Kasimir

The Turn has ended!

And...why do I exe my 'sleepy teammates' when I can win with them? More insinuation, more inability to engage, more FUD, more fearmongering, inability to address even Illwei's questions here.

Wanted to see if I could bait more out of Coffee by pretending not to be BS and ccing at Rollovet. Also, try to lure Coffee into complacency. My primary concern for most of the Night was reasoning out whether Coffee was the SK or the last Elim. Likely a better flip than green no matter what, but if there's good reason to think Coffee is the SK, then maybe not the best push.

Still not engaging with the arguments, Coffee. Still not engaging with the logic. Trying to slander me with 'grasping at straws' is another Elim move here - you can't address the arguments because you don't have anything left, so you try to accuse others of doing what you yourself are doing. I know this playbook - it's called DARVO.

Well, that and the fact Ookla season is due to expire soon - sure you can precode it but having to do it all over again for name regression is just a pain. Time not well-spent. And there are two of us to vc check. In theory. Mat here laughing at the fact I'm suddenly willing to go back to traditional vc methods when GMing

Only for those in Mat's MR and Araris's LG, which are two separate instances. I have not bothered to do one for this due to the effort/reward ratio.

Let me rehash where we are at, since Coffee doesn't have a defense anymore There is only one Brandon Sanderson in the game. Coffee has claimed it, and I'm ccing her. If I am Village, then it is patently unreasonable for me to cc Coffee here unless I am in fact Brandon Sanderson. V!Kas doesn't know what way Coffee will flip as he lacks TMI - pushing a sus player on gut is high risk as if Coffee flips V, V!Kas is next, causing a Village loss. If I am Elim, then it is patently unreasonable for me to cc Coffee here. Coffee, in addition, has paved the way for a brawl by hinting she is expecting a cc and lurking in thread all through the Night, presumably waiting for the actual Brandon to show up. If I am Elim, I am the last Elim. I don't know whether Coffee is Brandon or not, and the fact no one up to me has cced Coffee should crank my credences sky high that Coffee is Brandon, meaning I am absolutely screwed after Coffee flips Sanderson. Either way, E!Kas knows Coffee will flip green or blue, and quite likely green. This is a losing proposition for him, as Coffee has acknowledged. If I am the SK, it is still patently unreasonable for me to cc Coffee here, because I die next cycle to the exe once Coffee flips Sanderson. Keep in mind again that until me, no one has cced Coffee. This means to SK!Kas, BS!Coffee credences should be sky high. Again, Coffee acknowledges this is illogical. I'll add there's a second and third layer of illogic here: E!me was a crucial voice in getting JNV exed by campaigning aggressively for their death last cycle, and also pushed Ash hard. There's no incentive for E!me to do this, killing two teammates in one fell swoop. Coffee acknowledged this at the start of this cycle but has conveniently ignored it now to continue with her nonsense claim. I am also widely read as consensus Village - E!me has no reason to drive the bus over my teammates to make it harder to win; SK!me has no reason to make the Coffee push here because it's seppuku one way or another and I don't need it with my Village credences. Well, here's the fourth layer: we've worked out Raven was the SK kill. JNV would never consent to a Raven shot. I would certainly never consent to a Raven C1 kill either - it's BM, as Neil would put it, and I'm not only aware of Raven getting N1ed, but called Sart out on it in a separate game. Coffee earlier claimed that she has to be Brandon because she isn't cced. Now I'm explicitly ccing her and she's doubled down but keeps retreating to the BS claim and isn't able to defend against the various points/charges levelled against her. I return you to the first point: either Coffee or I am Brandon Sanderson. I'm ccing Coffee (thanks Araris >> MR4 flashbacks here.) If my actions make no strategic and tactical sense for an Elim or a SK, then it's pretty clear I am who I say I am, and Coffee is an Elim trying to avoid being exed. (JNV and Ash defense, which she cannot refute, supports this slightly.) I'll point out here that Coffee's worldview is patently absurd at this point. She acknowledges it's absurd for E!me or SK!me to cc here, but also insists she's BS(ing.) In contrast, it's easier to see what Coffee is doing - she came under pressure, panicked, trickled the idea of a tantalising role, and then was forced to claim when I pointed out that no Villager should be okay dying at lylo but not this cycle. Coffee keeps retreating to the Sanderson claim and "I'm tired" claims because she doesn't have a defense there so she has to handwave it. There's fewer absurdities if we take me at my word. She took forever to push back against me, because she knows I'm not Evil and she knows I'm lying - this is why she was so conciliatory earlier, as Eiwlil noticed. Meanwhile, I came out guns blazing against Coffee once Rollovet happened. I'd like us to keep analysing but believe Coffee is the best call for this cycle. I'm willing to be talked around to other options, but this would need hard convincing for me as Coffee looks much more likely red than blue. I've said my piece; I just wanted to demolish her BS because I'm tired and I don't know how she's not tired of all this rubbish on stilts

Illwei asked Coffee a good question. I'm waiting to hear from Neil. I think we need more discussion and data. But the important thing here is Coffee is one of our two remaining red/blue slots, so we just need to find one more. I think there's some argument for Aman being a Coffee kill contra @Winnie the Pookla and was why I asked - Aman wasn't as sold on V!Coffee and was largely restrained by my Coffee read. I'll also add Coffee's defense of JNV and Ash definitely seems to point more to E.

