Pathfinder

I commented this on another thread a while back. I interpreted Brandon's response to mean that spren are already investiture. Just like when people ask about awakening a shardblade, it is already invested to the hilt, so awakening it would be beyond difficult. Picking up a shard means investing yourself with its power. If you are already investiture, it is kind of hard to invest investiture. So I believe that is why Brandon is saying spren cannot. The Stormfather is unique because of him merging with Tanavast's cognitive shadow. Even then the stormfather isn't exactly acting as a vessel to a shard. He was expanded from the merging, but the stormfather isn't Honor. At least that was my understanding of it.

So first, we do know via WoB the requirement to be broken is not that high, so I am not commenting to dispute that or anything. However, in Tien's case he was very much treated as odd and an outsider by the other adults in the town, and made fun of by the children. We don't know the extent of the bullying because kids would leave Tien alone when Kaladin was around to glare at them. But Kaladin couldn't always be around.

So first and foremost, at least for myself, I am not arguing that Kaladin does not display leadership qualities. I just personally do not think those leadership qualities lend itself to kingship, or being a successful ruler. Kaladin has said multiple times he has trouble thinking/dealing with the bigger picture. For example when focusing on his bridge crew to the detriment of the rest of the army. And that is not the only time he has done that. I guess what I, and a few other people are saying is we see Kaladin as more of a direct military leader, than a ruler. But again as I posted before, I am not saying it is not possible. Just I personally do not think it will happen. I wish you luck! Totally respect your interpretation of that. For myself I thought it was saying the Dalinar must pick up the fallen title of the knights radiant. In other words re-found them. The tower was the battle of the tower. The crown was Elhokar and the highprinces. And the spear was Kaladin arriving. That was just my own reading of it. The back of the books are written by the Sleepless, and seem to concern the book itself (to me). So for myself, that quote has already come to pass and is done. I guess where we diverge is on the idea of corruption. I take Odium's influence as the Thrill working on Dalinar for years. Or the Heart of the Revel on the ardents. Gavinor just came across to me as a scared little boy who I agree will be traumatized by his experience, but I don't see him as being corrupted. But totally respect you see things differently. I didn't get the impression that Gavinor was comfortable with the voidspren. I feel that would have looked like the voidspren taking horrific forms of melting faces while the child giggled and clapped. That would come off as comfortable to me. So this is for iccaseiro58 and Bearer of Agonies (having trouble tagging you both). Regarding the highking and how it will function or at least how it was intended to function: Oathbringer page 140 "Dalinar Kholin. I swear to you now. There are princes and highprinces. Why not kings and highkings? I give an oath, immutable and witnessed, that I accept you as my monarch. As Alethkar is to me, I am to you" ......(to denote skipping general convo to the next pertinent portion) Elhokar pulled his arm free and rubbed it. "Won't even let me abdicate with dignity" "You're not abdicating." Navani said "Elhokar, you intend to shove your uncle into a position above you. He's right to ask. What will this mean for Alethkar" "I..." Elhokar swallowed "He should give up his lands to his heir. Dalinar is a king of somewhere else, after all. Dalinar, Highking of Urithiru, maybe the Shattered Plains." He stood straighter, speaking more certainly "Dalinar must stay out of the direct management of my lands. he can give me commands, but I decide how to see them accomplished" "I can accept these terms, though at times I might need to give commands to your highprinces." "As long as they're in your domain" Elhokar said, a hint of stubborness to his voice "I consider them under your authority. While they visit Urithiru or the Shattered Plains, command as you wish. When they return to my kingdom, you must go through me" "Very well" Dalinar said "Though we need to work this out with scribes before we make the change officially. And before we go too far, we should make certain there is still an Alethkar for you to rule" So first and foremost, the details were never hammered out nor announced. So there is nothing legally binding to Jasnah as of yet. I do believe she will agree with it, and hash out the terms with Dalinar, but it was never official, neither privately nor publicly. Secondly although Dalinar can command the highprinces while within his domain if need be, it does not make Dalinar king of Alethkar. The whole purpose of this was for him to divest himself from Alethkar. The ruling of the kingdom was to be under Elhokar. And commands Dalinar gave, it was up to Elhokar on how he would carry them out. But Alethkar was still very much Elhokar's kingdom. This is also especially nebulous as Dalinar said to first confirm there would be a land for Elhokar to rule. Now that Alethkar is an occupied state, I would imagine there would be some provisions since the bulk of Alethekar is currently situated at Urithiru. Though for myself all of this is moot as Jasnah already willingly works with Dalinar, and Dalinar trusts Jasnah's rule (he stated when he planned to abdicate back in Way of Kings that he wished she was around, so she could look out for Adolin and he said he trusts Jasnah implicitly.)

