thegatorgirl00

After reading through this thread, I'm going to take a slightly different approach to guessing the next ideal. I'm going to look at where I think the oaths are ultimately leading to see what steps need to be taken to get there. I think that the fifth oath of every order of knights comes with the understanding that the thing which originally attracted a spren to you, while good, is ultimately a flawed and imperfect system. I think that's why it's so hard for knights of any order to achieve the fifth ideal. They have to admit their philosophy on life isn't perfect, which many people can't do. Looking at Skybreakers, what initially attracts Nale to Szeth is his ability to follow the law no matter what. Yet Nale later tells Szeth that the law is imperfect because it was created by imperfect men. This is not something that someone who only swears to obey the law no matter what would admit. We also have the Lightweavers, who acknowledge all the different parts of themselves by their fifth oath, despite the fact that lies were what drew a Cryptic to them in the first place. While they lie to others, a Lightweaver at that stage likely can't lie to themselves in the way one at an earlier truth can. Lies to themselves aren't good for them, even though it is what drew a Cryptic in the first place. I think the we are moving to something similar with the Windrunners. Although Windrunners will always protect, they will eventually realize that trying to protect everyone in the way Kaladin wants to is a flawed system that just isn't as good as he wants to think. No one person can protect everyone. Yet that's what Syl says initially attracted him to her: his constant attempts to save everyone. I like the ideas of letting go of the ones you can't save or letting others save themselves/you because I think they both move towards this realization. I am very skeptical of any argument that uses the idea that an oath needs to be about leadership. That chart is a representation of ideas created by people on Roshar, and the Ars Arcanum can be wrong about such things, especially when the people are wrong about them. Lightweavers don't show any creativity in their oaths. All they speak are truths, which is just honest. Skybreakers are confident in following their codes, but there isn't any specific oath about being confident. And while we haven't seen every Bondsmith oath, I can't imagine how Dalinar's future oaths would involve him swearing to be more pious or how that would relate to uniting and guiding people, which is what Bondsmiths seem to be about.

I don't think she'll be five the entire book. I think that's just the prologue, and then she'll be older, probably a teenager, for the rest of the book.

We'll see if that's true when it actualy goes up on the site and everyone tries to view it.

When you open a tab to Brandon's website and constantly refresh it in the hopes of seeing the state of the Sanderson.

I thought Defending Elysium because there are aliens, which I don't recall in Firstborn and because

I think it's Defending Elysium.

Actually, I think it's probably Defending Elysium. It could also be Firstborn, but I find that much more unlikely based on the story and world. You can read them both online, which I very much suggest you read. http://www.tor.com/stories/2008/12/firstborn http://brandonsanderson.com/defending-elysium Edit: I'm adding Perfect State to the list of possibilities, but I think it's less likely than the others.

Kill Iadon, heal Elend 2. Nightwielder - 6 3. Regalia - 5 4. Fortuity - 6 6. Newton - 2 7. Obliteration - 9 8. Sourcefield - 5 9. Conflux - 5 11. Firefight (Fire epic version) - 6 12. Firefight (Megan) - 7 13. David - 6 14. Mizzy - 8 15. Lord Ruler - 2 16. Elend - 7 17. God King - 7 18. Gavilar Kholin - 11 19. Dalinar - 6 21. Elhokar - 7 22. Sebarial - 6 23. Raoden - 7 24. Eventeo - 6 25. Iadon - 0

I feel we have a good grasp on what the Edgedancers were about. They cared about the little guys, helping the common person while the orders did scholarly research or fought epic battles. I can imagine an edgedancer getting squires by 'adopting' orphans and the homeless and bringing them back to Urithiru with them.

You seem to have the idea that dullform doesn't have a spren. All forms except slaveform have spren. The ones that provide dullform are just the really common ones that don't do anything else.

It's my hometown. Even not being super interested in sports, a little bit of the insanity that is southern college football has still managed to seep in. Well, lobotomies sever the connection to the part of the brain dealing with personality and decision making. That's why I called it spiritual lobotomy. Sealing Ba-Ado-Mishram tore out the singers who were Connected to her's Connection and Identity. The listener's weren't connected to her, so they avoided those effects. The Everstorm, using Odium's Investiture, healed the parshmen's spirits.

I've seen people refer to it as lobotomizing them. Spiritual lobotomy would probably be pretty accurate, considering the effects on personality and ability to be independent.

Well, the Starfalls vision was WoK ch 19, though Dalinar only notices the shards, not surges and we only know the orders from the Dhardplate colors. The Recreance vision is WoK ch 52. I also forgot a vision in OB ch 38, when Dalinar sees a Stoneward use their powers, though there aren't any Windrunners obviously floating around that time. The Stoneward uses tension to change a cliff face so it has handholds, summons a Shardhammer, and charges toward Voidbringers.

We've seen Stonewards a few times in Dalinar's vision. They were in the vision of the Recreance coming back from the front lines, and the female Radiant in the Starfalls vision was one. Interestingly, both times they were with Windrunners. I don't have any evidence beyond that, but I suspect the Stonewards and Windrunners were the two primary combat orders and that their surges and combat abilities complement each other very well.