No, and genuinely - the point of me claiming at Rollovet was first because I'm traditional, I hoped to collect more data from Coffee, and I want us to talk about this and make the right call this cycle. In the very slim world Coffee is the SK instead, who are we going to push next cycle, at lylo? We don't want to be wasting time here, frankly. I don't like giving up tempo unnecessarily.

Honestly the way I see it it's a win/win. Either I finally stop a kill this cycle because they try to play the IKYK game with me, or I get to fill out the clown meme I sent Mat about my Lurching decisions as one box is still empty

No comment. I don't want my patterns to be disclosed here.

I'm intending to self-protect. Sorry to everyone as I agree with Aman that it's selfish, but I want to be insurance in lylo even though my Lurching skills are absolute crap OTL and I have an insane amount of memes about this game I sent to Mat, including a clown meme about my Lurching abilities FWIW I was a Lurcher in I think LG94 and LG7 and went the entire damn game without ever stopping a kill in both cases so yeah this is par for the course for me and when I opened my GM PM and realised I was supposed to be the wall between the Village and much stabby death, I just sent Mat and Elan this: Village on realising they are now dependent on Kas's Lurching skills, colorised: I'm not willing to disclose who I was on last cycle as this exposes them, but I had thought to shift to the low activity bracket, mirroring Aman's comments, given where the past kills had been.

Well, I never saw the point in claiming because of the off-chance it could force a situation where I could cc - also because most of the reason for it is clearing another slot, but I was consensus Village so no real incentive to do so there. It just exposes me for no particularly useful reason. This also explains why I was so willing to repeatedly call Aman Sanderson - I really appreciated the PR shielding, V!read him on the basis of meta and other factors (I've outlined this before C3), and was hoping to drive the NK to him and then shield him, making a liar out of him on self-protection (sorry bro.)

So clearly this means I'm not the SK, and the BM C1 Raven kill should have precluded me from being the SK anyway - at this point, I think people can see an interesting dynamic here. I am ccing Coffee and accusing Coffee of being Evil. Coffee has taken this long to get there. I'll also add Coffee has an interesting worldview here, expecting me to somehow be Evil after being the main voice behind the JNV push and pushing Ash as well, to quote her early words. We're back to classic Elim-about-to-die progression. I would like everyone to weigh on on whether you think Coffee is actually the SK here. I lean against it, but am not sure. I don't find engaging Coffee further to be productive here given Coffee's main security was the fact there was no cc, and I have now explicitly done so. Edited to add: I'm actually a bit surprised no one guessed by now, given this C3 post had explicit 'ask for advice on PR' vibes but I guess people were preoccupied.

Sorry, I won't, because you're still lying, hoping to save yourself from the exe

Nope. You're lying, I'm afraid Edited to add: Let me be very clear, Coffee. You've hidden behind the claim, insisting you haven't been cced. Let me spell it out for you: you've been cced. I'm calling you a liar and an Elim and claiming Brandon Sanderson. Your move.

Why would I vote Coffee, again, a certifiably insane move for V!Kas if there was no cc, if I wasn't dead sure Coffee was Evil, i.e. because I am Brandon Sanderson. Why would I keep pushing Coffee steadily and persistently, without a shred of doubt and hesitation. What I don't understand here is why you followed me, since without a cc, Coffee's claim is prima facie plausible.