I like that idea. Either using an honorblade from a different order, so you get access to 4 surges, and potentially get 6 resonances, or as you said pick an honorblade of an order one "over" as it were, thereby strengthening slightly one surge, while also getting two new resonances.

It looks like pre-Elantris, that there were still Elantrians, just they had to discover the aons. WoB below Brandon Sanderson Aons are an interesting part of this book–perhaps my favorite of the world elements. If you think about the system I've set up, you'll realize some things. First, the Aons have to be older than the Aonic language. They're based directly off of the land. So, the lines that make up the characters aren't arbitrary. Perhaps the sounds associated with them are, but the meanings–at least in part–are inherent. The scene with Raoden explaining how the Aon for "Wood" includes circles matching the forests in the land of Arelon indicates that there is a relationship between the Aons and their meanings. In addition, each Aon produces a magical effect, which would have influenced its meaning. The second interesting fact about the Aons is that only Elantrians can draw them. And Elantrians have to come from the lands near Arelon. Teoish people can be taken, but only if they're in Arelon at the time. Genetically, then, the Teos and the Arelenes must be linked–and evidence seems to indicate that the Arelenes lived in the land first, and the Teos crossed the sea to colonize their peninsula. Only Elantrians can draw Aons in the air, so someone taken by the Shaod must have developed the writing system. That is part of what makes writing a noble art in Arelon–drawing the Aons would have been associated with Elantrians. Most likely, the early Elantrians (who probably didn't even have Elantris back then) would have had to learn the Aons by trial and error, finding what each one did, and associating its meaning and sound with its effect. The language didn't develop, but was instead "discovered." There are likely Aons that haven't even been found yet. Elantris Annotations (Feb. 14, 2006)

Yolish lightweaving that Hoid possesses is a pre-shattering magic system with limitations.

Something is weird going on with the site so I am unable to respond separately to each of your points, so I will line them up the same as you did so you will know which is regarding which Sorry, as I clarified to asmodeus, it was never my intention to say windrunners did not have the attribute of leadership. My intention was, for myself, just because their herald is a king, does not mean windrunners end up kings, and that is especially so for myself when Brandon has said the order on whole functioned as scouts. Now could individuals end up as kings? Sure! But just for myself, I do not feel the two are connected. True an Odium spren was harassing a scared little boy, but that is not necessarily Odium's influence to me. You can totally think that, and I respect that, but I don't. As to "He must pick it up, the fallen title!" I always took it as the title "knight radiant". Which ultimately he did. I didn't feel it was associated with any kingship. I guess for myself I don't see the need for Kaladin to reign at all. He leads his troops, which for myself satisfies the leadership part of the windrunners. But like i said initially, it could happen. personally I don't think it will, but I totally acknowledge it could happen, and I wish you luck with your theory. Now to skip to the last point, personally I don't think Gavinor is necessarily corrupted. Also even if he was and became an issue, Jasnah, Dalinar, Adolin, or Renarin would step up in place as per the line of succession. There is also more (to me) separating Kaladin from ruling Alethkar than just those four people. There are also the other highprinces to consider as well as a host of other issues. Sorry, didn't intend to confuse things with the shock troop use Ah gotcha regarding the skybreakers.

Well the first oath seems to be easy enough to swear, and counts if you mean it. You don't have to say it (life before death, etc). Renarin was having future sight as of WoR for awhile, so he theoretically could have sworn that oath at around the beginning of WoR. By the end with the climax of WoR he could have sworn the third oath, which would be why when they explore Urithiru he has a shardblade. Just throwing out an idea. Nothing concrete.

Sorry, it was not my intent to say windrunners are not leaders at all. I was just saying just because the herald of their order was a king, does not (to me) indicate that the members of the order will tend to be rulers. That I referenced in past desolations as per Brandon, they were scouting troops. Not rulers of nations. I was just saying for myself, whether Kaladin rules Alethkar or not is not connected to the windrunner order due to their founding herald. Which is why I elaborated that Gavinor, Elhokar's heir would make more sense to me to take over from Jasnah when he comes to age. But totally not intending to say that windrunners don't attract people and have a large membership. I just don't see the order in and of itself as rulers of nations. They seem to be scouts to me. Scouts that can protect and lead the people they arrive to save.

So my use of shock troops were more in line with the idea of them being able to fly to places under attack, to hold the enemy till more dedicated forces could arrive. My intended focus was on the scouting portion of my statement, which was derived from this WoB: Questioner Is there anything about the Stonewards that you can share that's not a RAFO? I know they're coming later. Brandon Sanderson They are coming later, so not really. They were more of the Knights Radiant front line troops, as opposed to the Windrunners who were scouts. But you probably already knew that. Skyward Atlanta signing (Nov. 17, 2018) edit: where did you hear skybreakers get the same resonance as windrunners? Not saying you are wrong or challenging you. Just wanting to learn something new.

