Themasterhunter Posted May 16, 2017 Report Share Posted May 16, 2017 Szeth has quite a lot of names. (Truthless, Son-son-Vallano..) I know i missed at least three, but i was wondering if we could explain these things in the best way possible. What exactly do we know about the title of truthless? Who is Vallano? who is his father (i forgot his name) The only real obvious one is assassin in white. I just want a list of what exactly all these things mean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2 Spoolofwhool Posted May 16, 2017 Report Share Posted May 16, 2017 Vallano is his grandfather. He abandoned his father's name because he didn't want his father's name to be stained by his actions. Originally he was Szeth-son-Neturo. We don't know much about the Truthless, only that it seems to be a title given to those who have acted against the Shin society. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Alfa Posted May 17, 2017 Report Share Posted May 17, 2017 18 hours ago, Weltall said: A real-world example of this would be Russian names. For example, the composer Stravinsky's full name is Igor Fyodorovich Stravinsky, with the middle name being the patronymic meaning 'son of Fyodor'. English is full of them too but nobody really thinks of them any more because they haven't been used that way in a long time. For example Sanderson means "Son of (Alek)sander" - in several European languages the Patronyms became Family names over time. So, if Brandon was Shin he could call himself Brandon-Son-Son-...(five minutes later)...-Son-Sander. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 The Sovereign Posted May 16, 2017 Report Share Posted May 16, 2017 7 minutes ago, Spoolofwhool said: Vallano is his grandfather. He abandoned his father's name because he didn't want his father's name to be stained by his actions. Originally he was Szeth-son-Neturo. We don't know much about the Truthless, only that it seems to be a title given to those who have acted against the Shin society. Nailed it. 15 minutes ago, Themasterhunter said: What exactly do we know about the title of truthless? To expand just a little bit on Spool's answer, being a Truthless is a ridiculously cruel punishment; once Truthless you are obligated to obey the commands of whomever holds your Oathstone. There is an implication that it is expected that the commands you receive will go against the precepts of the Stone Shaminate. The cruelty comes from the idea that you are still required to fulfill the commands but you are not excused from the consequences and are not absolved of your actions. In addition, we know that soldiers are the lowest rung of Shin society and the implication is that Truthless are even lower so it is social deposition as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Weltall Posted May 16, 2017 Report Share Posted May 16, 2017 To add a bit more on Szeth's actual name, what that's called is a patronymic; the full name tells you not only who such-and-such is but identifies them specifically as the child of so-and-so as well. So Szeth-son-Neturo is 'Szeth, son of Neturo' but as noted he doesn't call himself that because he doesn't want to shame his father by association. We know this applies to both genders as we have people like Shauka-daughter-Hasweth, one of the scholars that Jasnah asks if Shallan has read. A real-world example of this would be Russian names. For example, the composer Stravinsky's full name is Igor Fyodorovich Stravinsky, with the middle name being the patronymic meaning 'son of Fyodor'. English is full of them too but nobody really thinks of them any more because they haven't been used that way in a long time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Themasterhunter Posted May 18, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 18, 2017 okay. other things. How exactly does the oathstone work, and is it bonded to szeth in a "magical" Way, or does he just follow it as a code of honor? Also, does Darkness (forgot which herald... maybe nale?) have szeth's oathstone, or is szeth following him for some other purpose? I think that Edgedancer and WoR kinda implied that his oathstone was no longer "valid" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Calderis Posted May 18, 2017 Report Share Posted May 18, 2017 11 minutes ago, Themasterhunter said: okay. other things. How exactly does the oathstone work, and is it bonded to szeth in a "magical" Way, or does he just follow it as a code of honor? Also, does Darkness (forgot which herald... maybe nale?) have szeth's oathstone, or is szeth following him for some other purpose? I think that Edgedancer and WoR kinda implied that his oathstone was no longer "valid" Whether his Oathstone bond was magical or not is never addressed, I personally lean towards no. Either way, the events at the end of WoR ended Szeth's time as Truthless, and he is following Nale of his own Volition. His lines in edgedancer imply that he has no issue contradicting Nale, and so it is definitely no longer a situation of him following without question, like he did with the Oathstone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 The One Who Connects Posted May 18, 2017 Report Share Posted May 18, 2017 28 minutes ago, Themasterhunter said: How exactly does the oathstone work, and is it bonded to szeth in a "magical" Way, or does he just follow it as a code of honor? Brandon has RAFO'd if he was bound by anything other than personal honor. (twice I believe) We've never asked how an Oathstone works. In the first Rysn interlude, non-truthless Shin Warriors are described as having similar stones of some sort. This may be a clue, or just to show us that Oathstones are part of normal Shin society. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Themasterhunter Posted June 8, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2017 But if oathstones are a normal part of shin society, wouldn't they be enslaved? Because an oathbound shin is better than a parshman by far. I don't know where, but I'm pretty sure szeth is a unique case Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 WhiteLeeopard Posted June 8, 2017 Report Share Posted June 8, 2017 I don't think this is known for certain yet. But the impression we get is that the difference between a warrior and a Truthless is that warriors are at least kept at home. Truthless are exiled, which as we saw in Szeth's pov was a horrible punishment, as the shin are deeply unhappy away from their homeland and culture. Whether a Truthless enslavement is to a greater degree than a warrior, we don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 BetaRayBilly Posted June 9, 2017 Report Share Posted June 9, 2017 What about his powers? Syl says he isn't bonded with a spren, so he probably gets his powers from his Shardblade. But why hasn't Adolin or any other Shardbearer experienced these kind of powers like the ones Szeth is showing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 StrikerEZ Posted June 9, 2017 Report Share Posted June 9, 2017 4 hours ago, BetaRayBilly said: What about his powers? Syl says he isn't bonded with a spren, so he probably gets his powers from his Shardblade. But why hasn't Adolin or any other Shardbearer experienced these kind of powers like the ones Szeth is showing. Okay, the biggest problem you have right here is that what Adolin and other Shardbearers have are dead Shardblades-their Soren are 'dead' so to speak, so they can't give powers (of course, they wouldn't if they were alive, as they probably wouldn't be Nahel bonded to most Shardbearers), while the blade that Szeth had until Kaladin took it was an Honorblade, a similar blade to Shardblades, but it was designed by Honor himself to give the Heralds Surgebinding powers, so that's how he does it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Chinsukolo Posted June 11, 2017 Report Share Posted June 11, 2017 I'm pretty sure it was mentioned but can't find it anywhere - but I believe he was classified Truthless for having reported in someway that the Surgebinding had returned. The Shin said this isn't possible and branded him a Truthless for lying. I want to say this is supported when he fights Kaladin and realizes Radiant's have returned, so he was correct, so he's not actually Trutheless because Shin leaders were wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Alfa Posted June 11, 2017 Report Share Posted June 11, 2017 8 hours ago, Chinsukolo said: I'm pretty sure it was mentioned but can't find it anywhere - but I believe he was classified Truthless for having reported in someway that the Surgebinding had returned. The Shin said this isn't possible and branded him a Truthless for lying. I want to say this is supported when he fights Kaladin and realizes Radiant's have returned, so he was correct, so he's not actually Trutheless because Shin leaders were wrong. It's implied ovet and over again, starting from wok prologue. It was also not necessary about Surgebinders returning, but Voidbringers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Question
Themasterhunter
Szeth has quite a lot of names. (Truthless, Son-son-Vallano..)
I know i missed at least three, but i was wondering if we could explain these things in the best way possible.
What exactly do we know about the title of truthless?
Who is Vallano? who is his father (i forgot his name)
The only real obvious one is assassin in white. I just want a list of what exactly all these things mean.
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