Jazzy Kandra

Peace, man. It's not good to make the whole fandom mad at you when you first join a community. As it happens, a creative person needs "breaks" anyway. Yes, that means doing casts, that means other things, too. He works for eight hours writing a day (from my understanding and what I've like seen on twitter, his blog, etc), and writes insanely consistently and quickly for someone who must, also, research (history, science, culture, economics, etc) build his worlds and magic systems from scratch. It's like, say, someone making a masterpiece. They have to do figure studies and months to even years of prep work before they can set down and paint it. There's a lot more to this kind of writing than you realize; it's a very active process, and we'll never see everything that goes into it...and that's ok. I suggest reading some of Brandon's other work. Given that Stormlight is part of the larger cosmere (and really, part of a 37~ book series; oh yeah, I just blew your mind!), I think you have plenty to read and explore. He also has contingency plans...but he's only 40, that's not even that old, we'll be fine.

I already have a theory along the same lines as your SA afterlife ideas, too, but I think yours is way better than mine. In brief: certain spren were not always spren, they were once people who, through a series of interesting events, got enough Investiture that they could stay as spren/cognitive ghosts. Originally (read, 2014), this was based on the Stormfather-is-Honor's-Cognitive-Shadow thing, but I think there's more evidence for this due to what happened in SH. I guess it's based on the idea that there is more than one way to get a spren, though whether the formerly-human-spren retain their memory is up for debate. *shrug*

It doesn't have to be tech, just a different technique or strange Command that we don't know of. We really don't get to see a ton of the more advanced stuff that presumably Vasher knows, like the Command that erases someone's memories, like what he did to the little girl he rescues in Warbreaker. This is completely off the wall, but I imagine that there could be a subtle Command for something similar to lightweaving that creates illusions using Breath and slowly drains the coat for fuel...as an illusion, I think, usually is a slow-drain kind of Investure and it'd be something that someone could probably do with Awakening if they just knew the right Command and had the imagination for it. This, however, is just an example, I don't think this is what VenDell is doing, but I will not say anything else on that particular line of thought... *raises eyebrow* I will come off as a genius, you mean. Or a loon. A loon is much more likely! ;D

I don't think that is what's going on here, but I think that is a REALLY interesting quote, nonetheless! pg. 131 "Soulstone, as a rock, looked not unlike soapstone or another fine grained stone, but with bits of red mixed in. As if drops of blood had stained it." Bits of red seems like a weird and very specific detail to mention. Brandon could've just left it at fine grained stone, but he flavors that description with that bit of text. Due to the rule of "word economy" (especially in Sanderson, yes, I know he writes a lot but he doesn't do purplish text, if you get what I mean), it's probably important. Soulstone is probably Invested in some way, though, I do not believe it's similar to what Atium and Lerasium are (bodies/physical presence of gods in a compressed form), but it might be from the same Shard that has caused Trellium to appear. Also for reference, the original quote from SoS is: "A small spike, as long as a finger, made of some silvery metal with dark red spots, like rusted bits." (370) And the other spikes (that TenSoon and Wax find in the weird creatures): "TenSoon came up with a thin piece of metal, silvery and perhaps as long as a finger. Did it have a red cast to it, or was that just blood?" (328) (I think it is the same metal, BUT Wax didn't get a good look at it. He couldn't know it was "dark red specks" because the caves are still somewhat dark, TenSoon was holding it, and he doesn't inspect it himself [hold it and examine it closely]") Perhaps things with "red flicks/specls/cast" (like Trellium/Soulstone) are related to this particular Shard, just like things with Red Eyes are related to it. I think that saying that the spike is soulstone takes this a little too far, but I think that it MIGHT be a sign that the same Shard is involved on the events on Scadrial.

It just seems very unlikely, though. Not to dismiss this, but he would've had to run home (the Homeland?) and change his suit and then return all within two hours. And do it more than once. That just seems a little too unrealistic, to me. Is it possible? Yeah, sure, but it doesn't seem as likely. And from the way Wayne reacts, it seems like the same suit.

That's why I thought it had to be something weird, because Awakening drains pigment, turning things grey. It also has to be different because it's a slow change over time (over the course of a few hours), but noticeable enough that change did occur... So, whatever VenDell is doing is happening slowly and slowly using fuel (the color in his suit) to power something. Also, as characters see color differently (because people do) I'm going to vouch for the perception explanation. We also don't know what 'type' of brown or 'tan' it is (considering that brown and tan have different hues themselves) and what we think of tan =/ what Wayne things of tan... Thank you! (As the last time he was in my state, I was in Ohio, it was pretty sad... Even if he goes back to Michigan next year, I'll probably be in Ohio...)