Kill Mitosis, Heal Elend 2. Nightwielder - 6 3. Regalia - 5 4. Fortuity - 6 5. Mitosis - 0 6. Newton - 5 7. Obliteration - 9 8. Sourcefield - 5 9. Conflux - 5 11. Firefight (Fire epic version) - 5 12. Firefight (Megan) - 6 13. David - 6 14. Mizzy - 7 15. Lord Ruler - 4 16. Elend - 6 17. God King - 7 18. Gavilar Kholin - 8 19. Dalinar - 5 21. Elhokar - 7 22. Sebarial - 6 23. Raoden - 7 24. Eventeo - 5 25. Iadon - 4

Getting new Radiants is also dependent on the spren. The honorspren are willing to bond in large numbers again, but other types are more hesitant. Ivory says the other inkspren didn't want him to come over, and he's the only one willing to bond. Glys is weird, we don't really know if Renarin can have squires.

I would definitely suggest going further if you stopped when they all said their opinions. I completely understand why that would make you not want to listen, but I thought they did a good job of calmly analyzing the situation. They couldn't be completely unbiased, obviously, but the definitely tried to look at it from both sides. I thought they had some really good insight. I found @Chaos's insight to Kaladin particularly interesting to listen to. Besides, if you disagree with a point they made, you can come down here and explain your reasoning for why you disagree. Or if you continue to find it too hard to listen to, you can still stop.

Ah, that makes sense. I think it's not a fabrial for two main reasons It can grow, and it used to disappear. This is so different from any other fabrial we've seen. It is more in line with what we've seen of Shardblades. Kaladin can power the plate with his Stormlight in the four-on-one duel. Every other fabrial we've seen has needed gemstones to work, even when being used by a Radiant.

My thought that the spren was like a on/off switch. When they were killed, the switch was pushed to on and the controls were torn out so it couldn't be flipped again. Shardplate doesn't scream, however, and you would think any sentient being would scream if they were trapped like that, even if they weren't sapient. It's an idea with lots of holes that I'm not particularly attached to. I don't think Shardplate is a fabrial because it has always felt alive in a way that Shardblades never did. It needs food to work in Stormlight. It can grow back broken parts, even if the he sees is as small as a grain of sand. Shardblades are just there to swing around, not nearly as interactive. I just had any idea. Maybe we've been thinking about Shardplate wrong. We've been assuming that if it is a spren, it would need to be dead lol me the blades. What if they're alive, but slumbering like the Sibling? Like Urithiru, Shardplate still has some functionality, just not to the extent it once did. And it would explain why there isn't any screaming. The spren aren't dead.

What made you think she wants to get with him? When Kaladin talks about his dreams of saving her, her response is pretty much "You don't get to decide what makes me happy, so stop talking about my husband and storm off". Sure she was surprised when Kaladin spoke to Dalinar, but she just found out her childhood friend was on a first name basis with the most important man in the world. That would surprise anyone. She didn't come across as fickle to me either, instead acting loyal to her husband and people. It's not like Kaladin's family was completely innocent either. Lirin had stolen a bunch of money from her father for Kaladin. It's not Kaladin's fault, but she has legitimate reason to be angered at his family.

I think this happens because the Radiant spren acts almost as a bridge to the Shardplate spren. There really isn't much of a bond between the person and the Shardplate spren, there are two bonds that go through the Radiant spren. That would explain why modern Shardplate can't be summoned or dismissed as well. It took a bond through the gen to be able to summon and dismiss Shardblades again. If that bond wasn't possible with the person in the first place, it couldn't be recreated. There is some evidence of this when Dalinar goes to the Starfall vision as a Radiant. When he claims he is having trouble with his helm, the Windrunner's first response is talk to your spren. Why would he need to do that if the spren wasn't involved in the process? We know Chasmfiends have some kind of bond with a spren that allows them to grow to giant sizes and not be crushed by their own weight, presumably using gravitation.

Keep in mind that Kaladin, our darkeyed KR, is only at the third ideal. It's possible that as he progresses his eyes change more, with a permanent change at the fifth ideal when the bond is at its strongest.

Singers are the species, listeners are the group specifically on the Shattered Plains. Voidbringer can be pretty much anything that follows Odium. Parsh would be equivilant to singers and Parshendi equivilent to listeners, but only if you are an ignorant Alethi. Parshmen are specifically the ones in slave form. @SLNC my problem with them together is that he just doesn't understand her. When they're talking on the boat in Shadesmar, he says it must be great to just forget things. He doesn't understand how unhealthy it is for her. Maybe Kaladin needs someone like her in his life, but I think Kaladin would be one of the worst people for Shallan to have in her life. And maybe he would be fine with her killing her mother, but would he be okay with how she killed her father? Poisoning him and then strangling him in his sleep? I don't think so. Would he like her constantly sneaking around with the Ghostbloods? I think it would go too much against what he believes is right to approve of that. On a surface level she seems to have all the traits that would work for him, but I think if you go deeper that relationship would fall apart because of their differences in worldview.

No one has mentioned Venli yet. We know human singer relationships have happened before. She's a scholar. They would need to develop a friendship first, because of how singer forms work. In terms of personality, my initial thought is someone like Adolin. Someone incredibly loyal and caring, but still able to keep up with him. Someone who knows how to deal with his depression. Someone who is truly a partner to him. I think it might be somewhat difficult for him to view someone as a partner, because he will either want to protect them or he's their superior officer.

He's actually said it was the sixth Alcatraz book.