So first and foremost i am not saying it couldnt happen. Just saying my own thoughts on the matter and why i think them. Windrunners are the scouts/shock troops of the radiants. That doesnt come off as rulers to me. True jezerien was a king and called herald of kings, but his radiant order for myself seems to be scout/mobile infantry. Elhokar already has an heir in Gavinor. So my expectation is for him to take over rulership after jasnah. Jasnah i could see world hopping when gavinor comes of age Side note, just curious, why do you think jasnah is going to die?

I could see it playing out a lot of different ways. Breaths are naturally more "sticky" so I think that is why an awakened item can last so long. It does eventually deteriorate. Brandon has said you can't have a never ending awakened arm turning a crank for electricity for instance. I could see needing regular stormlight "infusions" to maintain an awakened item.

Just some WoB that I think are pertinent to the discussion and can add to it: Hoiditthroughthegrapevine If a Dysian Aimian had the Elsecaller honorblade, could just a single hordeling transition to the Cognitive Realm? 'Cause I think I've heard that a person couldn't just transition a single part of their body. Brandon Sanderson They could transition a single hordeling, but as it works right now, they would probably lose contact with the host and would become broken-off and no longer part of the hive. It's not truly a hive. But it would be like of your finger got cut off and sent to-- something like that. It would start acting independently. Hoiditthroughthegrapevine So would you have to have the preponderance of the Dysian Aimian transition to the Cognitive Realm? And the ones that stayed in the Physical Realm would be cut off? Brandon Sanderson Yeah. It would be bad for half-and-half to go. Let's say that, one thing that they would love to be able to do is to have a little more versatility there. Let's just say that. Skyward Seattle signing (Nov. 10, 2018) Questioner Regarding Dysian Aimians. The cremlings that make them up are spread about in a large area-- Brandon Sanderson They can lose touch if the distance is too far. They can lose contact with the mind of the whole thing. Questioner Would their Cognitive aspect be affected by that? Brandon Sanderson Yes it would be. I'll just leave it there, but yes. Skyward San Diego signing (Nov. 7, 2018) Pagerunner In [Oathbringer], when they first enter Shadesmar, they see a bunch of spren that are a few inches tall, green or orange. Are those Cognitive manifestations of one or more Dysian Aimians that were in Kholinar? Brandon Sanderson No, but good question. Skyward Pre-Release AMA (Oct. 12, 2018) Questioner I am wondering if Dysian Aimians are more resistant to Soulcasting? Brandon Sanderson Yeah, I would say, yes. I would say, in general for various reasons, but yes. Prague Signing (Oct. 26, 2019)

Totally respect your opinion, and my reply is not to indicate you are wrong or not. Just responding in the manner as an atheist on earth, as kingsdaughter mentioned her own religious beliefs and alignment as it were. For myself, I believe there is a difference between the cognitive self issue, and abortion because I mentioned in a prior post that the cognitive self can potentially be viewed, interacted with, and spoken to. The cognitive self can reason and demonstrate sapience. For myself, a fetus cannot. So for myself, I would not equate the two. But having said that, again, I totally acknowledge and respect if you think differently in regards to a fetus and wish to connect the two. Just for myself, i do not.

I dunno. Personally I see it playing out very much like lobotomies. Initially people were thrilled with the results, even though a good chunk were turned into drooling and unresponsive (very few were capable of functioning normally after though still suffered from epileptic seizures, while others committed suicide), it was still seen as an improvement over mental illness. But as doctors learned more about the functions of the brain and what a lobotomy does to the individual, it (according to wikipedia) became known as "a disparaged procedure, a byword for medical barbarism and an exemplary instance of the medical trampling of patient's rights". Actually (for humor) I think it is rather apropos linking lobotomies with hemalurgy. Both involve taking a rather long spike, and driving it into a person lol.

I think I know what you are referring to, but just in case, could you elaborate? Why would they be unkillable due to abrasion?

I think the closest we can come to an example of this so far is when a radiant of an order holds an honorblade of the same order, so they are granted the same surge twice. Brandon was asked would that cause some compounding, and Brandon stated it would to a small degree. Now this is not a conclusive answer, but I think we could theoretically take that answer and apply it to the scenario you present. It would make it a bit stronger, but potentially not game breaking. Now as to resonances, I could see a resonance potentially forming, as it requires a few powers. Once you get past a certain number (I feel like it is three but I don't know if it was ever explicitly stated), then it is difficult to get resonances as you are focusing on too many powers. Side note, I think a truthwatcher with f-gold would be better personally, because I still lend towards Brandon's idea that radiant orders tend to learn one surge first over the other, and tend to be better in that surge. (so truthwatchers tend to learn progression first. Just like elsecallers tend to learn transformation first and ranged soulcasting is due to them being very practiced in it. That a lightweaver if they chose to focus on it, could potentially learn to do the same). So I would be interested in seeing how OP Truthwatcher f gold healing would be considering the combo of regrowth, stormlight healing, and f-gold.