Could be a greyish, tan. Who knows, I mean, tan has a variety of different shades and it's not something that these characters would think to note.

Still more like a sociopath considering how close he is to his crew, but yeah, his need to prove he hasn't been beaten is perhaps the biggest sign of it. He puts himself above all others, if he were to become 'evil' it would be because he feared that there was no other way for him to survive (though considering he thought death would be the end the first time, it can ALSO be seen, I think, as a "wait, I...don't have die?" situation for him. I'll admit, I'm really not for the whole "Kelsier is evil thing" or "Kelsier is Trell". I mean, I rationally realize that those are possible, but I hope it's not so. I would also have to be convince that it makes sense too... Also, if an idea as powerful as Kelsier/the Survivor did not have that person behind it, what might form in its place? It's not Roshar...but I can't imagine that as powerful an idea as a whole belief system wouldn't have some implications in a similar direction...

It begins, the newest, craziest topic of them all! So, recently, I mentioned my rather strange discovery of VenDell's coat and its tendency to get lighter throughout the first few chapters, and I predicted he was an Awakener. http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/53640-jordancon-this-year/page-5#entry436369 I predicted that VenDell had Breath and has used it for Awakening (or powering something via Breath). Since then, I have found more evidence to support this theory (yes, more...crazy as it is). I will be listing them in order, with the original quote I brought up in the JordanCon topic at the end. When VenDell first appears, his coat is described as "dark brown": ~The Bands of Mourning, 4, Kindle Edition~ Next, at the Survivorist Church it's described as just brown: ~BoM, 9 At Wax's manor the first time around it's lighter still: ~BoM, 24-25 And the last time we see VenDell at Wax's manor, when Wayne describes VD's suit as tan: ~BoM,42 In the course of only a few hours, VenDell's coat goes from a dark brown, to a light tan. This is obvious when put together like the above, I spotted the Wayne quote on my first reading and highlighted it (because I found it suspicious), but just recently was inspired to go back and look for more signs/clues though I was already pretty sure this was happening. So, what I think is going on here, VenDell has acquired some Breath. Not only that, he understands how to use it and is using it to fuel something throughout the time we see him (and possibly on screen). More than likely, this means that VenDell has gone to Nalthis, or if he hasn't, he has become familiar with Nalthis Investiture. Due to his somewhat advanced understanding of what Investiture is and how it works, this does make some sense...however: ~BoM, 43-44 He doesn't "like" leaving. Or so he claims...(and yes, the fact that Wax, of all people, calls him a Metalborn is also...an interesting tidbit, but let's ignore that, Wax is just using slang for people who can do cool things like be practically indestructible). In conclusion (TL;DR), I believe that VenDell has done three things. First, he has acquired Breath and is using it to fuel some kind of Awakening (I do not think it is traditional Awakening, though, I think he's doing something more interesting as the above WoB suggests, it says "And are making use of it in variety of ways." I believe VenDell fits into this catagory). Second, VenDell has been off-world, and has at least gone to Nalthis. This makes VenDell a world-hopping kandra. We also have a WoB about those (and it's stated in the plural). Finally, VenDell lied. He has a different reason he does not want to go with Wax and his crew, and he is probably much more interested in the Bands than he is letting on (because he's an innocent researcher!). In the end, I propose that there is a lot more to VenDell than we've been led to believe. I don't believe he's a "bad" guy or working for Shard X, but VenDell knows Wax (or knows about him...) well enough to push all his buttons and make Wax do what he wants.

That's a weird question... I have my suspicions, and since he did say people, I think it's more than just Hoid (and Vasher) fooling around with Breath...(super minor spoilers for BoM under the tags).

Since when is Hazel considered dark? I have dark hazel eyes (and so do some of my cousins)...so...it can be dark, just saying.

Alloy Lerasium and aluminum. Burn the alloy. Become a gnat. Regret your choices in life, you could've been a Mistborn.

"Reigns", though, is usually more passive than "ruled". Like, a dictator or an absolute monarch rules a country, but a monarch with a parliament (like, Elizabeth) reigns over it. They don't have as much power (supposedly) and their power is disbursed among their official representatives/councilors/etc. (in theory, this isn't really how it is in the U.K. anymore, but this is the easiest way to describe this idea). In other words, Odium doesn't have direct authority, he has disbursed power among his spren (which are his representatives, I guess)...and he was forced to do so by Honor. And this leads me to an unanswerable question, despite that Odium is still a Shard, could it be that when he attacked Honor that Odium lost a large part of his Shard? Not Splintered (I wouldn't suggest that, despite that an actually Splintered Odium would be ironic), but perhaps Honor was able to actually harm him in some respect, that might explain why he's "broken" but not fully Splintered...

