uchoo786 Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 I was reading Secret History again and noticed that Hoid says the following to Kelsier after beating him up: "I'm sorry, Survivor, for the rough treatment," Drifter continued. "But you are not supposed to be here. You did what I needed you to , but you're a wild card I'd rather not deal with right now." What exactly is Hoid talking about there? At first I thought he meant setting up TLR's death, but I'm not sure why Hoid would have wanted that since TLR was one making sure Ruin wouldn't destroy the world. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taveren he/him Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 ruin would have gotten out eventually so might as well let him out when he would lose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natc Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 Yeah, might as well let him out while a good vessel candidate (Vin) as still alive. The plan had been for Preservation to die, while keeping the atium in cycle using atium mistings to prevent reclaiming, so that another potential vessel can take the power and sacrifice themselves in a big kamikaze. Then the Hero of Ages cleans up the aftermath. Keeping Ruin sealed is counterproductive once the vessel is ready. Being older than the Shattering Hoid could've known or had figured it out to be the best course of action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormgate he/him Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 Hoid probably wanted TLR to die. Because the Lord Ruler fell, Ruin was released. Because Ruin was released, Vin had to stop him. Because Vin had to stop him, both Vin and Ati died. Because both Vin and Ati died, Sazed took up both Shards. Hoid, for some reason, wanted Harmony. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unodus he/him Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 Hoid probably wanted TLR to die. Because the Lord Ruler fell, Ruin was released. Because Ruin was released, Vin had to stop him. Because Vin had to stop him, both Vin and Ati died. Because both Vin and Ati died, Sazed took up both Shards. Hoid, for some reason, wanted Harmony. Perhaps because he wanted to give someone the capacity to be stronger than Odium? 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata he/him Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 I suppose Hoid knowed quite nothing of Preservation Plan. He wanted only some chaos in the Final Empire to find the Well with less trouble from Rashek... Probable he was quite surprised when TLR died. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natc Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 Or, without TLR he could hop in for the lerasium and not have difficulty on the way out, perhaps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata he/him Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 (edited) On 5/4/2016 at 3:38 PM, natc said: Or, without TLR he could hop in for the lerasium and not have difficulty on the way out, perhaps? His problem was his ignorance about the Well's location, I don't think Rashek was troublesome if you are in the Cognitive, sure in the Metallic arts there is a way to worldhop but Rashek can't catch someone (he had no way to discovered a Cognitive Intruder) in the Cognitive and Hoid would steal the Lerasium pretty fast. Edited October 31, 2016 by Yata Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natc Posted April 6, 2016 Report Share Posted April 6, 2016 The lerasium is in the physical, however, and I'm sure there's always a risk of TLR picking him up with one of his numerous ways to detect people. And he's got bottomless speed stores. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata he/him Posted April 6, 2016 Report Share Posted April 6, 2016 (edited) The lerasium is in the physical, however, and I'm sure there's always a risk of TLR picking him up with one of his numerous ways to detect people. And he's got bottomless speed stores. Sure but probably to him is more easy to get it, coming from the Cognitive (if Rashek was at home). I am unsure Rashek may detect him (until he is too late). If Rashek was also a guardian aganist Cognitive thief, He would never leave his palace. Instead he thinked that his defences (the quite unpullable door) and the false knowledge was enough Edited April 6, 2016 by Yata Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natc Posted April 6, 2016 Report Share Posted April 6, 2016 He did built his hut on top of the door and all. I'm sure he cares a little. Of course going in from the cognitive is the best way in. Pretty much the only way that isn't suicide. But the lerasium is not in the center of the room, you will have to materialize to reach it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndigoAjah he/him Posted April 6, 2016 Report Share Posted April 6, 2016 Hoid might not know WHY he wanted TLR dead if that is it. Depending on his method of knowing where he needs to be etc, he might just know that he needs to get TLR to die 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Espella Posted April 6, 2016 Report Share Posted April 6, 2016 I've always assumed that Hoid was friends with the shardholders before the Shattering (we know Tanavast bought him drinks once), so if he kept up any of those friendships post-Shattering he might've had a general idea of what Leras' grand plan was, and wanted TLR to die to make it happen (what with Vin ascending to beat Ruin and all that). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argel he/him Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 Taking that further, put the negative force Ati had corrupted into out if its misery, finally granting the Ati he knew peace. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manavortex she/her Posted October 30, 2016 Report Share Posted October 30, 2016 (edited) We have a WoB somewhere that odium is actually scared of harmony. I think that it is because harmony could soak him up, like preservation and ruin soaked each other up. Edited October 30, 2016 by manavortex Thank you autocorrect 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savanorn he/him Posted October 30, 2016 Report Share Posted October 30, 2016 I don't think we know. The ultimate defeat of ruin is possible, and certainly not beyond Hoid's plans, but I don't thibk this is it. Ultimately, I think Hoid wanted The Lord Ruler dead so he could steal the atium without a fuss. I don't know if Rashek is a match for Hoid, but of all the mortals we've seen he's probably the closest. It helps, however, that he doesn't need to kill Hoid, just stop him from taking the Lerasium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subvisual Haze Posted December 9, 2016 Report Share Posted December 9, 2016 I think Hoid just wanted the Lord Ruler out of the way so he could grab some Lerasium and bolt. Also Rashek was a full mistborn and feruchemist, presumably granting him access to some freaky compounding abilities we haven't seen in action yet. I imagine he somehow utilized his ability to store and tap fortune in chromium to be in the area when necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaymyth she/her Posted December 9, 2016 Report Share Posted December 9, 2016 There's been considerable speculation for some time now that Hoid's endgame might be to reassemble Adonalsium itself. If that's the case, then acting to recombine Ruin and Preservation would be a very reasonable first step. It's also conceivable that he was trying to find out whether fusing two Shards was even possible. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vissy Posted December 9, 2016 Report Share Posted December 9, 2016 Ah, I hope it ain't that. Recombining Adonalsium is such a boring outcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaymyth she/her Posted December 10, 2016 Report Share Posted December 10, 2016 36 minutes ago, Rob Lucci said: Ah, I hope it ain't that. Recombining Adonalsium is such a boring outcome. Well, it can be his ultimate goal and still also not actually be how it all turns out. At any rate, whatever the outcome, I trust that Brandon will send our heads spinning many times over during the ride. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vissy Posted December 10, 2016 Report Share Posted December 10, 2016 Could be. I'd rather have eight dual-shards, though - I mean, the power struggle is the source of all excitement in that realm! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angsos Posted December 21, 2016 Report Share Posted December 21, 2016 It might not be possible because there are alot of splinters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vissy Posted December 24, 2016 Report Share Posted December 24, 2016 The splinters are reforming slowly. It will be possibly eventually for someone to take up their power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doncissiero Posted August 4, 2017 Report Share Posted August 4, 2017 Well kelsier met Hoid first in Final Empire as an informant. So maybe he was just referring to that . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathrangking he/him Posted August 7, 2017 Report Share Posted August 7, 2017 It is possible to say that making Vin into a powerful force to be reckoned with was the plan. He might have predicted that she would be needed to defeat the corruption that Ati had become. Which might even conceivably have been part of the larger plan of giving someone the potential opportunity to take up two shards and thwart Odium on Scadrial. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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