Is Syl too dignified?

[Bearer of all agonies]

So, I’ve been recently wondering about this. If Radiants can summon blades to be just about anything, then do you think that Kaladin could summon her as a Shardrope? It would be so useful to tie someone up with an in unbreakable rope. I know, I know, Syl would probably think it was undignified, but could it happen? Also,  if that could happen, then do you think Kaladin could summon her as a Shardball? Like a giant hamster ball that he can go inside and nothing can get to him, because almost nothing can break a Shardblade. It would be crazy useful in a fight. There could also be some wicked games of baseball with Shardbaseballs and Shardbats. Sorry, got a little silly there at the end, but I was just putting some thoughts out there. Any thoughts from y’all?

[Chasmgoat]

I think you made this topic too many times, (at least 3 times)

anyway, I think that kaladin could summon syl as a 50ft spear and spear some person really far away or something like that.

(shardgun?)

[Aspiring Writer]

10 minutes ago, Bearer of all agonies said:

So, I’ve been recently wondering about this. If Radiants can summon blades to be just about anything, then do you think that Kaladin could summon her as a Shardrope? It would be so useful to tie someone up with an in unbreakable rope. I know, I know, Syl would probably think it was undignified, but could it happen? Also,  if that could happen, then do you think Kaladin could summon her as a Shardball? Like a giant hamster ball that he can go inside and nothing can get to him, because almost nothing can break a Shardblade. It would be crazy useful in a fight. There could also be some wicked games of baseball with Shardbaseballs and Shardbats. Sorry, got a little silly there at the end, but I was just putting some thoughts out there. Any thoughts from y’all?

Pretty sure there's a mass limit to what Spren can be, and we don't know if they can become bendable material like rope, only metal.

As for the metal ball, being in something you can't see out of, can't control what happens to, and can't breathe out of is a death trap.

[Weltall]

17 minutes ago, Bearer of all agonies said:

So, I’ve been recently wondering about this. If Radiants can summon blades to be just about anything, then do you think that Kaladin could summon her as a Shardrope?

Given that Wyndle basically refuses to be summoned as a blade with a sharp edge because he doesn't want to hurt people and the Stormfather refuses to be summoned as anything, I'm pretty sure that Syl could refuse to manifest as something she felt was undignified.

That said, you're gonna have a bigger problem: Syl like all spren has to manifest as metal. The godmetal alloy that all spren manifest as is notably not malleable, meaning you're not going to get something capable of bending.

5 minutes ago, Chasmgoat said:

anyway, I think that kaladin could summon syl as a 50ft spear and spear some person really far away or something like that.

There's a size limit and that is way above it.

Edited November 22, 2020 by Weltall

[Ixthos]

Just thinking about this now ... but even though it has to be metal and the metal, and as noted a metal that doesn't seem flexable, that doesn't restrict Syl or any other spren from manifesting in any shape the knight wants ... so could she perhaps not become a "rope", but rather a tight hoop around someone nearby the the knight, so the knight, for example, reaches out their hand towards someone and summons the spren as a loop around the person they want, perhaps with part of it in their hand, and then when it forms they can let go or will the shardhoop to tighten, just as they can adjust the shape of the blade?

[Aspiring Writer]

1 hour ago, Ixthos said:

Just thinking about this now ... but even though it has to be metal and the metal, and as noted a metal that doesn't seem flexable, that doesn't restrict Syl or any other spren from manifesting in any shape the knight wants ... so could she perhaps not become a "rope", but rather a tight hoop around someone nearby the the knight, so the knight, for example, reaches out their hand towards someone and summons the spren as a loop around the person they want, perhaps with part of it in their hand, and then when it forms they can let go or will the shardhoop to tighten, just as they can adjust the shape of the blade?

Perhaps, but remember, this will one, leave them without a weapon, so this can't be done in a fight with more than two people, two, use the spren for a long time, something the Radient might be against as they will be unable to interact with their spren, and third, it's a lot of effort to take someone alive, which can't be done with the fused as they are useless as captives.

[Ixthos]

30 minutes ago, Aspiring Writer said:

Perhaps, but remember, this will one, leave them without a weapon, so this can't be done in a fight with more than two people, two, use the spren for a long time, something the Radient might be against as they will be unable to interact with their spren, and third, it's a lot of effort to take someone alive, which can't be done with the fused as they are useless as captives.