I may be misunderstanding @Weltall and @Quantus but we have a WoB that when a radiant is in a highstorm they can soulcast whatever essence they want without gemstones. I will add it in a moment, but that coupled with the other WoBs say to me that a Radiant soulcasting does not need specific gemstones to soulcast. They are using the stormlight to fuel the surge and thereby can use any essence. Just some are better at/more practiced at some essences than others. Jasnah confesses she isn't very good with organics. For using fabrials alone, since they are limited, they need specific gemstones to soulcast specific essences. If that was what you both were saying, then I apologize in advance. If you both were saying something different, then I realize and acknowledge what I wrote has not been explicitly confirmed yet, and it is my own understanding/interpretation of the WoB at hand. The Forumlurker (paraphrased) If a Radiant tried to Soulcast directly with the Stormlight from the highstorm, what essences could they create? Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) They could basically do whatever they want. There wouldn't be any limitations, but only for Radiant Soulcasters. Stuttgart signing (May 17, 2019)

Thing is (for myself and myself only, just explaining how I would view it), in situations such as euthanasia, and the death penalty, there are legal requirements to what constitutes death, and what is cruel and unusual. If it is shown (which I think it could be, they just have not found out how to yet) that an observable, speaking, and reasoned "you" shows up in the cognitive realm, regardless anyone's personal belief system, then it must be established whether it has rights. Add that it does in fact feel pain, and "death" would be legally defined as when that cognitive self discorporated. Regardless what that discorporation ultimately means. If it can then be observed and see that that cognitive self is torn up and damaged, then it (for me) goes into ethical implications of cruel and unusual punishment. To my knowledge there is no way to anesthetize the cognitive aspect. That I think would be a huge speed bump for hemalurgy donation. It still goes back to (for me) that as per WoB, you are stapling someone else's "self" to your child. Brief or not, the child's identity and sense of self is still forming. It will have (to me) rather large ramifications. Especially when Brandon has said doing hemalurgy on a pregnant woman is a very very bad thing for the child in the womb. So, totally being genuine, and not condescending or snarky at all. Please take this with the intention it is meant. But a page or so back in this thread I posted every WoB concerning hemalurgy, how Brandon views it, and its effect on donor and receiver. I posted upwards to 10 to 12 WoB. Brandon calls hemalurgy bad two to three times, calls it evil twice I believe, and calls it horrible maybe two or three times. If you request, I will copy paste them all again, but it really is all there, you just have to go to a prior page. (page 2, I checked) Brandon has said the shards themselves are not inherently evil. But he also has commented that combining Dakhor and hemalurgy is very very very bad. I don't think I posted that one, but I can pull it up and add it here if you like. No problem. Thank you for opening up about that. I personally am an atheist and could be identified as a liberal but for myself so long as religious limitations are not imposed on others, that properly formed and regulated laws are necessary. Thing is (for myself), if donating part of the soul causes irreparable harm to the donor and the receiver, then I think it should not be employed. We could make leaps and bounds in scientific advancement if we didn't worry what happened to the people we test on. But we have a code of ethics that prevents that, and it is legally binding.

