Toaster Retribution Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 So, Shallan and Renarin both sensed that something was wrong inside Urithiru. In addition, Mraize seemed to feel it too, or at least knew someone who did. But Dalinar has not sensed anything, and Malata doesn´t seem to have noticed the Unmade either. So, why did Shallan, Renarin and Mraize sense something that the other Radiants did not? Well, Re-Shepir looks to be an evil counterpart to the Lightweavers. and which is an order affiliated with Cultivation, and also and order which uses the surge of Illumination, which both Renarin and Shallan can use. So I have two theories. One is that everyone who can use the Illumination or Transformation surges can feel Re-Shepir. The other one is that everyone who belongs to Cultivation-affiliated orders can sense it. Both of these explain why Dalinar didn´t notice anything. They don´t explain Mraize, but then again, we don´t know how he learned of the wrongness. So, what do you think of all this? Why couldn´t Dalinar sese Re-Shepir? Why could Mraize? Do my theories make sense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steeldancer Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 Just now, Toaster Retribution said: So, Shallan and Renarin both sensed that something was wrong inside Urithiru. In addition, Mraize seemed to feel it too, or at least knew someone who did. But Dalinar has not sensed anything, and Malata doesn´t seem to have noticed the Unmade either. So, why did Shallan, Renarin and Mraize sense something that the other Radiants did not? Well, Re-Shepir looks to be an evil counterpart to the Lightweavers. and which is an order affiliated with Cultivation, and also and order which uses the surge of Illumination, which both Renarin and Shallan can use. So I have two theories. One is that everyone who can use the Illumination or Transformation surges can feel Re-Shepir. The other one is that everyone who belongs to Cultivation-affiliated orders can sense it. Both of these explain why Dalinar didn´t notice anything. They don´t explain Mraize, but then again, we don´t know how he learned of the wrongness. So, what do you think of all this? Why couldn´t Dalinar sese Re-Shepir? Why could Mraize? Do my theories make sense? Could mraize have breath, giving life sense of a sort? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toaster Retribution Posted October 31, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 Just now, Steeldancer said: Could mraize have breath, giving life sense of a sort? That is a good thought. Zahel should have sensed the Unmade too in that case. Another idea that I have is that the Ghostbloods have experienced Soulcasters, who can sense the wrongness through their connection to the Transformation surge, and told Mraize about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScavellTane Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 O 1 minute ago, Steeldancer said: Could mraize have breath, giving life sense of a sort? Or any other kind of investiture, he has traveled extensively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiapet Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 I definitely got the sense that Illumination was the cause of Shallan and Renarin sensing the Unmade, as Illumination was the surge that it was attempting to copy/warping. Not sure what that says about Mraize. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wandering Investor Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 It may have to do with specific traits to the orders. Shallen's affinity for shadesmar via the transformation surge and Renarin via his ability to "see". This wouldn't account for Maize, but could explain why Dalinar and the Releaser couldn't sense the wrongness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What's a Seawolf? Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 If Mraize's chicken is actually Spoiler an Aviar, that could be his means of sensing the wrongness. Yes it goes against the Stormlight standalone idea, but it's not something that ever has to be fully explained or impact the plot. Can just be ascribed to Mraize being that mysterious guy who knows things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScavellTane Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 Maybe that's why he brought it along. To locate the source. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scriptorian Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 Hmm...how could Mraize sense the Midnight Mother... *ponders* The midnight essence bleed when you cut them, but their "blood" is smokey, insubstantial...ghost-like. You might say they have...Ghostblood . 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarion Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 I'm not touching Mraize. There's too much there we don't know. But I think it's becoming increasingly clear that there are separate and distinct Cultivation- and Honor-senses. Syl can sense highstorms coming, but not the Everstorm. Lift and Wyndle sense the Everstorm coming before it happens, but make no mention of sensing highstorms. I suspect that this Unmade comes under the Cultivation-sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kari-no-sugata Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 It might be that some Orders are more sensitive to things being wrong than others. ie it might not be that Shallan and Renarin are particularly sensitive to this specific Unmade but all Unmade. Both Shallan and Renarin seem to have a sort of clairvoyance, though Renarin more than Shallan it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lordofarda Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 Oooh, what if Mraize is part of the hidden radiant order and that is why he can sense her? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiamondMind Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 29 minutes ago, Tarion said: Syl can sense highstorms coming, but not the Everstorm. Lift and Wyndle sense the Everstorm coming before it happens, but make no mention of sensing highstorms. Do you have a prooftext for this? From what I remember, the only sense they get is that a storm is coming in general - clouds, sky darkens, winds, etc. While the presumed voidspren is the one who senses when the Everstorm comes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarion Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 (edited) 11 minutes ago, DiamondMind said: Do you have a prooftext for this? From what I remember, the only sense they get is that a storm is coming in general - clouds, sky darkens, winds, etc. While the presumed voidspren is the one who senses when the Everstorm comes. That had been my thought until my most recent listen to Edgedancer, in the context of the Oathbringer chapters we already have. So, Syl sensing Highstorms: Quote “I think I can sense a highstorm coming,” she whispered. “What? Really?” She nodded. “It’s distant still. A day or three.” She cocked her head. “I suppose I could have done this earlier, but I didn’t need to. Or know I wanted to. You always had the lists.” And Wyndle to Lift, on the topic of the Everstorm: Quote “Maybe. But don’t you feel something? Out there? Building?” “A distant thunder,” Lift whispered, looking westward, past the city, toward the far-off mountains. “Or … or the way you feel after someone drops a pan, and you see it falling, and get ready for the clatter ... “So you do feel it.” “Maybe,” Lift said. Quote “And when the great storm comes?” Lift’s eyes drifted toward the west. Toward … whatever was building there. There's a few others, I think, but these are the ones I spotted straight away. Edited October 31, 2017 by Tarion 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScavellTane Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 All the bonded spren felt build up/creation of the new storm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiamondMind Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 @Tarion, I definitely agree that Syl could sense the highstorms, since that was explicit; but Kaladin couldn't do so and had to rely on her. In your quotes (do you have chapters?) both Wyndle and Lift sense the approaching storm, and it seems different then the way Syl talks about it. For them, it's an ominous feeling of something building, not a direct connection. The voidspren seems to be the analogue to how Syl was sensing the highstorm, not Pattern and Wyndle. @ScavellTane, you're right! Syl talks about something being wrong on the winds right after she comes back to Kaladin. Do you remember any other time? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScavellTane Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 And Patterns assertion that the storms will crash together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildSpeculation Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 Put me in the camp that Re-Shephir is corrupting Illumination somehow and that is why Shallan and Renarin can sense her. Both of their orders share access to the Illumination Surge. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarion Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 58 minutes ago, DiamondMind said: @Tarion, I definitely agree that Syl could sense the highstorms, since that was explicit; but Kaladin couldn't do so and had to rely on her. In your quotes (do you have chapters?) both Wyndle and Lift sense the approaching storm, and it seems different then the way Syl talks about it. For them, it's an ominous feeling of something building, not a direct connection. The voidspren seems to be the analogue to how Syl was sensing the highstorm, not Pattern and Wyndle. Chapter 3 for the first. Chapter 7 for the second. And it's a rough sense before they know what the Everstorm is. If it happens again, I'd be willing to bet she recognised the feeling and could place it as the Everstorm. After all, Syl is intimately familiar with highstorms, so it makes sense that she can recognise the sensation and understand it's source. In Edgedancer, they're experiencing the Everstorm for the first time. They've got no reason to put names to the sensation, because it's something entirely new. The other spren in Kaladin's flashbacks has already been through the Everstorm, so would have the sense for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gigalemesh Posted October 31, 2017 Report Share Posted October 31, 2017 I'm of the opinion it's related to the illumination surge, at least that was my thought upon reading the chapters 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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