True, but each of those can be applicable in a different situation. It could be used to take one of the opponents in a fight out of it to deal with the others, especially if that one is the greatest threat. It can be a temporary thing to incapacitate someone until others can arrive to secure them, or even to keep someone locked in place once the fight is over, so not done in combat but to keep someone who has been defeated in one place and harmless - bonus points if the spren becomes stocks. And while it can't be used on Fused it could be used on regular singers, or when they go to space to contain other humans with abilities that require them to be free to move.

[Aspiring Writer]

3 minutes ago, Ixthos said:

True, but each of those can be applicable in a different situation. It could be used to take one of the opponents in a fight out of it to deal with the others, especially if that one is the greatest threat. It can be a temporary thing to incapacitate someone until others can arrive to secure them, or even to keep someone locked in place once the fight is over, so not done in combat but to keep someone who has been defeated in one place and harmless - bonus points if the spren becomes stocks. And while it can't be used on Fused it could be used on regular singers, or when they go to space to contain other humans with abilities that require them to be free to move.

All true. Will say that edge dancers or anyone with the surge of abrasion will not be affected by this maneuver, and not sure who will be a valuable enough target to capture and not kill. BTW have not read RoW yet. No spoilers.

[Ixthos]

6 minutes ago, Aspiring Writer said:

All true. Will say that edge dancers or anyone with the surge of abrasion will not be affected by this maneuver, and not sure who will be a valuable enough target to capture and not kill. BTW have not read RoW yet. No spoilers.

Hmmm ... I would dispute that, unless you mean they could sense and escape it in time :-P No spoilers, don't worry. Imagine an hourglass that is "awesome" as a certain radiant would say. If something were fixed around its waist, a ring with an inner diameter smaller than the outer diameter of the top and bottom of the hourglass, the hourglass would still be secured in place, though free to rotate around in the hoop. A hoop around someone's neck, for example, would be impossible to escape from no matter how slick the person was.

[Aspiring Writer]

Just now, Ixthos said:

Hmmm ... I would dispute that, unless you mean they could sense and escape it in time :-P No spoilers, don't worry. Imagine an hourglass that is "awesome" as a certain radiant would say. If something were fixed around its waist, a ring with an inner diameter smaller than the outer diameter of the top and bottom of the hourglass, the hourglass would still be secured in place, though free to rotate around in the hoop. A hoop around someone's neck, for example, would be impossible to escape from no matter how slick the person was.

Yes, but the human and parshendi body is very flexible and is quite capable of odd contortions, especially if their not afraid of breaking bones since they can heal. The loop would have to be strangling them to be small enough to guarantee they can't slip through, and that is especially through with a loop around the arms.

[Ixthos]

1 minute ago, Aspiring Writer said:

Yes, but the human and parshendi body is very flexible and is quite capable of odd contortions, especially if their not afraid of breaking bones since they can heal. The loop would have to be strangling them to be small enough to guarantee they can't slip through, and that is especially through with a loop around the arms.

True, though again I did mention the neck :-P the jaw would block the top, and the shoulders would block the bottom, and breaking either would probably be too difficult to pull off without a lot of stormlight. If they are fully secured, so not just at the neck but a full body bind so that the person has no freedom to move, and is still secured at the neck as well, might be too much for someone to escape from by themselves as they wouldn't be able to strain against it hard enough to break their own bones ... probably. If they could break their own bones then they might be able to. And I fully agree, being bound just at the arms wouldn't be enough to keep someone who really wanted to escape in place.

[Aspiring Writer]

1 minute ago, Ixthos said:

True, though again I did mention the neck :-P the jaw would block the top, and the shoulders would block the bottom, and breaking either would probably be too difficult to pull off without a lot of stormlight. If they are fully secured, so not just at the neck but a full body bind so that the person has no freedom to move, and is still secured at the neck as well, might be too much for someone to escape from by themselves as they wouldn't be able to strain against it hard enough to break their own bones ... probably. If they could break their own bones then they might be able to. And I fully agree, being bound just at the arms wouldn't be enough to keep someone who really wanted to escape in place.

Yeee! By the way, if they can use the surge of abrasion, they would be able to use stormlight or some other way of healing, so the two are a given for getting out, so without those two, that person is going to have a very frustrating time dealing with that collar.

[Ixthos]

2 minutes ago, Aspiring Writer said:

Yeee! By the way, if they can use the surge of abrasion, they would be able to use stormlight or some other way of healing, so the two are a given for getting out, so without those two, that person is going to have a very frustrating time dealing with that collar.

