Magestar

If lots of other people vote for the Sand Lord I'm not just going to not vote for him just on principle. Why waste a chance at a scan action? That's why I'm waiting for others responses. I did give my opinion on it; it seems like it'd be effectively another no-lynch, which I condemn. But I'm still not so opposed to doing it that I wouldn't if everyone else did. The response follows my thought process, to some extent. I was like, "Cool, free investiture!" Then I was like, "No wait, that's not such a good idea. It doesn't actually get anything done." And then I was like, "Well, I'm gonna wait it out." So yeah. That.

Ok, thanks. The thing about the chances of a player surviving the lynch is that at this point, we have a pretty good chance of hitting a player who's gonna have some sort of protection no matter what. There are a lot of shards out there, a number of people who could have taken some preservation investiture, and we might even have some people on scadrial who've been using that protection. I still think it's worthwhile to lynch someone, and I'm still suspicious of Pyro.

Hmm. Maybe he was talking about Megasif, but I can't find a defense of me by him either. Rand, who were you talking about?

Ambition? Do you mean Autonomy? And do you have any thoughts on who we should lynch?

Yeah that would've been really smart. The fact that they didn't in fact do that makes me rather more convinced of your innocence, at least for now. Hmm. While, on the surface, this seems like a good idea, I feel like it could just end up being another no-lynch. Pending other people's responses, though, I might end up doing it as well.

I can definitely see how it would look like that. Honestly, I really didn't know what to do and didn't have a lot of good reasons for doing anything. I felt safer not doing anything, especially when I didn't know how things would turn out at the end of the cycle and I knew I wouldn't be on when/if things changed. I didn't want to be the tiebreaker vote. On another note, thanks for pinging me, because I wasn't really paying attention to the game. Quick question; I may have missed this reading through the thread, but do we have any solid or even semi-solid proof that Pyro is survival? Also, even if they are survival, what's the problem with killing them? So far they haven't really offered any reason that I should trust them. If they are survival, I'm not sure I want them to have the shard, as their actions seem to be primarily leaning towards the Elim side of things. I still don't love the idea of lynching a new player in their first game, but it's not the first cycle anymore, and Pyro's actions have me on edge. Worst case scenario, in my mind, we lynch a villager pretending to be Survival. That would be kinda odd, and also disappointing. It seems more likely that we either end up lynching an Elim pretending to be survival, or we lynch a Survival that seems all to happy to let the village just die. So yeah. Pyro. I'll note that I'm also suspicious of Drought, Fifth, and maybe Orlok? Seems a bit tunnel-y, but maybe that's just because I was on the other end of the tunnel. I trust Rand, and MM, mostly. Maybe Mega. Not sure about Steel. HH, I could see, but I'm having trouble reading. It seems intentional, though, like someone who's playing hard to read. Not like Pyro, though, who's being obvious about it. Could be an Elim thing. Nope nope nope. Bolded for clarity. I didn't get Ambition, lol. I would have loved to get Ambition, but right now I not only don't have a shard I have no investiture. So yeah, I'd definitely make a good convert. 100% good idea. I haven't actually seen MMs defense of me, though I suppose I should go look for it. And I think that's all I've got for now.

Pff, what's wrong with TVtropes? It's not like you can get lost in there for hours- Woah, what just happened. I swear I only looked at it for a minute or two. I'll fess up to using Ambition's investiture to double tap Ambition and then I'll fess up to crying when I didn't get it. No really though I'm not happy.

I'm visiting colleges and don't have a lot of time to post. That being said, I'm a little unsure how to feel about Pyro. I know I'm not happy that we didn't have a lynch. I'm not sure about Fifth being cleared. And I'm worried about conversions. And that's all I've got right now. I'll probably have time to post properly next cycle.

@Straw, for the record, I took from Ambition. Extra actions ftw. I don't really have time right now to catch up properly on the thread, but I'm gonna list some things I feel are a bad idea. I don't want to lynch Pyro first turn. I don't like lynching newbies. It colors the game poorly for them, and I don't want them to go away with a bad impression. (Although, tbf, my first game was pretty awful, and I just kept coming back for more. ) I don't want to not have a lynch. That's just a bad idea. It gets us nowhere. I don't want to be stuck between these two options. -sigh- I feel like Fifth and Drought are both interesting options, and DoS feels weird to me too. But I'm a little hesitant to put down a vote when I know I won't be on at rollover to retract in case something bad happens. >.> I'm not going to vote. I got a really bad feeling about any of the lynch options, and I don't like what's happening right now. There are too many people on the table, and I'm worried that the Elims are stirring us up. edit; I realize this post did absolutely nothing useful and I apologize.

But why do you think I'm suspicious? Could you explain that to me? edit; Ooo. Is this a thing we can do, @Seonid? I'd rather do this than lynch Pyro, although I could maybe see a Drought lynch. Slightly suspicious of Drought, mostly gut.