True, but he wasn't focused on her 24/7 and then there is the thing about her brother that I will reply to later in this post Well Elend instinctfully burned lerasium making him a stronger mistborn than Vin, and having a greater connection to Preservation. So I am not sure we can assume that stands for everyone, including infants. To clarify, I acknowledge at this stage Scadrial does not have the knowledge of the cognitive realm to make these informed decisions. However, if they gain the knowledge (either via travel to the cognitive realm, or speaking to Harmony, or via a Worldhopper), I see it becoming an ethical issue even if you do not believe in the soul and the beyond. We know the cognitive self exists briefly after the physical body expires. We know it is capable of speech and reasoned thought. We know it can feel pain. And finally via WoB we know it is torn up and disappears faster because of hemalurgy. So the ethical question becomes, at what point do "you" cease legally to be alive? When the physical body expires only? Is your cognitive self not legally you? Because if it is, then you just committed cruel and unusual punishment to an inmate against his or her wishes. Regardless what happens to that cognitive self afterwards. Whether it goes to a "beyond" or discorporates into investiture, or returns to some cosmic cycle like in buddism (all Brandon mentioned he wanted to keep open to whoever believed whatever). You can believe you cease to exist after death, and still reason the cognitive self that sticks around a bit longer is still you, and that cognitive self is suffering after a chunk of it has been ripped away. I don't have to believe in an afterlife or god to not want the end of my life to be filled with pain. Just because I believe I will not longer exist after death, does not mean I want those moments before non-existence to be suffering. So removal of spikes are not necesarily that easy,. They would leave scarring on the infant due to the self trying to force the soul to align with what was grafted on them, and finally there is the risk to (especially with an infant) of the trauma of removing a spike would kill the infant. In Vin's case the purpose of the spike was only to provide a link to Ruin and increase her bronze seeking a negligible degree. Once you get to pewter powers, you are dealing with parts of the core body (shoulders, chest, etc). Removing pewter's ability and leaving a hole in a child's body? I think it would be very difficult for the child to survive. That is not an ear piercing by any means. Of course it would. But we also have statements from the author saying being spiked does in fact affect you. We have words from the author that the spike did in fact affect Vin. So sure she had a horrible childhood, but to me that does not preclude the influence of the spike from hemalurgy alone (forgetting Ati). We have the author say hemalurgy itself is bad. We have him saying its evil even. So I know I was not part of the conversation, and I am not joining this part, just clarifying my own stance on it. If spikes are not involved in medallion creation, then I feel hemalurgy should stop. if spikes are involved in medallion creation then now that we have medallions and medallions can be use to create more medallions, then I do not see the reason to continue hemalurgy. Vin didn't always hear her brother's voice in her head. Remember he only died around the time of Camon's crew. But her brother was very much alive and traveled with her for many a year raising her. Years Ruin wouldn't be the brother's voice in her head.

No problem. Sorry about that. Though Vin struggled throughout the books prior to Ruin's release with feelings of being a tool of destruction and death One of the WoB I posted earlier mentions that Brandon confirms there were individuals that willingly sacrificed themselves for the lord ruler to use spikes to create inquisitors. He called them crazy. Also multiple WoB I mentioned state hemalurgy messes up the "soul". For me, i read that as it does not matter how willing the donor, or how anesthetized the person is in the physical realm, it does not negate the damage done to the person's "soul" on both ends, donor and receiver. Based on the WoB I read, I think that is a very very bad idea. Grafting someone's soul onto yourself messes up your own enough as an adult. Imagine as a child.

So totally respect how you see it. Just explaining my own interpretation of it. I took that WoB where Brandon said Vin felt "bitter - almost hateful" due to the taint of hemalurgy. For myself grafting a part of someone's very being onto another is going to change you. To me, you certainly aren't the same person you were without it. As to modulating Ruin. Harmony is a king of two separate kingdoms. Yes it is one shard, but it still is Ruin and Preservation with two diametrically opposed intents. Ruin is still (to me) Ruin. Ruin strives for entropy. Breaking down. Its inherent in the power hemalurgy. There is always a power loss. No matter what. To clarify what I mean by taint, or corruption I think is separate from control Ruin exerts. What I am saying is hemalurgy period deteriorates/changes the person. Doesn't matter (to me) whether Ruin is guided by Ati trying to end the world, or Harmony trying to maintain it. The very nature of the power breaks things down. And the very nature of grafting a persons "soul" changes you. Brandon says hemalurgy always hurts. As to koloss, Sazed changed them so they breed true. You get a koloss born which are the ones with the grey skin. Since spikes have a half life like isotopes. They weaken greatly at first, then little by little it slows down till they stabilize at a certain massively reduce level. The koloss reuse those spikes and pass them down so they do not make new spikes by killing anyone. Because those spikes are so much weaker than the originals, subsequent generations of koloss have a greater capacity for thought, but at the same time are not as strong and rage filled. But koloss still end up warped and twisted, as per the WoB I posted earlier. Basically its not the holder of ruin that determines whether the person using hemalurgy is "changed" or "corrupted" or whatever other word can be used. It is built into the power. Stapling a person's "soul" to yourself or others turns it into a frankenstein like monster. You are putting a person's "essence" where it should not be and forcing your "sou" to accept it. I agree that ultimately medallions are good and hopefully it will be able to be switched to exclusively. Hemalurgy on the other hand I feel there are very big problems with.

So just two quick things So the WoB I posted in a prior post says Vin was "tainted by hemalurgy". The other WoB show for me that hemalurgy itself is bad. True Harmony is in charge now, but Harmony also does not want hemalurgy perpetuated or used. So he certainly thinks there is an issue with it outside his own influence. edit: oh! also the pathian earring is due to it being out for so long it lost most of its charge. hemalurgic spikes have a half life. they eventually reach a point where they no longer lose power, but it is far far far far diminished Telsin does in fact act differently. We see her when she is younger versus as an adult. Wax frequently comments on how cold and angry she acts. That it is unsettling to everyone else in the group. This is different than the way she acted when she was younger in the flashback. As to Edwarn, I don't think we see enough of him to fully know.