But if you want something formal, have the thing I wrote C1 and edited intermittently for if I ever needed to save myself from the exe, @Winnie the Pookla. SAVE FOR IF I NEED TO CLAIM: They were suspecting him, now. Kasim looked at the gathering SE players, concerned. He didn't know most of them. Hadn't played Sanderson Elimination, really, for too many years, though there were those early games with the names no one knew now: Hael, Doctor, Jain, though Araris was still around. Not everything was lost, in this world. They didn't know him, either. Perhaps that was why they suspected him. Easier to question the stranger in your midst, and he hadn't played with most of them. Not since he'd had to focus on graduating that semester, and then the RSI shoulder injury and— "You're one of them, aren't you. The ones causing all of this," one of them hissed. The names ran together in his head. "Siao liao, I'm trying to stop them as much as you are," Kasim began. But the accusations came in. "Who's WildKarrde?" someone asked. A corner of the edifice of fiction crumbled. "Probably before your time. Played with Araris's gen, apparently." "That's forever ago." Mailliw73 hit post. "Long Game 5: Noble Secrets" blinked to life in the thread of the Sanderson Elimination subforum. He sat back and watched as players showed up in the thread. "I've recovered," said @Kasimir. "So I doubt I'll fall sick and miss the game again. Guess this is my first sign-up instead!" "He did some kayana things. Shot Araris in the face C1 and killed a Village Seeker. Totally why you don't do that sort of thing." Another corner of the edifice of fiction crumbled. "Yeah," said Kasimir. "You'd've to be around to see it. Winter'd balanced the game based around estimates of how devastating E!Wilson would've been which was Not The Best Idea. And Wilson's still fried as a fish about it, by the way." ">>" said Wyrmhero. "Hey, it was your fault. You told Gamma he should totally do that random unspecified thing he wanted to do." "And I was supposed to know he wanted to shoot Wilson in the face on C1?" "And steal her Elim team from her, don't forget that." "Araris returned the favour in that space game, from what I hear. I don't see why he holds a grudge." "I'm not mad," Kasimir said. He totally was though. Had spent hours doing GCE Physics ten year series to calm the heck down. "But Christ. I can't believe you murdered me on N-freakin'-1. I had such a good character arc with Sonder! I was enjoying the RP!" "Araris was the one who murdered you," Wilson said. "Fine, I can't believe you let your freakin' teammate murder me N1 yet again! And this game of all games! God, what's with Araris anyway?" "Also that Rosharan warcamps duel. Shardblade-wielding Karrde versus Aman, and Aman wiped the floor with him." "Way I heard it from Kas, Karrde was pretty close to taking on Aman, but Sart got involved and Sart was Evil." "Yeah, better you than me," said Kasimir, sagely. "Taking on E!Aman? No thank you. Nowhere near drunk enough for that." "It was a very close thing," El lamented. "I had to keep PMing everyone to remind them of the facts." "Like I said, I'd druther fight an angry Wilson. And that is about as appealing as wandering through a preserve of bears with meat strapped to my body and having slathered myself temptingly with honey. Or wandering into a wilderness of hungry Bengal tigers. Or..." "Wait. Who's Kas?" "What do you mean who's Kas? Who's Karrde? I don't remember a SE player by that name." Yet another corner of the edifice of fiction crumbled. The structure staggered beneath the weight of reality, the weight of illusion dreamed into existence by curiosity and a writer's craft. "Dragonsteel?" Kasimir winced. "I'd love to go, but it's in the States man. This sort of thing never hits my part of the world, and travel is a nightmare. Maybe if I ever did the grad school thing..." He laughed at the idea. Stupid thought, now. Too old, too locked in to do it. They always wanted you fresh. Fragments shifting. Reality settling into place, reasserting itself. There had never been a @WildKarrde . Fragments of experiences from various SE players, snatches through the eyes of others, a heavier handful from Kasimir, gathered together, woven into the framework of a life that never existed. What is collective memory, other than the stories we tell ourselves? As it turned out, SE players had their own shared stories, after all. There must be these things: laughter, friendship, hope, memory. These things give us a little light. These things make us last. The house of fiction crumbled in various places beneath the weight of what was, beneath the weight of events, beneath the weight of history. Brandon Sanderson removed the disguise he'd used to get closer to the SE players and watch what they'd been doing. Probably wasn't going to do the fake wizard beard thing again. "I'd prefer not to be banned from the convention," he said, mildly. (N.B. Listen I would write this less magical realism but it doesn't feel respectful to RPF this and I don't think any amount of fake beard is gonna explain how Mr Sanderson is an ancient grouchy sleep-deprived sweary Asian man living on painkillers okay just cope guys I sure had to.)

My voting Coffee, who, despite being suspicious, has claimed Brandon Sanderson with no one ccing Coffee, as of the point I placed my vote.

Coffee claimed Brandon without a cc. I vote Coffee. Do you not find that suspicious?

Sorry, Araris If it's any consolation, I was waiting for the shoe to drop for the first person, and Mat was asking me incredulously if I was really going to do it without ccing. I have no idea how anyone expected me to do something certifiably insane for V!Kas without being dead certain Coffee was going to flip red.

I think there's a very slim SK possibility. But I've been spending most of my free time at Night considering it and wanted the thread to think it through - either way, I think there's value in exeing Coffee, as she certainly won't flip green. Then why join me on Coffee?

Yes, so are you ccing?

For what it's worth, Aeo, you wanted a hypothesis, here's mine: if we add two more votes to Coffee and give it a couple hours, Coffee will claim SK next