How? I always try to point out IKYK's when I find them. Knowing how far a play will go into an IKYK is an important part of getting a read on them. However, I totally agree that Fifth has brought a bit of attention onto himself. No, I get it. You should just know that it's not exactly a great defense. I personally am not sure that you're Odium, but what happens happens. If you are, I do suggest you either pass it before you convert or put it back. Although putting it back feels like it has a slightly higher possibility of the wrong people getting it then giving it to someone you trust. This is for whoever has Odium, honestly. Take your time. I'm fairly confident that you'll find they look fairly normal for me, but I'm always being told my posts look odd. I've been kinda busy lately, while trying to stay active, so a lot of these posts have been thrown together on the fly, or in pieces over a bit of time. That might explain some of the oddness, but IDK. Er. No... I haven't voted on Fifth. Vote tally from LL: And while I may have a lot of posts revolving around Odium, they're all basically saying the same thing; Odium isn't necessarily our biggest problem. I've said that across both threads, and it echoes my thoughts from the previous Shard game. People just can't seem to remember that Odium isn't necessarily anti-village, as annoying as he might be. OH MY GOSH. IT'S A WELL THOUGHT OUT POST I DON'T HAVE ANY PROBLEMS WITH! WONDERFUL! Seriously though, I agree with absolutely everything Rand is saying here. Still didn't vote on Fifth. At least, if I did, not only did I not intend to, I've apparently forgotten, and I can't find where I did.

Oddly, I'm suspicious of both 5th and Pyro. I'm unsure why 5th is so fascinated with Odium, and Pyro is just all over the place. Honestly having difficulty reading Pyro. Hmmm. Why though? Also, @Fifth Scholar, if you can't quote across tabs, there are actually unkeyed quote boxes that you can just add to your posts. You can paste into them, and it means you don't have to just color everything. I think you can do that on mobile too? I'm not sure. Elbereth seems to be acting differently, but it seems pretty NAI. Her posts seem more aggressive, as far as discussion goes, and pushing responses and discussion more than an Elim would, but that gets into IKYKs. Other than that I'm not really reading her as Elim, just as a villager who's trying to push people in order to get reads on them. Speaking of IKYKs, though: Wow. IKYK alert. I actually agree with most of this. It does, to me, seem statistically more likely to me that Odium is in village hands, and honestly I'm not super worried about Odium either. 5th's posts seem a bit off, and I'm really not suspicious Bard at all (I was more suspicious of them last game, actually, although that doesn't really mean anything.) but I'm equally suspicious of Pyro, mostly on gut. And all of the points 5th makes here seem pretty solid. I'm sure I had more to say but I'm forgetting what it was now... I might get back to this later. I don't think Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III has said anything so I'm going to take my vote off of Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III. Instead I'll @shanerockes in the hopes that they take a look at the thread. Other than that I'd like to say I'm pretty happy with the level of discussion, given the fact that people could definitely have felt like the wind was taken out of their sails from the cycle rebooting. Also I'm really tired and looking over this post it doesn't seem super cohesive so... forgive me for rambling a bit.

I didn't suddenly change my mind after the game started. Yes, I did start by saying this. But then you said something about the Elims being able to get survival, and I figured that was true, and I admitted it. Then, Elbereth brought up a number of points, some of which I originally refuted, but most of which I didn't have a valid argument against. I've tried sticking to a flawed opinion just because I didn't want to be seen as backsliding; it's a foolish thing to do. And anyways, before the game rebooted, I said this, in response to Elbereth questioning how Survival as an intermediary would work; It was only after El brought it up again in the new version of the game that I responded "That's fair" to it. I had already said I'd realized it wasn't such a good idea, so there wasn't much more to say. That's fair. That last post was a bit much, I think. Sorry. I'm a little frustrated right now, for obvious reasons. I know I'm innocent, and I don't really see how my actions point to anything else, but I'm still up for the lynch. Well, I suppose it's not the first time.

Seriously? There are people going around making a ruckus about past roles, and you want to lynch me because I said that mine didn't change?

Why? A smart Odium would instead pass the shard before becoming the single entity that every single faction wants dead. At least, that's what I would do. Maybe. I agree it'd be a good idea to not lose more villagers to shard win-cons, but again, I don't know that all shardic win-cons will be anti-village. In fact, I rather doubt it. That's fair. I don't believe the rules say he does. Lol so accurate though. I think you're referring to my apparent sudden change of opinion? I think I responded to that. Besides, if anything, my change of opinion was a progression that had continued since it was first brought up, and became more village aligned rather than less.

Do you have any reason for this?

