LopentheHerdazian Posted October 3, 2019 Posted October 3, 2019 It's safe to say that synthetic gemstones won't be available for a large amount of time and that the average person will not have piles of suffered soon. However the average person does have quite a few smaller gems. So having a fabrial that can be renued with stormlight is not so unreasonable. However assume it so. If so I reckon everyone will have heaters with rubies. They will have dishwashers that produce water with rain or river spren and then blow that around with wind spren. They'll have tumblerdryers with flame and wind spren. How do you reckon they will create trains? They'd need some kind of motion spren. I don't know if wind spren are that already.
Karger he/him Posted October 3, 2019 Posted October 3, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Kalaksbreath said: The biggest lack of labor will be the parhsmen and it's mostly the wealthy that owned them All caravans and every major utility in all cities and many of them were in armies and even prosperous merchants had them. Edited October 3, 2019 by Karger 1
Isilel Posted October 4, 2019 Posted October 4, 2019 11 hours ago, LopentheHerdazian said: However the average person does have quite a few smaller gems. So having a fabrial that can be renued with stormlight is not so unreasonable. Yea, I don't see common people having domestic appliance fabrials in a near future. Things will develop similar to how they did iRL, IMHO - i.e. industrial and business use first. Heating fabrial require big rubies, which are both expensive and need to be guarded against theft, so I don't see them in homes, other than those of the powerful and the wealthy. But, in the public baths or in a large laundry establishment? Yes, absolutely. Quote How do you reckon they will create trains? They won't. Railways or roads suitable for high-speed ground transport aren't feasible in eastern Roshar because of the highstorms. But Navani already has ideas about flying ships, which would allow them to circumvent this limitation. 10 hours ago, Karger said: All caravans and every major utility in all cities and many of them were in armies and even prosperous merchants had them. Yes, and flying ships - or to begin with even barges floating about a foot above the ground and towed by humans would replace and quickly exceed the use that they got out of parshmen as beasts of burden. 1
Karger he/him Posted October 4, 2019 Posted October 4, 2019 3 hours ago, Isilel said: Yes, and flying ships - or to begin with even barges floating about a foot above the ground and towed by humans would replace and quickly exceed the use that they got out of parshmen as beasts of burden. Those sound expensive. You need a bunch of gemstones and they will probably break frequently.
+Oltux72 he/him Posted October 4, 2019 Posted October 4, 2019 4 hours ago, Isilel said: They won't. Railways or roads suitable for high-speed ground transport aren't feasible in eastern Roshar because of the highstorms. But Navani already has ideas about flying ships, which would allow them to circumvent this limitation. In a world with fabrials of Cohesion a railway in a tunnel looks quite feasible, provide you find an engine without combustion. 1
Pathfinder Posted October 7, 2019 Posted October 7, 2019 On 10/3/2019 at 5:30 PM, LopentheHerdazian said: It's safe to say that synthetic gemstones won't be available for a large amount of time and that the average person will not have piles of suffered soon. I do not think it is safe to say at all. WoB shown below that Roshar is ahead in technology regarding gemstones. But to each their own. Braid_Tug (paraphrased) We asked Brandon about gem cutting tech levels on Roshar. Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) He hedged some. But did let us know that while it was still labor intensive, it was not as bad as Renaissance Europe. That yes, they do have an edge. But would not state what the edge was. Even with us making jokes about Shard scalpels to make the cuts. DragonCon 2019 (Aug. 29, 2019) 1
+Oltux72 he/him Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 On 07/10/2019 at 8:40 PM, Pathfinder said: Braid_Tug (paraphrased) We asked Brandon about gem cutting tech levels on Roshar. Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) He hedged some. But did let us know that while it was still labor intensive, it was not as bad as Renaissance Europe. That yes, they do have an edge. But would not state what the edge was. Even with us making jokes about Shard scalpels to make the cuts. DragonCon 2019 (Aug. 29, 2019) That is about cutting. Synthesis requires some chemistry. It is not difficult (except for diamond), but you need to understand what they are, chemically speaking. If you understad that, soulcasting the raw materials and heating by fabrial would give you an advantage.
