served for Odium the purpose of being the object of human hate. After they had outlived their use, he could throw them away. And maybe he hates Parshendi himself beeing the shard of Hatred and all. So this has been my first post... It is really not a pleasent theory. But in my opinion it makes a lot of sense to see it this way, even if a lot or even all of the details are wrong. Ah, and english is not my native language, so I apologize, if this has been a bit hard to read.