See, if El was lying, then there wouldn't be another Khriss. That's one of the really odd things about this. There are super easy ways to prove either of them wrong. But it seems really bizarre that either of them would lie about this. It just doesn't seem to have a good end for anyone who lied. And besides, how would this effect this iteration of the game at all? Like, why does it matter? Yup. Mage is indeed reluctant to give an opinion. I did indeed try to bring some levity to the game; TBF, though, that phrase that you seem to think was fabricated was literally what I thought when I looked at my role PM in the morning. The first sentence of the second line was me making sure Pyro understood something. I don't know what say to that, as that was my natural reaction. I admit I did consider removing it, as I could see that it looked sort of contrived; but I ended up deciding against it, as it was just my first reaction. As I've said in previous posts, my initial reaction to Odium being free was that it was a bad thing. This is a little odd, actually, as usually I'd be the one showing people that Odium isn't necessarily against the village. I don't know what you mean by this. I just poked a person I thought was quiet? I'm always averse to lynching people. And, honestly, I'm not surprised that my posts come off as contrived, or overly passive, or overthought. I spent a good portion of my early days in SE getting repeatedly lynched, as a villager, for my posts, which apparently gave off an "Elim vibe". As a result, regardless of my alignment, I spend a good deal of time reading over my own posts, and attempting to make sure everything is worded as cleanly as possible. If anything, this happens more often when I'm a villager, since when I'm an Elim I tend to feel more comfortable. Clearly, trying to make my posts sound less evil is just as bad as posting the first things that come to my mind, so I'm not sure what to do about that. In other news, this seems really really odd. First of all, as far as I can tell, Odium is not a huge problem RN. In fact, I don't even think we can say for sure that Odium will become a huge problem. Shattering Cultivation doesn't seem to be a bad thing either, at least for the Shard. This post feels a bit odd to me, as well as slightly overly emotive. Also, as I've said earlier, I'm not super fond of the discussion revolving around the previous game. The way distributions tend to work, I feel that the previous game shouldn't effect this one at all.

Well, to be fair, when I wrote that post, I wasn't really thinking about the reasons as thoroughly as perhaps I should have. I was more thinking along the lines of "Odium? Someone thought it was a good idea to release the essence of hatred?" But I suppose I can see reasons for Sharders to want Odium around. Fair. I am certainly interested to see what Devotary has to say. Hmm. For some reason that number seems really small to me, although I suppose it really isn't. I do think that it is more likely we have closer to two Elims rather then four, but if you guys want to proceed with the lynch that's fine by me. As far as lynching a shard... I don't really know that we want the shards to be moving around randomly. That's just that much more of a chance that they fall into the wrong hands. It'd be much better to have the holders return them, and/or give them to someone they trust just before they turn. And that's if they even want to give them up. To be fair, a shard's goals won't necessarily be contrary to those of the village, IMO.

I would assume they can only convert one player per night? Perhaps not. Neither do I, per se. Just an interesting note.

Alright then. Let's flesh this out. What's your point? This whole thing is becoming rather interesting. The fact that the game was rebooted at all, in such a fashion, makes it rather fascinating to begin with. It's already added an interesting dynamic, which I'm not sure I'm fond of. Another interesting thing is, with you having seen the previous spreadsheet, you're in a position to make a good number of claims about the previous distribution, which, without coming forward about their previous roles, people might have a hard time refuting. It would be really bizarre for DoS to claim such a thing, if it wasn't true, at least in my opinion. I'm a little suspicious of DoS to begin with, just from tone. However, similar tones have been non alignment indicative in the past, so I'm gonna withhold judgement for now. Another interesting thing is that at this point, there are at most four Elims. Odium doesn't really need to be a target for the village, as long as the owner passes it, or returns it to containment, before they're corrupted. But, knowing players on this forum, I can definitely see the current holder just keeping it. I'll note that while I'm usually all for a D1 lynch, I'm not sure how useful it will be in this particular game, with a max of 4 Elims and a min of two, as well as all these shards lying around who we don't necessarily want dead. Anyway, I wouldn't mind killing DoS, but for now I'm just gonna poke Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III.

What. Why. Seriously? Ok then. Well, in all likelihood, we have a bunch of villagers targeting Odium and Ruin. It seems a little odd to me, although I'm looking back and seeing some discussion about freeing Ruin to keep it out of the wrong hands? That's interesting. Odium, though, seems like an odd choice for a bunch of villagers to go after. Autonomy, I understand. It's investiture ability is super useful to the village, and it's Shardic abilities are really sweet. But as for the other two, well, I'm not so sure. What I'm wondering is whether you guys think these shards were released because lots of people wanted their investiture, or because people wanted the actual shards. Interesting to think about. What's also interesting is that even more shards weren't released, given the rather low release cost, and the number of players. I agree that shards should probably get put back before Alignment changes occur. But why not Steeldancer? I was actually thinking about suggesting something like that to Odium, as unfortunate as it is that we have to shatter a shard. Having at least one shard shattered is probably a good thing. Pick a boring one, pretty please? Not so sure about Ruin, but maybe.

Same faction as ever, actually. My role PM looks like a time loop. It's not like it was likely that my faction was going to change. People change their minds, you know. It's not like I'm going to persist in a bad idea once I realize it's bad.

Fair. I see it was a bad idea now. People do tend to reveal more and be more open in PMs, if they ever talk. But I'm not sure how useful it will be in this scenario, especially with conversions.

Good question. I was actually thinking about the logistics of this and I'm not sure how much sense it actually makes. I thought it was a really good idea before the game started, though. Mainly, I remembered it being brought up in the last game, and thought "That's a good idea. Intermediaries are cool! I should bring it up this game." Maybe not such a good idea though.

I feel you. In other news, lotsa people watching this thread.