Hoid the Former Drifter he/him Posted August 7, 2020 Posted August 7, 2020 What is it about the stone that allows the holder to control szeth? Is it psychological or can he actually not resist the holder?
Darkfinder she/her Posted August 7, 2020 Posted August 7, 2020 Just now, Hoid the Drifter said: What is it about the stone that allows the holder to control szeth? Is it psychological or can he actually not resist the holder? The stone is part of being a Truthless I think. Nothing specific about the stone makes the holder be able to control him specifically it is just a symbol of who is in charge Szeth could have resisted it at any time.
Brgst13 Posted August 7, 2020 Posted August 7, 2020 Based on his internal dialog in Oathbringer, it seems as it was psychological. However, that could be a result of his dying and being resurrected possibly breaking whatever bond existed. So I guess the answer is that we don't know.
Hoid the Former Drifter he/him Posted August 7, 2020 Author Posted August 7, 2020 So how come szeth makes it seem like he is forced to obey in WoK?
Darkfinder she/her Posted August 7, 2020 Posted August 7, 2020 It's ingrained in him he doesn't want to follow the orders at that time but he did because of his culture and internal code but he still could have its just a stone
+Invocation Posted August 7, 2020 Posted August 7, 2020 1 minute ago, Hoid the Drifter said: So how come szeth makes it seem like he is forced to obey in WoK? Because to him, he is. This is part of his culture, this is part of what he does. To be named Truthless is a punishment, so you are left to do whatever the person holding the stone says. He was just...really dedicated. 1
Nathrangking he/him Posted August 7, 2020 Posted August 7, 2020 wlmkfi (paraphrased) If i was holding Szeth's Oathstone would he understand my commands? Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) Good question, I don't believe anyone has asked it before. No, an Oathstone doesn't have any magical properties whatsoever. Supanova 2017 - Sydney (June 18, 2017) 1
Darkfinder she/her Posted August 7, 2020 Posted August 7, 2020 Quote 'More than seven years, sword-nimi. And I didn't follow the rock, but the words of the one who held it. I...' ...Had no choice? But it had always been nothing more than a rock. -Oathbringer Chapter 116 Szeth's view point here specifically states it was just a rock. 1
Brgst13 Posted August 7, 2020 Posted August 7, 2020 2 minutes ago, Nathrangking said: wlmkfi (paraphrased) If i was holding Szeth's Oathstone would he understand my commands? Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) Good question, I don't believe anyone has asked it before. No, an Oathstone doesn't have any magical properties whatsoever. Supanova 2017 - Sydney (June 18, 2017) Well I'd say that about settles that. 1
Karger he/him Posted August 7, 2020 Posted August 7, 2020 54 minutes ago, Hoid the Drifter said: What is it about the stone that allows the holder to control szeth? Is it psychological or can he actually not resist the holder? ^^Szeth states clearly in OB that it was really just a rock.
discorat she/her Posted August 7, 2020 Posted August 7, 2020 The stone could be any regular stone. In Shinovar culture being a soldier is being the lowest ranked class in the entire society. Truthless are lower because they get their orders from anyone (and thats why Szeth is given away to other people, because he is seen as absolute garbage). Spoiler as to why hes not truthless anymore: Spoiler Because Szeth became truthless when he said the radiants were coming back, and i think the leaders of Shinovar said he was a liar, and lying is bad, so he became a truthless. Kaladin proved that he was a radiant, so after that Szeth was no longer truthless.
Quantus he/him Posted August 7, 2020 Posted August 7, 2020 16 hours ago, Hoid the Drifter said: So how come szeth makes it seem like he is forced to obey in WoK? He's hardcore about Rules, it's one of the big things that impressed Nale enough to personally recruit him. It wasnt until he discovered through the existence of Kaladin and other Radiants that he came to the conclusion that it was the Shin Leadership that were in the Wrong, not him (an epiphany that the Diagram warned against). But even then, I think the fact that he literally died also helped him rationalize the end of his Truthless status and joining the Skybreakers, not to mention the fact that Skybreakers apparently have authority to absolve any and all past crimes of their initiates. 1
cfphelps he/him Posted August 8, 2020 Posted August 8, 2020 (edited) His honor demands that he follow his people's laws and customs. He was (wrongly) judged to be Truthless, and was thus required to follow the orders of whomever had his oathstone, as punishment for claiming the Radiants were returning. Nothing about the stone itself had any power over him, it's just a symbol of what it represents. As much as he hates having to kill, he's not willing to dishonor himself by breaking the law and not following through with his punishment. That's why Nale is impressed with him, he follows the law rigidly until it becomes undeniable that the Radiants are really returning, and that revelation that he's wrongly judged Truthless shakes him to his core. Edited August 8, 2020 by cfphelps
Honorless he/him Posted August 11, 2020 Posted August 11, 2020 (edited) It's not magically enforced, it's culturally ingrained in Shin culture, obeying the carrier of one's oathstone is part of being branded a Truthless, it seems. Edited August 11, 2020 by Honorless
teknopathetic he/him Posted August 12, 2020 Posted August 12, 2020 (edited) We do have Tien and his finding "face-rocks". There is a possibility that magic stones do/did exist in some way. Hints would be Tien, Thunderclasts, Shin Stonemages, the Sibling going to a mountain range, and the prohibition against walking on stone. I am wondering if Ashyen magic was more stone based than gem based, and some of the stone magic went with the refugees. A common counter theory to mine is the theory that the Shin were told not to leave the reservation, so they had a big thing with leaving the grassy areas (that eventually became a stone aversion). Personally, I think there have been too many unexplained stone hints and really want there to be some truth to it. Edited August 12, 2020 by teknopathetic
GudThymes he/him Posted August 12, 2020 Posted August 12, 2020 7 hours ago, teknopathetic said: A common counter theory to mine is the theory that the Shin were told not to leave the reservation, so they had a big thing with leaving the grassy areas (that eventually became a stone aversion). Personally, I think there have been too many unexplained stone hints and really want there to be some truth to it. I personally believe in this theory and think that it's not that far fetched. On Earth a lot of religions have a similar "flood event" in their histories, even ones that were geographically isolated from each other. We've found anthropological evidence that a giant flood did really happen. I think having a religion evolve from a natural event and get twisted and turned into Stone Shaminism really brings the world of Roshar to life that much more.
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