Karger he/him Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 (edited) 8 hours ago, StanLemon said: I must not be able to recall that, because I can't think of an example in the books. I'd appreciate one. There is a fused that attacks Kaladin that has progression. While they can't block but they do regenerate damage. I also think there is another one with "plate"(carapace that blocks shardblades) but I can't find them right now. Quote Kaladin swept with the Sylblade, cutting through the Fused’s forearms. That sheared the spurs completely free and disabled the hands. … The creature’s cut arms had regrown, and—even as it swung its hands—a large club formed there from carapace. 8 hours ago, StanLemon said: Plate without Stormlight is a hindrance, not a boon. Without Stormlight it is a bunch of heavy metal you are lugging along. We don't know how living plate works. However considering that it can be instantly summoned or dismissed using it to just block has some potential and if you can grab then summon then fall on someone... That is going to hurt. 8 hours ago, StanLemon said: Brandon disagrees. He straight up said that an Atium Misting could beat Kaladin. He says could not will. There is a large difference. Assuming Kaladin has no or very limited stormlight or assuming that the seer has an unrealistic amount of atium they stand a decent chance but it is by no means certain. In fact Brandon bets the other way. 8 hours ago, StanLemon said: I never said it didn't increase speed. But they haven't done any feats of speed greater than Pewter. They don't need to be greater. They just need to level the playing field. 8 hours ago, StanLemon said: And "perfects" is a stretch to say that it does all the things Pewter does. Sounds a lot like the general enhancement pewter gives to me. 8 hours ago, StanLemon said: Actually no, you can move faster without having better dexterity or balance. Why "should" it increase balance and dexterity? Because if it did not you would fall over with the increased strength and speed as your balance is compromised. However Kaladin does not report this to be a problem and neither does Shallan. Edited March 30, 2020 by Karger 1
Bigmikey357 he/him Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 The thing that makes Atium an "I Win" card is its ability to give a person the knowledge to kill their opponents with one strike. But as long as a Radiant has Stormlight there is nothing a Mistborn can bring to the table that will kill the autoheal Radiant that way. Also Atium loses some effectiveness at distance, as anything flying becomes fixed in the timestream. But a Mistborn could pepper a Radiant with coins and win at a distance by forcing them to use up more and more Stormlight. Unless it's an Elsecaller/ Lightweaver who can instantly magic up a wall for defense. Or a Willshaper who can just step into the CR where the Mistborn cannot possibly follow. Anyway, to use Atium most effectively with fewer factors to futz up the magic, one must employ it at close range. And that's the problem. Most Radiants 3rd Ideal or better will be able to shrug off all but the most grievous of wounds and still be effective in a fight. They aren't going to survive a beheading but anything short of that type of wound heals nearly instantly and unconsciously (said Radiant doesn't have to activate the healing, healing happens without effort). A Mistborn with Atium and a decent size weapon could maybe manage to incapacitate or even kill the Radiant, although the outcome is nowhere near certain. But give that Radiant Shardplate and that close range becomes a death sentence. Why? Because for all a Mistborn's awesome power they are almost pure offense. They have no defense against a Shardblade, no way to block one seeking their spine. And they cannot breach a Shardplate defense from anywhere other than up close. 2
