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Rhythm of War Part Three Reactions


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If you're reading the book and you want to liveblog some thoughts as you read, this thread will exist so you can chat about Part Three but NOT be spoiled by later stuff in the book. So feel free to discuss Part Three of Rhythm of War! 

No spoilers, even tagged, for later portions of Rhythm of War beyond Part Three.

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I'm fully into it now, so I might be reducing the amount that I write about each chapter.

  • I-4. Vyre
    • I don't like this at all. Kaladin fighting dream-visions is not exactly going to be pretty
  • I-5. Lift
    • So Lift also wasn't brought low by the pillar's inversion. And she did meet Cultivation. Her metabolism might even be cultivationlight?
    • I am not sure how to figure out why she and Kaladin wern't affected. She has weird Cultivation things going on, but what is special about Kaladin?
    • Is the green chicken Mraize's Aviar? What's the red one?
    • So she can still kinda use Regrowth - is she somehow closer to higher ideals? Is Regrowth closer to Cultivation?
  • I-6. A Boon and a Curse
    • I wonder what it is about Renarin that produces the invisibility to Fortune. Sja-Anat did something right, it seems
    • Brandon points more to Nightblood being mega OP
    • I will understand, but feel bummed, if Taravangian doesn't get bopped. I know he won't, but he really has approached moash levels of ire. This chapter made me feel for him too much >:/
  • 44. Tinder Waiting for the Spark
    • Spidey sense? What is it that's different about Kaladin?
    • So this is going to have some sort of an insurgency feel to it, with Navani, Lift, Kaladin at the tower and the Sibling secretly helping them. What's confusing about this is that supposedly Szeth is with Dalinar still, but then it's unclear who the 5th POV/main character at the tower is supposed to be (4th is Venli).
  • 45. A Bold Heart, A Keen and Crafty Mind
    • Not much to say :/ Venli still unlikable though I know that's just her character
  • 46. The Weight of the Tower
    • sd
  • 47. A Cage Forged of Spirits
    • It's going to be a bad scene when they find out about Urithiru
    • Nale grabbing the arrow from the air is totally nuts. What lets him do that???
    • Which Oathpact line is the one that is not broken? Taln's, I'm assuming

Gave up notes :/

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After completing this part I am terrified that I am going to get to the end of this book and find Kal still at the 3rd oath. 

I was also kind of peeved to find that our first experience of living shardplate was through Jasnah and it was seemingly nonchalant. I feel like I have been waiting so long for Kal's big 4th oath shardplate moment and we get this instead, a scene with Jasnah struggling to defeat a fused that we saw 3rd oath Kal kill in Oathbringer... crossing my fingers for something for substantial in Part 5 regarding Kal swearing oaths and getting a big plate scene that provides a smidge more excitement surrounding it.

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Not finished part 3 yet, so haven’t read any posts. But man, at the end of chapter 53 I misread a line and my breath caught with a “WHAAAT!?”

What I thought I read


...particularly with you baring the child of traitors.

What it actually said


...particularly with you being the child of traitors.

For half a second, I thought Venli had somehow been impregnated by a human (even though I see now the traitors in context are the other Listeners).

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Part 3.... I don’t mind it. Skimmed a lot of flashbacks though.

The Sibling seems more human than something like Honor or Cultivation.

It is like a sanderlanche action novel with a lot of flashbacks and side plots thrown in.  Very different pacing.

Kaladin doing the mission impossible sequences, and Navani with the dialogue.

It’s good though.  I have abandoned the audiobook in favour of Kindle for part 3, just to get through it quicker.

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I liked this part more than I thought I would, especially the Navani parts. I'm a little bummed that I am not getting to see more character conflict between Kaladin and Lirin like I thought I would, but at least there is some building up of Kaladin continuing to defy growing. He continues to do the same things and act the same ways as he has before, on instinct, because he can't think to do anything else. A good way of building up the arc for the payoff later, I'm sure.

Also really enjoyed the Jasnah POV. Seeing a higher order radiant in plate and using it as it was meant to be was good. Also seeing her fail and flail in an environment she is unfamiliar with humanized her in a way she desperately needed.

All in all, though, I agree with some other posters here. This part felt like it had a lot of padding to it. Some that might have been better served getting cut. It's a difficult balance to walk: Brandon needs to put in the work to earn his payoffs later, meaning the characters in the tower need to struggle, to encounter obstacles, to communicate the difficulty in the task that is ahead. However, I would have expected the end of this part to have had a bit more "progress" than we did.

Oh well, time to continue on, and read more about the Rosharan Jesus, ready to stand trial for the sins of humanity, to take their collective mistakes and be judged guilty for them though he himself is innocent. Who's playing the role of Pontius? Of Judas? Do they have crucifixion in Shadesmar? Guess we'll find out.

