Why the Southern Scadrialians are Operating at at least a 22nd Century CE Technological Level

[DeadFencer]

My personal favorite Bands of Mourning theory is that prior to the Catacendre, the Southern Scadrialians had at least more advanced technology than present-day Earth's. After the Catacendre, they kept as much of this technology as possible, though also adopted the metal magics of the Sovereign. Since there is no evidence Rashek did anything to limit the technological growth of the Southerners, and since Scadrial was at a 1700s technology level prior the his interference in the North, that would put Southern Scadrial at a 2700s technology level at the time of the Final Empire. Even knocking off a hundred years or so for adapting to being dumped in a new environment, the Southerners should be extremely advanced. 

[Spoolofwhool]

This is an interesting thought. We don't know whether allowed the Southern Scadrians to have the technologies of the time when he moved them, but he definitely couldn't have limited them during TFE, so they would've advanced during those thousand years, using the knowledge they brought and the technology. 

One thing though, I'm not sure the Southern Scadrians are quite that advanced. They don't seem to have electricity for example, at least there was none on their airships. It is possible that they could have but it isn't mobile, but then they definitely wouldn't be anywhere near Earth 22nd Century tech. It seems to me that they are still fairly unadvanced, relying strongly on magic to survive. While their hardships have motivated to advance their technology, their tech relies more on magic versus the Basin, which has tech not reliant on magic, which could be in fact considered more advanced. The Southern Scadrians are reliant on metalborns to keep their technology. If for some reason they lose their metalborns, then they'd be essentially screwed.

[The One Who Connects he/him]

11 hours ago, Spoolofwhool said:

their tech relies more on magic versus the Basin, which has tech not reliant on magic, which could be in fact considered more advanced. [..] If for some reason they lose their metalborns, then they'd be essentially screwed.

Their tech relies more on power versus the South, which has tech not reliant on power sources, which could be considered more advanced. If for some reason the Basin ran out of fuel (coal/oil/electricity/etc) then they'd be essentially screwed for a while too. [Not trying to start an argument, but from the Southerners PoV...] Semantics, sorry.

The Basin is more advanced in stability, as their fuel source is not tied to bloodlines.
The Southern Continent is more advanced in what their tech can do at the time.

[Spoolofwhool]

1 hour ago, The One Who Connects said:

Their tech relies more on power versus the South, which has tech not reliant on power sources, which could be considered more advanced. If for some reason the Basin ran out of fuel (coal/oil/electricity/etc) then they'd be essentially screwed for a while too. [Not trying to start an argument, but from the Southerners PoV...] Semantics, sorry.

The Basin is more advanced in stability, as their fuel source is not tied to bloodlines.
The Southern Continent is more advanced in what their tech can do at the time.

True. Good point. However, I don't think the Basin is in danger from resource depletion, since we know that Harmony provided an ample amount.

[king of nowhere]

the south could not be that advanced. in fact, the south was not advanced after the last ascension. if it was, they wouldn't have been all that bothered by the colder climate; they would just have turned up the heating.

[Shadeshadow227]

1 hour ago, king of nowhere said:

the south could not be that advanced. in fact, the south was not advanced after the last ascension. if it was, they wouldn't have been all that bothered by the colder climate; they would just have turned up the heating.

Um...why would a people who lived where the sea BOILED during Era 1 need artificial heating?

[Spoolofwhool]

7 minutes ago, Shadeshadow227 said:

Um...why would a people who lived where the sea BOILED during Era 1 need artificial heating?

Because they're freezing now, due to the planet being further away from the sun. They spent a thousand years adapting to the heat but now they're not in their warm climate. The coppermind that Wax got from Hoid even showed it, the southern scadrians huddling in the cold, having burnt their masks for warmth. 

[The One Who Connects he/him]

2 hours ago, Spoolofwhool said:

True. Good point. However, I don't think the Basin is in danger from resource depletion, since we know that Harmony provided an ample amount.

That's why I made it from a Southerner's PoV, since they wouldn't know that. But then you get to: they have power with magic, we have power with fuel, which is created by magic, and etc... I'll see myself out and clear my head to think again.

[king of nowhere]

2 hours ago, Shadeshadow227 said:

Um...why would a people who lived where the sea BOILED during Era 1 need artificial heating?

they were freezing to death after the world was moved back into its proper orbit. if they had industrial level technology, they could have heated themselves by burning whatever fuel they were using to power the industries.

[natc]

Doesn't ettmetal actually deplete somewhat though? I was under the impression that it did.

 

Also, using metallic arts as the basis of technology, while allowing for many otherwise difficult or impossible feats, would make you more reliant on metal production and supply than industry based on natural sciences (which still uses absurd amounts of course, but your vehicles won't stop running because the local iron mine went dry while electricity and gas would carry on fine).

 

Actually, past a certain point of development, wouldn't their metal industry need more metal itself to use even more metallic arts to mine metal fast enough to keep up? They probably use more than the north by a significant margin. Where ettmetal comes from notwithstanding.

[teknopathetic he/him]

I assumed the people in the south were less invested (few metalborn ) so they were less protected against the cold ( like with breath). Maybe a touch of the mista can strengthen people with a touch of the gene. 

Edited November 25, 2016 by teknopathetic

[DeadFencer]

On November 24, 2016 at 2:22 PM, king of nowhere said:

the south could not be that advanced. in fact, the south was not advanced after the last ascension. if it was, they wouldn't have been all that bothered by the colder climate; they would just have turned up the heating.

Imagine out of nowhere the temperature  becomes -70 degrees Fahrenheit (the average temperature in Antarctica) in an instant. No amount of turning up the heating is going to save you. 

[Kingsdaughter613 she/her]

People do live in Antarctica though, so we have thechnology to allow for it. The problem I see is that the Southerners were living in the coolest place already. Everywhere else was hotter! So heating would not be needed and need inspires invention.

[king of nowhere]

8 hours ago, DeadFencer said:

Imagine out of nowhere the temperature  becomes -70 degrees Fahrenheit (the average temperature in Antarctica) in an instant. No amount of turning up the heating is going to save you. 

it wasn't that bad. kelsier arrived at the southern continent years after the final ascension, and the southerners survived that long. if it had been so bad, they would have all died in a matter of hours, days at most. the fact that they survived for years means that with modern technology they would have survived indefinitely. at least regarding heating. the real problem would have been to grow crops that were suddenly unsuitable to the climate. you can grow stuff in a greenhouse, but you can't feed a whole nation that way.

[Kingsdaughter613 she/her]

1 hour ago, king of nowhere said:

it wasn't that bad. kelsier arrived at the southern continent years after the final ascension, and the southerners survived that long. if it had been so bad, they would have all died in a matter of hours, days at most. the fact that they survived for years means that with modern technology they would have survived indefinitely. at least regarding heating. the real problem would have been to grow crops that were suddenly unsuitable to the climate. you can grow stuff in a greenhouse, but you can't feed a whole nation that way.

I actually think that was what, along with the loss of familiar animal life, that was killing them. You can survive being cold far more easily if you are well fed. Loss of body fat would make the effects of the cold worse, never mind all the other difficulties that come with the lack of a proper food supply.