NameIess Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 3 hours ago, Karger said: Because if it did not you would fall over with the increased strength and speed as your balance is compromised. However Kaladin does not report this to be a problem and neither does Shallan. The way I see it, Stormlight's "boost" is simply the fact that it instantly heals your muscles, meaning you never get tired. It doesn't vastly improve your strength, and Shallan wasn't able to run faster than Vathah and the others, simply longer. 58 minutes ago, Bigmikey357 said: Anyway, to use Atium most effectively with fewer factors to futz up the magic, one must employ it at close range. And that's the problem. Most Radiants 3rd Ideal or better will be able to shrug off all but the most grievous of wounds and still be effective in a fight. They aren't going to survive a beheading but anything short of that type of wound heals nearly instantly and unconsciously (said Radiant doesn't have to activate the healing, healing happens without effort). A Mistborn with Atium and a decent size weapon could maybe manage to incapacitate or even kill the Radiant, although the outcome is nowhere near certain. But give that Radiant Shardplate and that close range becomes a death sentence. Why? Because for all a Mistborn's awesome power they are almost pure offense. They have no defense against a Shardblade, no way to block one seeking their spine. And they cannot breach a Shardplate defense from anywhere other than up close. With Atium, it is still basically impossible to hit the Mistborn. Yes, a fifth Ideal Radiant with a ton of Stormlight would be nigh impossible to kill with conventional means, even for a Mistborn with Atium. The Mistborn still has a few options, such as duraluminum-steel pushing a large chunk of metal at the Radiant to break their armor, or Duraluminum-pewter punching them in the chest, then using chromium to drain their Stormlight and keep them from summoning their Shardblade. On the whole, however, I think that the more combat-based orders would have an advantage over the Mistborn. Unless you give the Mistborn aluminum daggers. Those things can block a Shardblade, and any wounds inflicted by them cannot be healed until they are removed. All it takes is a little Atium, a close quarters throw or stab, and the Radiant is dead. Unless they use my patented idea: Shardglasses. (That would still leave the Radiant more open to having their Shardplate broken, and would limit their offensive capabilities, but it might keep them alive long enough for the Mistborn's Atium to run out.)
StanLemon Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 3 hours ago, Karger said: There is a fused that attacks Kaladin that has progression. While they can't block but they do regenerate damage. I also think there is another one with "plate"(carapace that blocks shardblades) but I can't find them right now. Healing isn't the same as blocking 3 hours ago, Karger said: We don't know how living plate works. However considering that it can be instantly summoned or dismissed using it to just block has some potential and if you can grab then summon then fall on someone... That is going to hurt. As you said, we don't know how living Plate works. We don't know if it can instantly be summoned. All we know is that the helmet could, but that is just as likely to be because it melds into the rest of the armor. So until we know more we have to be using arguments based on what we know of dead Plate. 3 hours ago, Karger said: He says could not will. There is a large difference. Assuming Kaladin has no or very limited stormlight or assuming that the seer has an unrealistic amount of atium they stand a decent chance but it is by no means certain. In fact Brandon bets the other way. He starts by saying the Misting. Who has one power versus Kaladin who was a 3rd oath Radiant. And he placed his bet on waiting out the Atium. A Mistborn has many other powers on top of Atium. 3 hours ago, Karger said: They don't need to be greater. They just need to level the playing field. And? The whole point of this was the comment that Radiants have superior strength and speed which I explained that that isnt the case. Though it might be with Plate. 3 hours ago, Karger said: Sounds a lot like the general enhancement pewter gives to me. Brandon repeatedly explains the benefits of Pewter in Mistborn books, in Stormlight the internal monologues only speak of strength, speed, durability, endurance, and healing. 3 hours ago, Karger said: Because if it did not you would fall over with the increased strength and speed as your balance is compromised. However Kaladin does not report this to be a problem and neither does Shallan. Neither do Feruchemists. That doesn't mean they get all the benefits.