Eh, Kelsier (or the memory he stored in the that metalmind) notes that the Ice Death wasn't all that cold... I think that the difference between the Northerners and the Southerners might have something to do with their sDNA. Differences in sDNA can have interesting effects on the physical realm, and differences in sDNA don't have to be genetic (they can be based on locations, or regional expectations/connection/whatever), so it would be a perfect explanation...maybe.

I wonder if they're messing with the Identity of the object somehow (making it think that it doesn't belong to anyone) instead of messing with their own Identity (i.e., that of a Soulbearer). How they would do that is beyond me, but because everything in the cosmere seems to have a soul and therefore some kind of Identity, if you could make an object think it has no owner or that anyone who realizes it's a metalmind can use it (this, at the very least, is a requirement) then you can make a metalmind "anyone" can use.

He was on the (sub)-astral location between worlds (space, the final frontier...I shouldn't make a Star Trek joke). I have no doubt, either, but then again, it seems that Marsh hasn't left yet, so...I guess I just want a complete confirmation. *shrug*

Maybe the Excisors are what they use in their culture... Spook mentions that someone using Hemalurgy could take away the powers of an old or sick person and pass it on to keep the power in fold, this could be what the Excisors are actually used for so that the Southerners don't lose valuable powers. I wouldn't call it..."good", though it might be possible to use an alternative Hemalurgic technique to make it less...disturbing and merciful, perhaps. Keeping the powers in the population, especially when it is still generally rare for SoScads to be born with the right sDNA would be a valuable asset. It might mean that you could make the argument that in this situation, using Hemalurgy is a necessary evil that keeps their people alive because spikes/Excisors let them pass down powers without having to rely on getting lucky with sDNA and genetics. Now, let me clean my hands, I feel like a terrible person for even suggesting this...-.-

We have no proof (yet) that Kelsier is a worldhopper (despite the it's super likely, you should probably correct that for completeness...that should also probably include implausible Fullborn headache, too).

Maybe it's a threnody for Dominion and/or Devotion...It is near Sel... It is effected by the same thing causing the Svrakiss (probably) and maybe the not-kandra (freaky). It might mean that all three red-eye beings-things are related to Odium...hmm...

I think it's wonderful wording, honestly. You gave him an example (people or location), so, I think it counts as a confirmation...(or pretty close) to the idea that it would work like storing senses...since that just makes sense.

Below is a…RATHER UGLY CHART because I’m lazy (sorry) and having insomnia. This chart assumes that the Adventure Game does not correspond to one of the basics laws Hemalurgy, which is Bases steal a human attribute (that anyone has); while alloys steal an Allomantic or Feruchemist attribute. You will notice that the first eight metals follow this pattern, we should assume this is true for ALL metals. Reading the chart. First Column: Metal; Second: Allomancy; Third: Feruchemy; Fifth: Hemalurgy; Sixth: Blessing Physical Bases Iron | pulls metal | store weight | steals strength | increases strength (Steel steals Physical Allomancy) Tin | improve senses | store/improve senses | steals metal fortitude | increases senses (Pewter Steals Physical Feruchemy) Emotional Bases Zinc | riots emotion | stores mental speed | steals emotional fortitude | increases emotional fortitude (Brass Steals Cognitive Feruchemy) Copper | Hides Allomancy | stores memories | steals mental fortitude | increases mental sharpness (Bronze Steals Mental/Cognitive Allomancy) A note; it seems that the first two Blessings are to do the Physical Realm, while the next two are to do with the Cognitive; but still basic human abilities. Nothing especially magical. Assuming that all Based metals (like Dirigible suggests) are INDEED stealing human attributes…we need to rewrite this table a little bit. Moreover, it seems that the abilities being stolen are appropriately external/internal; almost seeming to switch between something “more” allomantic related then to something more feruchemical. The most obvious example of this is Zinc and Copper. For the lower chart, I have added both bases and alloys. Note that Alloys don’t have a Blessing. The only way to get a Allomantic/Feruchemic Blessing is to “Rust” a metal; red flakes. Temporal Metals Cadmium | Slows time | stores breath | steals human attribute (steals temporal related attributes? steals energy/breath?) Bendalloy | Hastens time | Stores Energy | steals Temporal Allomancy Gold | Shows Past | Stores health | steals human attribute (either past/future; or health, this seems more likely) | blessing health/healing Electrum | Shows future | stores determination | steals breath/energy/health/determination Feruchemy (I REALLY WANT TO CALL THIS TEMPORAL FERUCHEMY, le sigh) Spiritual Bases Chromium | Removes another’s metals | stores fortune | steals something odd (Investiture? But that’s what Atium does, so, let’s say it steals Fortune; if we assume fortune is "the chance of getting the best possible out come" for the person) | blessing is something to do with fortune (seems most likely) Nicrosil | Flares another’s metals | Stores Investiture | Steals Spiritual Feruchemy Aluminum | removes one’s metals | stores identity | steals identity/connection | Blessing identity/connection Duralumin | Flares one’s metals | stores connection | Steals “Enhancement”/”Spiritual” (You are PLAYING with Investiture directly and what it does, I like Patterns…) Allomancy So, I suggest that our friend ReLuur either has an Aluminum spike or a Chromium Spike. An Atium Blessing probably would grant him any Blessing the Lord Ruler wants of the eight regular Blessings, so, not that useful, I think. So, arguably, and rather oddly, Alumninum does something useful, too? It might be a "warped" Blessing, but who knows.