Pathfinder Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 19 minutes ago, Oltux72 said: That is about cutting. Synthesis requires some chemistry. It is not difficult (except for diamond), but you need to understand what they are, chemically speaking. If you understad that, soulcasting the raw materials and heating by fabrial would give you an advantage. And I respect that is how you view it, but for myself if in the other WoB, Brandon says it makes sense for a culture to be further along regarding a resource that is important to them (Metal on Scadrial), and then another WoB states at least one aspect of gemstones is more advanced than one would expect, then I do not think it is implausible to think it could be more advanced, or could become more advanced at an accelerated rate. But I did not post the WoB to beat a dead horse. It has already been well established what everyone's opinions are on this thread. I posted the WoB as added information. I am not going to rehash the same arguments made repeatedly over the course of this thread.
Pathfinder Posted October 21, 2020 Posted October 21, 2020 Rhythm of War Spoilers Spoiler It is nice to feel vindicated on these two topics (synthetic gemstones and industrialization). Not posting this to start this up again, but more a post for myself for reference.
Aspiring Writer Posted October 21, 2020 Posted October 21, 2020 On 7/31/2019 at 6:23 AM, Karger said: Fabrails are a bit to expensive for the average Jo shmo. Remember they consume gemstones fairly quickly and those gemstones are extremely valuable to soulcasters. Well, remember, gem hearts make gemstones much cheaper and obtainable than what we have. STuff like emeralds might still be rare, but most fabrails use other more common gemstones. Remember, their currency is gemstones. Can you imagine us not using copper or gold despite them being amazing conductors? This is similar to that. 1
Karger he/him Posted October 21, 2020 Posted October 21, 2020 (edited) 36 minutes ago, Aspiring Writer said: Can you imagine us not using copper or gold despite them being amazing conductors? This is similar to that. Not really. Platinum is also an excellent conductor but we don't use it to make wires and silver is superior to copper but we still use copper instead. There is a cost benefit analysis. A great example is manufacturing. We still often use human labor rather then machines even though machines make better products most of the time. 5 hours ago, Pathfinder said: Rhythm of War Spoilers Spoiler Are you referencing the black sphere in chapter 16? Edited October 21, 2020 by Karger 1
Pathfinder Posted October 21, 2020 Posted October 21, 2020 57 minutes ago, Karger said: Reveal hidden contents Are you referencing the black sphere in chapter 16? Like I said, not starting this up again. Just for my personal reference.
Karger he/him Posted October 21, 2020 Posted October 21, 2020 46 minutes ago, Pathfinder said: Like I said, not starting this up again. Just for my personal reference. Not argument and will not resume just wondering as I actually had the same thought to some degree.
Vessel of Theory he/him Posted October 22, 2020 Posted October 22, 2020 Since it seems we're just musing on whether or not Roshar's going to have a massive fabrial revolution... What's Shinovar doing? Isn't Shinovar the one place where the Highstorms don't destroy but still give Investiture? If the Shinovar have a more Earth-like(or maybe Ashyn-like) climate and ecosystem, wouldn't they be discovering things at a rate we understand better, or consider more balanced? Does anyone know what the Stone Shamans do? Would they, or the Honorblades, have any effect on the Shinovar industrial revolution? If/when the Shin get their revolution, will their technology prominently feature fabrials like we expect the rest of Roshar's to?
first void Posted October 27, 2020 Posted October 27, 2020 I think we are starting to see traces of a more Renaissance type thing. For one thing, Dalinar is starting to see reading as possibly helpful to ruling, and a lot of ancient knowledge has been rediscovered. I also think renaissance themes fit better with the Atheli culture. If they solve the problem of restarting every desolation, they will progress. 1
Stormwalker Posted October 28, 2020 Posted October 28, 2020 (edited) On 7/30/2019 at 10:15 PM, ZenBossanova said: One of the prime reasons for the Industrial Revolution in England, was the shortage of labor. The Black Plague had eliminated enough people that they needed to automate things. On Roshar, they have just lost a lot of manual labor. They are ripe for their own industrial Fabrial Revolution. They have the technology and the understanding. Am I the only one who wonders at the premise of this thread? I'm no historian, but the black plague happened centuries before the industrial revolution. Moreover, what I remember from history class is the exact opposite. The industrial revolution happened right after the agricultural revolution in England. They didn't have less people for labour, they instead had way more people than they needed to provide their necessities, allowing them time to do other crafts. Sorry if I'm derailing this into a mundane discussion. Edit: I guess this would even suggest the opposite. That Roshar is far away from any industrial revolution of its own. Edited October 28, 2020 by Stormwalker
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