Frustration Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 20 minutes ago, StanLemon said: Healing isn't the same as blocking He is talking about two different orders. Also a Mistborn can't do either so what is you point? 20 minutes ago, StanLemon said: As you said, we don't know how living Plate works. We don't know if it can instantly be summoned. All we know is that the helmet could, but that is just as likely to be because it melds into the rest of the armor. So until we know more we have to be using arguments based on what we know of dead Plate. It's pretty clear you can dismiss all the armor 20 minutes ago, StanLemon said: And? The whole point of this was the comment that Radiants have superior strength and speed which I explained that that isnt the case. Though it might be with Plate. It would take Dur-aluminum, a Pewter compounder or a feruchemist with a lot of time on their hands to match plate, Adolin has to actually restrain himself in order to not crush metal cantines/railings. Also with we know that the squires feel they can run forever with excessive gear just by holding stormlight, I have trouble just going a mile with a heavy bag, it they need more than just strength and endurance if they don't have balance their form will suffer and they won't go anywhere. 20 minutes ago, StanLemon said: Brandon repeatedly explains the benefits of Pewter in Mistborn books, in Stormlight the internal monologues only speak of strength, speed, durability, endurance, and healing. Re-read Brandon's description of Kaladin in WoK both Teft and Dalinar are in awe at what he is capable of. 21 minutes ago, StanLemon said: Neither do Feruchemists. That doesn't mean they get all the benefits. For the Feruchemist everything else slows down so they don't need additional balance to them they are moving at a normal speed. 25 minutes ago, StanLemon said: He starts by saying the Misting. Who has one power versus Kaladin who was a 3rd oath Radiant. And he placed his bet on waiting out the Atium. A Mistborn has many other powers on top of Atium. Atium that burns like nothing else, Kal won't have any trouble holding out.
NameIess Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 3 minutes ago, Booknerd said: It would take Dur-aluminum, a Pewter compounder or a feruchemist with a lot of time on their hands to match plate, Adolin has to actually restrain himself in order to not crush metal cantines/railings. Also with we know that the squires feel they can run forever with excessive gear just by holding stormlight, I have trouble just going a mile with a heavy bag, it they need more than just strength and endurance if they don't have balance their form will suffer and they won't go anywhere. And pewter let Vin outrun a horse. What's your point? We know Plate makes Radiants way stronger than a Mistborn, but in terms of speed and agility? They are roughly equal, except that pewter enhances your dexterity as well. As for bridge 4, they have form. They have been running that bridge for miles at least twice a week, and they trained to carry it every day. If they didn't have form, they would be dead.
Frustration Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 3 minutes ago, Nameless said: And pewter let Vin outrun a horse. What's your point? We know Plate makes Radiants way stronger than a Mistborn, but in terms of speed and agility? They are roughly equal, except that pewter enhances your dexterity as well. As for bridge 4, they have form. They have been running that bridge for miles at least twice a week, and they trained to carry it every day. If they didn't have form, they would be dead. Carrying a bridge is different from a bag it's all about the grip, the bridge let's you hold it from the underside and carry it overhead, a bag sits on your back, need I explain how that changes everything? Also other bridge crews where out of shape so no they did not need good form, but they did have it.
StanLemon Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 2 minutes ago, Booknerd said: It's pretty clear you can dismiss all the armor Really? And your bases for this is? 2 minutes ago, Booknerd said: It would take Dur-aluminum, a Pewter compounder or a feruchemist with a lot of time on their hands to match plate, Adolin has to actually restrain himself in order to not crush metal cantines/railings. Also with we know that the squires feel they can run forever with excessive gear just by holding stormlight, I have trouble just going a mile with a heavy bag, it they need more than just strength and endurance if they don't have balance their form will suffer and they won't go anywhere. I've already said that it gives strength and endurance. It is the balance, dexterity, and grace of movement I'm saying it lacks. 2 minutes ago, Booknerd said: Re-read Brandon's description of Kaladin in WoK both Teft and Dalinar are in awe at what he is capable of. I did, today even before you made this post in fact. Theft straight up thinks to himself that what Kaladin does is more than Stormlight. That it has to do with Kaladin being a master of the spear. In that same scene, Kaladin considers it the strength of the storm running through him empowering him. He never thinks to himself that it betters his movements. 2 minutes ago, Booknerd said: For the Feruchemist everything else slows down so they don't need additional balance to them they are moving at a normal speed. That's partially supported by the books. But again, Stormlight is never described by someone using it as increasing their dexterity and balance 2 minutes ago, Booknerd said: Atium that burns like nothing else, Kal won't have any trouble holding out. Why do you think a Mistborn would waste their Atium like that? They can use their Tin enhanced senses and Bronze when Atium would not be helpful.
