Aoibheann

I think Brandon has told us how the Oathgates are locked. It struck like lightning this weekend on my re-read. After the Radiants stopped using the Oathgates, the purpose of the plateaus was eventually forgotten and the plateaus (except on the Shattered Plains) were built upon. There are many people and buildings to move, requiring an astronomical (if not infinite) amount of Stormlight. The locking is not intentional. Check out these quotes: Shallan has been mostly moving people from the warcamps, we don't know how physical matter affects the amount of Light needed. It's possible that physical matter is unimportant, only the number of "conscious" minds impact Light needs. We may see what happens if/when the palace in Kohlinar is emptied of people. A co-worker of mine pointed out: The Everstorm may take care of these "locks" by scouring the plateaus clear of buildings; inadvertently helping via destruction. Thoughts?

Thanks for the update. I don't follow twitter I will stop my daily checking until past Peter's deadline. (Thank you Peter!)

This thread got me thinking. We need to look at the Chapter Headings. Chapter 40, "Palona" has Kalak and Vedel as the Heralds. This is the first chapter where Sebarial's actual organization is revealed and Palona is introduced. This doesn't hold for Chapter 86, "Patterns of Light", but there are some many things going on in that chapter... (I think the Heralds are for Kaladin and Szeth).

Anyone have an update? I'm trying not to be impatient (and certainly don't want to interfere with deadlines). Do we know when to expect Team Sanderson to have time to get this up?

I wonder if a question about Tarah would be answered in the question period at the end of the WoK reread? Asking "Who is Tarah?" would probably get RAFO'd. Other possible questions: was Tarah a lighteyes or darkeyes? was Tarah someone Kaladin could/should have saved? Other questions?

Shallan assumes the assassins took Jasnah's body & trunk above. When the trunk shows up unharmed on land, Shallan still doesn't revise her assumption about Jasnah.

I like the anagram part of the theory! There's something odd about the couple, but I'm not willing to put money on any of the theories I've seen. Mraize & Iyatil? Nazh and Khriss? Demoux and nameless Terris woman?

At the end of WoR, Pattern strongly hints that Shallan will need to stop with the Veil front if she is to truly become a Radiant. Pattern is really attracted to the abstract thought humans produce linking otherwise disparate ideas. Shallan's synthesis of the Urithiru location is a perfect example of this. Pattern assumes each map is drawn to scale, but many of the older maps are really vague drawings. Pattern knows there is no Truth, but he can't find the truths Shallan can. Shallan believes she is searching for Truth, finding many truths along the way.

- Found it! WoR page 595, kindle edition. Re: Skybreakers. I keep coming back to Shallan's comment about Heleran (WoR, page 423, kindle ed): Shallan thinks this about her brother who joined the Skybreakers. I can't imagine him being involved in an organization only aimed at killing surgebinders. I think the Skybreakers are trying to do good in the world, (as are most of the secret organizations) they are just misguided. They no longer have the "checks a spren requires."

The assistant, Ivis, who Zahel sends to help with Kaladin and the other bridgemen is female. Zahel finds the Alethi sexism rather silly, As for Adolin... There are many options for him. I have a feeling Szeth may be sent after him in the next book. It will be interesting to see how Nightblood reacts.

Sadeas admits he's been lying to himself: He originally wanted Dalinar out of the way, so he could influence Elhokar, but that didn't work. Now he wants them both out of the way. He also took a major step toward embracing Odium when he deserted Dalinar at the Tower. Even pretending to be honorable influences people toward Honor. With the abandonment of allies on the field, Sadeas stopped pretending to be honorable.

Main theory - solid - it could be Ishar. Crazy end theory - I don't follow. How did the Shin manipulate Nalan? We don't see anything of that. Also (and this doesn't really impact your theory, but you mention it): We don't know Gavilar was actively involved in the Sons of Honor. We know Amaram (and Taravangian) were influenced by Gavilar. We know they want to claim Gavilar as theirs, but we don't know Gavilar's actual allegiances.

On the "extra shardblade" - It looks to me like Captain Khal started off with only plate, but ends up with Teleb's shardblade after Teleb is killed during the battle.

from tWoK page 370, kindle edition: Teleb is the officer who recommends looking into a combination of man carried bridges and the siege bridges. He is still alive at the end of tWoK. During WoR Dalinar/Adolin give him Shards. During the final battle of WoR Teleb is slain, his shardblade is recovered by Captain Khal. Just last week I found the quote discussing Oldbloods being descended from the last rulers of a united Alethkar... but I can't find it today. Argh!