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Okay, now onto the end of Part 2 interludes!

It's nice to see Khen again and she's doing well. She seems to have gotten attached to Moash. We see Moash's nihilism again. Moash still feels for Kaladin, though it has been twisted by Odium.

Honorblades do seem inferior to Shardblades so far. iirc Brandon said Honorblades don't need 10 heartbeats, it's just perception that makes it so.

Odium is now also gunning for Kaladin. Vyre and Odium plan to give Kaladin Visions to break him, through the former's Connection to him.

Hmm... this emotion consuming thing of Odium feels similar to Allomantic emotion dampening plus sensing which emotions his followers are feeling, is also possible with emotional Allomancy. I don't think he's consuming emotions in any way but something similar to what we saw in Mistborn.

Odium is about Passion, Sja-Anat saw this, as Odium and Rayse had a split in their thinking. Rayse told her to stop questioning him, but Odium encourages such disagreements. We saw this back in Thaylen City as well.

So those heightened emotions of Forms of Power / Regals might just be like Rioting version and giving one's emotions to Odium kind of like Soothing.

Lift interlude, part of this was released early, like the Syl interlude. Lift had gone to the Nightwatcher to ask to not change, she always wanted to be her mother's little girl. Her Boon was granted by Cultivation but she's still growing (wouldn't granting her original Boon that go against Cultivation's Intent anyway?). I look forward to her flashbacks in Book 6.

Wyndle said that the Nightwatcher is not Connected to the people of Roshar and isn't influenced by their perception.

Wyndle seems to wonder if Lift converts food to Stormlight at all or if she converts it into Cultivationlight. We still don't know what exactly Lift got from Cultivation but we do know what she can do: convert food into Light to fuel Surgebinding but she doesn't seem to be able to use Stormlight from spheres; she also exists partially in the Cognitive. So she can see and interact with spren far more easily and slip into Visions. Lift has noticed "strange cremlings", seems Arclo is keeping an eye on her, as the other Sleepless weren't, according to him.

Oh! Mraize & his Aviar killed the Bondmate of another Aviar but Lift saved the bird itself. Lift and Wyndle weren't knocked unconscious by what Raboniel did to the Tower. Lift couldn't use Abrasion but managed to overcome the block on Progression (this Surge must be to Cultivation what Adhesion is to Honor). Mraize is now hunting Lift. Who was the dead man with the Aviar? A Worldhopper presumably but why was he targeted by Mraize? Did he betray the Ghostbloods or was he from a different group? Two groups have access to the Aviar? His body looked different than how Lift remembered him looking, a Lightweaving magic from off-world? The Aviar ability?

Congratulations to those who correctly guessed Taravangian as the main interlude character!

I have to say, Taravangian's Boon and Curse are absolutely poetic: intellect or compassion but never both together. Today was a day of compassion.

Again with the posturing, Rayse seems to like appearing grand, maybe he'd have been even better suited to the Shard of megalomania. And Taravangian noticed it. He baits Odium into showing off Fortune again!

Looks like having Dalinar as his Champion was really, really integral to his plans. His complex plan fell to shambles. Renarin blocks Odium's sight, Taravangian's future is clouded by Renarin too! Ha! He saw that Odium is afraid of Nightblood

Huh, Odium intends to continue using the Singers after taking Roshar. Because of their capacity to listen to the Rhythm and their gemhearts, I assume. They would make good troops. Shards are bound by oaths, the Veden simply expected rewards and did not make a deal. Do the Shin or Iriali have a deal?

Taravangian saw that Odium had a wound or a sickness or something. Is that why he's called the Broken One?


All of Kaladin's hardships, all of the things he's survived, they're not just his weaknesses, they're his strengths. This is in display as he flees with Teft. The Sibling also helped him hide.

First flashback chapter! Ten ancient Singer cities near the Shattered Plains... what became the Highprinces' warcamps? There are multiple Listener families living as separate tribes at this time. Looks like Venli was jealous of her sister's freedom, not her sister herself. Eshonai wanted to not be tied down by her family, leaving Venli kinda alone and responsible. Venli does want power though, but who doesn't? She grew up on the songs of her people's lost Forms.

Raboniel further tempts Navani and gets more information than she gives. Oh... the Soulcasters are spren, taking that form rather than that of a Shardblade!

Kaladin is receiving Visions from Vyre. Lift could be of great help here as she's slipped into Visions before. The Sibling was always secretive and did not appear to humans, according to Syl. Can they even appear separate from the Tower?