Indeed! Also, it just occured to me that when dealing with someone willing to break their own bodies to escape they could always cut out the middle man and make a hollow metal sphere around the person :-P I doubt they could break their body into small enough shapes to fit through the gaps between the atoms :-P

[Aspiring Writer]

6 minutes ago, Ixthos said:

Indeed! Also, it just occured to me that when dealing with someone willing to break their own bodies to escape they could always cut out the middle man and make a hollow metal sphere around the person :-P I doubt they could break their body into small enough shapes to fit through the gaps between the atoms :-P

There is a slight problem with air if that is to capture the person alive, and even stormlight runs out, though it would be a useful way to keep a person in place and be surrounded and then let go and ambushed.

[Ixthos]

Just now, Aspiring Writer said:

There is a slight problem with air if that is to capture the person alive, and even stormlight runs out, though it would be a useful way to keep a person in place and be surrounded and then let go and ambushed.

Hmmm ... well, a small hole or two for air probably wouldn't be too big of a security risk ...

(Also, I know this isn't relevant to this tangent, but I'm also picturing spider-radiant right now, swinging through a city and using their spren to become a "web" to swing on, only in this case its a single pole they summon and resummon, attaching to hooks :-P)

[Aspiring Writer]

Just now, Ixthos said:

Hmmm ... well, a small hole or two for air probably wouldn't be too big of a security risk ...

(Also, I know this isn't relevant to this tangent, but I'm also picturing spider-radiant right now, swinging through a city and using their spren to become a "web" to swing on, only in this case its a single pole they summon and resummon, attaching to hooks :-P)

Well, not sure if this is possible as we only see spren as one object, but maybe a spren can turn into a chain with a hook, so spider-radiant can still swing, but would that be considered one object or would each link be it's own object?

[Ixthos]

1 minute ago, Aspiring Writer said:

Well, not sure if this is possible as we only see spren as one object, but maybe a spren can turn into a chain with a hook, so spider-radiant can still swing, but would that be considered one object or would each link be it's own object?

I think a chain would probably be too complex, at least at first and so maybe with practice a spren could become a single item made from multiple pieces, but I'm thinking more like they are holding onto a single solid tube of metal with a hook at the end to attach to normal metal hoops on the sides of a city. So like those old wooden poles used to pull down or open windows.

[Aspiring Writer]

1 minute ago, Ixthos said:

I think a chain would probably be too complex, at least at first and so maybe with practice a spren could become a single item made from multiple pieces, but I'm thinking more like they are holding onto a single solid tube of metal with a hook at the end to attach to normal metal hoops on the sides of a city. So like those old wooden poles used to pull down or open windows.

I know what you mean, but I'd rather try for the chain. A pole is just.. ugh.

Edited November 22, 2020 by Aspiring Writer

[Ixthos]

Just now, Aspiring Writer said:

I know what you mean, but I'd rather try for the chain.

Yeah, that probably would make for a nicer swing.

[Bearer of all agonies]

9 hours ago, Aspiring Writer said:

Pretty sure there's a mass limit to what Spren can be, and we don't know if they can become bendable material like rope, only metal.

As for the metal ball, being in something you can't see out of, can't control what happens to, and can't breathe out of is a death trap.

Ah. Makes sense 

5 hours ago, Ixthos said:

Just thinking about this now ... but even though it has to be metal and the metal, and as noted a metal that doesn't seem flexable, that doesn't restrict Syl or any other spren from manifesting in any shape the knight wants ... so could she perhaps not become a "rope", but rather a tight hoop around someone nearby the the knight, so the knight, for example, reaches out their hand towards someone and summons the spren as a loop around the person they want, perhaps with part of it in their hand, and then when it forms they can let go or will the shardhoop to tighten, just as they can adjust the shape of the blade?

Yeah, that’s what I meant with the rope. Like it is in one shape and can’t move, but it is unbreakable. 

[Ramona Tehradin]

On 11/22/2020 at 8:57 AM, Chasmgoat said:

anyway, I think that kaladin could summon syl as a 50ft spear and spear some person really far away or something like that.

(shardgun?)

*Whispers from Sixth of Dusk* 

[Bearer of all agonies]

Yeah, my brother an I were talking about this the other day. Radiants could summon their spren as Shard arrows, like the actually weapon that gets shot. Then ht shoot the arrow, and it can tear through walls and armor, and then the Radiant could immediatly summon the arrow back and shoot again.