StanLemon Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 Just now, Booknerd said: Carrying a bridge is different from a bag it's all about the grip, the bridge let's you hold it from the underside and carry it overhead, a bag sits on your back, need I explain how that changes everything? Also other bridge crews where out of shape so no they did not need good form, but they did have it. Other bridge crews also collapsed constantly. Even though carrying a bridge as a group is different than packs. Endurance training of any kind carries over to other endurance based work
NameIess Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 2 minutes ago, Booknerd said: is different from a bag it's all about the grip, the bridge let's you hold it from the underside and carry it overhead, a bag sits on your back, need I explain how that changes everything? Also other bridge crews where out of shape so no they did not need good form, but they did have it. I'm just saying that Bridge four has good form, they have experience with heavy lifting and hard work. Also, Stormlight heals you, so it wouldn't matter as much if you used bad form. The other bridge crews were exhausted at the end.
Karger he/him Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 Just now, StanLemon said: Really? And your bases for this is? Stoneward in starfall vision has not summoned his armor yet. 1 minute ago, StanLemon said: I've already said that it gives strength and endurance. It is the balance, dexterity, and grace of movement I'm saying it lacks. In WoR Kaladin is figuring out his limits and states that it increases his speed. The fact that he maintains a remarkable amount of grace while doing so as we see in the second ideal scene with no training indicates extremely strongly that those qualities are enhanced as well. 3 minutes ago, StanLemon said: That it has to do with Kaladin being a master of the spear Teft states that it can't grant skill. He does not state that it does not increase balance or speed or dexterity. 4 minutes ago, StanLemon said: Why do you think a Mistborn would waste their Atium like that? They can use their Tin enhanced senses and Bronze when Atium would not be helpful. As soon as they stop burning they loose.
NameIess Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 1 minute ago, Karger said: As soon as they stop burning they loose. Are you saying that Kaladin could survive against someone as skilled as, say Vin, when Vin had Atium? (Since you chose an exemplary Radiant, they must be fighting an exemplary Mistborn.)
Frustration Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Nameless said: Are you saying that Kaladin could survive against someone as skilled as, say Vin, when Vin had Atium? (Since you chose an exemplary Radiant, they must be fighting an exemplary Mistborn.) Yes, unless you give Vin the power of Preservation, in which case Kal gets Honor, Kal wins, the second Vin stops burning Atium. Edited March 30, 2020 by Booknerd
NameIess Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 Just now, Booknerd said: Yes, unless you give Vin the power of Preservation, in which case Kal gets Honor, Kal wins, the second Vin stops burning Atium. Is this the same Vin who battled well against thirteen inquisitors? Without Atium, Vin could give third ideal Kaladin a run for his money. My favorite character in any series is Kaladin, and even I don't think that he could hold up against Vin with Atium and all sixteen metals, unless the fifth ideal gives some sort of mega-boost. Seriously, Vin ripped through thousands of Kollos, killed compounding inquisitors, and killed someone using Atium all without Atium herself. Give her Atium, and Kaladin stands no chance, at least at close range, which is the only place were Vin would need it.