Dalinar used Connection to see parts of Nale's past and see the Connections joining the Heralds that comprise the Oathpact. Eight lines of light, with one still vibrant, which two are gone? Jezrien? Is the other one Battar, who's purportedly much more stable-seeming and came to Kharbranth to warn of the coming Desolation? Is it Ishar? He and Jezrien were the ones who knew the most about Realmatics according to Shalash. His Honorblade had the power of the Bondsmiths. Also, I still can't be mad at Nale for killing Radiants, knowing what the Heralds have been through for millenia. Seems like the Heralds might have inhuman reflexes, or at least Taln and Nale do.

Ah, we saw why the Alethi had thought the Chasmfiends were Listener gods. Gavilar's interested in their songs of remembrance from the False Desolation and looking for the central ruin of the Shattered Plains, the city of Stormseat. Ah, sounds like the... Hog we saw in Sheler interlude was a Greatshell after all, it also reminded me of the Marabethian Greatshell Sigzil talked about so that was my first impression anyway. The Listeners didn't even know anyone survived the False Desolation.

Wow the Sibling is pretty humanphobic. Humans should die to protect them but they don't want to fight with humanity against the same enemy! The spren really are just afraid of death aren't they? Death was something that happened to other people, now after the Recreance, it isn't.

Ah, Mraize has captured Lift and put her in an aluminium lined box. The Sibling also seems to hint that she uses a different Light. So that's why Re-Shephir was in the crystal pillar room. The Tower's actual name is Ur? (I like it, very Mesopotamian! It came to be called Urithiru during the Silver Kingdoms. I keep forgetting how long ago the Heraldic Epochs were, mad respect to the Heralds for withstanding for that long!). Ah, the barrier works by the principles of Soulcasting, making air act solid like glass.

The Sibling lost the Rhythm of their Light during the Recreance when the Singers were stripped of Connection and Identity, so they couldn't access their Investiture anymore (but they started withdrawing way before, from Melishi sharing his plans?). All Lights have Rhythms. Now the Rhythm and Light of Odium Corrupts them (could they become of all three? That would be interesting!) The Sibling can't see the whole tower anymore, but the Radiants act as nodes and let him see.

A detailed explanation of the three Windrunner Lashings! Basic Lashing to change the direction (and intensity) of gravitation of infused target (sounds like one could also crush someone to the ground with it, not just throw them into the air), Full Lashing to bind or stick infused objects together, seems to work using atmospheric pressure (and Khriss agrees), Reverse Lashing: infuse something to attract (specific) objects towards it. It requires Command and visualization.

Hmm... sounds like Awakening is really close to the fundamentals. 

Dawnshard spoilers


⚠ major Dawnshard spoilers! ⚠


The Dawnshards themselves are Commands of Adonalsium.

The effect of holding a large number of Breaths seems to be similar to hosting a Dawnshard.


Actually, with fabrials using metals, it seems we are delving into the fundamentals of Cosmere magic faster than we expected.

Same goes for the Rhythms, which seems to be a... Metamagic, so to speak. Changing the Rhythm of something. Do Soothing and Rioting work by influencing the Rhythms of emotions then... Hmm... Dawnsingers, Singers, Listeners... Listening to the Rhythms of something versus singing a Rhythm or shaping/altering a Rhythm... Rothfuss' Naming magic gave me the idea. Gods, if this is true... that would be absolutely splendid! I mean, the Rhythms can encourage plant growth with a little Stormlight and the Rhythms called forth the Everstorm from Shadesmar.

Colors are probably also as Cosmere-wide as metals judging by things that Brandon has said in the past plus what we've been told so far regarding gemstones in this book. The difference between colours probably doesn't come into play in Awakening due to Endowment making all colours equally usable (and from a writing perspective because Brandon doesn't want to go back and retcon, as per himself)

Reverse Lashing also had a block, like Progression (...or to be more specific, Regrowth, now that I think about it) but like Lift, Kaladin overcame it and made it work.

Navani contacts Kaladin via the veins of garnet. Hmm... I don't think the reversed protections are just affecting Stormlight users, it's affecting the very Surges, otherwise Adhesion would not be usable either and Lift still would've been able to use Abrasion with Cultivationlight, besides the Sibling uses their own Light not Stormlight.

Voidlight spanreeds presumably using Voidspren or Corrupted spren. As for the Oathgate working with Voidlight, we Oathgate spren (who look like gigantic Inkspren and Reachers) can be Corrupted in OB.

Hmph Dalinar the monarchist strikes again, ah, thank you, Jasnah! Dalinar is suspicious of what's happening in Urithiru, thank goodness. Oof, Ruthar gets a dressing down. Another reminder of the kind of person Dalinar was, killing people at feasts over perceived insults. Navani, Adolin, apparently Dalinar too think of Jasnah high on a pedestal.