Just saw this. To add, Vin had a greater distrust and hatred for the mist because of the spike in her ear. Found that WoB while pulling up the rest. Will need a moment to find it again. Will edit when I get it. edit: here it is Brandon Sanderson Chapter Eight Killer Mists The mists kill now. That was a major plot point from book two, so I hope you haven't forgotten it. Not only was it necessary for the mythology of the world—as will be explained—it was a necessary shift for Vin's personality. This series is about, as I've stated before, the concepts of trust, betrayal, and faith. The mists are the one thing Vin thought she could trust, but now they have turned against her. How she deals with that is a big part of this book. If you watch throughout the book, Vin has a stronger reaction against the mists than other characters. True, they're worried about the way it's killing people, but Vin is bitter—almost hateful. This is partially because she feels betrayed, but another factor is the taint of Hemalurgy—and therefore Ruin's touch—in her blood. The Hero of Ages Annotations (July 14, 2009)

So posting these WoB in reference to Karger regarding how hemalurgy damages the person spiked and the person spiked from. As per Brandon, spiking someone (receiving a spike) warps them. They will never be the same. They will not pass abilities on to their children, but it will warp their children as well. It is a very bad thing to do to a pregnant woman. Now I don't believe in the "beyond" or an afterlife, but I come into the teleporting conundrum for me. The type that breaks you down into data, sends you someplace, and then rebuilds you. Again, for myself forgetting an afterlife, if I do not know for a fact that what is rebuilt on the other end is me, then I don't want to do it. Same would stand with getting spiked just before death. It messes up the "soul". It is observable. The person is messed up, and will fade faster. That leads to ethical issues, especially if used on criminals. Would that constitute as cruel and unusual punishment? Again that is all with treating as if there is no after life. Now lets treat it as the individuals do believe in an after life. It would seem like a chunk of the person's soul was ripped off, and they could spend all of eternity torn apart suffering. That I think is going to give people pause. And this is all with using hemalurgy as intended, and correctly. This has nothing to do with whether the person is an expert or playing around. It is a function of the process. Even if you spike a gold compounder who could heal their soul back and regain their feruchemy (which is possible) it still leaves scar tissue. The "soul" regrown isn't the original. Who knows the results from doing that over and over? Regarding keeping a piece of a loved one? Personally I would rather go the cognitive shadow route where the person could theoretically watch over me and guide me, than the idea I am horribly tearing off a piece of them. And I say horribly, because that is the word Brandon used. So I know and acknowledge Scadrial doesn't know these facts yet, but I think it is in the realm of possibility for them to find out, and I think that would change their view on it rather quickly. All WoB stating what I wrote above are shown below: Brandon Sanderson The Mechanism of Hemalurgy The Blessings and the workings of Hemalurgy gave me some trouble as I designed the second and third books of this series. On one hand, I liked the way Hemalurgy worked by stealing powers from Allomancers or Feruchemists and giving them to other people. However, if I was going to limit myself to sixteen metals and be able to steal both Allomancy and Feruchemy, that meant I needed a mechanism to determine which power got stolen. If, for instance, you drove a pewter spike into a person who was both an Allomancer and a Feruchemist, then how would that spike know which power to suck out and grant to the one who would gain it? As I was toying with how this would work, I realized that I needed to work the kandra and the koloss into this as well. Only, it was ridiculous to assume that the Lord Ruler would kill Allomancers to make koloss. There weren't enough Allomancers, for one thing—plus it would be foolish to lose the power of an Allomancer to gain an inferior tool in a koloss. So that meant koloss had to be made out of regular people, not Allomancers or Feruchemists. Suddenly I had another set of abilities that Hemalurgy had to be able to steal—the basic pieces of Preservation inside the souls of all men. Hence the decision that where the spike was placed in the receiver, and how it was used to kill a person, influenced how the power was shaped. Now a pewter spike could steal any of a number of powers, based on how it was used. And regular people could be used instead of Allomancers—however, when that happened, the receiver was twisted much more than if an Allomantically charged spike or a Feruchemically charged spike was used. My rationale for this is that if the spike is pulling out the pure power of Preservation—part of the power of all creation—and twisting it, it would change the body of the recipient greatly. Twisting them through use of the twisted power. The Hero of Ages Annotations (Nov. 17, 2009) Aradanftw If you were to use Hemalurgy on a Surgebinder, would it steal the Surge or the actual spren bond? Brandon Sanderson