Daycrow Posted March 27, 2021 Report Share Posted March 27, 2021 Gonna keep it simple. Does Vargo still have his boon and bane as a vessel? Will he have smart days and dumb days? Days void of passion, and days of pure passion? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aspiring Writer Posted March 28, 2021 Report Share Posted March 28, 2021 2 hours ago, Daycrow said: Gonna keep it simple. Does Vargo still have his boon and bane as a vessel? Will he have smart days and dumb days? Days void of passion, and days of pure passion? Brandon Sanderson Rafo'ed this. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leuthie Posted March 29, 2021 Report Share Posted March 29, 2021 It wasn't a boon and bane as it wasn't Nightwatcher who did it. Vargo misinterpreted the whole thing thinking the smart days were a boon and the "dumb" days were a bane. There was no bane. The emotional days were meant to help him deal with holding the Shard of Odium. Vargo was just too elitist to understand the boon of those days and spent that time crying in a corner. Is he still effected by Cultivation's change? The RAFO tells me there is some residual effect, but it probably isn't going to manifest the same way with Vargo holding a Shard. If there were no effect going forward, I don't think there would have been a RAFO to the question. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LewsTherinTelescope Posted March 30, 2021 Report Share Posted March 30, 2021 6 hours ago, Leuthie said: If there were no effect going forward, I don't think there would have been a RAFO to the question. Brandon RAFOs crem all the time, lol, including things he has directly confirmed before in-book and out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honorless Posted March 30, 2021 Report Share Posted March 30, 2021 (edited) On 3/28/2021 at 5:22 AM, Daycrow said: Gonna keep it simple. Does Vargo still have his boon and bane as a vessel? Will he have smart days and dumb days? Days void of passion, and days of pure passion? It certainly seemed like it at times extract from Broken Gods: Quote They thought him dead. He was free.… Free to destroy! To burn! To wreak havoc and terror upon those who had doubted him! No. No, free to plan. To devise a way to save the world from itself. He could see so far! See so much! He needed to think. To burn! No, to plot! To … To … Edited March 30, 2021 by Honorless 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bejarden Posted March 30, 2021 Report Share Posted March 30, 2021 I think that was the influence of the Power right? Like how all Vessels are eventually corrupted by it but he’s still able to fight it 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daycrow Posted March 30, 2021 Author Report Share Posted March 30, 2021 Initially, I thought the same as @Bejardin1250, but I'm not sure anymore. Honestly, based on what I remember of Vargo's emotional days, he was an empathetic and compassionate man, in a soft way iykwim. Though Odium has been associated with passion in-text, I don't really see any connection between his increased emotional capacity and the emotional fury of the Shard. I think that this definitely shows in the quote that @Honorless added. He's very internally conflicted. In the coppermind, we have this quote: Quote What becoming a Vessel requires above all is Connection to the Shard in question, whether forged artificially or driven by a natural inclination towards the Shard's intent. So maybe Cultivation was attempting to forge a Connection between Taravangian and Odium? If so, I'm kinda skeptical of whether or not it worked. Odium and emotion: Quote It was hatred. A deep, pulsing hatred with a pressure to turn all things molten. It was the heat of a thousand suns, it was the bliss of every kiss, it was the lives of all men wrapped up in one, defined by everything they felt.- Dalinar Kholin I don't think that lines up well with Taravangian and his experiences. Another take is the Cultivation-is-evil route, and honestly I think that makes the most sense to me as of now? Idk where but there's the pretty infamous quote about odium being most dangerous in the hands of someone smart and scheming, like Taravangian... Cultivation has to have known that. Man, I need to reread that whole section. Anyways, back to the main question, (if a shard has power over an individual, and that individual ascends, does that influence remain?) if, after ascension, Taravangian is still affected by Cultivation, would that give Cultivation power over Odium? I can see that as a motive for what she did. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bejarden Posted March 31, 2021 Report Share Posted March 31, 2021 I’m not saying he’s not being influenced by Cultivation I’m just saying that specific scene does not show anything. 3 hours ago, Daycrow said: I don't think that lines up well with Taravangian and his experiences It’s not his experience as a whole but when Taravangian Acended he was feeling an intense hatred at Szeth for killing him 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LewsTherinTelescope Posted March 31, 2021 Report Share Posted March 31, 2021 16 hours ago, Daycrow said: So maybe Cultivation was attempting to forge a Connection between Taravangian and Odium? If so, I'm kinda skeptical of whether or not it worked. Seems like it worked pretty well. Quote It killed the person holding that power, however, which left a hole. A need. A … vacuum, like a gemstone suddenly without Stormlight. It reached out, and Taravangian felt a distinct Connection to it. Passion. Hatred. Today, Taravangian was only passion. Hatred, fear, anger, shame, awe. Bravery. The power loved these things, and it surged around him, enveloping him. His soul vibrated. Take me, the power pled, speaking not in words, but in emotion. You are perfect. I am yours. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aleph-Naught Posted March 31, 2021 Report Share Posted March 31, 2021 The direction of my thoughts, as laid out in the post below, are that Cultivation's influence on Taravangian--even as he holds the shard of Odium--endures and probably insulates her from any attack on her that he may be plotting: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harkain Posted April 9, 2021 Report Share Posted April 9, 2021 My guess is it could be that since his bond to Odium was artificial (via Cultivations meddling) he's not going to actually fit the shard that well in practice. So he's gonna be constantly fighting his motivation and will for a time at least stop the power from completely fulfilling it's intent? Honestly, I think I remember Cultivation saying something about Taravangium holding the power with honour (tho it's lower case) and my mind keeps coming back to it. I could imagine that being Cultivations ultimate goal, merging the shards of Odium and Honour so that Odium becomes bound by structure and order and is no longer as horrifying. Thinking on it, Taravangium could actually be a pretty good vessel for War as well. He's driven by strong emotions(Odium) but he also plans and acts in a structured way (Honour). Tho this is just rampant theorising on my part. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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