Karger he/him Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Nameless said: Are you saying that Kaladin could survive against someone as skilled as, say Vin, when Vin had Atium? (Since you chose an exemplary Radiant, they must be fighting an exemplary Mistborn.) When Vin runs out of atium yes. Or rather Vin will probably find some clever way of escaping. In a pitched battle though she will probably loose unless she can find some way of outlasting Kaladin's stormlight supply. 5 minutes ago, Nameless said: Is this the same Vin who battled well against thirteen inquisitors? They were not trying to kill her. 5 minutes ago, Nameless said: Vin could give third ideal Kaladin a run for his money. My favorite character in any series is Kaladin, and even I don't think that he could hold up against Vin with Atium and all sixteen metals Maybe not but I don't know what a fifth ideal Kaladin will look like. 5 minutes ago, Nameless said: Seriously, Vin ripped through thousands of Kollos, killed compounding inquisitors, and killed someone using Atium all without Atium herself Both Atium burners got cocky. I don't think thousands. Also Kaladin has killed dozens of Parshendi who are much better soldiers. I also don't think she killed the compounding inquisitors until after gaining Preservation power. Edited March 30, 2020 by Karger
StanLemon Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 5 minutes ago, Karger said: Stoneward in starfall vision has not summoned his armor yet. Or he didn't have armor. Not every Radiant did. Oathbringer implies it's not all that common to get past the 3rd Ideal. 5 minutes ago, Karger said: In WoR Kaladin is figuring out his limits and states that it increases his speed. The fact that he maintains a remarkable amount of grace while doing so as we see in the second ideal scene with no training indicates extremely strongly that those qualities are enhanced as well. Kaladin is a master spearman. His scenes without Stormlight prove that. Also it isn't uncommon for Investiture related powers to give an instinctive ability to use them. 5 minutes ago, Karger said: Teft states that it can't grant skill. He does not state that it does not increase balance or speed or dexterity. He doesn't state that it does either. 5 minutes ago, Karger said: As soon as they stop burning they loose. That's a preposterous fallacy. There are numerous ways a Mistborn could evade a Radiant without the use of Atium.
Frustration Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 4 minutes ago, StanLemon said: Or he didn't have armor. Not every Radiant did. Oathbringer implies it's not all that common to get past the 3rd Ideal. In the midnight essence vision, the one Radiant had to dismiss their armor to be lashed to the battle, and we know they had armor from the first run through. 6 minutes ago, StanLemon said: That's a preposterous fallacy. There are numerous ways a Mistborn could evade a Radiant without the use of Atium. Oh, really, how? Steel is pointless against gravitation, and hiding is useless against spren, also this is a contest of combat, not who can run away like a dog with it's tail between it's legs.
StanLemon Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Karger said: When Vin runs out of atium yes. Or rather Vin will probably find some clever way of escaping. In a pitched battle though she will probably loose unless she can find some way of outlasting Kaladin's stormlight supply. If Vin had all 16 metals then even without Atium, she would have Duralumin megaboosts, Chromium leaching of Stormlight, time bubbles, Nicrosil as another method to burn away Kaladin's Stormlight, Electrum as an alternate future sight, and her prodigious abilities in the basic 8 metals. She would most definitely be able to give Kal a hard time. Quote They were not trying to kill her. Yes they were, Marsh was in the process of torturing her to death when he gained enough control to remove the earing. Quote Maybe not but I don't know what a fifth ideal Kaladin will look like. That's true we don't. But it's nothing but conjecture without much backing to say it's an unstoppable force. Quote Both Atium burners got cocky. I don't think thousands. Also Kaladin has killed dozens of Parshendi who are much better soldiers. I also don't think she killed the compounding inquisitors until after gaining Preservation power. You're right, it was only hundreds of Koloss. Parshendi are better warriors but so is every other warrior. What makes beating Koloss impressive is the raw power they have. No she didn't kill the Inquisitors before, you are right about that. But considering compounding is pretty much the most powerful combat magic, the fact that she could hold them off as long as she did is impressive. Edited March 30, 2020 by StanLemon
StanLemon Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 4 minutes ago, Booknerd said: In the midnight essence vision, the one Radiant had to dismiss their armor to be lashed to the battle, and we know they had armor from the first run through. Can you get the quote? I have no recollection of them dismissing armor. 4 minutes ago, Booknerd said: Oh, really, how? Steel is pointless against gravitation, and hiding is useless against spren, also this is a contest of combat, not who can run away like a dog with it's tail between it's legs. Steel still gives a lot of maneuverability, which is never useless. Also, your definition of combat being one that advantages the Radiant shows your bias. Retreating and attacking in irregular ways is still combat. Turning the combat into something that advantages you is the true contest. Not just slugging it out.