As we saw in OB, the awakened Parshmen got a Connection to their land, affected by perception. They are Alethi, they are Azish. They are warlike, they are bureaucratic. Venli wants to run, anticipating using the Radiant counterattack. If they do get free from both humanity and the Fused, where would they even settle? Back to the Frostlands, in ancient Natanatan?

Leshwi, Lezian, Raboniel are hogging the screen, where are the Fused we saw in Oathbringer? Where's Turash whom Odium called an old friend in Thaylen City? Hnanan who gave Vyre the dagger? Hariel who took over Demid's body?

Oh, Venli and Eshonai's mother got dementia, that's sad. Hoping that if you don't think about a problem, it will eventually go away on its own, how relatable. Who is Axindweth? That name sounds strange. Hmm... she probably doesn't actually know the Listener language and just using Connection.

Lezian didn't tell Raboniel that Kaladin was still conscious, he has Kaladin's family. Venli found out & plans to tell Leshwi. Timbre can... suppress Venli's ability to attune to the Rhythms somehow? Then again she managed to capture a Regal Voidspren in a Gemheart. I like Timbre, she's bringing out the best in Venli. Ah, confirmation that the Reachers have decided to not Bond humans (and try Bonding Singers). Wait... can the Sibling sense Venli? She's a Radiant too. Hmm she's still on her First Ideal, I think. Is her Regal Form / Form of Power preventing them from sensing her? Timbre trusts Leshwi? She caught Venli humming to an older Rhythm not of Odium! 

Edited by Honorless
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8 minutes ago, Soby said:

Thanks for the reply! If she uses Stormlight though will she go unconscious?

Kaladin also used Stormlight but he is the only Radiant using Stormlight who doesn't get unconscious because he's far enough into his oaths (Plus whole 'Child of Tanavast' thing) and he can use Honor's true surge aka Adhesion with Stormlight. 

If Venli wouldn't be having a voidspren in her gemheart, then she would be just of 1st ideal and could possibly be affected by Tower's corruption. 

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I'm not sure how I felt about this part. It felt loaded with little tidbits but how many of them were significant enough to warrant the time spent left me a bit flat on it. 

I guess part 4 will show how well judged it was.

I'm also getting a little meh on Kaladin being depowered and beaten down but still being able to continually outdo the Pursuer who seems increasingly like a joke.

I am enjoying the navani / raboniel stuff and I'm interested to see which of them is responsible for the rhythm of war. It's presumably one annotating the other as I can't see a true cooperation at this point

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I’m in the minority here, but I didn’t feel like part 3 was dragging at all:ph34r: I really like how immersed I was in this world so far in the last couple of days. 

I teared up when Lift talked about her mother. I love Venli a lot! I’m so excited for her maybe freeing Lift & getting to her 2nd oath! Also the flashbacks made me realise I don’t like Eshonai as a character at all! I’m glad we got Venli instead of her. The Sibling is maybe the best new character is this book :wub: 

Did anyone else notice how, at one point, someone(I think it was the Sibling) calls the city Ur, instead of Urithiru? For a moment there I thought if the “El” mentioned on the epigraph of chapter 60 couldn’t be short for Elantris, based solely on the fact that they are both cities of gods & get a short form? :blink:

one thing that bothers me is that I’m getting close to 70% & I am not ready to let this book go, but also can’t stop reading. 

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Ya, I'm not feeling any loss of interest or "bloatedness". I was really shocked that the tower was already taken at the end of part 2, and really satisfied to see the developments of part 3. It makes me a little sad to see it not jiving with people.

Edited by Asrael
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4 hours ago, mariapapadia said:

I’m in the minority here, but I didn’t feel like part 3 was dragging at all:ph34r: I really like how immersed I was in this world so far in the last couple of days. 

I teared up when Lift talked about her mother. I love Venli a lot! I’m so excited for her maybe freeing Lift & getting to her 2nd oath! Also the flashbacks made me realise I don’t like Eshonai as a character at all! I’m glad we got Venli instead of her. The Sibling is maybe the best new character is this book :wub: 

Did anyone else notice how, at one point, someone(I think it was the Sibling) calls the city Ur, instead of Urithiru? For a moment there I thought if the “El” mentioned on the epigraph of chapter 60 couldn’t be short for Elantris, based solely on the fact that they are both cities of gods & get a short form? :blink:

one thing that bothers me is that I’m getting close to 70% & I am not ready to let this book go, but also can’t stop reading. 

For some reason I thought of the reference to "El" as Elend but I can't remember if anyone ever actually refers to him as El. Maybe that will become a bit clearer as we find out who the two people working on the rhythm of war are.

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