It's going to steal the spren bond, but you've got to remember the spren has power over that bond. So what you're doing is (1) incredibly evil, even more evil, but (2) you may not end up with what you want, because that spren has free will in most cases. You may go through all this trouble and then they may break the bond, and you would be left without it. So you would need something else to force them to be unable to break the bond, which would be even more evil, but it is possible in Hemalurgy. Starsight Release Party (Nov. 26, 2019) Questioner The people on Scadrial have innate Investiture from Preservation. If someone from another planet, say Roshar, were to get Allomancy, from Hemalurgy or Feruchemy, would that person have to have Stormlight as well as the metal in order to do their-- Brandon Sanderson No, good question. They would just need the metal if you were Hemalurgically getting the ability. Remember, Hemalurgy is basically ripping off a piece of someone else's soul and stapling it to yours. Short circuiting the soul, so to speak... All the pieces of the soul you would need, it is giving you. It has dangerous ramifications, but you wouldn't need Stormlight also. Skyward Seattle signing (Nov. 10, 2018) Moogle Why can non-Scadrians use Hemalurgy? Don't they need Ruin's sDNA, like Allomancers need Preservation? Brandon Sanderson Hemalurgy is built to be able to be used by anyone. It's about taking and breaking. Ruin doesn't care who does such things #NookTalks Twitter Q&A with Barnes & Noble (Feb. 16, 2016) Moderator Is there such a thing as… voluntary Hemalurgy? Brandon Sanderson Voluntary Hemalurgy? Yes. Moderator ...Where you can give a power to someone through those sorts of means. Brandon Sanderson Through any means, or through Hemalurgic means? Moderator Er, explain what you mean by that question. *laughter* Brandon Sanderson In Nalthis, you are giving up your power voluntarily to someone else. Moderator Specifically in the context of Scadrial here. Brandon Sanderson I mean, can you not imagine a person who's like "Yes I am crazy and will give up my power to this…" you know? Bystander But don't the end results negate? Brandon Sanderson You can't imagine somebody who would do that? …I am absolutely sure that at some point even in creating Inquisitors there's somebody who would be like, "yes, I will give my life to the Lord Ruler." So, yes? JordanCon 2016 (April 23, 2016) Questioner Could you use Hemalurgy to steal Surgebinding? Brandon: Absolutely, you could steal Surgebinding with Hemalurgy. *crowd laughs* Booooo, you should be scared of that. Salt Lake ComicCon FanX 2016 (March 26, 2016) Kurkistan So you've said that healing is like the Spiritual wants to heal and then it filters through the Cognitive, but how's that work with healing wounds to the soul like Hemalurgy or Shardblades? What do you refer to to heal the soul at that point? Brandon Sanderson You need to make a patch on the soul with Investiture. Kurkistan So how's the Investiture know where to go, what to look like? Brandon Sanderson Well your soul is an ideal. So if you can get it up there, there are ways to do-- to recreate that with um... See I'm getting into stuff for later books. Argent No, that's okay. Kurkistan So when Hemalurgy rips something off the soul, is that the ideal soul or some sub-soul? Brandon Sanderson That is off of your soul, and it can be healed; but what it's going to be doing is creating a patch of new soul. So it will not be your original soul. Does that make sense? Kurkistan Okay, that- well, not completely, but I think that's your intention. Brandon Sanderson Yes. Bystander If you do that, is that like Frankenstein's monster, or is it like a graft that's absorb-- Brandon Sanderson Less horrifying- Less horrifying than Frankenstein's monster, but it is a graft that is like-- It is not your original soul. Bystander Yeah, but in modern medicine stuff like that is absorbed- Brandon Sanderson Yeah, in this you will always have a scar on your soul that something else has patched over. Kurkistan So Kaladin shouldn't just keep getting his arm chopped? Brandon Sanderson *ignoring/not-hearing Kurkistan just now* But that is what happens with most forms of Investiture in the first place. Firefight Chicago signing (Feb. 20, 2015) Questioner Are Hemalurgic spikes fabrials? Is a body that has been spiked a fabrial? Are koloss and kandra also something similar? Brandon Sanderson No, actually. Fabrial means specifically a bit of Investiture that has been trapped by a gemstone and then modified to do something else. Hemalurgy is its own thing--though there is a slight similarity. In most Hemalurgy, Investiture keyed to the Identity of someone (a bit of a soul) is ripped off, and then magically grafted onto someone else's soul. Not the same, though I can see the confusion. Koloss and kandra are similar, though in this case, the soul is mostly just being distorted by using an Invested spike. In the cosmere, the body will attempt to match the soul, and so a twisted soul (Spiritual aspect of a person) can have profound effects on both mind and body. FAQFriday 2017 (March 10, 2017) Djarskublar (paraphrased) So I could be wrong, but a Hemalurgic spike, when you use it and become a savant it does damage to your Spiritweb, right? Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) Yes Hemalurgy always hurts you. Djarskublar (paraphrased) So say you go to Roshar and you give somebody a Hemalurgic spike for some Allomantic power, don't care what, and you use it to become a savant. Does that qualify them as 'broken' enough to become a Radiant? As long as they are also following the Ideals to attract a spren. Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) So becoming a Radiant is a spectrum of terminologies. It... probably, but you would have to find a Radiant who would, or a spren who would be willing to touch that, okay? It's going to drive them back. Djarskublar (paraphrased) So would it also affect your probability of becoming an Elantrian? Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) Yeah it would affect your ability to become anything else, yes. Djarskublar (paraphrased) Okay, so would it be a positive effect, negative effect...? Because I was like, it gives you cracks in your Spiritweb. Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) It does give you cracks in your Spiritweb. Djarskublar (paraphrased) So it's easier for Investiture to get in. Does it make it easier for other Investitures to get in? Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) It would make it... yes. It's going to drive spren away. So what it's really going to make easier for, there, is spren and Investiture that doesn't care. Djarskublar (paraphrased) Okay, so Investiture doesn't care but spren do. Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) Investiture might care depending on if it's part of a Shard-- if it has intent and things like this. Djarskublar (paraphrased) So it might let Stormlight in easier than a Breath, type thing. Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) I'm saying it might let Odium in easier than Syl. Because Syl would care, and Odium would not care. Djarskublar (paraphrased) Okay cool. Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) Alright, so it could be a really bad thing, is what I'm trying to say to you. Djarskublar (paraphrased) Yeah that's cool. I just want to know more about gold too. Gold Allomancy too. Because Miles was doing some funky stuff. Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) Miles was doing some funky stuff. Dark Talent release party (Sept. 6, 2016) Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) One does not have to kill someone with Hemalurgy to charge a spike, but it rips off a large part of the soul. The person would not be the same. Alloy of Law 17th Shard Q&A (Nov. 5, 2011) Questioner Have your ever thought about how your magic systems would affect a pregnant woman? Brandon Sanderson I have given thought to it. Questioner ...Which system would you say would be safest as a pregnant woman? Brandon Sanderson I think Stormlight-- being Invested with Stormlight would be very safe. You would probably be better off than not. Hemalurgy would be very bad. Skyward Atlanta signing (Nov. 17, 2018) Questioner How does rewriting the Spiritual aspect work? Brandon Sanderson ...So, it has ramifications through the other two Realms. It can happen. You've seen it happen. Questioner That's what happens with kandra, right? Brandon Sanderson Yes, to an extent, yes. Questioner With the koloss? Brandon Sanderson Yeah, both of them. Hemalurgy is, like, sticking a piece of someone's spirit to another person's spirit and creating a Frankenstein's monster of spirits. Oathbringer release party (Nov. 13, 2017) Jack Eaton Can Hemalurgy steal a Nahel bond? And if so, would that bond be unbreakable for as long as the spike was implanted. Brandon Sanderson This is a very dangerous and frightening thing in the cosmere, but it is possible--and the implications of it are something I intend to cover eventually in the books. General Twitter 2018 (May 25, 2018) Questioner (paraphrased) If you have a series of Inquisitors, like a family of Inquisitors having children for generations over... Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) Would the Hemalurgy influence the sDNA of the children? Is that what you are asking? That is a hypothesis that has merit in the way the magic system works (grin). It is not a supposition to be discarded out of hand. Steelheart Seattle signing (Oct. 14, 2013) Blainethetrain Is the access to Allomancy and Feruchemy granted via Hemalurgy heritable? Brandon Sanderson No. Good question. Skyward Houston signing (Nov. 19, 2018) Questioner (on behalf of Yata) When someone is spiked, and dies, does that affect the time they spend in the Cognitive? Brandon Sanderson If they are spiked, yes because if you are extra Invested, which spiking technically does, if you have a spike stapling a bit of someone else's soul to yours-- Questioner The other way. Someone spikes through you and you die-- Brandon Sanderson Ohhhhh, oh okay, no, that might make you go faster. Questioner Is that why Harmony doesn’t know who's spiking people? Or-- Brandon Sanderson Hmm. Yeah. Okay. I had not considered that. But yeah, sure. *laughter* Suuureee. You added to the canon. I mean, the actual answer was, when you're spiking somebody, you're ripping of the soul, so kind of, there's not enough left to talk. I mean, you're ripping off enough of the soul, so it's a bad thing. It's a very bad thing. So you go "Who killed you?" and it's just somebody who is essentially-- But yes, they would go faster too. Arcanum Unbounded Chicago signing (Dec. 6, 2016)