Frustration Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 Just now, StanLemon said: Can you get the quote? I have no recollection of them dismissing armor. The one where Dalinar talks to Fen(I don't have the books on me) the other Radiant says that he had to dismiss the armor to be lashed. 2 minutes ago, StanLemon said: Steel still gives a lot of maneuverability, which is never useless. Lashings are so much better it's like comparing a hangglider to a fighter jet. 3 minutes ago, StanLemon said: Also, your definition of combat being one that advantages the Radiant shows your bias. Retreating and attacking in irregular ways is still combat. Turning the combat into something that advantages you is the true contest. Not just slugging it out. Hiding is what you suggest. That's not fighting. Surprise attacks won't work, so what you are suggesting is to hide. 14 minutes ago, StanLemon said: If Vin had all 16 metals then even without Atium, she would have Duralumin megaboosts, Chromium leaching of Stormlight, time bubbles, Nicrosil as another method to burn away Kaladin's Stormlight, Electrum as an alternate future sight, and her prodigious abilities in the basic 8 metals. She would most definitely be able to give Kal a hard time. Amaram had all ten surges, and dozens of Fused, who exactly won that conflict? 15 minutes ago, StanLemon said: Yes they were, Marsh was in the process of torturing her to death when he gained enough control to remove the earing. You're right, it was only hundreds of Koloss. Parshendi are better warriors but so is every other warrior. What makes beating Koloss impressive is the raw power they have. No she didn't kill the Inquisitors before, you are right about that. But considering compounding is pretty much the most powerful combat magic, the fact that she could hold them off as long as she did is impressive. Ruin was just having fun at that point, if he wanted to just kill Vin he would have done so. And also no Surgebinding is far more powerful combativelly it's drawback is fuel, I don't care how fast you can move, when I hold power over motion itself you might as well give up.
StanLemon Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 3 minutes ago, Booknerd said: The one where Dalinar talks to Fen(I don't have the books on me) the other Radiant says that he had to dismiss the armor to be lashed. I'll wait on that quote. 3 minutes ago, Booknerd said: Lashings are so much better it's like comparing a hangglider to a fighter jet. In close quarters they would be pretty even. 3 minutes ago, Booknerd said: Hiding is what you suggest. That's not fighting. Surprise attacks won't work, so what you are suggesting is to hide. No I'm not, and spren aren't omniscient. 3 minutes ago, Booknerd said: Amaram had all ten surges, and dozens of Fused, who exactly won that conflict? Amaram was drunk on the Thrill and had literally just acquired those abilities. Also, Kaladin only got the upper hand when he was able to distract him with his guilt. Admittedly Kaladin had Fuzed to worry about but even before that at the beginning of their fight they were fighting fairly evenly. 3 minutes ago, Booknerd said: Ruin was just having fun at that point, if he wanted to just kill Vin he would have done so. The point of that fight was to kill her. He had no reason to keep her alive at that point. Marshal's inner monologue basically confirms that 3 minutes ago, Booknerd said: And also no Surgebinding is far more powerful combativelly it's drawback is fuel, I don't care how fast you can move, when I hold power over motion itself you might as well give up. No, there is a reason this fandom overall considers Fullborn the strongest non Shard in the setting (other than maybe Nightblood). Compounding offers virtually unlimited power in whatever trait is being compounded
Frustration Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 11 minutes ago, StanLemon said: In close quarters they would be pretty even. But that gives Radiants the advantage as they have plate, and blade 11 minutes ago, StanLemon said: No I'm not, and spren aren't omniscient. No but they're practically invisible and can follow you anywhere 11 minutes ago, StanLemon said: Amaram was drunk on the Thrill and had literally just acquired those abilities. Also, Kaladin only got the upper hand when he was able to distract him with his guilt. Admittedly Kaladin had Fuzed to worry about but even before that at the beginning of their fight they were fighting fairly evenly. I mean fair enough, but as the fight progressed Amaram got better and better with his power. 13 minutes ago, StanLemon said: The point of that fight was to kill her. He had no reason to keep her alive at that point. Marshal's inner monologue basically confirms that Then why on Earth was Ruin taunting her? Ruin enjoyed the torture as much as the Inquisitors do. 14 minutes ago, StanLemon said: No, there is a reason this fandom overall considers Fullborn the strongest non Shard in the setting (other than maybe Nightblood). Compounding offers virtually unlimited power in whatever trait is being compounded And when they can freeze you in place, break you down to atoms? Auto age you to a thousand? Multiply the amount of friction your blood experiences until you boil from the inside? As I said fuel is the problem, but surges are basically fundemental forces so if Yelig-nar get's full power look out.