Shallan does have ideals, they are a more liberal interpretation of ideals. Shallan must achieve a level of enlightenment or self-awareness. She gets there by speaking or acknowledging truths about herself. WoB (thanks RShara!) says Shallan at the end of WoR is one "level" above Kaladin. I understand Kaladin is at Level 3 based on the ideals he has sworn. I believe each order has 4 ideals beyond the first "universal" ideal. Kaladin has 2 more levels/ideals to go, Shallan has 1 more. Presumably the last ideal potentially allows Shardplate.

@Argent, Thanks for clarifying what I meant re: larkin. (I've considered changing my name... but I haven't found the right one just yet. Coincidentally I used to have ARGENT as a license plate. I'm not coveting your name though... really. Imagine you need an infused emerald for soulcasting. You need a huge, infused emerald; large enough you can't get one from the money exchanger. You have an emerald, but it has no stormlight in it, or not enough to perform the task. It would be nice to be able to transfer the stormlight from some broams to your giant gem and finish your task. This sort of convenience, short of being a surgebinder, would not come cheaply. The only people with that requirement would have access to abnormally large gems and the technology powered by those gems. Larkin seem to be able to suck in stormlight. The larkin may have no choice about it. We don't know what happens to the stormlight the larkin ingests. If it is later transferable, this ability may continue after death. The Reshi seem to tend and care for the larkins. The above, along with Nalan's treatment of his larkin make me think the Reshi have very good reasons for to care who has access to the corpses of their larkin friends.

In the Rysn interlude she mentions dead larkin are very valuable. Could this be a way of storing/infusing stormlight into a "sphere" outside normal highstorm infusion?

I think a Windrunner would feel duty bound to protect Ym or Lift. Nalan seems to believe 1) there is no statute of limitations and 2) everything is a capital crime (when it comes to surgebinders). Do I think Nalan is following the Skybreaker ideals? I don't know. He (likely) has no spren. His emphasis on death before life seems to indicate he's lost his way (to say the least). But it's possible the Skybreakers would see no problem with going after decades old crimes, despite living a clean life for years... In fact, perhaps that's the dilemma (real) Skybreakers need to deal with, recognizing it's important to temper Justice with mercy, recognition of extenuating circumstances, etc.; as Windrunners need to protect even those they dislike/hate.

On my last read-through WoR I tried to catch the Heralds' names. Not all are in swears. I've tried to leave off the ones already mentioned in the thread. Battah (Navani discussing Jasnah's disappearance pg 221) Vedel (Taln's monologue, pg 401) Chana (Kaladin thinking about Navani, pg 886) Chanaranach (stormseat temple pg 941)

There's also this quote after Shallan's decision to deal with her Father: To me this implies Shallan had tried to hide and/or flee from her Mother. Maybe this is why Shallan spent so much time in the gardens? Even before her Mother's death?

I've been thinking about Valam's death rattle and the suckling child rattle coming up with a slightly different interpretation. Every time someone is killed unnecessarily it advances Odium's cause, for the choice of Honor is life. Life before death, etc. Examples: Redin killing Valam, Taravangian sowing chaos, Amaram killing Kaladin's men, etc. Taravangian using the sick and unnoticed to ferret out the death rattles is a perfect example of choosing death before life. Odium makes this so tempting via the Unmade (Moelach specifically).

@Argent - there are 7 references in WoR. They all talk about green specks or green motes. Ym's spren is referred to as a shimmer of light. I can't think of any other examples of spren that jump out as being different between the Listeners and the humans.

Liss also has a shardblade. Not impossible to come by, but not common either. Which world are you positing she's from?

Weiry, I'm going to disagree about the locking only working on flamespren. I think it only works on flamespren, so far. Even Rushu comments on how interesting it is as a beginning. I think Shallan did pull Pattern much more into the physical world with her drawing. I think her bond had weakened (ala Kaladin) causing the child-like behavior he exhibited in the first few chapters of WoR.

Do you think there are other voidspren hanging about the Parshmen and Listeners waiting for the right moment to bond? spren they assume are normal emotion spren?