Maybe Spankey is a spren-like being that Hoid either is bonded to or who he is friends with. Basically, Spankey is what Hoid uses to get around in the Cognitive Realm (or find a 'real' boat, but Spankey is more fun), so, Spankey might be a very old creature that has known Hoid for a very long time. The real question is, what does Spankey look like in the Physical Realm and have we seen this form without knowing what it is?

It's a year and a half, not two years, and I think it will be earlier fall (think August/September, both good months for a book)...I'm not happy with it either, but'm also kind of glad that it won't be coming out when I'll be finishing my thesis. That wouldn't be good... By then I will either be done with grad school and working, or possibly getting yet another degree...*sigh* In other words, won't be reading a book in a week any more...*sighs again*

Indeed. But I have been suspicious of it since we read it. The story seems too neat, so to speak. It's possible, but we were given a list of [four] Blessings that the Lord Ruler gave his kandra; by metal, these are zinc, iron, tin, and copper. That's why Dirigible thought that Marasi getting it so...wrong was an odd thing. I doubt you can shave the red spots off (or if you do, it would be trellium)... I think that the red bits might be Rust...as in trellium is rusting some kind of metal and changing its properties. (Imagine if Trell is rusting atium...now that would be fun). Or trellium might be some kind of Trell-based atium alloy... Or possibly, Trellium might just be a metal with red bits, but I doubt shaving the red bits off is an option...

While you got this WoB, (which was not that much better than a RAFO, it's a rather vague answer, Sanderson uses his wiggle room well): I feel like it's time to play my hand. I have thought about this topic too much, I pointed it out to Weiry a few days after I read the book in January. What's really weird about this is, Marasi should (probably) be familiar with the other metals from which the four Blessings that we know of are made. She should know Zinc and Iron by sight. Marasi shouldn't be confusing either of those metals with pewter... In the book, Marasi claims: Marasi shouldn't be confused about ReLuur's odd, silvery metal spike. She should recognized pewter without any issues. The odd thing is ReLuur's story, and the spike that is made of a metal that Marasi can't name on the spot. Logically: the metal that the spike is made of is something that Marasi just isn't familiar enough with, but a silvery metal. Assuming that she knows steel, iron, pewter, zinc, aluminum, cadium, bendalloy, etc. on sight, more or less, then it has to be made of something rarely seen...like Duralumin or Atium. Why duralumin? Considering how hard it is to afford aluminum, creating it's alloy would be expensive and a waste unless you are a Terris/Ferring with the ability to store Connection. There's a good chance that she may have not seen a huge chunk of it in one place, making it harder to identify. The metalmind that Allik uses would've only had a relatively small amount considering its size and shape, so, it wouldn't help her identify a large amount of the metal. Logically, duralumin makes sense. Atium isn't something she'd know, of course, but where the heck did he get so much of that? I think if the spike is something OTHER than pewter, it is also something OTHER than steel or zinc, since Marasi should know those... This means that the spikes that ReLuur is using are relatively new. That could mean a couple things. ReLuur made himself a new pair of spikes for fun (seems unlikely). ReLuur is a new kandra, and some of the story that VenDell tells Wax's crew is a lie. Which, of course, leads us to the final set of questions... Why are MeLaan and VenDell lying about ReLuur? Why would they not tell them ReLuur is a relatively young kandra? What exactly are we missing?