Karger he/him Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 51 minutes ago, StanLemon said: Or he didn't have armor. Not every Radiant did. Oathbringer implies it's not all that common to get past the 3rd Ideal. 19 minutes ago, StanLemon said: I'll wait on that quote. The quote specifically says. "You haven't summoned your armor yet; you had to dismiss it so I could Lash you ." 12 minutes ago, StanLemon said: In close quarters they would be pretty even. Depends on the skill level. Lashings are easier to use in a lot of ways you can also go down with them as well as up. MB spoilers Spoiler 43 minutes ago, StanLemon said: Yes they were, Marsh was in the process of torturing her to death when he gained enough control to remove the earing. Ruin did not want her dead he wanted to know where the atium was before he killed her. Ruin can't control people in a blind rage. So Marsh lost control. During the prior combat the goal was to disable not kill. 45 minutes ago, StanLemon said: That's true we don't. But it's nothing but conjecture without much backing to say it's an unstoppable force. To compare ax=by is largely meaningless without any kind of context which is why I am ignoring it and sticking to things we know. 47 minutes ago, StanLemon said: the fact that she could hold them off as long as she did is impressive. I suppose. But if that is the contest (survive against these guys for longer) then Kaladin still wins by falling up. 20 minutes ago, StanLemon said: No I'm not, and spren aren't omniscient. They are better the most other security systems as they don't have to sleep and might have a passive investiture sense. I also don't think they are bothered at all by darkness or obscurity life fog. 33 minutes ago, Booknerd said: Amaram had all ten surges, and dozens of Fused, who exactly won that conflict? Amaram. He was about to kill Kaladin. Rock intervened at the last second. Also Amaram did not know what he was doing and was burning out as he fought. 5 minutes ago, Booknerd said: Then why on Earth was Ruin taunting her? Ruin enjoyed the torture as much as the Inquisitors do. He was trying to break her will so that she would tell him where the atium is.
Frustration Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 2 minutes ago, Karger said: Amaram. He was about to kill Kaladin. Rock intervened at the last second. Also Amaram did not know what he was doing and was burning out as he fought. Not to hurt an ally but Amaram was almost dead by the time Rock shot him
StanLemon Posted March 30, 2020 Posted March 30, 2020 5 minutes ago, Booknerd said: But that gives Radiants the advantage as they have plate, and blade If there is enough room to be jumping around with Steel then there is enough room to dodge. 5 minutes ago, Booknerd said: No but they're practically invisible and can follow you anywhere True, I'll give you that, but considering Copper has an unspecified effect on spren it, they might not be so helpful 5 minutes ago, Booknerd said: I mean fair enough, but as the fight progressed Amaram got better and better with his power. Not particularly, he used a couple tricks but he really didn't do much 5 minutes ago, Booknerd said: Then why on Earth was Ruin taunting her? Ruin enjoyed the torture as much as the Inquisitors do. Because he had her beat and was taunting her 5 minutes ago, Booknerd said: And when they can freeze you in place, break you down to atoms? Auto age you to a thousand? Multiply the amount of friction your blood experiences until you boil from the inside? As I said fuel is the problem, but surges are basically fundemental forces so if Yelig-nar get's full power look out. They are fundamental forces, but you are waaaaay overplaying how a Radiant could use them. Using that logic a Mistborn should just be able to push on the iron in the Radiants blood causing a whole host of nastiness.
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